164 réponses à ce sujet

[lynroy]

Thread might be locked by the time you get back. Run like the wind!

Edmonton doesn't wake up for a few more hours so might as well order pizza.

[SolNebula]

Once respected back in the old days where they really fought for equality, now I literally cannot take modern feminists seriously. IMO modern day feminists leaders are radicals and deliver a hate message toward men.

Of course this is my opinion.

 

I don't think DA hates woman. BW is the most female friendly company I have ever seen, of course if someone want to create a polemic over something they will always find something or someone to get offended.

[n7stormrunner]

Because they're....  What's the politically correct term for "F'ing idiots"?

 

 

intelligently disadvantaged? no wait that could be one of the ones for people with real problems. 

 

cognitively underdeveloped? no that one is for real problems too...

 

I don't think there is one. admitting people may be morons isn't fashionable enough to get one I sorry to say.

[Slogbarg]

It was a tiny few seconds of a 30 minute critique. I think the DA example isn't particularly strong (she does present a lot of stronger ones in that video). The fact that there is such hostility to the point of death threats for such critiques is extremely problematic and thankfully the Bioware team have condemned the attacks on Sarkeesian and said that developers should be open to critique.

 

Have the "Death Threats" ever been officially investigated?

 

http://www.returnofk...against-herself

 

I would be interesting in seeing exactly where these death threats were sent from.

[Stronglav]

I'm back with popcorn.

But seriously I get impression that those feminists have nothing better to do then to look

for oppression of females in videogames?

This reminds me of the "ass effect" scenario.

[Revelat0]

I agree, feminist leaders 20-30 years ago would be protesting to be able to have a female "Hawke", "Inquisitor" or "Dovahkiin" to play as but now it just seems like it's more "It's misogynist/sexist...because" fuel, with no real argument or structure to support it. 

Ehh... Some things can outstay their welcome as they say.

[Rockpopple]

I'm just gonna leave this here and pretty much say or do nothing else while the thread is still relatively civil. I know how hot this topic can get.

 

I don't speak for Sarkeesian and I never would, and I don't know her. But I'm not convinced that she was slamming the entirety of Dragon Age: Origins by posting that clip in her video. I think it's a good possibility that if she is any kind of gamer at all, she loves DA:O but just hates the female City Elf origin.

 

I mean the female City Elf origin is kind of bleh. You could have been anything. You could have been a cutpurse on the run. You could have been the leader of a merc group, or a grunt in a merc group or I dunno something exciting or interesting.

 

Intead what are you? A girl about to get married who's kidnapped and threatened with rape.

 

Now I get that as the MC you get yourself out of that situation, but think about it: if you were a dude would you be put in that situation in the first place?

 

You can say "Hey, ******, male city elves have their wedding ruined too." Yes, but male city elves aren't dragged off to some dude's castle with the intent of a night's worth of molestation. I don't think anyone can imagine their male city elves would ever be put into that kind of demeaning situation.

 

And it's a shame because like I said, the female City elf could have an interesting, eclectic origin that had nothing to do with what was going on between her legs and what others wanted to do with it. Plus there'd actually be a reason for the character having martial ability other than "Oh, you're a badass but you happen to be getting married so shush about it"

 

Hell, that Grey Warden recruit rogue (I forget his name now, Daved? Daveth? Something like that) has a far more interesting Origin than the female City elf AND HE LIVED IN THE SAME CITY. 

 

Compare the female City elf origin to the female Dalish elf Origin. The Dalish elf doesn't have anything happen to her that wouldn't have happened to a dude (or rather, the dude elf doesn't NOT go through anything the female elf does). Imagine how much it would have sucked if the Dalish female elf was... I dunno.... kidnapped by the Dark Spawn so they could use her for breeding purposes. Well maybe that would have been more interesting cuz Darkspawn.

 

Now I don't know if that was Sarkeesian's reasoning for putting that DA:O clip in there, nor do I know if she feels the same way I do about Origins as a whole. But that's my two cents anyway.

[Stronglav]

Im leaving this party before THEY get here.And close it.

[Roamingmachine]

Edmonton doesn't wake up for a few more hours so might as well order pizza.

 

 

I can imagine the screams of horror coming from the BW community team when they discover that she-who-doesnt-deserved-to-be-named and her vitriol is being discussed here.....

[Scerene]

Once respected back in the old days where they really fought for equality, now I literally cannot take modern feminists seriously. IMO modern day feminists leaders are radicals and deliver a hate message toward men.

Of course this is my opinion.

 

I don't think DA hates woman. BW is the most female friendly company I have ever seen, of course if someone want to create a polemic over something they will always find something or someone to get offended.

women do a better job of oppressing eachother than men do. Who maintains all the gossip blogs, counts other womens cellulite, looks for "proof" ofplastic surgery, showcases celebs without makeup and parades it around for everyone to see. Who takes up patriarchal religions and decides to follow them and try to force them them on other women. Who insists on accepting their oppressed status?`Who resents and tries to keep down other women who are more beautiful/ and or talented and successful. Atleast with men if you earn their respect its there, but with women its all fine and dandy while gossip and bs reigns in the background. The most suffocating, oppressive and controlling teachers ive ever had were women who touted themselves as feminists. Nobody had a chance to speak in the classroom and was shut down as soon as they said something that said teacher wasnt on board with. Female "equality" is about everyone being good enough, until they prove themselves to be be better in which case other women will try to cut them down to size. Im not saying this is always true, a lot of the time it isnt. But men being blamed for everything? Yea no.

Who creates and maintains oppressive beauty standards and the fashion industry?

[Revelat0]

I'd rather avoid this discussion but I'll just point this out: There are a few games out there that over-sexualize women (some are even made by women; but that's beside the point.) There is a load of games out there however that generalize men as being nothing more than punching bags, and objects to be manipulated in various forms of death. Do people bring that subject up at all? No, death in video games sells. Anyways /end-rant... Hope this stays civil.

[n7stormrunner]

I can imagine the screams of horror coming from the BW community team when they discover that she-who-doesnt-deserved-to-be-named and her vitriol is being discussed here.....

 

you mean the "heh, they're at it again..." granted this exact thread hasn't happened before but much of it has. we're a rather repetitive bunch. 

[BronzTrooper]

I'm just gonna leave this here and pretty much say or do nothing else while the thread is still relatively civil. I know how hot this topic can get.

 

I don't speak for Sarkeesian and I never would, and I don't know her. But I'm not convinced that she was slamming the entirety of Dragon Age: Origins by posting that clip in her video. I think it's a good possibility that if she is any kind of gamer at all, she loves DA:O but just hates the female City Elf origin.

 

I mean the female City Elf origin is kind of bleh. You could have been anything. You could have been a cutpurse on the run. You could have been the leader of a merc group, or a grunt in a merc group or I dunno something exciting or interesting.

 

Intead what are you? A girl about to get married who's kidnapped and threatened with rape.

 

Now I get that as the MC you get yourself out of that situation, but think about it: if you were a dude would you be put in that situation in the first place?

 

You can say "Hey, ******, male city elves have their wedding ruined too." Yes, but male city elves aren't dragged off to some dude's castle with the intent of a night's worth of molestation. I don't think anyone can imagine their male city elves would ever be put into that kind of demeaning situation.

 

And it's a shame because like I said, the female City elf could have an interesting, eclectic origin that had nothing to do with what was going on between her legs and what others wanted to do with it. Plus there'd actually be a reason for the character having martial ability other than "Oh, you're a badass but you happen to be getting married so shush about it"

 

Hell, that Grey Warden recruit rogue (I forget his name now, Daved? Daveth? Something like that) has a far more interesting Origin than the female City elf AND HE LIVED IN THE SAME CITY. 

 

Compare the female City elf origin to the female Dalish elf Origin. The Dalish elf doesn't have anything happen to her that wouldn't have happened to a dude (or rather, the dude elf doesn't NOT go through anything the female elf does). Imagine how much it would have sucked if the Dalish female elf was... I dunno.... kidnapped by the Dark Spawn so they could use her for breeding purposes. Well maybe that would have been more interesting cuz Darkspawn.

 

Now I don't know if that was Sarkeesian's reasoning for putting that DA:O clip in there, nor do I know if she feels the same way I do about Origins as a whole. But that's my two cents anyway.

 

tbf, the CE origin was as much about racism as it was about sexism.  Maybe even more-so, imo.  Would you see Vaughan attempting to kidnap and rape a group of human women?  Nope.

[SolNebula]

can someone post the Star Trek "in before the lockdown" picture...

 

It should be here.....

[Roamingmachine]

I'm back with popcorn.

But seriously I get impression that those feminists have nothing better to do then to look

for oppression of females in videogames?

This reminds me of the "ass effect" scenario.

 

They are not feminists, they just abuse the term. They are what we here call, and this is a rough translation, "professional complainers".  They find validation by being unhappy and being vocal about it so they find every little, real or imagined, to complain about. Though she-must-not-be-named is not one of these. She's just a troll.

[Semyaza82]

   I actually think Anita makes some really good points in her videos. Personally I think she slightly misread DA:O, but that doesn't invalidate her opinion. As for 'well, we get to kill the rapist so its all good', she does actually talk about that fact and how that response doesn't change it being problematic.

   For me DA:O didn't fit her trope because there an attempt to show something of the emotional impact of rape. Again though, me disagreeing with her on this game doesn't mean I think she isn't raising some important issues.

 

Have the "Death Threats" ever been officially investigated?

 

http://www.returnofk...against-herself

 

I would be interesting in seeing exactly where these death threats were sent from.

Well police have been involved on several occasions, so yeah. Pretty much confirmed. 

[BloodyTalon]

Just a sad time to be a gamer I guess

[Roamingmachine]

can someone post the Star Trek "in before the lockdown" picture...

 

It should be here.....

 

 

Edit: Ninja'd!

[BronzTrooper]

can someone post the Star Trek "in before the lockdown" picture...

 

It should be here.....

 

How about an Indy one?

 

[JerZey CJ]

   I actually think Anita makes some really good points in her videos. Personally I think she slightly misread DA:O, but that doesn't invalidate her opinion. As for 'well, we get to kill the rapist so its all good', she does actually talk about that fact and how that response doesn't change it being problematic.

   For me DA:O didn't fit her trope because there an attempt to show something of the emotional impact of rape. Again though, me disagreeing with her on this game doesn't mean I think she isn't raising some important issues.

 

Well police have been involved on several occasions, so yeah. Pretty much confirmed. 

But did anything ever come of her "getting the police involved?" Was there ever a follow up to that? I remember seeing those tweets, but never what resulted.

[lynroy]

I can imagine the screams of horror coming from the BW community team when they discover that she-who-doesnt-deserved-to-be-named and her vitriol is being discussed here.....

I imagine it's more an internal groan or this expression:

[n7stormrunner]

I'd rather avoid this discussion but I'll just point this out: There are a few games out there that over-sexualize women (some are even made by women; but that's beside the point.) There is a load of games out there however that generalize men as being nothing more than punching bags, and objects to be manipulated in various forms of death. Do people bring that subject up at all? No, death in video games sells. Anyways /end-rant... Hope this stays civil.

 

that reminds me a good number of the classic harem romance manga were written by women.

 

one of the newer one which would throw many a feminist into a fit is written by a woman... I'm talking it has rightfully been called pokemon with t***. hell one of the actual ads for sekirei for the funimation channel  was "the breast show of the season."

 

now before I end up saying something embarrassing, rude, or random, I'm going to bed.

 

p.s. no, not that pervs