1260 réponses à ce sujet

[Lulupab]

I'm irresponsible? Do tell. I'm looking forward to a list of my irresponsible acts.

Anders stopped being relevant the moment we had the opportunity to kill him. Then Fiona took center stage as the driving force of Mage seperatists, And we found out that he is considered an insane radical by both sides. He's not considered a martyr or a hero, just an idiot.

That, and his voice actor talking about not being in DA:I kills any argument about his importance.

 

He doesn't need to appear or speak to be important.

 

Voice actors change all the time.

 

Justice's voice actor is in DA:I and given that he strictly and solely voiced Justice in both Awakening and DA2, I seriously doubt its anyone else other than Justice.

 

Not to mention his VA Adam Howden is probably the biggest troll among all voice actors and teases all the time.

 

First he mentioned he did not receive any invitation from Bioware yet.

Then he said he had his first booth yet its not in his record of, what the hell he did and which company?

He said he is voicing for DA:I but it was April 1st.

 

I copied your sentence because it added nothing to argument.

[SpiritMuse]

Anders is... complicated. I love him, most of the time. But there are also times when I just want him to shut the hell up and stop being such a jerk. I suppose what I love is the "Anders" side, who is sweet and kind and gentle, and what I hate is the "Justice" side, who is judgmental and unforgiving and a jerk and blows up chantries.

That said, I haven't killed him in any of my playthroughs so far, and rivalmancing him was one of the most interesting things I've done in the game.

[thesuperdarkone2]

Didn't Adam Howden also voice Martin in DA2?

[Lady Mutare]

I will say this again, like or dislikes do not really matter. He would have to still be judged by the Chantry or the Warden Commander.  Alot of you are "he was my lover/friend rival etc".  So you would let someone be free of judgement because of that? Not real good of a Champion to do that.   What Anders did was wrong.  Whether I agree with that or not, whether he is a friend/lover or rival.  Whether i support the Mages or the Templars etc.   Anders is a Warden and if not killed that issue would still have to be dealt with.

[thetinyevil]

I hope he is Inquisition with my Hawke in love and as happy as they can be during an apocalypse.

[Magdalena11]

I will say this again, like or dislikes do not really matter. He would have to still be judged by the Chantry or the Warden Commander.  Alot of you are "he was my lover/friend rival etc".  So you would let someone be free of judgement because of that? Not real good of a Champion to do that.   What Anders did was wrong.  Whether I agree with that or not, whether he is a friend/lover or rival.  Whether i support the Mages or the Templars etc.   Anders is a Warden and if not killed that issue would still have to be dealt with.

Yes, the issue should have been dealt with.  We weren't given a choice, other than "live" or "die."  If we let him live, we could leave him to fate, I guess, in which case he would die and justice would be served.  I'd like to think, since the choice was left up to Hawke, it would be more personal and substantial than that.  If someone doesn't agree, then they are indeed free to kill him in their playthrough and he will stay dead, per the powers that be.  You probably won't be able to desecrate his corpse and hang him from the ramparts as an example for the rest, but such sacrifices do need to be made in desperate times.  Maybe, it will be your favorite character being paraded on the gibbet next time around.

[Mentxi]

I want to see him facing Cullen and Cassandra (that would be glorious) and I REALLY want to ask him again (this time as Inquisitor) why he killed Elthina,there were more options, no? diplomatic ones I mean. He knew Alistair and my champion for example, If he had a better plan than BAAAAANG, maybe other people could have helped him (my champion for example). It's sad coz he really did a lot for other mages and was doing something for them and Kirkwall,but suddenly he went crazy and forced everything. I don't say he isn't right, but killing people that can help you and make everyone your enemy, bad move Anders...or vengeance?

[Lady Mutare]

Perhaps in your love/hate for Anders you missed my point. No matter who he/she is, they should be held accountable for their actions.  Anders is a Warden and if not killed, should have been sent to the Warden Commander for Judgement.

[TheChosenOne]

Perhaps in your love/hate for Anders you missed my point. No matter who he/she is, they should be held accountable for their actions.  Anders is a Warden and if not killed, should have been sent to the Warden Commander for Judgement.

 

He's a warden that LEFT the order. He isn't protected by the Wardens anymore. he's fair game

[Joe-Poe]

I killed him so he better not be in my play through other than stopping to take a pee on his grave.....

[Lady Mutare]

If he will not be judged by the Warden Commander(once a warden always a warden) then he should have been judged by the Chantry.

[TheChosenOne]

If he will not be judged by the Warden Commander(once a warden always a warden) then he should have been judged by the Chantry.

 

Which would have just done what many people did to him. Killed him

[Sifr]

Perhaps in your love/hate for Anders you missed my point. No matter who he/she is, they should be held accountable for their actions.  Anders is a Warden and if not killed, should have been sent to the Warden Commander for Judgement.

 

He's a warden that LEFT the order. He isn't protected by the Wardens anymore. he's fair game

 

Actually, it's probably worth discussing whether or not the the Warden (or Orlesian Warden) might also face punishment, or at least some potential backlash, for Anders actions and the Mage-Templar War?

 

After all, they were the one who first recruited Anders into the Grey Wardens, allowed Justice to not only join the Wardens, but parade around like a demon wearing a former Warden's corpse, as well as allowing the two to eventually go AWOL on their watch, without bothering to send anyone to track them down?

 

Sure, there is that possibility that Anders faked his death, but otherwise, doesn't that make the Warden seem just a little bit negligent in their duties? Especially if they were aware that Anders had merged with Justice and became an abomination, a possibility since they knew Justice needed a better place to stay than in Kristoff's decaying body and both of them went missing at the same time?

 

Of course, it's not to say that the blame is on the Warden for what Anders did, but there's not exactly without fault for what transpired either?

[Lady Mutare]

He choose his actions. he should have to be accountable for them. If death is the outcome, That was his choice. Being Responsible sometimes means pissing people off.  I just do not see how his actions are being justified just because he was a lover/friend etc.  I support the mages but I condone Anders actions.  

[SomeoneStoleMyName]

When the world needs change, drastic things need to happen. Anders created a revolution that in the long run will make the world a better place.

 

Better for the world to suffer alot for a short moment than for the world to suffer alot over a much longer time span. Anders created a violent outburst that lasted for 5-10 years. 100 years of oppression and silent suffering / slow deaths - is better? I think not. 

If a poison that would kill the body enters the bloodstream through a limb - then its better to amputate that limb to save the body than dying from the poison later. 

 

[Lady Mutare]

"throws hands into the air and sits back and waits for the Qun"

[Master Warder Z_]

Which would have just done what many people did to him. Killed him

 

And?

[-TC1989-]

He choose his actions. he should have to be accountable for them. If death is the outcome, That was his choice. Being Responsible sometimes means pissing people off.  I just do not see how his actions are being justified just because he was a lover/friend etc.  I support the mages but I condone Anders actions.  

 

Being a Templar supporterish... I can say no mage, or templar has the right to make a decision like that. Hell if Isabela (my LI) or Varric (best friend in DA2) made a similar action... I would put them to the sword as well. Sure I couldn't stand Anders to begin with, and in general I find myself at odds with mages... but that moment was not about the Mage/Templar conflict, it was about a individual making the choice to blow away dozens, if not more in a fit of rage, or whatever the hell you want to call it. So like Joe-Poe.... if he is in Inquisition in a scene where I walk past his grave... I personally will spit on it.

 

The only time I went back on that way of thinking was with Loghain. The only reason I spared him was for the war ahead. I just couldn't throw a mind away like his over his actions. What he did was wrong, yes.... but do you think the Darkspawn give two craps about any of that? No, and I had to learn we can't either.... at least not at that time. Which in that scenario made me hate Alistair, but that's another story.....

[TheChosenOne]

And?

 

And what? The Chantry would have done what our Hawke could have done to him. Hell, EVERYONE in Thedas would have done it and called it justice. Wardens,Kirkwall goverment, et cetera. If you let him lived he would have been a dead man walking

[R0vena]

When the world needs change, drastic things need to happen. Anders created a revolution that in the long run will make the world a better place.

 

Better for the world to suffer alot for a short moment than for the world to suffer alot over a much longer time span. Anders created a violent outburst that lasted for 5-10 years. 100 years of oppression and silent suffering / slow deaths - is better? I think not. 

If a poison that would kill the body enters the bloodstream through a limb - then its better to amputate that limb to save the body than dying from the poison later. 

 

I was under impression the overall revolution was created due to events of Asunder and would have happened regardless of Anders anyway.

[Sifr]

In fairness to Anders, the most you can say he's repsonsible for is blowing up the Chantry with a half-dozen people inside of it, including the Grand Cleric. While he was responsible for lighting the fuse, he didn't force half of the city to subsequently riot, nor Meredith to overreact and immediately try to annul the Circle, forcing the mages to rebel. Likewise after the Kirkwall incident, it wasn't Anders who caused mages like Fiona to vote to disband the Circle?

 

Yeah, Anders is responsible for the destruction of the Chantry, but to pin the whole Mage-Templar War on him is kind of scapegoating, just a tad?

 

It's like blaming Gavrilo Princip for starting World War I, just because he was assassin who killed Archduke Franz Ferdinand of Austria. In reality, the situation in Europe at the time was already volatile and there were a ton of assassins trying to murder someone important to make the house of cards to topple over, he just happened to be the one who pulled it off.

 

If Anders hadn't blown up the Chantry and killed the Grand Cleric, the Exiled Prince DLC informs us that there were a ton of fanatical Resolutionists who were seeking to murder Elthina or a high ranking member of the Chantry in an attempt to start a Mage uprising in Kirkwall, which is why Leliana was sent to check out the situation?

 

In other words, if it had not been Anders, it probably would have been someone else eventually?

[Lady Mutare]

And "Justice" means just not judging Anders?  Seems a bit off for a justice spirit.  Justice is blowing up a chantry?  Perhaps a better thread would be "Justice or Vengeance"?

[R0vena]

In fairness to Anders, the most you can say he's repsonsible for is blowing up the Chantry with a half-dozen people inside of it, including the Grand Cleric. 

Much more people than that died in the explosion.  The building was completely annihilated, there is no way only people in it died. I would guess at least the part of the district was gone, as well.

[lupin8314]

Anders would not appear because he died in many playthroughs.

[Sifr]

Much more people than that died in the explosion.  The building was completely annihilated, there is no way only people in it died. I would guess at least the part of the district was gone, as well.

 

 

While the explosion was massive, most of it seems to come from the airburst and a large majority of the actual debris is shown being thrown clear of the city. The buildings around the Chantry also appear to have remained standing in the aftermath of the explosion, although those nearer the explosion likely suffered structural damage, shattered windows, etc.

 

It's also worth noting that this happens in the dead of night, so there presumably wouldn't have been many people out and about on the streets, with most people being protected in the buildings, which are of Tevinter and Dwarven make, reasonably strong enough to provide at least some shelter and protection from the worst of the explosion.

 

I think you're probably right that more people died than the half-dozen we see in the Chantry, but I don't know if it's the "hundreds" that Vivienne claimed in the recent twitch video. I'd say that that figure probably only came about after the city erupted into anarchy, looting, rioting and unchecked fires?