This might seem like an unusual question,
but how do you change Kelly's dancer outfit in ME2 into for instance just her normal outfit?
Thus, for when she comes up for post-Suicide Mission cuddling and dancing, she just wears her regular outfit (or any other outfit that would be easier to mod).
Thanks at beforehand:)
You're right. It seems like an unusual question!
I'm on console, so I'm no help, but I'd be surprised if there wasn't a way to do it on PC.
You're right. It seems like an unusual question!
I'm on console, so I'm no help, but I'd be surprised if there wasn't a way to do it on PC.
Oh well, here's hoping someone knows:p
My guess is, you'd have to find Kelly's actor object in the Captain's cabin BioD pcc file, then redirect the model appearance references in that object to the outfit you want or change the mesh and texture reference objects, depending on how it's set up. (this assumes that ME2 works similar to ME3 in that regard but I think it would).
I'd say it's possible but since ME2 is more tedious to mod than ME3 these days i would probably take a while to find everything.
My guess is, you'd have to find Kelly's actor object in the Captain's cabin BioD pcc file, then redirect the model appearance references in that object to the outfit you want or change the mesh and texture reference objects, depending on how it's set up. (this assumes that ME2 works similar to ME3 in that regard but I think it would).
I'd say it's possible but since ME2 is more tedious to mod than ME3 these days i would probably take a while to find everything.
I figured it wouldn't be as easy as for example giving Shepard other casual outfits, but darn, hm...
Being a complete rookie at modding, I wouldn't know how to figure that stuff out myself:s And odd, I always figured ME2 was easier to mod (with stuff like this at least) than ME3. As I said, total rookie.
In any case, if anyone would know how to make this work exactly, I'd greatly appreciate it:)
The ME games are anything but mod-friendly. Which makes the modding tasks performed by some resident modders here (MEHEM, for example) all the more damn impressive. Anywayyyy...
IMO, which doesn't mean much, I would think that changing the texture of her dancing outfit to be easier than actually changing the outfit shes wearing. If that makes sense. That could potentially be done through texmod, I think, without messing with ME3Explorer. Though saying it would be easier doesn't mean much - everything in perspective right? Like I said, ME isn't the friendliest place for a modder. I cannot help much with this other than to direct you to the ME3Explorer forum where you may find guides on modding or better access to help from savvy users who mod. Not saying none of them are here, of course. Just that you may find help a bit quicker there since its pretty much dedicated to the modding of the game and use of ME3Explorer. Their guides and such helped me out a lot back when I was doing a few mild mod tweaks to my game, such as unlocking the Citadel DLC outfit for all-time use (casual wear) and switching armor stats around to make a preferred set be more flattering to my classes skills.
http://me3explorer.freeforums.org/
Yes, changing the texture through, e.g. texplorer or texmod is much easier. The problem is, you will change every instance of the dancer outfit in the game. E.g. if you walk into Afterlife at Omega, you may find that some Asari in a Cerberus outfit is now dancing around the pole. Might break immersion (well, maybe it's a theme night, right 
).
You could of course only use texmod when you invite Kelly up but you'd have to restart the game every time.
So yea, I guess your choice is between a "hard to do but care-free afterwords" solution or an "easy to do but only works under certain circumstances" solution.
In any case, it's not a perfect world.
Oh, btw, I just notice a typo in my post above, which might lead to a misunderstanding, where it said "i would probably take a while to find everything." that was supposed to mean "it would probably take a while to find everything.".
Sorry, don't have the time to figure this out at the moment.
The ME games are anything but mod-friendly. Which makes the modding tasks performed by some resident modders here (MEHEM, for example) all the more damn impressive. Anywayyyy...
IMO, which doesn't mean much, I would think that changing the texture of her dancing outfit to be easier than actually changing the outfit shes wearing. If that makes sense. That could potentially be done through texmod, I think, without messing with ME3Explorer. Though saying it would be easier doesn't mean much - everything in perspective right? Like I said, ME isn't the friendliest place for a modder. I cannot help much with this other than to direct you to the ME3Explorer forum where you may find guides on modding or better access to help from savvy users who mod. Not saying none of them are here, of course. Just that you may find help a bit quicker there since its pretty much dedicated to the modding of the game and use of ME3Explorer. Their guides and such helped me out a lot back when I was doing a few mild mod tweaks to my game, such as unlocking the Citadel DLC outfit for all-time use (casual wear) and switching armor stats around to make a preferred set be more flattering to my classes skills.
Oh yes, I tried to modify one thing, turning off the hints in ME2 (since when you have after-Suicide Mission cuddling and a message pops up and stays there saying 'Press F to continue', it really gets on your nerves), ME2 plain wouldn't start. On the other hand, tricking the game into turning those off is apparently tedious and annoying, even for advanced modders.
Thanks man, I'll go ask over there^^ Sure is worth a try.
Yes, changing the texture through, e.g. texplorer or texmod is much easier. The problem is, you will change every instance of the dancer outfit in the game. E.g. if you walk into Afterlife at Omega, you may find that some Asari in a Cerberus outfit is now dancing around the pole. Might break immersion (well, maybe it's a theme night, right
You could of course only use texmod when you invite Kelly up but you'd have to restart the game every time.
So yea, I guess your choice is between a "hard to do but care-free afterwords" solution or an "easy to do but only works under certain circumstances" solution.
In any case, it's not a perfect world.
Oh, btw, I just notice a typo in my post above, which might lead to a misunderstanding, where it said "i would probably take a while to find everything." that was supposed to mean "it would probably take a while to find everything.".
Sorry, don't have the time to figure this out at the moment.
I didn't misunderstand and I'm glad you guys wanted to help me out with this.
I guess the hardest part would be finding the right .tpf to load (and where to put it), because texmod (e.g. temporary) sounds fine to me.
Over to the ME3 explorer forums we go;)
Since she uses the same stripper clothes as Asari dancers (I didn't realize that because I never romance her - I'm faithful to Tali damnit!) you could probably 'cheat' a bit by finding a pre-existing mod that effects their clothes. I'd be surprised if there isn't one that makes them more slutty or naked - even in a hard-to-mod game like Mass Effect theres gotta be some T&A mod. Using that mod as a guideline you can find out what clothes need to be changed and then nab another mod that effects the Normandy Cerberus clothes (or you know, whatever you want) and borrow its texture/mesh file.
I'm not sure how practical that would all be since I never actually tried making a texture mod and always relied on more talented individuals. Though I think it should work. All you need to know is what ... reference number or whatever links to the stripper outfit. I don't know what its called but I'm sure theres some kind of filename or something that you need to use to point it at the right asset. Basically if you find a stripper mod and an outfit mod you should be able to Frankenstein the two together, using the relevant parts to make your task easier and save you the hassle of hunting down stuff.
Get what I'm saying? Like, since she wears the stripper outfit use a stripper mod (I dont know if there is one but I'd be damned surprised if there wasn't) to find the location and another mod to apply a texture/mesh. Tada, benefit from others work and labor. Is that wrong? I'm not sure.
Again, I've never tried making a texture mod so I don't know if its more complicated than that. I might be speaking out of my ass here. In which case, sorry. I'm just trying to offer up some hopefully useful suggestions.
wonder if you change the dancer outfit to Miranda black loyal outfit? Also can you change her cerberus outfit to miranda black outfit too?
Since she uses the same stripper clothes as Asari dancers (I didn't realize that because I never romance her - I'm faithful to Tali damnit!) you could probably 'cheat' a bit by finding a pre-existing mod that effects their clothes. I'd be surprised if there isn't one that makes them more slutty or naked - even in a hard-to-mod game like Mass Effect theres gotta be some T&A mod. Using that mod as a guideline you can find out what clothes need to be changed and then nab another mod that effects the Normandy Cerberus clothes (or you know, whatever you want) and borrow its texture/mesh file.
I'm not sure how practical that would all be since I never actually tried making a texture mod and always relied on more talented individuals. Though I think it should work. All you need to know is what ... reference number or whatever links to the stripper outfit. I don't know what its called but I'm sure theres some kind of filename or something that you need to use to point it at the right asset. Basically if you find a stripper mod and an outfit mod you should be able to Frankenstein the two together, using the relevant parts to make your task easier and save you the hassle of hunting down stuff.
Get what I'm saying? Like, since she wears the stripper outfit use a stripper mod (I dont know if there is one but I'd be damned surprised if there wasn't) to find the location and another mod to apply a texture/mesh. Tada, benefit from others work and labor. Is that wrong? I'm not sure.
Again, I've never tried making a texture mod so I don't know if its more complicated than that. I might be speaking out of my ass here. In which case, sorry. I'm just trying to offer up some hopefully useful suggestions.
They are indeed useful suggestions:D I will certainly try, but I probably won't succeed:p You never know though:p Let's see for those mods...
Creating a high quality texture mod would obviously be complicated, creating 'a' texture mod isn't per say.
You'd have to look into how to use texmod (logging mode & package mode) and look into texture formats in mass effect.
Here are some guides:
http://ottemods.blog...-files-tpf.html
http://forum.bioware...1#entry16613881
https://www.youtube....h?v=Sus1yGuoBgA
Creating a high quality texture mod would obviously be complicated, creating 'a' texture mod isn't per say.
You'd have to look into how to use texmod (logging mode & package mode) and look into texture formats in mass effect.
Here are some guides:
http://ottemods.blog...-files-tpf.html
I thought to myself: Well, can't find anyone who's done it (it being swapping Kelly's dancer outfit for her normal outfit for the cuddle scene), so let's do it myself.
I did use texmod before to use a .tpf for a tali reskin (which I got working checking every supposedly needed box),
but didn't use logging mode before.
I'm stupidly stuck because the red text simply doesn't appear in Mass Effect 2 (it runs normally), causing me to get up to there in the video tutorial and no further.
Details I can think of that might cause this... I bought Mass Effect 2 on Origin, I have Windows 7 (64-bit)... Note: I know little to zip about any of this stuff, I just play games and make a machinima (which I feel I should mention I'm trying to do this for, just in case that will get reviling or something).
I am running Texmod as an Administrator. The Draw Control and Texture info box is checked. I have flycam on F1, other stuff on other buttons that are not F6, which I put as the log button. The red text doesn't show in Mass Effect 1, running ME2 with Origin logged in or off doesn't do anything.
Possibly unrelated, I seem to have forgotten one or two checks for the .tpf to work in ME2, since I can't get it to work again (in package mode).
You can run ME2 bypassing your Origin library. Just open texmod.exe and go straight to the install folder to open ME2Game.exe (not MassEffect2.exe)
You can run ME2 bypassing your Origin library. Just open texmod.exe and go straight to the install folder to open ME2Game.exe (not MassEffect2.exe)
Well, now (technically hours ago, but it still applies at the moment) I feel like an idiot... That was the check I needed for running the .tpf as well.
If you want to read about my perilous journey, do continue after this paragraph. If not, just read the following part: I swapped both extractable dancer outfit textures with Kelly's normal uniform confirmed main texture and it created a seamless outfit... but it's quite different in multiple areas from her actual normal outfit xD
I figure the game (any modern game most probably) is told where to find each piece they need: gloves, sleeves, upper part of the outfit, etc. I also figured the normal map was the one telling them this (or at least how to fold), but I guess I either did something wrong or need to change something that I don't know how to find, which is the 'put this piece there' 'thing' or file. I would think people don't have issues with this because they change the original textures, rather than outright replace them with another one with differen positions on the texture for hands, legs, back, etc. Did I mention I have no idea how this all works?
Read on for my multiple experiments that were in the end fruitless in getting any closer to Kelly's outfit. It's almost as if... Kelly's dancer model isn't her body (which if I think about it for two seconds, wouldn't be all too surprising). That or I somehow extracted an unknown texture, which I triple checked: it's the same texture all the female crew members use.
Now after I read your post and used your links (I can't say I understand all of it), I managed to get Mass Effect 2 to swap two textures of the dancer outfit for Kelly's normal outfit, BUT it results in a weird semi-transparent shiny hybrid. (Of note is that both normal uniform textures or maps are 512x512 and the dancer outfit textures or maps I managed to get are 512x512 and 256x256)
Extra note: I first tried all this with .DDS before letting texmod save .JPG's so I could see them. Using .JPG's might ruin the alpha channel (which I figure might be causing this mess), though as I said, I used .DDS first with only the (seemingly to me at least) primary textures (the diffuse ones, I'm guessing), had one swap out for the other and it produced the weird hybrid that I'm still stuck with while using two replacing textures (though yes the second one should normally not matter nearly as much as the first, they still overlap instead of the old ones going away).
I repeatedly failed to to extract two other textures or maps, one for each outfit, which by the look of it are the normal maps purpleish and blue), which are apparently indeed hard to extract from the game. I don't own Photoshop and I have no idea how to make a normal map or modify one, though I suppose if I could get the number of the dancer outfit's normal map and the actual normal map of Kelly's normal outfit, I might get this fixed, assuming not swapping out the normal map is the main problem.
I've been at this for hours and I'm not sure screenshotting the normal map and cutting it down and swapping one for the other is going to fix this shiny hybrid and I'm guessing I did something stupid again, though I can't figure out what, since most tutorials talk about modifying an existing texture and swapping it out instead of using another texture. I figure Kelly's dancer outfit having heels and her normal uniform not having those and the dancer outfit being shiny 'should' cause problems in the first place.
Update:- I noticed it was strange there would be Cerberus symbols on the back of her hands... Resized the normal uniform's texture that replaced the smaller one (256x256) so it would be the same. Didn't do anything though.
- Changed which texture was swapped with a uniform one. Hardly a change, so the second one is probably mostly for accents... I could probably just stick to one texture being swapped, excluding the red-green one from Kelly's normal uniform.
- Next up, figuring out if I simply forgot to swap out her skin areas, though for the non-head stuff I thought they were included in the outfit textures, rather than put somewhere separately... Ah heck, they are. Explains only one male and one female outfit for crew members with all skin colors... And, which I didn't know yet, the blue skin zones for the asari come from the model or texture underneath and don't come from themselves. Must be that grayscales stuff. Hm, so does that mean I have to track down the skin textures of the hands, neckline and err, legs? Then again, the normal uniform appeared semi-transparent over the dancer outfit anyway... Then again there were the Cerberus symbols... NOPE, no skin textures found for hands, arms, legs or chest (that light up green when the outfit doesn't anyway).
- There is the strange texture that is left that is a rectangular black bow with orange stripes, which might help with marking the uniform a bit more but for the rest, beats me:(
- FINAL check: The dancers at Omega wear the exact same euh, 'creation' of mine. So... what now? I'm guessing the normal map (and/or another map) is what I need. Time to try to cut it out of a screenshot I guess... Ah, had the dancer outfit normal map (confirmed) swap out with the normal uniform. Didn't do anything:(
The UV wrap (which determines which element of the body is mapped where on a texture) comes from the 3D model itself, that's why you are limited by the layout of the original dancer textures and the channel use of the spec map (changing it messes with things, aka weird glow effects for instance). Specmap channel usage varies so one outfits textures won't always work in place of anothers. This info is in the link i posted, the info on textures in my thread. The model is also shared with the other strippers, as was pointed out before.
What you are trying to do is impossible without replacing the mesh (which you can't in me2). You can change the look of the stripper outfit within restraints of the original, aka an altered bodysuit following the same wrap as the original suit.
Extracting a normalmap in me2 is done through screen capping or going through texplorer (me3explorer).
Diffuse textures show a flat version of your mesh's texture and look. The spec map controls the way it responds to light and tracks various other overlay effects like skincolour/outfit light locations and material sheen effects. These maps are greyscale (black negative white positive) and their function predetermined per channel (RGBA). The normalmap adds a degree of depth and as such detail to your objects ( more realistic texturing) and light reflectivity. You need all three for a proper edit.
(If you feel the need to tear out your hair while reading this, think 'why is he not getting it?!' and you want to punch me in the face, it's because I'm really, really bad with this kind of stuff; (exaggeration follows) it's a miracle I don't crash my computer when editing a simple episode. I'm much better with science and college level mathematics for scientists (people studying mathematics in college are just as much space wizards to me))
I want to thank you for all your help on this and I find your thread to be thorough, detailed and well-written. Sadly, I am really, really bad at understanding this stuff.
In any case, from what I've gathered and what you clarified (which I can't thank you enough for), I'm not going to get what I want by dabbling anymore in this (emphasis on dabbling, which is the extent of my abilities). A bodysuit isn't what I'm looking for, only the exact same uniform (I'm an annoying little brat aren't I).
I have used two mods where you can play as squadmates in ME2 and they were quite impressive (if very buggy). No idea how to do that with squadmates and there seems to be much more of an interest in taking stuff from NPC's for your Shepard then the other way around.
The key element for the scene I needed this 'swap' for was Kelly wearing her normal uniform while cuddling (I feel more and more embarassed using that word, but it's the best I got) with a male customshep. I found a Kelly ME2 headmorph which will be useful for a shot of her leaving, but not for pasting together a still of Jacob and Femshep and Maleshep and Kelly (it will look wrong, though I'll try it if I'm desperate enoughxD). I guess I'll have to use a lot of editing tricks OR get better at modding (in a short time).
Now I sound ungrateful, which is not my intention. I can tell you I put a couple of hours in this (okay, peanuts compared to what other modders do) and am at a loss how I could get this in ME2, if it's even possible (I'd need to replace the mesh, which is impossible in ME2 as you say, or use another method which I don't know).
I don't think you're stupid, honestly with indepth texture information like this, most of it is most likely going to go straight over someone's head and start to slowly make sense the more you struggle with it. More and more 'ooooh and 'aaah' moments, so to speak =) It helps when working with textures when you keep the original close and compare a lot, it's possible to extrapolate a lot from just looking at them closely but it takes practice.
I'm afraid you'd need what we all need, a capable programmer to port the meshmod tools over from ME3 to ME1/2. It's not an impossibility as much as we just do not have a programmer with the time to port the functionality over and because of that we're stuck where we are atm.
Crewmate swaps are a different beast as they can be hacked together avoiding mesh modding but for non-playable characters we don't have the information we need in places we can get to it I'm afraid. For Shep you have gibbed and the coalesced to mess around with, but they are limited in therms of followers/NPC's if not completely useless. Mesh modding can be a clean solution to this problem but unfortunately not available as it stands.
The only way to achieve a mesh swap now would be what Fob described a ways back up, where you go into the actual code and change the line what refers to the stripper armor to the default outfit, unfortunately I have zero experience there and couldn't tell you where to start looking. Others might be able to help / point in the right direction / have experience.
You could also look into 3D posing software perhaps, a lot of these models you can download here and there already converted for such programs, maybe you'd be able to get some decent stills otherwise impossible that way. Obviously not the easiest thing to pick up (and do well) but certainly a nice challenge =)
I don't think you're stupid, honestly with indepth texture information like this, most of it is most likely going to go straight over someone's head and start to slowly make sense the more you struggle with it. More and more 'ooooh and 'aaah' moments, so to speak =) It helps when working with textures when you keep the original close and compare a lot, it's possible to extrapolate a lot from just looking at them closely but it takes practice.
I'm afraid you'd need what we all need, a capable programmer to port the meshmod tools over from ME3 to ME1/2. It's not an impossibility as much as we just do not have a programmer with the time to port the functionality over and because of that we're stuck where we are atm.
Crewmate swaps are a different beast as they can be hacked together avoiding mesh modding but for non-playable characters we don't have the information we need in places we can get to it I'm afraid. For Shep you have gibbed and the coalesced to mess around with, but they are limited in therms of followers/NPC's if not completely useless. Mesh modding can be a clean solution to this problem but unfortunately not available as it stands.
The only way to achieve a mesh swap now would be what Fob described a ways back up, where you go into the actual code and change the line what refers to the stripper armor to the default outfit, unfortunately I have zero experience there and couldn't tell you where to start looking. Others might be able to help / point in the right direction / have experience.
You could also look into 3D posing software perhaps, a lot of these models you can download here and there already converted for such programs, maybe you'd be able to get some decent stills otherwise impossible that way. Obviously not the easiest thing to pick up (and do well) but certainly a nice challenge =)
They're great games and I've been able to do some great things with them in my machinima, but they have shown how less than handy they are for modding:(
I'll certainly look into that 3D posing software, all the more because I really want to have conversations happen between quarian characters while not reusing all the firebases because mp has even more limits for machinima... and that's just a total pain. Still, it will be hilarious.
So now you know how I get myself into these messes and why I ask such strange questions. I've stuck to using Kelly in her dancer outfit, using the most strategic of angles to make her seem more modest (which was the goal, since the dancer outfit did always seem very... slutty?) in it and hint she and Customshep change positions when you're not looking xD
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