Zevran hits on you way more in DAO and people didn't freak out. Isabela hits on you and no one freaked out. I cannot help but think that it had a lot to do with Anders being hated, and to add insult to injury, he would react badly when he was rejected, which really didn't help.
It wasn't a flaw in the system, just in the writing.
If they removed that feature because of that, it seems a little silly.
Zevran hits on you way more in DAO and people didn't freak out. Isabela hits on you and no one freaked out. I cannot help but think that it had a lot to do with Anders being hated, and to add insult to injury, he would react badly when he was rejected, which really didn't help.
It wasn't a flaw in the system, just in the writing.
If they removed that feature because of that, it seems a little silly.
Yeah. I am familiar with many players who don't mind Zevran hitting on them at all (after all you can just ask him to stop) or Isabella. Even conservative ones
Anders was just... not well written in many aspects. Though I also can hardly understand why his bad reaction to being rejected is such a big deal. He's a bit hurt but it isn't even mentioned later in the game
Guest_StreetMagic_*
I like this idea, but I'm at a loss how it could be done well in a CRPG (not saying there isn't a way.. I'm just drawing a blank). In a tabletop RPG at least, you'll have people/friends who could cajole you (or your character) with their own initiative, but it doesn't sound easy to pull off here. Computer games kind of presume player intiative at all times.
I like this idea, but I'm at a loss how it could be done well in a CRPG (not saying there isn't a way.. I'm just drawing a blank). In a tabletop RPG at least, you'll have people/friends who could cajole you (or your character) with their own initiative, but it doesn't sound easy to pull off here. Video games kind of presume player intiative at all times.
I think at least in some cases the LIs can begin flirting first, like Iron Bull, Dorian, Sera - if it fits their personalities - and the PC can act innocent, obvious or just shy
Or DA:O's style: some romance starting lines were both friendship AND romance-based. These teasing/cute/sweet/caring moments when one scratches her/his head and wonders: "Are those close friends talking to each other or is there something more between them?". Lelianna and Alistair falling for the f!Warden without her noticing it because she was a caring, good friend to them is one of the best LI moments in DA:O
Too many people complained about ninjamances for this to work. Hence the heart.
Feel free to disable the icons if you don't like them; that's an option.
Zevran hits on you way more in DAO and people didn't freak out.
Haha, you never read the long thread about the player that Zevran "tricked" into his tent! 
The only thing I didn't like about Isabela hitting on my character was the forced smile and raised eyebrow from Hawke when I didn't want to react that way.
Guest_StreetMagic_*
Haha, you never read the long thread about the player that Zevran "tricked" into his tent!
The only thing I didn't like about Isabela hitting on my character was the forced smile and raised eyebrow from Hawke when I didn't want to react that way.
I thought it was a neutral look.. done in a way where the player would have to read into it. Hawke could either be atrracted or just confused like "What the hell..?"
I read that they completely removed the NPCs' romantic initiative for this game, possibly because of people complaining about Anders in the last game. It is sad.
I think they may have made them more subtle instead. The other night watching Cullen invite female Quizzy to play chess, and then saying how much he enjoyed her company and not talking about work, came across to me as a mild flirt. Then her flirt option came up. So I'm hoping the same is true of the other LIs...subtlety...Jospehine is going to be a classic if this is true
My husband has still not forgiven Anders for the male flirt, and rushes through that part of DA2 every single time 
Haha, you never read the long thread about the player that Zevran "tricked" into his tent!
I confess I have not haha, I wasn't following the forums at that time.
@Xilizhra: I would love to hide icons, but I don't think it will be a viable option because of those stupid paraphrases that tell next to nothing about what the character will actually say. Maybe I am judging too quickly, but after watching some of the gameplay videos, it seems the paraphrases are still really vague. Another thing that could be quite immersion breaking in DA2.
Yeah, but the way Anders hits on you, for some people, is like Emile does with a femHawke. If only it were that funny.
Really? Compared to Zevran or Isabela, I thought it was pretty mild. He just tells you he finds you attractive, right? And then ask you if it's ok. I would think that does not call for outrage.
No, I have a hard time buying that the problem is a npc hitting on the character, it feels it has more to do with people disliking Anders or disliking the mere idea that a guy could like another guy. I'm trying to not be judgemental, but it is frustrating to think they might have scraped npc flirting. or npc falling in love, because of that.
Again, we don't know, so I might be pleasantly suprised.
@John-in-France: This is encouraging, here is to hope some of them will be courageous enough to try to woo our awesome inquisitors.
Too many people complained about ninjamances for this to work. Hence the heart.
Feel free to disable the icons if you don't like them; that's an option.
Guest_StreetMagic_*
I think at least in some cases the LIs can begin flirting first, like Iron Bull, Dorian, Sera - if it fits their personalities - and the PC can act innocent, obvious or just shy
Or DA:O's style: some romance starting lines were both friendship AND romance-based. These teasing/cute/sweet/caring moments when one scratches her/his head and wonders: "Are those close friends talking to each other or is there something more between them?". Lelianna and Alistair falling for the f!Warden without her noticing it because she was a caring, good friend to them is one of the best LI moments in DA:O
True enough. It's worked in romance before. But I mean the whole gamut of RPG'ing. I thought this thread was about any scenario. I think it'd be hard to be both protagonist and not very assertive at the same time. It can be done in novels (Hobbit/Bilbo), but not sure how you go about it here.
This is actually why I kinda like the heart icon. I remember talking to Kaidan once in ME1, one single time in an entire play through and I ended up in a romance with him. It was really annoying because I was trying to keep that Shep single to romance Thane in ME2. And I don't like being a jerk to my companions, but ME1 kinda forces you to if you don't want a romance. So yeah I like the heart icon because it helps me avoid unwanted romances. (ME2 was really good at having a middle of the road friendship path though without icons so I don't know.)
What I would like to see is some subtly on the part of the PC when initiating a romance rather than "Oh, you're so handsome/beautiful. Love me!"
Hawke begins with Merrill with "You're so sweet" and nothing else (at least when being diplomatic). That was... marginally more subtle.
What I would like to see is some subtly on the part of the PC when initiating a romance rather than "Oh, you're so handsome/beautiful. Love me!"
Absolutely. A lot of Hawke's flirts come out quite aggressive which really wasn't appropriate in some cases (like Sebastian and Fenris).
I'd love an option for PC to be more subtle, too.))
I actually have more problems with the PC character and weird flirt lines...femShep has some really bad ones in ME2, femHawke had what I felt were awful first flirts with Fenris and Anders (which is why I skip those and flirt later).
This is actually why I kinda like the heart icon. I remember talking to Kaidan once in ME1, one single time in an entire play through and I ended up in a romance with him. It was really annoying because I was trying to keep that Shep single to romance Thane in ME2. And I don't like being a jerk to my companions, but ME1 kinda forces you to if you don't want a romance. So yeah I like the heart icon because it helps me avoid unwanted romances. (ME2 was really good at having a middle of the road friendship path though without icons so I don't know.)
What I would like to see is some subtly on the part of the PC when initiating a romance rather than "Oh, you're so handsome/beautiful. Love me!"
I haven't played ME yet (I plan to at some point!) but I don't think that the problem is "ninjamance" here, it's more the fact that if a romance starts, all the others ends. Which completely sucks I agree.
That's why I think Origins got it right, you could initiate romance with all the characters at the same time if you wanted to, and you could also decline politely if they showed interest. I agree with Chari, the first time I played and Alistair started showing interest while my PC was just being a nice friend, it really felt like a surprise (a good one).
I completely agree with having more subtle options, Hawke was sometimes just... no.
Well, maybe getting rid of the heart is not necessary to keep the surprise. If hiding the icons is viable, I guess it could satisfy almost everyone. The problem is those overly simplified paraphrases that forces you to use the icons if you want to have at least a vague idea of what the character is going to say.
This is actually why I kinda like the heart icon. I remember talking to Kaidan once in ME1, one single time in an entire play through and I ended up in a romance with him. It was really annoying because I was trying to keep that Shep single to romance Thane in ME2. And I don't like being a jerk to my companions, but ME1 kinda forces you to if you don't want a romance. So yeah I like the heart icon because it helps me avoid unwanted romances. (ME2 was really good at having a middle of the road friendship path though without icons so I don't know.)
What I would like to see is some subtly on the part of the PC when initiating a romance rather than "Oh, you're so handsome/beautiful. Love me!"
Happened to me with Kaidan and Liara on my Shepard file I was making into a Garrus romance. The whole romance system from ME was a disaster imo - I never felt comfortable being rude to anyone, but I just couldn't understand how choosing the dialogue options I did led to a romance initiation, since they were all rather un-flirty. At least the options for turning them down aren't horrifically rude.
I always thought the majority of the flirt lines were way too strong in Dragon Age, but especially so for my reserved Inquisitor, who absolutely would (and hopefully will) never say half the things my Hawke did. Try as I might, I just can't picture him being okay with over-the-top flirting with someone unless they first gave him "permission" to do so, so to speak - presumably by flirting first. So it's not that I want "ohmigawsh I'm so shaiz and yur the hotness pls notice me senpai" so much as I want an option akin to "I like you but I'm unsure how to approach you, let alone if you would reciprocate, and I don't want to make things awkward between us." Or maybe your Inquisitor just isn't the sort of person for blatant flirting. Either way, I'm all for some more subtlety.
Well, maybe getting rid of the heart is not necessary to keep the surprise. If hiding the icons is viable, I guess it could satisfy almost everyone. The problem is those overly simplified paraphrases that forces you to use the icons if you want to have at least a vague idea of what the character is going to say.
Maybe just toggle them off every time you're in Skyhold and back on when you leave? I think all romance happens at Skyhold.
I agree with the OP. I really want the LI's to come onto me more often this time and let me be the shy, reserved, and inexperienced one.
@Mimilette
For me it was sort of out of place since he just killed his friend.
Meh. I don't see any problem with how Anders flirts with Hawke. Unless there is something specific people are thinking of? The fact that it can be same sex doesn't matter.
What I would have liked would have been an option to more respectfully turn him down.
I also honestly don't like the inclusion of homophobic options that both DA:O and DA2 gave you. What's the point? Another opportunity to show that the PC can be a jerk?
Guest_StreetMagic_*
Meh. I don't see any problem with how Anders flirts with Hawke. Unless there is something specific people are thinking of? The fact that it can be same sex doesn't matter.
What I would have liked would have been an option to more respectfully turn him down.
I also honestly don't like the inclusion of homophobic options that both DA:O and DA2 gave you. What's the point? Another opportunity to show that the PC can be a jerk?
Can you give examples of homophobia? I don't remember feeling that way myself. Like if I turn down Anders or Fenris or something. It seemed more casual than rude.
Can you give examples of homophobia? I don't remember feeling that way myself. Like if I turn down Anders or Fenris or something. It seemed more casual than rude.
Both Zevran and Anders ask if (specifically) gay flirting bothers the PC. The PC can say yes. This isn't the only way to turn them down, but I thought to mention it because people were talking about players being uncomfortable with gay flirting. David Gaider has confirmed that homophobia exists in-universe and presumably that those options were homophobic. It seems pretty sad that they were included in the games.
Guest_StreetMagic_*
Both Zevran and Anders ask if (specifically) gay flirting bothers the PC. The PC can say yes. This isn't the only way to turn them down, but I thought to mention it because people were talking about players being uncomfortable with gay flirting. David Gaider has confirmed that homophobia exists in-universe and presumably that those options were homophobic. It seems pretty sad that they were included in the games.
Oh, I didn't know the Zevran one was homophobic. Even if I play a female character, I don't like his approach. Like Alistair says, he's a bit "too much". It's why Morrigan and Leliana aren't receptive to him either.
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