318 réponses à ce sujet

[lordsaren101]

Dumat grants Corypheus powers every time he is called upon. Its also told to the ancient magisters the gods exist in a realm beyond the fade.

Also faith.

And where is your proof? Other than chantry propaganda? There is none.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Dumat grants Corypheus powers every time he is called upon. Its also told to the ancient magisters the gods exist in a realm beyond the fade.

Also faith.

And where is your proof? Other than chantry propaganda? There is none.

That is proof that their spirits are beyond the Fade, not that they are gods. Any Fade entity can do the same. Is every Fade entity a god too?

 

My proof is that they do nothing other Fade entities haven't done. They have done nothing a Fade entity can't. 

[herkles]

While I tend not to care for the Old Gods, they have been described as generally evil so far.

 

There is a question that must be asked, what makes one a god? Gods don't need to be omnipotent, nor omnescent nor omnibenovlent. After all I am a Hellenic polytheist IRL, and the beings that I worship are certainly not those things. 

 

The fact that in thedas, people worshiped/worshed evil dragons of evil, doesn't mean they can't be gods of evil.

And you have proof of this where exactly? 

 

The elves believe their gods exist in the fade. Speaking of the elves, I am wondering if there is any overlap between the Old Gods and the Forgotten ones?

 

 

Dumat grants Corypheus powers every time he is called upon. Its also told to the ancient magisters the gods exist in a realm beyond the fade.

Also faith.

And where is your proof? Other than chantry propaganda? There is none.

Where is the proof that he actually grants him the power?

[Hanako Ikezawa]

The elves believe their gods exist in the fade. Speaking of the elves, I am wondering if there is any overlap between the Old Gods and the Forgotten ones?

Well, both the Forgotten Ones and the Old Gods were sealed away deep underground. However the dates are very different. 

[lordsaren101]

The old gods granted great powers to Tevinter. Under their guidance the greatest empire in history was formed and flourished.

@herkles

The proof is in the fact when he begs Dumat grant me your powers, a new power is given.

A god by nature exists on a plane beyond the mortal realm. The fact that the gods manifest a physical form of such magnitude on thedas is testament to their power and greatness.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

The old gods granted great powers to Tevinter. Under their guidance the greatest empire in history was formed and flourished.

They taught the Magisters blood magic. Guess what other creatures can teach people blood magic? That's right, Fade entities. 

 

So again, how are they different when the Old Gods haven't done a single thing other Fade entities can't? 

[lordsaren101]

They taught the Magisters blood magic. Guess what other creatures can teach people blood magic? That's right, Fade entities.

So again, how are they different when the Old Gods haven't done a single thing other Fade entities can't?

They are not fade entities. And what fade entity has manifested a body as magnificent and powerful as the gods in our world? None. For with certainty no entity in all of Thedas or in that universe can compare to Dumat.

Morrigan takes an eluvian to a realm beyond the fade, she takes Urthemiel with her, your warden too if he chooses. Perhaos she has found a way into the golden land, doubtful, but intriguing.

[Inquisitor Julianos]

I'd like it noted: Dumat was finally slain by Grey Wardens at the Battle of Silent Fields in -203 Ancient (992 TE). when Greywardens do the soul absorbing thing when they slay an archdemon, they destroy the soul. Y'all be heretics... For shame... FOR SHAME

[Medhia_Nox]

Korth the Mountain Father is greater than your mute god!

Does it sadden you little magister that a barbarian woman broke your nation and sent you scrambling to the north?

[Hanako Ikezawa]

They are not fade entities. And what fade entity has manifested a body as magnificent and powerful as the gods in our world? None.

You earlier said their earthly bodies were merely avatars, not that they created them themselves. Where does it say that they manifested the dragon bodies instead of possessing dragons?

 

But we have seen literally dozens of Fade entities manifest a body in Thedas rather than possess one already here. 

[lordsaren101]

I'd like it noted: Dumat was finally slain by Grey Wardens at the Battle of Silent Fields in -203 Ancient (992 TE). when Greywardens do the soul absorbing thing when they slay an archdemon, they destroy the soul. Y'all be heretics... For shame... FOR SHAME

Matter can neither be created nor destroyed. All that was slain was a tainted shell.

[Inquisitor Julianos]

Um Soul... Aware Darkspawn and Archdemons have them.

[HaHa365]

All hail the true gods. May they cast down this false trickster that the Chantry calls the "Maker"

[lordsaren101]

You earlier said their earthly bodies were merely avatars, not that they created them themselves. Where does it say that they manifested the dragon bodies instead of possessing dragons?
 
But we have seen literally dozens of Fade entities manifest a body in Thedas rather than possess one already here.

It says it in the book of Dumat. Chapter 1 page 3, stanza number 2.

They didnt posess anything. They manifested as massive supernaturally powerful male draconic entities...all male dragons are drakes. The old gods manifested a male form similar to the most majestic and powerful creatures of thedas...dragons. what does the maker manifest as? Oh yea, thats right....nothing.

[lordsaren101]

Um Soul... Aware Darkspawn and Archdemons have them.

Again souls cannot be destroyed because matter cannot be truly destroyed. Also, legacy dlc, altar of Dumat and the fact Dumat grants Corypheus powers during the fight. Next.

[Medhia_Nox]

@lordsaren101:  Wait... so the ability for an old god to become a dragon is proof of greatness.

If DA has a "universe" - a little dragon on a little planet is hardly impressive.

[lordsaren101]

All hail the true gods. May they cast down this false trickster that the Chantry calls the "Maker"

I would love to see the chantry and their non deity wiped out. Dumat, since he exists unlike the maker is more than capable should he so choose.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

It says it in the book of Dumat. Chapter 1 page 3, stanza number 2.

They didnt posess anything. They manifested as massive supernaturally powerful male draconic entities...all male dragons are drakes. The old gods manifested a male form similar to the most majestic and powerful creatures of thedas...dragons. what does the maker manifest as? Oh yea, thats right....nothing.

Link to the source please? 

[Inquisitor Julianos]

Again souls cannot be destroyed because matter cannot be truly destroyed. Also, legacy dlc, altar of Dumat and the fact Dumat grants Corypheus powers during the fight. Next.

Who says it's actually dumat? and not some residual power, or ..."The Elder One" corrupting dumat's altar? And a Soul isnt Matter.

[lordsaren101]

@lordsaren101:  Wait... so the ability for an old god to become a dragon is proof of greatness.

If DA has a "universe" - a little dragon on a little planet is hardly impressive.

Far more impressive than anynother entity we have seen or encountered.

[lordsaren101]

Link to the source please?

I was being facetious.

[lordsaren101]

Who says it's actually dumat? and not some residual power, or ..."The Elder One" corrupting dumat's altar? And a Soul isnt Matter.

So many non believers. The elder one is beneath the might of Dumat.

[Inquisitor Julianos]

Dumat was taken down by a bunch of little girls and boys with sharp pieces of metal.... The Maker brought the Tevinter Imperium to it's knee's through his Vessel Andraste... Maker:1... Dumat:0

[lordsaren101]

Dumat was taken down by a bunch of little girls and boys with sharp pieces of metal.... The Maker brought the Tevinter Imperium to it's knee's through his Vessel Andraste... Maker:1... Dumat:0

The maker would have to exist to score. All that died was a corrupted physical shell. Dumat laughs at the makers non existence. Laughed as Andraste cooked.

[Inquisitor Julianos]

Yeah sept the Maker put the old Gods in a Box under ground cause he could. Maker:2, Dumat:0