Currently looking for something to do 'til DA:I comes out... is A Dance with Rogues any good?
I liked it for the excellent game play. The dialogues are a bit meh sometimes, but overall it's one of the best if not the best of rogue/stealth modules out there. I've replayed it several times. It's pretty huge too. Most of the adult content is optional except for the introduction and that isn't very descriptive on purpose (fade to black as well). But yeah definitely not for kids.
1-> Yes I'd like if my LI wrecked some random person's **** to get me a gift (though not effing flowers <.<)
2-> I didn't dislike Quentin that much, mostly because I honestly don't care about Hawke's mom
Maybe the game could be the LI's story and the PC is just a part if it. The story would be the means the LI expects you to take vs the actual deciions made.It sounds like this Darker LI would just be basically selfish, ends-justify-the-means, and have zero empathy for strangers. So I'm guessing they would have some sort of agenda, which may or may not be apparent at first blush. Accumulating wealth / power is pretty typical.
I'm wondering what sort of character arc might work well for such a character. The standard Bioware companion formula allows the PC to influence them to change in some way ("for the better"). I wonder how players would feel about a role-reversal here, where a companion character would be the catalyst for change in the PC.
It sounds like this Darker LI would just be basically selfish, ends-justify-the-means, and have zero empathy for strangers. So I'm guessing they would have some sort of agenda, which may or may not be apparent at first blush. Accumulating wealth / power is pretty typical.
I'm wondering what sort of character arc might work well for such a character. The standard Bioware companion formula allows the PC to influence them to change in some way ("for the better"). I wonder how players would feel about a role-reversal here, where a companion character would be the catalyst for change in the PC.
I kind of want this.
A darker companion corrupting my PC would be a nice change.
Anders isn't even close. He's whiny, emotionally vulnerable and generally trying to help people. He's basically a good person going off the rails in his desire to give freedom and justice to people he considers oppressed. Both his character and his motivations are thus the precise opposite of what is being asked for.
Err if you say so. I saw Anders devolve from someone who was a caring person to a mass murderer. That is a pretty dark tragetory. And him being whiny doesn't negate him being dark. Most people who murder for a political cause do so for "freedom" that doesn't make them any less dark. Most villians don't actually think they are villians. Anders is evil, his cause might be just but he ends up evil. He doesn't start there but by the end of the story he is evil.
Anders knows what he did is extreme, he expects people will want to kill him for it and agrees that would be justice too. He's aware that his good intentions have paved his way to hell, so to speak. He just thinks that it's still worth it regardless of what happens to him, the guy is pretty damn selfless. So not what we're asking for here
If he was the kind of dark we want, he probably would have made it look like someone else blew up the chantry, or have left the deed unclaimed, and then sided with the mages being unjustly killed totally not because of him and looked like a hero.
Or for another kind of dark, have blown it up as a gift to a romanced Hawke who didn't like the chantry or something
I remember after The Dark Knight came out seeing self-insert fanfiction about THE ****** JOKER
It was the most popular trend everywhere.
Batman was totally forgotten. LOL
Maybe the game could be the LI's story and the PC is just a part if it. The story would be the means the LI expects you to take vs the actual deciions made.
I kind of want this.
A darker companion corrupting my PC would be a nice change.
How about some:
Me, too.
Bonus points if PC and LI can ride off into the sunset with the spoils after not having solved everybody else's problems.
Yes running off into the sunset stealing everyone's loot sounds wonderful 
Kain why do you like Yanderes so much 
I'm scared.
Kain why do you like Yanderes so much
Because they are very nice and caring towards their loved one, and appreciate their company and don't need other people, never cheat, don't hurt. And all you have to do in return is love them as well. I'd love the crap out of a Yandere if I had one.
Because they are very nice and caring towards their loved one, and appreciate their company and don't need other people, never cheat, don't hurt. And all you have to do in return is love them as well. I'd love the crap out of a Yandere if I had one.
Never hurt?
what Yanderes have you been seeing? All of them hurt!
Never hurt?
what Yanderes have you been seeing? All of them hurt!
They never hurt their beloved if said beloved loves them back.
They never hurt their beloved if said beloved loves them back.
Hell some even hurt them then. If you dare look at anyone else. *shudders*
Hell some even hurt them then. If you dare look at anyone else. *shudders*
Noo, they hurt the ones that you look at, not you. And whats the problem anyway? Don't look at other people like that lol.
Dat smexy psychosis ^^
I'd have to disagree. I already went through cheating drama once. I rather not do it again. There's a reason I stick to one LI most of the time and it's to avoid the drama. (and when I don't I usually regret it). One Jacob was quite enough.
I think a 'cheating' LI arc could work decently if done in reverse- if the PC were the one who could incite the LI to cheat on a prior relationship, rather than the PC being the one cheated on.
I wouldn't try to mix it with your 'darker LI' idea, but you could have a pretty solid character arc with a romance twist in which Companion X, in a committed relationship, undergoes relationship troubles. As an RPG plot you could push X to either (A) remain committed or (
to end the relationship. The romance arc twist would be to introduce some romantic tension that never gets acted upon in (A), while ( becomes 'leave them for me.'
It would certainly be an option to place the player in an atypical role.
I think a 'cheating' LI arc could work decently if done in reverse- if the PC were the one who could incite the LI to cheat on a prior relationship, rather than the PC being the one cheated on.
I wouldn't try to mix it with your 'darker LI' idea, but you could have a pretty solid character arc with a romance twist in which Companion X, in a committed relationship, undergoes relationship troubles. As an RPG plot you could push X to either (A) remain committed or (
It would certainly be an option to place the player in an atypical role.
Reminded me of a scene in fable 3, when you meet your old girlfriend ( by story ) and she is with another guy because you disappeared for a long time, and then she asks if she should dump him to reunite with you. I was speechless.. and the game acknowledged my speechlessness. xD
You don't see how two ambitious and power hungry people doing whatever it takes to save the world while putting themselves ontop could work? Because I can. The two aren't anti one another. You can nurture a power base while stopping a greater threat (especially since that threat itself threatens you and your power as well).
Again I'm not looking for stupid evil kick the puppies as they walk by types. Someone who wants to expand their own influence and wealth and a villian with great publicity is the type of evil I'm looking for. Someone who's not at all unwilling to crack a skull open if something they need is inside it but they won't just do it for the evilulz if it's unnecessary since they're well aware a good reputation is helpful and being loved is better than being hated.
Reading through much of the thread, I think it would help to identify that horribly divergent question of 'what is evil?' Or rather, 'what is evil enough'?
Are we looking for someone who simply has very significant character or moral flaws? Someone who advances a cause that harms others? Someone who is unapologetic about flouting certain social conventions? Someone who holds cultural beliefs radically different in values from modern western liberalism?
There's quite a bit you could do with all of them, enough so that I think fixating on 'evil' is a bit misleading. Evil frequently implies a malevolence that need not apply: David Xanatos was unquestionably an antagonistic villain, but he was more about amoral self-interest than making people suffer for laughs. He also had a close friend and an honest romantic relationship.
Since a LI should be attractive or appealing in their own right, even if they aren't of full moral rectitude, I think focusing on 'evil' LI's is a misnomer.
I need to get some sleep for tomorrow, but here's some ideas that I'll try to elaborate more on later that could be legitimate LI 'flaws' that needn't overshadow the character to the point of utter unlikability.
1. Imperialist administrator/aristocrat.
2. Casual racism.
3. Cultural chavenism.
4. Ideological Zealot
5. Unrepentent petty criminal (especially scam artists)
6. Corrupt official/white collar criminal
7. Amoral ego-centric (a particularly good one: they care more about your perception of them than anything they do in partiuclar)
8. Petty rivalries with others
9. Deliberate corruptor
And, of course...
Yandere
Just as feedback I personally am kind of tired of the Knights in Shining Armor and would be morally dubious but they had a bad past and want to become a better person woobies.
I just would prefer a much more morally twisted love interest for once. (Preferably a straight male since we get close to it on female love interests (Morrigan but even she has woobie syndrome). Hopefully that doesn't fall into the stupid evil pitfall or the love redeems trope (maybe they could encourage the PC to be darker and make more ruthless decisions for a fall to darkness). I'd just like someone a bit on the darker side that my darker characters could romance. Who isn't that way because of a terrible childhood for once (would be nice if they had a nice childhood and was just an jerk because some people are just jerky).
And no this isn't a demand. Just a request for an LI type I'd like to see in the future.
(If anyone else has any suggestions for future LIs for more morally dubious PCs feel free to throw em in here)
Wait a second. OP, are you asking to romance Kreia?
Reading through much of the thread, I think it would help to identify that horribly divergent question of 'what is evil?' Or rather, 'what is evil enough'?
Are we looking for someone who simply has very significant character or moral flaws? Someone who advances a cause that harms others? Someone who is unapologetic about flouting certain social conventions? Someone who holds cultural beliefs radically different in values from modern western liberalism?
There's quite a bit you could do with all of them, enough so that I think fixating on 'evil' is a bit misleading. Evil frequently implies a malevolence that need not apply: David Xanatos was unquestionably an antagonistic villain, but he was more about amoral self-interest than making people suffer for laughs. He also had a close friend and an honest romantic relationship.
Since a LI should be attractive or appealing in their own right, even if they aren't of full moral rectitude, I think focusing on 'evil' LI's is a misnomer.
I need to get some sleep for tomorrow, but here's some ideas that I'll try to elaborate more on later that could be legitimate LI 'flaws' that needn't overshadow the character to the point of utter unlikability.
1. Imperialist administrator/aristocrat.
2. Casual racism.
3. Cultural chavenism.
4. Ideological Zealot
5. Unrepentent petty criminal (especially scam artists)
6. Corrupt official/white collar criminal
7. Amoral ego-centric (a particularly good one: they care more about your perception of them than anything they do in partiuclar)
8. Petty rivalries with others
9. Deliberate corruptor
And, of course...
Yandere
Honestly I felt Morrigan and Viconia come pretty close (except they almost always get a redemption arc of sorts)
That said you're right I am focusing on evil too much since people are apparently thinking I want someone who eats babies for the lulz as an LI 
Though I am looking forward to your expansions on those. They do peek my interest (particularly 9)
Though god I'll take a Yandere rather than another KISA or woobie. I don't particularly like yanderes but damnit it'd be different. >_>
I think a 'cheating' LI arc could work decently if done in reverse- if the PC were the one who could incite the LI to cheat on a prior relationship, rather than the PC being the one cheated on.
I wouldn't try to mix it with your 'darker LI' idea, but you could have a pretty solid character arc with a romance twist in which Companion X, in a committed relationship, undergoes relationship troubles. As an RPG plot you could push X to either (A) remain committed or (
It would certainly be an option to place the player in an atypical role.
It could but I personally would flee in the opposite direction. That just isn't for me sadly.
Wait a second. OP, are you asking to romance Kreia?
*snip*
I mean, I know Kreia is the **** but is she really anything past ally material?
Anyway it seems like your asking for a love interest that is bad for the sake of being bad. I think you need to take a long hard look at the definitions of villain, antagonist, and the necessary rounding of those characters by giving them something more that just an impression of being morally bad.
Kreia was more neutral than evil actually from what I recall of KOTOR2.
But fair enough Blackout I am clearly not explaining myself clearly enough. I mean self interest and power and not wanting the typical "I was abused as a child and do this until you can heal me with the power of your love whether friendship or romantic" is bad for the sake of being bad now? I must've really explained myself badly over these last few pages.
Honestly I just want an LI that fits with the more jerkwad PCs without seeming ridiculous.
Noo, they hurt the ones that you look at, not you. And whats the problem anyway? Don't look at other people like that lol.
Nope. Some of them hurt you too just for daring to look at someone too long. Nope nope nope.
Nope. Some of them hurt you too just for daring to look at someone too long. Nope nope nope.
Well don't look! You are supposed to look only at your beautiful Yandere, look! 
Forget about everyone else, that's the only one you need!
Ehem.. anyway..
That said you're right I am focusing on evil too much since people are apparently thinking I want someone who eats babies for the lulz as an LI
How about someone like Vaas? A little torture doesn't hurt:
I really wouldn't mind a friend or a LI like that, they would make my day. 
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