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[Returnpolicy]

All this talk about agenda is somewhat silly in my opinion. It's about having more choice and more balance in the relationships we can build with our team-mates in one of the best-loved titles and most anticipated game of 2010. What kind of gamer would object to having more choice?



Choice is optional - don't want it don't go there. We're arguing same-sex romance should be included because a significant proportion of gamers would dearly like to play their Shepard as they see fit. It's a single-player game so that one gamer's choice has no impact on another gamer's game.

[Darth_Shizz]

 Well...one of them is unbuttoned in the first. Though that's probably balanced out by the fact they have no eyes.

Edit - Cushion, sofa, stool, carpenter, stable, horse, unicorn, ogre...

WIZARD  

Modifié par Darth_Shizz, 25 janvier 2010 - 01:57 .

[vhatever]

Returnpolicy wrote...

All this talk about agenda is somewhat silly in my opinion. It's about having more choice and more balance in the relationships we can build with our team-mates in one of the best-loved titles and most anticipated game of 2010. What kind of gamer would object to having more choice?

Choice is optional - don't want it don't go there. We're arguing same-sex romance should be included because a significant proportion of gamers would dearly like to play their Shepard as they see fit. It's a single-player game so that one gamer's choice has no impact on another gamer's game.

Any gamer who isn't an ignorant kid?

The reality is that bioware does not wave a magic wand to create a game and then ship it out. It takes lots and lots of programming hours. All those hours devoted to pointless ****** relationships that 98%+ don't even want could instead have been spent adding other content, a new squadmate, more weapons, a new mission or mission series, which 98% DO want.

[Darth_Shizz]

vhatever wrote...

Any gamer who isn't an ignorant kid?

The reality is that bioware does not wave a magic wand to create a game and then ship it out. It takes lots and lots of programming hours. All those hours devoted to pointless ****** relationships that 98%+ don't even want could instead have been spent adding other content, a new squadmate, more weapons, a new mission or mission series, which 98% DO want.

One that happens to be gay 

[Returnpolicy]

vhatever wrote...

Returnpolicy wrote...

All this talk about agenda is somewhat silly in my opinion. It's about having more choice and more balance in the relationships we can build with our team-mates in one of the best-loved titles and most anticipated game of 2010. What kind of gamer would object to having more choice?

Choice is optional - don't want it don't go there. We're arguing same-sex romance should be included because a significant proportion of gamers would dearly like to play their Shepard as they see fit. It's a single-player game so that one gamer's choice has no impact on another gamer's game.

Any gamer who isn't an ignorant kid?

The reality is that bioware does not wave a magic wand to create a game and then ship it out. It takes lots and lots of programming hours. All those hours devoted to pointless ****** relationships that 98%+ don't even want could instead have been spent adding other content, a new squadmate, more weapons, a new mission or mission series, which 98% DO want.

I disagree, Vhatever. Consider the following: Bioware has made no less than *6* romance options available which apparently play out differently depending on whether you interact with them as paragon or renegade. This already represents a significant investment in resources and underlines the importance that Bioware has accorded to the team-building part of the game.
Relationships = emotional engagement with the characters and NPCs which increases identification and makes for more replayability. Allowing, say, 2 of these characters to be open to both sexes would need *no* or very little customization on Bioware's part. A weapon does not represent content per se just an additional option whereas interaction options amount to a significant amount of content.

[vhatever]

Darth_Shizz wrote...

vhatever wrote...

Any gamer who isn't an ignorant kid?

The reality is that bioware does not wave a magic wand to create a game and then ship it out. It takes lots and lots of programming hours. All those hours devoted to pointless ****** relationships that 98%+ don't even want could instead have been spent adding other content, a new squadmate, more weapons, a new mission or mission series, which 98% DO want.

One that happens to be gay 

Nah. a real gamer isn't going to really care about "who is a LI" and "who is not" -- gay or straight. Which is why i know these gay LI pushers aren't actually gamers.

[ERJAK2]

Ethan009 wrote...

vhatever wrote...

Darth_Shizz wrote...

vhatever wrote...

Any gamer who isn't an ignorant kid?

The reality is that bioware does not wave a magic wand to create a game and then ship it out. It takes lots and lots of programming hours. All those hours devoted to pointless ****** relationships that 98%+ don't even want could instead have been spent adding other content, a new squadmate, more weapons, a new mission or mission series, which 98% DO want.

One that happens to be gay 

Nah. a real gamer isn't going to really care about "who is a LI" and "who is not" -- gay or straight. Which is why i know these gay LI pushers aren't actually gamers.

Oh god.

Its the girls can't play video games because they're to busy doing their hair and other nonsense type arguement and actually want character development other than "let's kill things." I thought I had gotten over this already.

Plus weapons in this game don't actually have stats, and we have like 20 sets of fully customizable armor, why do we need more?

And adding another character is the best option, here's hoping Katsumi is Bi!

Oh, and I hate space hamsters, just putting that out there.

Modifié par ERJAK2, 25 janvier 2010 - 02:23 .

[PiercedMonk]

vhatever wrote...

The reality is that bioware does not wave a magic wand to create a game and then ship it out. It takes lots and lots of programming hours. All those hours devoted to pointless ****** relationships that 98%+ don't even want could instead have been spent adding other content, a new squadmate, more weapons, a new mission or mission series, which 98% DO want.

98%, eh? Did you know that 87% of all statistics on the internet are made up on the spot? Still, I'm curious to know where you're getting that figure from. I don't think there's been a comprehensive poll of BioWare's fanbase to sort out exactly what their sexual orientations are.

Also, let's assume for a moment that you're correct, and only two per-cent of the people playing 'Mass Effect' are gay or bisexual.

That still ignores all the male players who'd be the primary audiance for a female/female scene. Most lady-on-lady pornography made isn't actually aimed at women. True story!

It also ignores all the ladies playing the game who'd be all about seeing a male/male romance. Women are the primary source of all the male/male slashfic on the internet, and the target audiance for yaoi [boy's love] manga.

Now, I have no idea what the numbers are on dudes playing the game who'd be quite happy to have their femShep motor-boat Miranda, or just how many women would quite happily play as guyShep so they could see him share a tender moment with Jacob, and I'm not just going to make some numbers up. However, I would be willing to bet actual cash-monies on the number being a whole lot higher than your supposed two per-cent.

Further! The idea that the developers didn't have the time and resources to include same-sex romance options is completely invalidated by the fact that there's a whole fish tank mini-game. I'm not objecting to the fish tank--well...any reasons I would have for doing so don't belong in this thread--but I am saying that if the BioWare developers were sitting around a table and figured that letting players collect fish and modle spaceships was a worthwhile use of resources, than they have no leg to stand on if they're going to claim that they've taken a step backwards and excluded same-sex relationships solely on the basis of resource expenditure.

[vhatever]

Ethan009 wrote...

vhatever wrote...

Darth_Shizz wrote...

vhatever wrote...

Any gamer who isn't an ignorant kid?

The reality is that bioware does not wave a magic wand to create a game and then ship it out. It takes lots and lots of programming hours. All those hours devoted to pointless ****** relationships that 98%+ don't even want could instead have been spent adding other content, a new squadmate, more weapons, a new mission or mission series, which 98% DO want.

One that happens to be gay 

Nah. a real gamer isn't going to really care about "who is a LI" and "who is not" -- gay or straight. Which is why i know these gay LI pushers aren't actually gamers.

Oh god.

Its the girls can't play video games because they're to busy doing their hair and other nonsense type arguement and actually want character development other than "let's kill things." I thought I had gotten over this already.

Is that some kind of ****** vernacular you are communicating in? Is there some kind of gay lexicon i can consult to figure out what the hell you said, or what your point was for that matter?

I don't find girl FPS/RPG players any different than guys in anything other than they tend to to like to customize their outfits/characters more.

[ERJAK2]

PiercedMonk wrote...

vhatever wrote...

The reality is that bioware does not wave a magic wand to create a game and then ship it out. It takes lots and lots of programming hours. All those hours devoted to pointless ****** relationships that 98%+ don't even want could instead have been spent adding other content, a new squadmate, more weapons, a new mission or mission series, which 98% DO want.

Also, let's assume for a moment that you're correct, and only two per-cent of the people playing 'Mass Effect' are gay or bisexual.

The likelyhood of this^ is very small as this is a Bioware game, and I'd bet that close to every gay/lesbian person who play videogames plays Bioware games because of their superior track record. 

[ERJAK2]

please do not respond to vhatever for any reason. No good will come of it.

[Akrim_Drak]

Ethan you need more Bara... Yaoi is so meh! (don't hurt me!)



And yeah ERJAK I totally agree. Anyway, I wonder if Liara will at least tell you she still loves you in her "cameo" I think that would be nice.

[Yazston the Invoker]

Ok, first off, who in their right mind would create a thread entitled " it's 2010, players should have a same-sex romance option", and then state that there can be no discussion of the topic unless it's all-out support? Really? I thought we got over that "free-speech" hurdle about 200 years before homosexuality became a topic that was discussed in public. And why is it in this country, that you can talk about such things without being put to the lash, unlike some others? Please...this topic merits discussion, no matter what you may want.



Now, while I have no problem with homosexual romances in games, I don't see why this is such a hot issue. They left out an option for your character, that they either did not have time for, did not want to add, or could not put together in a way that they felt made sense. (this could have been because of the lask of a believable homosexual character, or otherwise) More than likely, I think they came to the end of their funding and had to choose between a little more game content/dialogue, and chose to omit some dialogue/scenes that would have allowed for a homosexual romance. Now, the reason I don't see this as a huge issue, is because, I, for one, do not play these games for the romances. I find them fun diversions at times (and other times annoying, like when Leiliana and Morrigan get mad at you for romancing them both, when you only ever said anything romantic to one of them), but my main reason for playing these games is the story. Problem is, the story in this one appears to be based on the possible extinction of the human race, and the one human who has a chance to fight to stop it. Now, personally, given the overarching story, I would not have been disappointed to see NO romance options available. Seems to me that someone with that kind of responsibility would find it difficult to have a good, maningful romantic relationship. I mean, heck, I used to find it difficult to date myself when I was working 60-hours a week at a desk-job, let alone flying around the galaxy getting my ass shot off every other day. Basically, what I am saying, is that story-wise, we should be happy that they put in a romance period.



Also, they may have chosen not to have a homosexual relationship for another reason...has anyone possibly thought that perhaps Sheppard, feeling a duty to the human race, has chosen to forgo his(or her) true sexual orientation for the good of the human race? I mean, if the human race is brought to the brink of extinction, barring the ability (and morality) to clone humans, we would need whatever people we have left to focus on breeding, in which case, a homosexual relationship does not cut it. Given an attitude like this, Sheppard may have tried to suppress his/her homosexual tendencies in order to deal with the fact that he/she needs to have heterosexual sex with people he/she is less than attracted to in order to further the race. Just a thought.



In the end, though, it's Bioware's IP, and Bioware's choice. If they choose to do something about it in the future, then kudos to them for listening to the fan base, but in the meantime, let's not make this a political or religious argument, or talk about who they dissed...just enjoy the game for what it is, and keep sending your feedback to the devs, instead of trying to drum up support while telling people not to exercise their right of free speech.

[vhatever]

ERJAK2 wrote...

please do not respond to vhatever for any reason. No good will come of it.

Oh, I dunno. the destruction of your bogus arguments and lame agenda sounds pretty good to me.

[Akrim_Drak]

Ethan009 wrote...

Akrim_Drak wrote...

Ethan you need more Bara... Yaoi is so meh! (don't hurt me!)

And yeah ERJAK I totally agree. Anyway, I wonder if Liara will at least tell you she still loves you in her "cameo" I think that would be nice.

But Bara scares me (or at least the bara I've seen) too much muscle! Scary guys.

XD

Here something actually on topic. XD
www.youtube.com/watch

What could have been.

Yeah some of it is outrageously overdone I guess. I like tasteful too aaaand I hate that video, it will forever make me sad and bitter.

[Phate Phoenix]

I would've loved to see a homosexual choice in Mass Effect 2. Heck, the whole reason I became interested in ME1 was because Liara was romancible by FemShep. I thought, hey, if they're willing to do that, what else are they going to do?



Plese Note: ME1 was my first Bioware game. XD

[Medhia Nox]

Yazton - seriously? You know that science makes straight sex irrelevant (and I'll repeat this so long as I see inane excuses using reproduction).

Shepard could have a loving relationship with a man - and still have a child with a woman. And don't give me - that's not good for the child. Look what some of you people do with your childen.

There is no reason NOT to have the option. I believe the people who would purchase because of its inclusion would outweigh the people who would refuse to purchase the game because of the same reason.

And for crying out loud - it isn't about sex - it's about a story telling opportunity that isn't provided for a portion of the consumer base.

Any good company would want their consumer base to express their desires. I expect Bioware to be no different. Sadly - most people also feel the need to defend their position because of bigots who belong to a static majority of tradition - who are hell bent on keeping what they have and not sharing any of it.

Modifié par Medhia Nox, 25 janvier 2010 - 02:55 .

[Yazston the Invoker]

1) Breeding was not a point, just a quick try at a possible explanation...as in use your imagination, and think of one of the thousands of reasons story-wise, why Bioware chose to exclude a homosexual relationship.



2) The only 2 romance options I know of as a male Shep are with the 2 humans...who are the other romances with? (I'm curious, and I assume you are speaking of confirmed romances) It would truly look worse on Bioware's side if they have more than 2 or 3 romance options alltogether, though I still stick with my point that they may not have felt that they had a "believable" homosexual option...

[Akrim_Drak]

Yeah, that's one of the reasons I think people are upset, practically the entire romance was there and done(all of it for femShep and Ashley) but a few tiny animations was "too much"? I dunno. I don't know why I even bother anymore.