242 réponses à ce sujet

[Keroko]

The lore argument cuts both ways anyway. There was always a bit of a disconnect between creation magic as a gameplay feature and creation magic in the lore. When shown in lore, it seems really hard and time consuming. Whereas in the game the entire party gets topped out in the blink of an eye.

[Realmzmaster]

Having no Health regen in Baldur's Gate didnt really effect much since you had Healing Spells, Carry as many Potions as you wanted/could afford, and in the wilderness could camp where ever you wanted, granted no enemies where around. and or Pay for an Inn room in every town.

 

So I've been reading this thread for a bit, and I am still confused.

 

Are there Healing Spells in DA:I or.... not. 

 

I have read people mention Buffing spells to Increase Armor or Magic Resist, Resurrection, but no clear Yes or No as to if healing spells are a thing or not.

 

With Limited Potions, No healing spells, and only being able to Camp, at a "Camp Site"  Exploring on the highest difficulity seems like its going to be a chore.

 

I enjoy playing games on a harder difficulity due to the fact that one shotting everything and enemies not denting my HP pool is very boring to em.

 

Employing strategy is what I enjoy, not facerolling and winning without a scratch on me.

 

But it seems that playing the game on Hard will just be a chore, with enemies having more HP and dealing more dmg, forcing you to run back and camp after every fight/buy more pots, etc, and not employing more advanced tactics.

 

I got a bit off track but

 

 

 

 

TL;DR  Are healing spells in this game?  Do enemies get "Smarter" as difficulity is increased, or just get more DMG and HP?

 

Baldur's Gate had a limited amount of healing spells further limited by the vancian casting system. Healing potions also were not in abundance and had to be managed by the party. The big difference with BG is that it had a party of six. So you could dedicate the cleric or druid to be a healer or include a paladin or ranger ( but their healing spells could only be selected when a certain level was reached . If you spec your wizard or sorcerer to be a healer you limited your major damage dealer and crowd controller.  Imagine the vancian casting system with a party of four instead of the mana system used in DA.

 

As I stated before it is a matter of resource and party management and advanced tactical thinking and decision making  will be necessary at higher levels.

[Remmirath]

I'm quite glad that health regeneration is gone. I don't like it. It means that the moment you exit combat you don't have to worry until the next time you enter combat, and there's no sort of long-term planning -- get through that one fight and you're good. Health regeneration (without resting) also makes little to no sense.

When did health regeneration become the expectation, anyhow? I think of it was being the new, unexpected thing. I doubt it is most people's expectation.

The lore argument cuts both ways anyway. There was always a bit of a disconnect between creation magic as a gameplay feature and creation magic in the lore. When shown in lore, it seems really hard and time consuming. Whereas in the game the entire party gets topped out in the blink of an eye.

Yes. This is often a problem in games; healing magic is more effective in-game than it's said to be. Particularly jarring when people die and you could technically have healed or resurrected them...

Also, since the main healer available in DA:O was Wynne and the main one available in DA II was Anders, you could pretty easily make the case that only spirit healers are really effective healers or something to that effect. This bothers me much less than enemy mages flitting around the battlefield when there is no teleportation. Or one could assume that the tears in the Fade are making it more difficult to cast healing magic, or some such. Still -- I don't mind healing spells, and I'm indifferent to their being gone. I'm happy that health regeneration is gone.

[AlanC9]

I'm quite glad that health regeneration is gone. I don't like it. It means that the moment you exit combat you don't have to worry until the next time you enter combat, and there's no sort of long-term planning -- get through that one fight and you're good.

Well, theoretically, you could balance the combat so players do have to think about their potion stock, etc. Whether this has ever been accomplished in practice is another matter. In practice it'd play fairly similar what we're getting anyway; in effect, your potion stock would be the party HP total.

Health regeneration (without resting) also makes little to no sense.

I can see why they added health regen. Can you imagine the howls if DA:O hadn't had health regeneration but did have healing spells and mana regeneration?

[Malvus]

I like how everyone ignores my post. No one complained when healing was in DA:O and DA II. Now masochist shitheads are defending the lack of healing because they want their Dark Souls in Dragon Age. Yeah, no.

[PhroXenGold]

I like how everyone ignores my post. No one complained when healing was in DA:O and DA II. Now masochist shitheads are defending the lack of healing because they want their Dark Souls in Dragon Age. Yeah, no.

 

 

1) grow up

2) read the thread

[Remmirath]

Well, theoretically, you could balance the combat so players do have to think about their potion stock, etc. Whether this has ever been accomplished in practice is another matter. In practice it'd play fairly similar what we're getting anyway; in effect, your potion stock would be the party HP total.

True, but then it still wouldn't matter if you encountered combat again shortly after the last combat, so long as you had a little time to regenerate.

I can see why they added health regen. Can you imagine the howls if DA:O hadn't had health regeneration but did have healing spells and mana regeneration?

I certainly wouldn't've had a problem with it. Well, I'd've preferred no mana regeneration as well, but healing spells are fine with me. There have been plenty of game with no health regeneration and healing spells. It certainly once was the norm; I suppose it might not be now, but I still don't think it's that unusual.

[Keroko]

When did health regeneration become the expectation, anyhow? I think of it was being the new, unexpected thing. I doubt it is most people's expectation.

 

While the system itself has existed as far back as the 1980's, they tended to be exceptions rather than the rule and it didn't become the mainstay of video games until the 2000's. The success of Halo is often credited as being the turning point where regenerating health became the norm in video games.

 

 

I can see why they added health regen. Can you imagine the howls if DA:O hadn't had health regeneration but did have healing spells and mana regeneration?

 

KotoR had exactly this. It didn't lead to howling, and everyone was fine with it then, but... in hindsight it did lead to drops in gameplay post combat as you'd just heal up after each combat the moment you got a jedi.

 

 

I like how everyone ignores my post. No one complained when healing was in DA:O and DA II. Now masochist shitheads are defending the lack of healing because they want their Dark Souls in Dragon Age. Yeah, no.

 

Sorry, must have missed your post. Yeah, everyone was fine with healing in Origins and DAII. That doesn't mean we can't prefer a system without it.

 

But mostly we're just countering the baseless claims that a lack of healing will ruin the game.

[Lux]

I like how everyone ignores my post. No one complained when healing was in DA:O and DA II. Now masochist shitheads are defending the lack of healing because they want their Dark Souls in Dragon Age. Yeah, no.

 

You definitely have a good point, but the way you said it leads to this:

 

1) grow up

2) read the thread

 

Which would be a fair enough reaction that takes away all focus from the valid points.

 

It's this kind of interaction that can happen when more people start to play the game and are unaware of the changes, don't understand them, and come to the forums to vent their frustrations. People fine with it will react, and those already sensitive will be offended and get more frustrated. A toxic atmosphere is thus created that will only reinforce each other's radically different viewpoints. 

 

Anyway, I've said my piece. I think I've exposed my concerns well enough and hope that BioWare has already considered the implications of the more limited way that healing is done post combat, that greatly modifies a perceived useful feature, combined with a somewhat counter-intuitive approach to how damage is handled, and ultimately affecting how players will be able to process the massive open world areas.

 

I analyse potential issues as a systems admin all the time and I'm in constant contact with less tech savvy people; as an experienced gamer, my "spider sense" is tingling on this one. But I would prefer not to be right.

 

I want to thank everyone for their feedback. Have fun with Inquisition!

[Razyx]

You definitely have a good point, but the way you said it leads to this:

 

 

 

 

PhroXenGold, on 24 Oct 2014 - 09:25 AM, said:

1) grow up

2) read the thread
 

 

 

Which would be a fair enough reaction that takes away all focus from the valid points.

 

It's this kind of interaction that can happen when more people start to play the game and are unaware of the changes, don't understand them, and come to the forums to vent their frustrations. People fine with it will react, and those already sensitive will be offended and get more frustrated. A toxic atmosphere is thus created that will only reinforce each other's radically different viewpoints. 

 

Anyway, I've said my piece. I think I've exposed my concerns well enough and hope that BioWare has already considered the implications of the more limited way that healing is done post combat, that greatly modifies a perceived useful feature, combined with a somewhat counter-intuitive approach to how damage is handled, and ultimately affecting how players will be able to process the massive open world areas.

 

I analyse potential issues as a systems admin all the time and I'm in constant contact with less tech savvy people; as an experienced gamer, my "spider sense" is tingling on this one. But I would prefer not to be right.

 

I want to thank everyone for their feedback. Have fun with Inquisition!

 

Probably you are right on having concerns about the health/exploration/combat symbiosis but till we put our hands on the game is something like a futile act 'be afraid' of the unknown.

 

There's something that took me out of this 'concern', a dev that talked about how he is not a tactical guy in combat and was going on in DAI without much problems, even better compared with DA:O, DAII...
Afterall If you think about that crafting is not a must the game has to have a well thought balance (damage/health ratio)... If not we will ask for some kind of camping to craft potions or the like   

[phantomrachie]

You definitely have a good point, but the way you said it leads to this:

 

Regardless of how they said it, I don't think their point is valid.

 

It leads to the assumption that BioWare should only change things that people complain about and never experiment on their own.

 

Who cares if no on complained about health regen in DA:O & DA2, their combat systems seem to be different to DA:I, which was designed from the ground up to 

accommodate for the fact that there is no health regen.

 

Game Developers should take both fan feedback & their own desire to try something new, when designing a game or a new feature for a game series. 

 

Otherwise games will stagnate

[Muspade]

 Not everyone wants to grind 5 hours before each battle for potions and other rubbish.

1. Read up
2. Grow up
3. Come back when you're updated.

[Malvus]

Regardless of how they said it, I don't think their point is valid.

 

It leads to the assumption that BioWare should only change things that people complain about and never experiment on their own.

 

Who cares if no on complained about health regen in DA:O & DA2, their combat systems seem to be different to DA:I, which was designed from the ground up to 

accommodate for the fact that there is no health regen.

 

Game Developers should take both fan feedback & their own desire to try something new, when designing a game or a new feature for a game series. 

 

Otherwise games will stagnate

Nuh-huh. It's called option. Lower difficulties imply a game is easier to play and not harder. Sure, you can regen 50% and 25% but you could leave those for higher difficulties. Besides, how is no healing even a new feature? They should make people like you play with a whip in one hand and hit yourself with it each time you chug a potion or craft better armor. No healing isn't helping anyone. No one was up in arms about healing before. Now you white-knight douchebags come to defend it because what? You want a harder game? Is that it? I doubt you even know yourselves. No healing won't do anyone any favors. It's not lore-unfriendly and it's not gonna break the game. ****** go stagnate yourself.

[KoorahUK]

1)grow up

2)read the thread

If you're going to be a troll you can go **** yourself frankly. Being condescending doesn't help with countering hypocrisy.  I somehow doubt you even know what is actually being discussed here. Regen outside combat. It was in the last 2 games, no one ****** went batshit over it and now everyone wants it to be Dark Souls. If you're gonna be a masochist go do it where it doesn't affect anyone else. Not everyone wants to grind 5 hours before each battle for potions and other rubbish.

For a start, calling other forumites "shitheads" becasue they have a differing opinion to you (which you don;t even seem to understand) shows a massive lack of maturity. hence, "grow up"

Secondly, the rest of this post, and your insistance that DA:I will be like Dark Souls combat shows how little you understand the changes being discussed, hence "read the thread".

When you are ready to join the debate and converse like a grown up let us know. 

[Malvus]

1. Read up
2. Grow up
3. Come back when you're updated.

Really? What are you? 10? All you can come up with are condescending posts? 

[Muspade]

Really? What are you? 10? All you can come up with are condescending posts?

That's funny, coming from you...

[KoorahUK]

Really? What are you? 10? All you can come up with are condescending posts? 

Who is the one calling others "shitheads" and "douchbags"? Seriously do you even read what you post?

[Razyx]

[...] No healing isn't helping anyone. No one was up in arms about healing before. Now you white-knight douchebags come to defend it because what? You want a harder game? Is that it? I doubt you even know yourselves. No healing won't do anyone any favors. It's not lore-unfriendly and it's not gonna break the game. ****** go stagnate yourself.

 

Who needs to defend anything..., again, have you played the game to make such statements (harder game, break the game, etc)?

[Malvus]

For a start, calling other forumites "shitheads" becasue they have a differing opinion to you (which you don;t even seem to understand) shows a massive lack of maturity. hence, "grow up"

Secondly, the rest of this post, and your insistance that DA:I will be like Dark Souls combat shows how little you understand the changes being discussed, hence "read the thread".

When you are ready to join the debate and converse like a grown up let us know. 

Oh, you poor little thing. Boo-hoo-hoo. I feel so sorry for you that you were insulted. Would you like a free estus flask shard? You actually have no idea how it will work do ya? It feels like talking to a brick wall. I like how you hypocrites come out of nowhere and defend this ****. How come you weren't all teary eyed when Origins and DA 2 had it? Yeah, that's what I thought. Grow up.

[Muspade]

Oh, you poor little thing. Boo-hoo-hoo. I feel so sorry for you that you were insulted. Would you like a free estus flask shard? You actually have no idea how it will work do ya? It feels like talking to a brick wall. I like how you hypocrites come out of nowhere and defend this ****. How come you weren't all teary eyed when Origins and DA 2 had it? Yeah, that's what I thought. Grow up.

This guy....Oh, wow.

Spoiler

[Malvus]

Who needs to defend anything..., again, have you played the game to make such statements (harder game, break the game, etc)?

Yes, I have played an early build of it. You done?

[KoorahUK]

Oh, you poor little thing. Boo-hoo-hoo. I feel so sorry for you that you were insulted. Would you like a free estus flask shard? You actually have no idea how it will work do ya? It feels like talking to a brick wall. I like how you hypocrites come out of nowhere and defend this ****. How come you weren't all teary eyed when Origins and DA 2 had it? Yeah, that's what I thought. Grow up.

Offended? Jesus Christ kid, you know nothing about me.

Being called a shithead and a douchbag doesn't offend me, in fact I think its pretty laughable, but if you can't see the irony of calling out other people for being condesending and immature when you are hurling insults around yourself, you need to get some perspective.

[KoorahUK]

Yes, I have played an early build of it. You done?

You realise that nobody is going to believe that right? 

[Lux]

Malvus, you're going overboard with your comments. Lower down the tone and be more civil, otherwise don't get surprised if your account is banned. 

[Semyaza82]

It's a whole new system for managing health - it might take a bit of getting used, to but until people have time play to an extended period of time complaining about it seems premature. Even if you played an early build you don't know what has changed since that point, plus doesn't seem like a stretch to suggest that you probably didn't have time to really get to grips with the tactics (correct if i'm wrong about that though).