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[Battlebloodmage]

I know what you mean, and I know it was my post that said it, but I stand by it, not in the sense that I think bisexual people are an " inbetween" or "haven't made up their mind" sexuality, but more so from the standpoint that if a character is bisexual, then unless otherwise stated, many people will assign the heterosexual aspect as the "default" preference, this in effect nullifying a major component of what this thread is asking for. I can symp/empathize with the bisexual identify perception conflict as I have dated a bisexual male, so I do get the whole "you're not gay enough to be one of us" stigma, but I truly believe that having a stereotypically masculine, yet homosexual man (or woman for that matter) would allow for the character to adhere more closely to the archetype, while simultaneously subverting it. Though they could invert it completely and have him/her be completely feminine.

It's not so much problem with bisexuals as how Bioware handles bisexual characters. Asides from Dorian, all the relationships Iron Bull have are with women. Kaidan comments about EDI, dated a woman, and his gay scenes are converted from femShep with contents cut out. Zevran prefers women, Fenris slept with Isabela never commented on male attraction. Bisexual characters also generally have "reasons" for why they are bisexuals. The way Bioware portrays bisexuals, it seems like ALL of bisexuals are "straight with one exception". They never commented or talked about the same gender attraction. 

[veeia]

I get where you're coming from, and I would be 100% no reservations or hesitations thrilled for a gay KISA over a bisexual one, but the idea that a bisexual one doesn't fit In to this thread as much because some people would default them to straight is basically to me reading like the same bi erasure we get from the queer community all the time so I'm feeling wary about agreeing with that. Of course I would want them to be explicitly bisexual, and then people reading them as straight would be their own ignorant fault.

And bisexual men as manly is not a thing. So it would still feel subversive for me.

Like honestly I would prefer a gay/lesbian KISA over a bisexual one but I'm not really comfortable with creating a hierarchy there, that's all.

[Lady Nuggins]

It's not so much problem with bisexuals as how Bioware handles bisexual characters. Asides from Dorian, all the relationships Iron Bull have are with women. Kaidan comments about EDI, dated a woman, and his gay scenes are converted from femShep with contents cut out. Zevran prefers women, Fenris slept with Isabela never commented on male attraction. Bisexual characters also generally have "reasons" for why they are bisexuals. The way Bioware portrays bisexuals, it seems like ALL of bisexuals are "straight with one exception". They never commented or talked about the same gender attraction. 

 

Are there any female characters Bull gets together with besides the serving girls?  Regardless, even if he and Dorian don't get together in your game, if you take Bull to meet Dorian for the first time, he says something like "never trust the pretty ones." 

 

But yeah, this is generally a problem with Bioware games.  Josephine's romance with a female Inquisitor could be considered subversive (Inquisitor gets to be her knight in shining armor) but people always talk about her romance as though you're playing a male character.  

[Reva-C]

It's not so much problem with bisexuals as how Bioware handles bisexual characters. Asides from Dorian, all the relationships Iron Bull have are with women. Kaidan comments about EDI, dated a woman, and his gay scenes are converted from femShep with contents cut out. Zevran prefers women, Fenris slept with Isabela never commented on male attraction. Bisexual characters also generally have "reasons" for why they are bisexuals. The way Bioware portrays bisexuals, it seems like ALL of bisexuals are "straight with one exception". They never commented or talked about the same gender attraction. 

 

Basically, they're straight characters with a 'bi' allowance on them to up the numbers on same sex LIs LOL Having said that....I was delighted enough to jump on Kaidan having wanted to from ME1, and I liked Anders and Fenris enough as characters to not mind it LOL I just think the KISA gay man would be a really great new option.

[Milana]

Are there any female characters Bull gets together with besides the serving girls? Regardless, even if he and Dorian don't get together in your game, if you take Bull to meet Dorian for the first time, he says something like "never trust the pretty ones."

But yeah, this is generally a problem with Bioware games. Josephine's romance with a female Inquisitor could be considered subversive (Inquisitor gets to be her knight in shining armor) but people always talk about her romance as though you're playing a male character.

[Milana]

Bull sleeps with chantry girl from Haven too. I stumbled on her talking with another chantry sister about it:)
so yeah beside Dorian only girls. Though he is an exception, he did convert my inquisitor who was supposed to fall for Cass at least in one playthrough lol

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

Are there any female characters Bull gets together with besides the serving girls?  Regardless, even if he and Dorian don't get together in your game, if you take Bull to meet Dorian for the first time, he says something like "never trust the pretty ones." 
 
But yeah, this is generally a problem with Bioware games.  Josephine's romance with a female Inquisitor could be considered subversive (Inquisitor gets to be her knight in shining armor) but people always talk about her romance as though you're playing a male character.

That was my disappointment with Josephine's F/F romance, was essentially a straight relationship with the gender pronouns changed, very obvious the sword fight was designed for a guy Inquisitor

I get tired that apart from Leliana, every bi character acts like their straight unless romanced

[Lord Bolton]

No one is saying that he's not a badass, because he is.  In fact, I'd suspect that almost everyone who is asking for the gay KISA character is probably also a fan of Dorian.  He's definitely my favorite DA romance and one of my favorite companions in the entire series.  But If it weren't for that one line in his quest, which I'll admit is the type of attitude that I'd like to see from a gay KISA, no one would be able to argue that Dorian is even close to the trope.  Just saying, "Don't worry, I'll protect you" once isn't enough to qualify as a knight in shining armor type.  I'd need to see him act chivalrous and selfless more than just once.  I'd need to see him be humble and polite and romantic to fit this trope.  Plus, there's the fact that a KISA is a front line warrior ('shining armor' is part of the name after all).  Dorian's great; he's just not a KISA. 

Just curious- when he said that line?

[daveliam]

Just curious- when he said that line?

 

I'm not sure how long we should use spoiler tags at this point, but I'll err on the side of caution:

 

Spoiler

He says it when you do the mage questline.  When you first go back in time, he has a really sexy bravado about him and says, "Don't worry, I"ll protect you."  <swoon>  Damn, if that guy wasn't such an arrogant jerk..... (oh, who am I kidding?)

[Lady Nuggins]

That was my disappointment with Josephine's F/F romance, was essentially a straight relationship with the gender pronouns changed, very obvious the sword fight was designed for a guy Inquisitor

I get tried that apart from Leliana, every bi character acts like their straight unless romanced

 

I'm just starting my Josephine playthrough now so I only know what I've been told about it, but that actually appeals to me.  I'd love for my female character to take up a knight in shining armor role and duel for her hand.  If I can't have my KISA lady romance, at least I'm given the chance to play one.  I just mean that every time I see reviews or discussions about the romance, it's usually assuming that you're playing a male character (and that it's therefore a very stereotypical situation).  

 

To be fair, I don't want every bi character to talking about their sexuality all the time, either, because there's a risk of falling into "promiscuous bi" trope territory.  It suits Josephine's character not to talk about what she's attracted to either way.  But I see no reason why, say, Isabella couldn't have been more explicit about being into women.  

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I'd prefer a bisexual KISA over a strictly homosexual KISA personally. 

 

That was my disappointment with Josephine's F/F romance, was essentially a straight relationship with the gender pronouns changed, very obvious the sword fight was designed for a guy Inquisitor

Considering the effort Richard put into animating that scene so it would work well for all races of both genders, no it was not designed for a guy Inquisitor. It was designed for all Inquisitors.

 

I'm just starting my Josephine playthrough now so I only know what I've been told about it, but that actually appeals to me.  I'd love for my female character to take up a knight in shining armor role and duel for her hand.  If I can't have my KISA lady romance, at least I'm given the chance to play one.  I just mean that every time I see reviews or discussions about the romance, it's usually assuming that you're playing a male character (and that it's therefore a very stereotypical situation).  

 

To be fair, I don't want every bi character to talking about their sexuality all the time, either, because there's a risk of falling into "promiscuous bi" trope territory.  It suits Josephine's character not to talk about what she's attracted to either way.  But I see no reason why, say, Isabella couldn't have been more explicit about being into women.  

Isabela does go into her being into women. The "Men are good for one thing, women are good for six" banter with Bethany comes to mind. 

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

To be fair, I don't want every bi character to talking about their sexuality all the time, either, because there's a risk of falling into "promiscuous bi" trope territory.  It suits Josephine's character not to talk about what she's attracted to either way.  But I see no reason why, say, Isabella couldn't have been more explicit about being into women.

I wouldn't want them being promiscuous stereotypes all the time, just would like it to be recognised as a S/S relationship more rather then the usual "straight relationship with the odd words changed to make it look more S/S", just makes it seem like their straight characters that happen to be available to a S/S PC as a optional choice

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

Isabela does go into her being into women. The "Men are good for one thing, women are good for six" banter with Bethany comes to mind.

She has 1 conversation about liking women & thats only if Bethany is alive, she just talks about men & flirts with the male companions otherwise

[sandalisthemaker]

 

Isabela does go into her being into women. The "Men are good for one thing, women are good for six" banter with Bethany comes to mind. 

 

Yeah this. Also, although it is subtle, there are differences between Isabela's romance with a woman. For example, she gets jealous when femHawke flirts with Tallis. She doesn't with maleHawke. 

 

I'd like for there to be more of these differences with the bisexual LIs. 

[Lady Nuggins]

I wouldn't want them being promiscuous stereotypes all the time, just would like it to be recognised as a S/S relationship more rather then the usual "straight relationship with the odd words changed to make it look more S/S", just makes it seem like their straight characters that happen to be available to a S/S PC as a optional choice

 

Yeah this. Also, although it is subtle, there are differences between Isabela's romance with a woman. For example, she gets jealous when femHawke flirts with Tallis. She doesn't with maleHawke. 

 

I'd like for there to be more of these differences with the bisexual LIs. 

 

Out of curiosity, what would such differences entail?  Obviously bisexual people don't treat people of all genders exactly the same in real life.  What I'm attracted to in a woman is not what I'm attracted to in men.  But I can't think of how they'd do that in a game romance without it coming off the wrong way (i.e. Anders not talking about past relationships with female Hawke).

[sandalisthemaker]

Out of curiosity, what would such differences entail?  Obviously bisexual people don't treat people of all genders exactly the same in real life.  What I'm attracted to in a woman is not what I'm attracted to in men.  But I can't think of how they'd do that in a game romance without it coming off the wrong way (i.e. Anders not talking about past relationships with female Hawke).

 

I think they'd have to be careful about it. That thing with Anders is a good example of what not to do. Perhaps a character could show one part of their personality more when romancing a man and another part more when romancing a woman.  Let's say character "x" tends to be a bit more cocky/funny/confident when in a relationship with one sex, but more open and vulnerable with the other sex.  It would have to be subtle though.

 

Perhaps a female chevalier could talk more candidly about her experiences in that male-dominated order when in a relationship with a woman, for example.  It would be tricky, and going too far would make some players feel like they are missing out. So in this example, it would only be a few lines of dialogue.   Regardless, the core of who the character is should definitely stay the same, though. 

[(Disgusted noise.)]

Did we ever discuss voice casting ideas for a queer KISA? I'd probably melt into a puddle if they cast Zachary Levi since it would be as close as I'll ever get to having my crush on Arcade Gannon from F:NV requited. Plus, bonus Disney price pedigree.

[daveliam]

If I got to cast a guy for this, I'd go with Russell Tovey.  His voice isn't posh, but it's sexy.  He'd be my pick.

[Winged Silver]

Ooh yes! I am always for seeing the character archetypes get mixed up

 

(can I just add that I'd love to also see an LI of any sexuality/sex with strong morals and decent amounts of common sense who uses blood magic? We've always had opportunities to see the dark side of blood magic - I'd love to see it in a neutral light, rather than a "evil doer!" or "corrupted innocent who learns their lesson through the PC"

[In Exile]

Out of curiosity, what would such differences entail? Obviously bisexual people don't treat people of all genders exactly the same in real life. What I'm attracted to in a woman is not what I'm attracted to in men. But I can't think of how they'd do that in a game romance without it coming off the wrong way (i.e. Anders not talking about past relationships with female Hawke).

I'm honestly not sure how it could work. I'm attracted to very different types in men and women (in hindsight kind of polar opposites in personality once you get past my very similar tastes in appearance) but I'm not sure I'm different around them beyond how I'm different around anyone who is different so to speak.

[DirkJake]

I absolutely adore Dorain, and I would not trade him for anything. But adding a gay knight in shining armor as a companion and love interest in the next game (or DLC?) would be really awesome. 

[sandalisthemaker]

I absolutely adore Dorain, and I would not trade him for anything. But adding a gay knight in shining armor as a companion and love interest in the next game (or DLC?) would be really awesome. 

 

They already said no to additional companions via DLC, but my fingers are perpetually crossed for the next game. 

[In Exile]

They already said no to additional companions via DLC, but my fingers are perpetually crossed for the next game.

No new companions for the base game. We could get a KISA temporary companion via a Tallis like addition.

[sandalisthemaker]

No new companions for the base game. We could get a KISA temporary companion via a Tallis like addition.

 

Hmmm.... I don't know how I would feel about that. That's interesting. A DLC-only gay KISA  who can be flirted with.  Although I would lament not having them for the full game, I'd still welcome that.  Although, hopefully the similarity between this hypothetical character and Tallis ends with DLC only and flirt-able.  Lol 

[TheOgre]

And Aveline....... Plz add her ! 

 

I was really upset when I couldn't have Aveline as Hawke.

 

And no, Cassandra IMO does not count as an Aveline type character!