72 réponses à ce sujet

[Slogbarg]

I take it this level of facial scarring would be out of the question?

 

[In Exile]

I don't think this dude will help me rule:

 

[Lee T]

The problem I see is that a system like that could end up gimmicky. There is so much fight in those games and there's not that much space available on a character to show skin. Furthermore, though I do not spend much time designing my characters, I agree that look should fit with how the player envisio his chafter's personnality. When designing a face, putting a scar on it is not something you do at random.

I wouldn't mind a story related scar appearing on my character, but I have no interest in having a scar appear everytime the character goes down in a fight.

[Lebanese Dude]

Fable morphing doesn't really apply in the Dragon Age world since characters don't tend to spawn halos or horns depending on how naughty they are. Alignment and morality don't really shift your appearance in Thedas, unlike Albion. 

 

A possible use is a "body size" morph that makes your character more muscular and toned depending on your attribute choices. A mage should be visibly less buff than a rogue and a warrior, although it made sense with Hawke since he was a farmer.

 

Another is scars but since Dragon Age is a party-based game, your character has a higher chance of being knocked out than a single player game as battles are balanced around a group rather than an individual. 

Also aging based on training is a little problematic as your companions don't age with you. Also, the game doesn't span a significant enough period of time to warrant aging.

[Heresie Irisee]

I'm fond of the idea of my character acquiring scars after major events (eg I always gave my Hawkes scars after the Arishok fight); from rando #3658? Not so much.

 

I'd personally really love it if this were implemented, but hopefully they just let us alter our Inquisitor's face post-CC like with the black emporium mirror. I don't mind having to do it myself.

[Applepie_Svk]

heads will be rolling, you can count on it.. LoL

[Silver Souls]

Would be cool if you char could lose their eyes and use their fade mark like a sonar to locate their enemies, having a cloth or something over their eyes

[Slogbarg]

Just I don't really wish to turn to looking like a dead corpse at the end.

 

I wouldn't mind that being a potential outcome of your choices, a character so battleworn and disfigured by their scars that they need to wear a mask to hide their face. Personally I think it is more interesting when a character can change in unpredictable ways, while some of you might view it as damaging to your headcanon of your character personally I feel that the events of the game should be the story of your character in a cRPG and it is up to the player to make these events (even if they are less than fortunate) work as a part of their character. Do they hide their scars behind a mask or do they display them proudly and give children nightmares every time they smile?

 

If you want to write a story exactly as you want it to happen then personally I think you would be better off with a typewriter.

 

 

The problem I see is that a system like that could end up gimmicky. There is so much fight in those games and there's not that much space available on a character to show skin. Furthermore, though I do not spend much time designing my characters, I agree that look should fit with how the player envisio his chafter's personnality. When designing a face, putting a scar on it is not something you do at random.

I wouldn't mind a story related scar appearing on my character, but I have no interest in having a scar appear everytime the character goes down in a fight.

 

Just because that was how it was implemented in Fable does not mean that is the only way scarring can be implemented, in my opinion there are far better ways scars can be acquired and in a game where choice and consequence seems to be a selling theme I would think a good way to acquire scars would be as the consequence of certain actions made throughout the game, like putting yourself in harms way to save another or tampering with arcane magics beyond your understanding.

[Samahl]

If you want to write a story exactly as you want it to happen then personally I think you would be better off with a typewriter.

 

Perhaps you should take your own advice?

 

We already know DAI doesn't have dynamic scarring, and yet you don't seem content with that. I thought "the events of the game should be the story of your character in a cRPG"?

[Slogbarg]

Perhaps you should take your own advice?

 

We already know DAI doesn't have dynamic scarring, and yet you don't seem content with that. I thought "the events of the game should be the story of your character in a cRPG"?

 

We also know that at this point in time it would be incredibly unfeasible for the developers to add a dynamic scarring system even if they wanted to given that the game comes out next month, what of it? I am fully aware that Dragon Age Inquisition will never have a dynamic scarring system no matter how passionately I ask for it on these forums and this is not what this thread is about, I am merely discussing the merits of such a system and the narrative structure of video games.

 

Also to clarify, yes the events of the game should be the story of your character in a cRPG, did I say something to contradict that?

[Samahl]

Also to clarify, yes the events of the game should be the story of your character in a cRPG, did I say something to contradict that?

 

In Dragon Age, there is no dynamic scarring system, therefore, nothing happens within the story to cause your character to receive scars. The approach you seem to be taking is that people should live with what happens within the story, therefore, it seems odd that you would find changing what BioWare has already come up with preferable to the alternative, even if you have already come to terms with the fact that it will probably never happen. Why bring it up at all, if your philosophy is just to deal with it?

[Decepticon Leader Sully]

Sorry this just reminds of a Naked gun quote.

"the Mayor. She runs her city like she prefers her sex... with an iron fist. "

honestly im probably miss quoteing.

[AshesEleven]

Slightly off topic, but one thing I like about the Arkham game is how Batman's costume gets slightly more beatup as the story progresses.  It's a really cool little thing that adds immersion.

 

That being said, I'd be fine if you had the option to add scars and change your appearance slightly as the game progressed, but it should be an option; that's what the Dragon Age games are all about, your choices.  Not just for scars, but maybe broken noses, different haircuts, adding/removing makeup, etc.  I find the whole  Mirror of Transformation a BIT silly, as it's odd to suddenly have a completely different appearance, but whatever.

 

But no, it shouldn't be just a random, dynamic system.  Or if it is, it should be a toggle, kinda like blood.  

[Slogbarg]

In Dragon Age, there is no dynamic scarring system, therefore, nothing happens within the story to cause your character to receive scars. The approach you seem to be taking is that people should live with what happens within the story, therefore, it seems odd that you would find changing what BioWare has already come up with preferable to the alternative, even if you have already come to terms with the fact that it will probably never happen. Why bring it up at all, if your philosophy is just to deal with it?

 

Are we not allowed to consider new ideas? To discuss them on these forums? Bioware will do whatever it does regardless of what I say but I do feel that the Dragon Age series does fall pretty short when it comes to depicting character growth (10 years pass, Hawke and companions remain virtually unchanged) and I feel that a dynamic scarring would help not only help the Dragon Age series in this regard but cRPGs in general. Most of the objections against this idea seem to be because they don't want anything bad to happen to their character (unless of course the player wants and chooses to let it happen) and I just don't feel this is how a cRPG story should be written especially in a game that markets itself as 'Dark Fantasy', bad things should happen to your character based on their choices even if it is something you don't want to happen, a story in a 'Dark Fantasy' cRPG should not turn out exactly as you want it to happen, you have control over the actions of your character but not the consequences and sometimes those consequences will leave their mark on your character, it is up to the player to make it work as part of their character, I just don't find stories where the flawless hero manages to save everyone and come out the other side unmarked and as handsome as ever interesting.

 

Of course I know it will probably never happen in a Dragon Age game as it would seem the stories are more about stroking the player's ego than telling a compelling story however this thread is more about how such a system could benefit cRPGs in general as I feel that the cRPG genre is capable of much more compelling and interesting stories.

[Slogbarg]

Whoopsies, double post. 

[In Exile]

Are we not allowed to consider new ideas? To discuss them on these forums? Bioware will do whatever it does regardless of what I say but I do feel that the Dragon Age series does fall pretty short when it comes to depicting character growth (10 years pass, Hawke and companions remain virtually unchanged) and I feel that a dynamic scarring would help not only help the Dragon Age series in this regard but cRPGs in general. Most of the objections against this idea seem to be because they don't want anything bad to happen to their character (unless of course the player wants and chooses to let it happen) and I just don't feel this is how a cRPG story should be written especially in a game that markets itself as 'Dark Fantasy', bad things should happen to your character based on their choices even if it is something you don't want to happen, a story in a 'Dark Fantasy' cRPG should not turn out exactly as you want it to happen, you have control over the actions of your character but not the consequences and sometimes those consequences will leave their mark on your character, it is up to the player to make it work as part of their character, I just don't find stories where the flawless hero manages to save everyone and come out the other side unmarked and as handsome as ever interesting.

 

Of course I know it will probably never happen in a Dragon Age game as it would seem the stories are more about stroking the player's ego than telling a compelling story however this thread is more about how such a system could benefit cRPGs in general as I feel that the cRPG genre is capable of much more compelling and interesting stories.

 

Dynamic scaring is a bad feature because the scars are meaningless. My IRL scars represent something. For example, I have a pretty small scar under my left eye - it's just a straight line, about the length of the eye - in some personally relevant circumstances. That scar has meaning. 

 

Randomly having my PC's face have a scar down the eye (or nose, like Hawke) has no meaning, because there's no control or significance to random combat against mooks. 

 

There's no way to avoid dynamic scars being contrived. In Fable 2, it's totally possible to avoid any scar at all. You just have to never get KO'd (or KO'd without the revival thing, I can't recall). Otherwise you just scar automatically based on taking any damage, which is sort of meaningless, or it's done via cutscene, and then it's just the aggravation of Kai Leng on Thessia all over again. 

 

I just don't see a way to implement it in an RPG. 

 

Injuries can't work in RPGs because fights aren't really interactive in a way that could make injuries work. 

[Almostfaceman]

I am not sure how that is a productive contribution to the the thread, have I offended you somehow?

 

Use that grey matter between your ears, or perhaps I expect too much from you.

[Slogbarg]

I just don't see a way to implement it in an RPG. 

 

That is because you have no imagination, I already said that having scars randomly appear after combat with random mooks is not how I would implement dynamic scarring in a game, it is on this very page about 8 posts up from your post.

 

No having a scar appear randomly after a battle with random mooks or having a random scar appear every time your character falls in combat defeats the purpose of what I am talking about and only really signifies how many times you have fallen in combat, that is why you have the scars result as the consequence of certain actions, perhaps you say the wrong thing to the wrong person or perhaps you put yourself in harms way to save another, perhaps you were tampering with a powers beyond your control or perhaps you are marked by an outsider you have sworn an unholy oath to. What I am talking about is adding significance to the scars gained through the game instead of having them as mere facial decoration and if they are just added randomly after inconsequential fights with trash mobs then it kind of defeats the purpose.

[In Exile]

That is because you have no imagination, I already said that having scars randomly appear after combat with random mooks is not how I would implement dynamic scarring in a game, it is on this very page about 8 posts up from your post.

 

I read your post. I addressed every eventuality for completeness. 

 

 

No having a scar appear randomly after a battle with random mooks or having a random scar appear every time your character falls in combat defeats the purpose of what I am talking about and only really signifies how many times you have fallen in combat, that is why you have the scars result as the consequence of certain actions, perhaps you say the wrong thing to the wrong person or perhaps you put yourself in harms way to save another, perhaps you were tampering with a powers beyond your control or perhaps you are marked by an outsider you have sworn an unholy oath to. What I am talking about is adding significance to the scars gained through the game instead of having them as mere facial decoration and if they are just added randomly after inconsequential fights with trash mobs then it kind of defeats the purpose.

 

All that you're asking for is the second circumstance I discussed: mandatory cut scene scarring. And that's as problematic as the random scarring. Why does putting myself in harm way lead to a scar when I can be burned alive and not scar? Why does barely dodging a knife in a cutscene scar me when I can be sliced by thousands of knights and never even have a scuffmark? It's contrived, and all boils down to "Because The Writer Said So", which is not satisfying. 

[Doll]

The problem I see is that a system like that could end up gimmicky. There is so much fight in those games and there's not that much space available on a character to show skin. Furthermore, though I do not spend much time designing my characters, I agree that look should fit with how the player envisio his chafter's personnality. When designing a face, putting a scar on it is not something you do at random.

I wouldn't mind a story related scar appearing on my character, but I have no interest in having a scar appear everytime the character goes down in a fight.

 

I agree that in a game like this where I'm going to end up spending endless hours running all over the map and getting into countless fights, scars and wounds would probably end up accumulating to the point where it might end up looking more ridiculous than anything else. Like, yeah, I hunted bears for 3 hours and got mauled a few times, does this really need to be recorded forever on my face? It's like imagining Varric telling Cassandra all those tiny little details about DA2.

 

"And then the Champion spent hours running around Kirkwall trying to collect that last damn Elfroot before advancing the story so she can get a trophy."

 

I like the idea of a story given scar though, like depending on what choices you make in the story and what fights you end up in you end up with a new scar to reflect that. Like, for example, a main story quest has one route you can go down where there's no fighting and no one dies and so no scar appears, and another route has you at odds with someone or a group and you end up in battle to defeat them, and a scar appears. It would be cool to look back on it like, yep, I remember making that decision, I have to live with this scar because I really wanted that guy dead... but it was so worth it.

 

For aesthetic reasons I could understand that just being an option that some can opt out of it, because honestly adding dynamic scars would also just be something aesthetic as well and not necessary to gameplay, but I would find that to be a great addition.

[Slogbarg]

I read your post. I addressed every eventuality for completeness. 

 

 

 

 

All that you're asking for is the second circumstance I discussed: mandatory cut scene scarring. And that's as problematic as the random scarring. Why does putting myself in harm way lead to a scar when I can be burned alive and not scar? Why does barely dodging a knife in a cutscene scar me when I can be sliced by thousands of knights and never even have a scuffmark? It's contrived, and all boils down to "Because The Writer Said So", which is not satisfying. 

 

Usually the injuries suffered in a cutscene are far more damaging than the ones suffered in gameplay, pretty sure that is the case for nearly every game in existence, how can Batman be shot half a dozen times in gameplay in the Arkham games and show no signs of damage then all of a sudden get suit torn by catwoman in the next scene? Yes it requires a bit of suspension of disbelief and there is a bit of gameplay/story segregation going on here but honestly I think you are stretching a bit too hard to find problems in an effort to avoid the real issue, would you say that Batman should not show signs of visible damage in the Arkham games either?