52 réponses à ce sujet

[Patchwork]

Could be they disagree on the reasons for not squashing the rumours. Cassandra might honestly believe that the quizzy is the HoA but Leliana sees it more as a political tool. 

[Chernaya]

I honestly think Cass's disapproval has more to do maybe with thinking it's a great way to get support from the common people for the Inquisition, and less to do with actually thinking the Inquisitor is the herald. Cass is pretty practical and although she may be religious, I think her first thought when she sees someone fall from the sky after a blast that killed everyone else in the area is more "who the **** is this suspicious person" instead of "omg Andraste's BFF!"

[90s Luke]

I don't get the feeling that Cassandra actually believes that the Inquisitor is the Herald of Andraste. Cassandra believes in the Inquisition, since it was the Divine's plan.

 

Cassandra values order and justice over faith and duty. In her mind, the Inquisition needs a figurehead (the Inquisitor) that people can rally around. Otherwise, the organization cannot achieve its goals.

 

That's how I interpreted it, at least.

[WildOrchid]

instead of "omg Andraste's BFF!"

 

That made me laugh like mad, bless you.

[nutcrackr]

She calls you the Herald right at the end, so I assume she wants you to assume the role.

[SomeoneStoleMyName]

She calls you the Herald right at the end, so I assume she wants you to assume the role.

So the best way to *P* cassandra off would be...

 

Reject the title of Herald
Romance her
Ask her to call you "Herald" in bed because... roleplay?

Then again that would probably lead to a black eye.

[HiroVoid]

Considering Cassandra's storyline is partially supposed to be around faith in some form (and the game in general has that as a theme), I wouldn't doubt it if she does genuinely believe you were chosen and blessed by Andraste.

[frylock23]

I always thought of Leliana as very Maker oriented, yes, and faithful, yes, but more in the way of someone who had faith without being in a church. Leliana has loyalty to people who happen to be the Divine or a Mother in the Chantry, but not so much the Chantry, itself. So I see her as less likely to be enamored of pushing someone just to build an organization like the Inquisition until you win her loyalty and convince her your cause is the one she ought to endorse. Until then, I see Leliana as being sort of rudderless except for her personal faith. 

[YourFunnyUncle]

I always thought of Leliana as very Maker oriented, yes, and faithful, yes, but more in the way of someone who had faith without being in a church. Leliana has loyalty to people who happen to be the Divine or a Mother in the Chantry, but not so much the Chantry, itself. So I see her as less likely to be enamored of pushing someone just to build an organization like the Inquisition until you win her loyalty and convince her your cause is the one she ought to endorse. Until then, I see Leliana as being sort of rudderless except for her personal faith. 

 

Yes. In Origins, Leliana's faith was always very personal in nature. She had thought things through and come to her own conclusions, even though they diverged from Chantry teachings. This is why I always liked her even though I didn't always agree with her. It strikes me that she joined up with the Divine because she thought that she was a good person, with the capacity to change the world for the better, who could use her help. She was allied to the woman, not the position.

 

Cassandra strikes me as a little more dogmatic in her faith. She just seems blunter and more straightforward in general. Maybe she has hidden depths, though. I guess we'll see...

[Vincent-Vega]

I think Cassandra disapproved because the answer dissed Andraste.

 

I also think that her blunt comment to Leliana was more of a "get to the point" than a "I don't want the rumors to be quelled". You really need to pay attention to the body language.

 

Leliana: ''Even if we tried to stop it (the rumor)...''

Cassandra: "Which we have not" (exasperated glare/body language = Get to the point)

Leliana: (pointed stiff glare back = Don't tell me what to do) The point is...

 

That exchange is totally awesome might I add.

 

Anyway, it's clear that Cassandra and Leliana already discussed it and agreed to let the rumor spread (or even spread it). Leliana was just trying to make it look a bit less like they let it happen by making it look like it is out of their control. Cassandra doesn't give a damn if the PC is totally aware they are being used.

 

I disagree. The first interruption (spymaster) was what you call "Get to the point". The second interruption however emphasizes (for us, the player) that they weren't trying to stop the rumor or maybe even actively trying to spread it because

a - Cassandra actually believes it herself (hard to tell right now but unlikely imo)
b - she believes the Inquisition can use it to increase its popularity/power. (my guess)

or both.

Leliana on the other hand seems to be hesitant to use the rumor.

 

Edit: To sum up , I think it's 2 (OP)
 

[boissiere]

This is way too much thinking. Feel free as Isabella does!

[jlb524]

Going back to DA:O, there's the quest in Redcliffe for Ser Perth where you can ask the Mother at the Chantry to 'bless' a bunch of amulets to give to Perth's knights so they can have 'the Maker's protection' for the up-coming battle.  The Mother refuses to deceive the knights since she can't literally provide the Maker's protection.

 

Leliana agrees with the Mother and disapproves if you persuade her to 'bless' the amulets for Ser Perth.  Leliana's issue is that you're lying about something that's important and sacred to believers.  Alistair, on the other hand, is accepting of the lie since it will help with their morale.

 

I think this situation is similar.  Leliana doesn't want the Inquisitor to claim he/she is Andraste's Herald until everyone would be super sure of it (if that's even possible).  Possibly lying about this is disrespectful to Andraste/Maker in Leliana's eyes.

 

Cassandra's opinion is similar to Alistair's in the amulet example.  

 

My opinion:  I don't think Cassandra believes the Inquisitor is the Herald but is thinking about how that belief cultivated in others could help the brand new Inquisition grow (and give hope to people).  Leliana isn't sure if the Inquisitor is the Herald or not and is uncomfortable with the possibility that they are lying to people about it.

[nutcrackr]

I agree with jlb524. Leliana values honesty so would feel uncomfortable reinforcing a claim she has yet to believe.

 

As for Cassandra, that one is harder to read. She likely has seen more than anybody else in regards to the Inquistor, so she would certainly be the best judge. Perhaps she just wants to believe so badly or it's just a matter of using it for strength.

[YourFunnyUncle]

Hmmm... I'm not sure that the attitudes to honesty of early Origins Leliana necessarily match those of the Divine's chief spy...

[azarhal]

Hmmm... I'm not sure that the attitudes to honesty of early Origins Leliana necessarily match those of the Divine's chief spy...

 

Was Leliana really honest in the early Origins anyway? She's a bard, lying, deceit and manipulating people are her trade.

[nutcrackr]

Honesty regarding faith, not necessarily other things.

[Lenimph]

That's a really good analysis. It's also the second time that Cassandra interrupts Leliana in that scene. She did it during her introduction too. Leliana could just be fed up with the bluntness at this point. 

 

Leliana: *quit cramping my style, dammit!*

This is the vibe I got this most tbh. 

[YourFunnyUncle]

Was Leliana really honest in the early Origins anyway? She's a bard, lying, deceit and manipulating people are her trade.

Well exactly... Even if we take her at her word, though, and she was at that point truly attempting to leave that life behind, it's pretty certain that she's back in it up to her neck by the time of DAI, "hardened" or no...

[Basement Cat]

Another thought:

 

Leliana might be against using the title because it lets the other side know they have an enemy that can stop them and it tells them who and where that person is. They will probably get more cautious too. It makes her job harder.

[Chari]

Cassandra obviously approves of the title

Lelianna is probably a tad jealous she didn't get it

[Roamingmachine]

Ho-hum.... Cassandras disapproval is interesting. I can see that riding the title for all its worth could be useful regardless of personal feelings, but its also the reason the chantry has kicked the inquisition to the curb. I personally don't think that the disapproval is religious, that is Lelianas thing after all, but more grounded on practicality. She just sees the ability to fire up the mob as more useful than the chantry which, at the moment, has exactly zero bodies to throw at the demon problem. Or at least i really, really hope that this is the case. Leliana is quite enough on the faith front thankyou very much.

[Wolfen09]

you know, im not sure about any of it.... we have a little bit of dialogue (not pertaining to the herald title) right with her before we meet the advisers and it is technically part of a cut scene...  im wondering if what was said in that conversation is what she disapproves of and not the whole herald thing....  and cullen seemed to embrace it, im surprised his approval didnt jump up too... (hes a LI so i assume he has an approval rating).

 

But if thats not the case, im kind of disappointed that cass would be the one to like the herald title.... leliana seems to believe things outside the norm in religion (I.E. her visions etc.)  Cass strikes me as the straight and narrow and would shoot such blasphemy down (only way i could see her being happy about it, is as said before using the title for influence)

[Helios969]

Cass is pragmatic and realizes playing "the role" will garner more support.  I'd imagine that Leliana would disapprove if you embrace the title (maybe race dependent)...assuming she has maintained her pious nature from Origins.

[azarhal]

Another thought:

 

Leliana might be against using the title because it lets the other side know they have an enemy that can stop them and it tells them who and where that person is. They will probably get more cautious too. It makes her job harder.

 

And Cassandra would totally be to show it off everywhere if it meant getting the enemy's attention.

[Milan92]

On the other hand, Leliana did say that the people are looking for a symbol of hope and that the Herald of Andraste could be that symbol.