242 réponses à ce sujet

[LightningPoodle]

Right.

 

We've gone off topic...

[AlanC9]

It certainly is a convenience. It's like one more push before having to go back to camp, opposite from having to immediately go there. Didn't expect it to be such a blight on challenge - which I don't think it is.

I don't follow the italed. With regenerating health when do you ever have to go back to camp? I suppose DA:O's injury system was supposed to do that job, but it failed.

[Lux]

I don't follow the italed. With regenerating health when do you ever have to go back to camp? I suppose DA:O's injury system was supposed to do that job, but it failed.

Getting into a bigger fight without healing potions wouldn't be wise, unless it's a choice you make. There's no automatic health regeneration during combat.

[Trikormadenadon]

Is it too much to ask not to feel obligated to go back to a camp because health is too low? What if I want to risk taking a new camp with no potions but with replenished health? Backtracking makes for a boring game experience, imo.

You are never obligated to do anything. If you choose to go back that's fine, but no one is forcing you to turn back. That's just you choosing to be cautious, thus is it not obligatory. I think the concept is as some others have said, the point is to NOT turn back after every fight but to press onward to the next camp, and only turning back if you are really dangerously close to failing. Stop trying to turn your cautious game-play choices into a design flaw. Just because you would take the time to run back after every fight does not mean that you are obligated to do so.

 

Your complaint sounds more like this to me..., "Is it too much to ask that the game be made the way I want to play it instead of the way the game devs wanted it to be played?" (And just so there is no miss-communication, the answer is yes, it is too much to ask.)

Try playing the game first, before worrying about game-play issues. You might find yourself pleasantly surprised.

[Zatche]

This is not a ARPG, getting the loot without any battle scars makes this more like a "Fable/Zelda" approach than a more mature one.

Funny you mention Zelda. Zelda has limited health potions and no health regen, yet I've never heard people complain about backtracking or the combat being to difficult without it.

[Lux]

You are never obligated to do anything. If you choose to go back that's fine, but no one is forcing you to turn back. That's just you choosing to be cautious, thus is it not obligatory. I think the concept is as some others have said, the point is to NOT turn back after every fight but to press onward to the next camp, and only turning back if you are really dangerously close to failing. Stop trying to turn your cautious game-play choices into a design flaw. Just because you would take the time to run back after every fight does not mean that you are obligated to do so.

 

Your complaint sounds more like this to me..., "Is it too much to ask that the game be made the way I want to play it instead of the way the game devs wanted it to be played?" (And just so there is no miss-communication, the answer is yes, it is too much to ask.)

Try playing the game first, before worrying about game-play issues. You might find yourself pleasantly surprised.

 

I don't know... walking about on very low health and no healing potions makes me feel that I'd be the preferred food for any lowly critter out there.

 

Devs seem to have decided that the formula from Dark Souls would work in this new game. It's a new experiment, and I have a bad feeling about this since it seems to be an all or nothing approach. That worked so well in DA2 with flying ninjas and exploding awesome bodies everywhere.

 

/sarcastic Hawke

[Commander Michael]

I feel like the devs are taking a Dark Souls approach, with camps restoring health and filling your health pots. Difference is that in Dark Souls every single enemy (except bosses) respawned if you went to camp; I doubt that'll be the case in Inquisition.

 

Really, there is NO punishment to just going back to camp after every fight in inquisiton (unless you count walking as a punishment), whereas in DS that would have been redundant since the enemies would've just respawned again. 

 

I currently feel like the whole mechanic is unneccesary, but I'll reserve judgement until I've actually played it. Who knows, maybe it'll make the game THAT much more fun.

[RustyW]

Another post, complaining about a change in game play mechanics, when the vast majority are yet to get their hands on the game.

How can we know for sure how this will affect our enjoyment of the game or even completing it?

So to suggest that changes are needed without playing it are premature. The exception being this auto attack issue for disabled gamers, that is a problem.

Also to say 'expected' is assumptious as if you are speaking for all. You may think you want it but until you play how will you know.

[Lux]

Another post, complaining about a change in game play mechanics, when the vast majority are yet to get their hands on the game.
How can we know for sure how this will affect our enjoyment of the game or even completing it?
So to suggest that changes are needed without playing it are premature. The exception being this auto attack issue for disabled gamers, that is a problem.
Also to say 'expected' is assumptious as if you are speaking for all. You may think you want it but until you play how will you know.

You're writing as if this is the first game of the franchise and that no one played Dragon Age before. Also, health regeneration has been widely used in RPGs. It's not far fetched to say that it would be expected.

My point is that there's substantial changes in combat and people will need to rethink how they would normally engage it. Health regen in between combat (NOT during) albeit at a slower rate, or still existing at lower levels of difficulty, could help mitigate this change by surrounding it with a familiar mechanic. It would also benefit exploration in wide open areas (one more big change where health regen would be useful) and would provide another option to the all important camp. Camps would still be extremely important to replenish healing potions, cure injuries, and serve as waypoints.

Contrary to what people might think when they are motivated enough to engage in forums and follow the development of a game, casual players - in general terms - are not that adept in handling unfamiliar gameplay mechanics which, in this game, relates to the adaptation of Dark Souls combat formula in an already establisted franchise, where healing around combat didn't change that much from the first two games. Also, Dark Souls appeals to a more hardcore player base where, thus far, Dragon Age was more mainstream. There will be a substantial difference between DA2's more casual combat and this new approach. It's interesting to note that the advertisement coming out about the game is failing to inform about this fundamental shift, as if players aren't usually cranky about this sort of gameplay "surprises" from an otherwise familiar franchise.

This to me looks like the making of a backlash that could perhaps be mitigated by the careful placement of a familiar process: having health regeneration after combat that could depend on a number of factors.

You may not agree with this pre-emptive feedback but I'm basically trying to provide perspective on a potential cause of conflict.

[dlux]

I'm glad that health regen outside of combat is GONE. Good riddance too.

[Antimonde]

Its going to fail horribly and will be modded in for PC. Enough said.

[Lux]

Its going to fail horribly and will be modded in for PC. Enough said.

 

Sorry to say that Frostbite, the same engine that powers Battlefield 4, is very difficult to mod and any modification attempts will be limited. :/

[Zatche]

I don't really understand why you think this change will inherently make the game hardcore difficult in the vein of Dark Souls. The combat mechanics and the balance are completely different. There have been plenty of games with exploration and without health regeneration that have been balanced to still appeal to non hardcore players, yet I don't expect DAI to be as easy as Zelda (well, maybe on casual).

[Lux]

Because of classic play versus a brand new one and that a familiar cushion could smooth things up for casuals.

[dutch_gamer]

Its going to fail horribly and will be modded in for PC. Enough said.

And why would it fail horribly? DAI is not DAO's or DA 2's combat system with health regen and healing removed, the whole combat has been built from the ground up with less emphasis on healing in mind. If it "fails" in the mind of some it is probably because you are playing the game wrong.

 

Because of classic play versus a brand new one and that a familiar cushion could smooth things up for casuals.

That "cushion" doesn't work in a game with a combat system designed around not needing health regen. Instead of wanting a cushion one could attempt to just learn the new system instead of asking for the system to be changed back to something it was never meant to be. I really wonder how some gamers are able to play different type of games if they mainly want everything to stay the same between games because of the unwillingness to learn how to play with a different combat system. There are a good amount of games out there which have already shown that health regen outside of combat is not remotely needed.

[phantomrachie]

Its going to fail horribly and will be modded in for PC. Enough said.

 

you say that like DA:I is the only RPG not to have health regen.

 

Many modern RPGs don't , Skyrim, Fallout 3 & NV, Wasteland 2 to name a few.

[dutch_gamer]

you say that like DA:I is the only RPG not to have health regen.

 

Many modern RPGs don't , Skyrim, Fallout 3 & NV, Wasteland 2 to name a few.

This person is also of the believe the trinity is necessary and that without a game is failure. Yes, there are some bad examples but that is because those games attempted to remove the trinity (I like to call it a duality because it mainly revolves around the synergy between tank and healer) while not replacing it with anything else or basically they went full on DPS and nothing else. From the sound of it BioWare is not making this mistake.

[Paul E Dangerously]

you say that like DA:I is the only RPG not to have health regen.

 

Many modern RPGs don't , Skyrim, Fallout 3 & NV, Wasteland 2 to name a few.

 

Minor nitpick: You can get health regen in Fo3 / NV. Skyrim also has Regenerate Health spells/scrolls/potions.

[Sidney]

Well and lot of games don't have it natively but have items that grant it. I'm in Borderlands and they have no regen except my Oz kit allows it. Do we know if items will allow regen? Will make those very valuable items to have or craft.

 

I dislike the no regen because it is lazy. It is a lazy way for developers to turn mindless drudge fights vs trash mobs into a threat not because any individual fight is challenging but because of the attrition of many of these fights over time because problematic. The counter is that you need to use barrier and guard so that those soak up damage and I guess that is what you have to do but it really does now force THAT approach to combat whereas traditionally I went with high damage output so that I might take a beating but everything else died first and eschewed barrier, shields, rock armor and all the other names for additional armor/shields to that end.

[phantomrachie]

Minor nitpick: You can get health regen in Fo3 / NV. Skyrim also has Regenerate Health spells/scrolls/potions.

 

but only by picking a certain perk and even then your health might only regen in sun light and then health regen in Skyrim is base on potions/spells/scrolls so I don't think it counts as the type of auto heath regen that the OP wants DA:I to have.

[KoorahUK]

Well and lot of games don't have it natively but have items that grant it. I'm in Borderlands and they have no regen except my Oz kit allows it. Do we know if items will allow regen? Will make those very valuable items to have or craft.

 

You can craft items with a chance to leech health.

 

I dislike the no regen because it is lazy. It is a lazy way for developers to turn mindless drudge fights vs trash mobs into a threat not because any individual fight is challenging but because of the attrition of many of these fights over time because problematic. 

 

No, re-engineering the entire combat mechanics from the ground up instead of just porting over the old one is not "lazy". Its the very opposite of lazy. I'm not sure what you are trying to say with the second half of your sentence there but I'm pretty sure I don't agree with it. Most encounters in the Deep Roads felt pretty drudgy to me, but I survived each virtually identical encounter and as a result arrived at my destination as if nothing had happened otehr than I swept up some loot on the way. 

Thats not memorable combat in my opinion. 

 

The counter is that you need to use barrier and guard so that those soak up damage and I guess that is what you have to do but it really does now force THAT approach to combat whereas traditionally I went with high damage output so that I might take a beating but everything else died first and eschewed barrier, shields, rock armor and all the other names for additional armor/shields to that end.

 

You went in with overwhelming damage because, with Health Regen, all you had to do was down them before they downed you. Fight over, health back to full, move on. The fight was meaningless other than a pair of torn leggings, a +2 Mana/Stamina Regen ring and another 2 minutes sunk into the games duration. This new system will force people to re-evaluate the same old strategies its true, but...thats kinda the point.

I have no doubt there will be plenty of ways of avoiding the standard cookie cutter approach once we've had our hands on the game. I actually think parties of all the same class are more viable now than before, ironically, because combat is based around mitigation and avoidance which can be done by any class in different ways, rather than healing damage which can only be done by mages.

Its not about making combat artificially difficult because they "are lazy", its about making it more meaningful and trying something new.

[Paul E Dangerously]

You can craft items with a chance to leech health.

 

If it's anything like DA2 (and in many ways, DAI seems to be DA2.5) it's going to be so miniscule as to be useless.

[KoorahUK]

If it's anything like DA2 (and in many ways, DAI seems to be DA2.5) it's going to be so miniscule as to be useless.

Guess we'll have to wait and see. I'm certainly not planning my combat strategy around it. I'd prefer items that boosted Guard to prevent needing to leech health in the first place. 

[Sidney]

The problem is trash mobs fights are meaningless. I hated the a Roads for slogging through mindless fight after mindless fight. Yes, high damage output was predicated on health regen and being able to "win" a fight even if I had 1 HP per party member to end the fight because by the time I had my next mindless fight I was back. High damage output let me blow through those fights faster as well so the slog seemed less...sloggy?

The change that has been made doesn't make trash mob fights less trashy. It changes how you fight them it sounds like. You toss up barriers and guard and then grind away at them. It is a safer, albeit, slower way to fight. There is still no intent that any individual encounter is dangerous but now the accumulation of damage as you slog through something like the Roads for example will eventually become a threat. It does make me worry that the Roads are going to be the "model" because it is just that sort of dungeon that will play well to to attritional model no health regen wants to use.

[Lux]

 

but only by picking a certain perk and even then your health might only regen in sun light and then health regen in Skyrim is base on potions/spells/scrolls so I don't think it counts as the type of auto heath regen that the OP wants DA:I to have.

 

It's more about options with a little bit of continuity for me. Dragon Age had as many potions you wanted but with a recharge timer + health regen post combat + camp. Now it will be something like 8 potions for 4 characters + camps.

 

Casual gamers might not understand the departure from a more forgiving setting - that seems to be popular, giving sales figures from less "severe" RPGs - to a more hardcore flavor.

 

 

 

You went in with overwhelming damage because, with Health Regen, all you had to do was down them before they downed you. Fight over, health back to full, move on. The fight was meaningless other than a pair of torn leggings, a +2 Mana/Stamina Regen ring and another 2 minutes sunk into the games duration. This new system will force people to re-evaluate the same old strategies its true, but...thats kinda the point.

 

Hope it's not: fight over >> go back to camp >> move on to that-a-place and curse your mount because it doesn't go any faster.