272 réponses à ce sujet

[Semyaza82]

back on topic. I have a question.

What exactly makes "knight in shining armor" archetype? The fact that he is, in fact, a knight (a warrior in DA language)? The fact that he has a noble and protective personality? Combination of both?

I never thought of it as purely a class-restricted, to be honest, so for from my point of view Dorian could be the knight in shining armor for all we know.

I'm kind of with you Rovena, I'd always thought about it more in terms of personality. Me and Dave both thought going on that Kaiden was a pretty good fit as well. Think with the 'knight in shining armor' idea it was meant more literally in this case - as in a warrior wearing heavy armor. Also, you win +1 internets for getting us back on track

[daveliam]

back on topic. I have a question.

What exactly makes "knight in shining armor" archetype? The fact that he is, in fact, a knight (a warrior in DA language)? The fact that he has a noble and protective personality? Combination of both?

I never thought of it as purely a class-restricted, to be honest, so for from my point of view Dorian could be the knight in shining armor for all we know.

 

Yeah, I think it's a combination of both, but it's more the latter.  The "noble and protective personality" part is the more relevant part from my perspective.  However, I also recognize that it's something to do with the actual "Knight" piece too.  I think it's the "chivalrous" nature that is often a trait for male warrior types (particular those associated with organized military/combat groups) in fantasy fiction. 

 

For example, Kaidan kind of falls into this archetype a bit, but he's the "mage class" of ME.  I wouldn't really consider him a "white knight", but he's the closest that we've gotten for m/m options. 

 

ETA:  Sem

[sylvanaerie]

back on topic. I have a question.

What exactly makes "knight in shining armor" archetype? The fact that he is, in fact, a knight (a warrior in DA language)? The fact that he has a noble and protective personality? Combination of both?

I never thought of it as purely a class-restricted, to be honest, so for from my point of view Dorian could be the knight in shining armor for all we know.

 

 

I'm kind of with you Rovena, I'd always thought about it more in terms of personality. Me and Dave both thought going on that Kaiden was a pretty good fit as well. Think with the 'knight in shining armor' idea it was meant more literally in this case - as in a warrior wearing heavy armor. Also, you win +1 internets for getting us back on track

 

Yea, I'm thinking in terms of personality.  The strong, charming, chivalrous and sweet type of romance.  (Straight up examples being characters like Ivanhoe).  But can be a mage (my MHawke mages who romanced Isabela and Merrill were this archtype).  As was my bisexual female mage who first tried to romance Fenris and then flipped to Merrill when I realized Fenris wasn't a good fit for her.

 

Fenris was so prickly the MHawke Rogue I Rivalmanced him on was snark, snark, snark, deflecting all that anger and hostility with sarcasm/humor and a considerable patience. While I wouldn't say he was a 'white knight' type, he had a lot of charming to him (think Hook from Once Upon a Time TV series--if you've seen that, or Capt Jack Sparrow of Pirates of the Caribbean).  There could actually be a 'white knight' type under that roguish exterior, (Will from Pirates of the Caribbean) but more often than not, it's the swashbucklery type instead.  

*Edit* and OMFG If Dorian turned out to be the 'white knight' type I think my head would explode with joy.

[Semyaza82]

There could actually be a 'white knight' type under that roguish exterior, (Will from Pirates of the Caribbean) but more often than not, it's the swashbucklery type instead.  

*Edit* and OMFG If Dorian turned out to be the 'white knight' type I think my head would explode with joy.

Or Sky from Jade Empire...mmmm...Sky...

[Lumix19]

Or Sky from Jade Empire...mmmm...Sky...

I never actually played Jade Empire but wasn't Sky's male romance really hidden?

[Semyaza82]

I never actually played Jade Empire but wasn't Sky's male romance really hidden?

Both the m/m with Sky and f/f with Silk Fox meant you basically could never ever flirt with anyone of the opposite gender or you were locked out of it. Also the kiss scene isn't there for same sex couples (apparently it was issues with model heights), we got the fade to black just as they go in for it. So not hidden as such, but you had to know it was there and play with in mind.

[Semyaza82]

 

*Edit* and OMFG If Dorian turned out to be the 'white knight' type I think my head would explode with joy.

Mine too! Just from what we know so far it could well happen anyway though

[Lumix19]

Both the m/m with Sky and f/f with Silk Fox meant you basically could never ever flirt with anyone of the opposite gender or you were locked out of it. Also the kiss scene isn't there for same sex couples (apparently it was issues with model heights), we got the fade to black just as they go in for it. So not hidden as such, but you had to know it was there and play with in mind.

Issues with model heights? That...sounds like an excuse. Just saying.

[Semyaza82]

Issues with model heights? That...sounds like an excuse. Just saying.

I thought so at the time as well - though in fairness I know less than zero about any form of game designing (personally i think its all cleverly disguised magic) so i given em the benefit of the doubt

[Lumix19]

I thought so at the time as well - though in fairness I know less than zero about any form of game designing (personally i think its all cleverly disguised magic) so i given em the benefit of the doubt

That's true, I guess I will too. And even if it was an excuse they've certainly moved on since then.

[Lady Luminous]

back on topic. I have a question.

What exactly makes "knight in shining armor" archetype? The fact that he is, in fact, a knight (a warrior in DA language)? The fact that he has a noble and protective personality? Combination of both?

I never thought of it as purely a class-restricted, to be honest, so for from my point of view Dorian could be the knight in shining armor for all we know.

 

For me, there has to be a noble steed involved.  

[daveliam]

For me, there has to be a noble steed involved.

 

Yeah, that's what I was talking about:  My White-Knight m/m LI......

[Skymaple]

I want a Knight guy type of LI (don't care if white or black, or else - just handsome) I'd love to see that kind of personality (Cullen, Alistair...) portrayed in a gay character. Romantic, noble, brave, strong... the "typical hero"...

But no need to take it out on Iron Bull! >.< I am so glad he's a m/m option! I mean, he's quite big... and strong... and manly (something new in a bi character in this franchise -> Zev, Anders and Fenris (though I love you Fenris) were not)

 

P.S.: Everytime I see Cullen or hear his voice in the twitch ("such as they areeeee" ) I want him more, but...

[daveliam]

I want a Knight guy type of LI (don't care if white or black, or else - just handsome) I'd love to see that kind of personality (Cullen, Alistair...) portrayed in a gay character. Romantic, noble, brave, strong... the "typical hero"...

But no need to take it out on Iron Bull! >.< I am so glad he's a m/m option! I mean, he's quite big... and strong... and manly (something new in a bi character in this franchise -> Zev, Anders and Fenris (though I love you Fenris) were not)

 

P.S.: Everytime I see Cullen or hear his voice in the twitch ("such as they areeeee" ) I want him more, but...

 

Totally agree with you.  I love that Iron Bull is a m/m option.  He seemed like one of the least likely candidates, so it's great to see that they are playing around with stereotypes by having the large, boisterous, muscle-bound warrior be into guys.

 

Just to make a quick clarification:  I hope no one thinks we are talking about race when saying "White Knight".  I could honestly not care what color my "White Knight" is.  I just want him to be a noble, do-gooder type (hence "white-knight").  He could be a blue twi'lek for all I care!

 

Clearly i was mistaken.. as some eloquent members points out to me,i have no say in this discussion,point taken and noted.. So I´ll just mosey out of this mess and leave the topic to those who clearly are more intelligent and sensitive than I.. I do however reserve the right to have an opinion..I´ll just be careful not to anger the almighty beings that so politely requested my person and opinions to go to a much warmer place... (reminder to self..ask permission before forming opinion)

 

You are absolutely welcome to share your opinion in this thread.  I don't want to see anyone leave the thread unless they choose to or only come in to be insulting.  I welcome well-thought out and polite disagreement personally.  I just want people to treat my opinions with the same respect that I treat theirs. 

[daveliam]

thanks but.. If it´s allright  with you guys and gals.. i get so fed up with righteous crusaders of the pink cause,that i´d rather leave... 

 

Then, I agree, this is probably not the right thread for you.

[Skymaple]

Totally agree with you.  I love that Iron Bull is a m/m option.  He seemed like one of the least likely candidates, so it's great to see that they are playing around with stereotypes by having the large, boisterous, muscle-bound warrior be into guys.

 

Just to make a quick clarification:  I hope no one thinks we are talking about race when saying "White Knight".  I could honestly not care what color my "White Knight" is.  I just want him to be a noble, do-gooder type (hence "white-knight").  He could be a blue twi'lek for all I care!

Hahaha, don't worry, maybe it's just me 'cus I'm not a native speaker and it's easier for me to miss some nuances.

Yeah... that's true, but I'm still a little worried, because they could always fall into other stereotypes with Bull... (the massive gay gym guy who only thinks about f***ing and is kinda promiscous?) I hope Iron Bull is not as simple as that, I want him to settle down with my MInquisitor and love him and only him! xD

I mean, it would really suck if the LI that betrays us (if there sould be any) is a m/m one... I'm sorry for the straight girls, but they'd still have 3 LI left if one of their LIs turned out to be a traitor or something...

[KaiserShep]

You are trying to make this a homophobic issue. It's a weak defense - my original and continuing suggestion is this: romance content creates unnecessary dissonance from many fans and removing them (all of them) would save Bioware a ton of grief.

 

Hah. Removing them would just trade one brand of grief for another. Grief for everyone!

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I disagree, In DA2 fenris is a warrior and he is gay if you are male.

 

I think people missed the entire subtlety of the comanion sexuality system in DA2. There was only ONE bi character in DA2, Isabela. She was the only one that taked about her sexuality in terms of being attracted to both sexes.

 

I know everyone will decry thats not true they were all bi because you could romance them as either a male or female hawke. This is why i say the average player missed the subtlety of the DA2 system. In DA2 the world is not fixed the player makes changes to in during character creation, you can either choose from a history based on a pervious save of DA:O or use one of several default settings. The Key to note is that your history and the world history is defined during character creation.

 

One point of the world history is desided by your class which determines which sibling lives, the other is your sex. Anders is gay if you are male he is straight if you are female the same for fenris. Isabela is Bi regardless and Merrill is gay if you are female and straight if you are male. They designed it this way so that every sex and orientation had the exact same choices but the community freaked out.

 

Some of this freak out was homophobia with Anders, he chatted you up ONCE and if you said no he never bothered you again... err.. well.. he never tried to pick you up again but he was rather annoying in a completely unrealated way. And if you have ever been rejected by someone after asking them out whom you like it hurts so anders -10 relations was realisitc and reasonable. And there were SO many places to get those 10 points back it has almost zero impact long term.

 

Some of the freak out was not homophobia but by people not grasping that the reality that the world changed for your companions based on the choices you made in character generation. Just like you determine who was king of Ferelden is in DA2 during character creation so too you make the determination of the sexual orientation of 3 companions by choosing your sex, only isabela's sexuality in DA2 is fixed.

 

Given the above I think bioware has provides a male gay warrior romance option it might not be with a personality or look people wanted but he was a gay male romance option.

At GaymerX this year, Bioware themselves confirmed that Anders, Fenris, Isabela, and Merrill are bisexual.

[R0vena]

I mean, it would really suck if the LI that betrays us (if there sould be any) is a m/m one... I'm sorry for the straight girls, but they'd still have 3 LI left if one of their LIs turned out to be a traitor or something...

I doubt it, it would be really mean.

 

I would prefer nobody would turn out a traitor or a cheater unless due to my Inquisitor actions in the game.

Besides, aren't romances get locked at some point? So you can't just switch from one LI to another.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

 

p.s. If anyone wants to check out their panel from GaymerX2 I've popped a link in - its an interesting listen.

Yep. If I ever want to get disheartened, it's a great listen.

[Skymaple]

I doubt it, it would be really mean.

 

I would prefer nobody would turn out a traitor or a cheater unless due to my Inquisitor actions in the game.

Besides, aren't romances get locked at some point? So you can't just switch from one LI to another.

Yeah, I don't really think the writers would be that "cruel"

I was just putting my fears into words xD

IB and Dorian will be awesome, we'll see! (And for DA4 maybe the knight gay guy?)

 

EDIT: and Sera, and Josephine, ofc!

[Andir]

i'm happy with the way things turned out. could they have been more even? yes. but i think it's a nice blend and all the characters are very unique. they wrote the characters they wanted even if it's not a perfect split. 

 

the writers have also said they create a character, their sexuality, and then decide if they will be a romance. not the other way around. and i would much prefer they develop characters how they see them instead of designing them around an archetype or orientation. it should be just another trait, not the sole reason for that character existing! when that happens, that's all the character becomes. and while romance is probably one of my favorite aspects of the game, the characters are there for so much more than that purpose. : )