you are talking about evil relationships. EVIL, and you explictly stated and I quote "they don't care about other people." Abuse and Rape are two things which would occure in an evil relationship, because by their very defination they are not in a good or healthy relationship.
Evil people DO care about other people, they just don't care about random people. They care about people that care about them, people that they benefit from.
The thing is though who really wants to be with a complete dick? You ever hear the warning of never dating someone who's rude to waiters?
Plenty of people in fiction anyway (before someone tries to make me out to drag that stuff into RL). I was also warned not to date thieves and liars. But we can date those in DA games.
Evil people DO care about other people, they just don't care about random people. They care about people that care about them, people that they benefit from.
Sooo, a one night stand with an evil person? that I can understand
Sooo, a one night stand with an evil person? that I can understand
No... a long lasting committed relationship. Jeez..
Plenty of people in fiction anyway (before someone tries to make me out to drag that stuff into RL). I was also warned not to date thieves and liars. But we can date those in DA games.
I suppose I can imagine a few scenarios where it's believable 2 immoral people wind up together- things like a junky couple robbing people and doing whatever it takes to get their next fix, and an ambitious and power hungry couple doing whatever it takes to further themselves (Macbeth?), etc. but all of them don't work with a protagonist out to save the world.
I suppose I can imagine a few scenarios where it's believable 2 immoral people wind up together- things like Junkies robbing people and doing whatever it takes to get their next fix, and ambitious and power hungry people doing whatever it takes (Macbeth?), etc. but all of them don't work with a protagonist out to save the world.
You don't see how two ambitious and power hungry people doing whatever it takes to save the world while putting themselves ontop could work? Because I can. The two aren't anti one another. You can nurture a power base while stopping a greater threat (especially since that threat itself threatens you and your power as well).
Again I'm not looking for stupid evil kick the puppies as they walk by types. Someone who wants to expand their own influence and wealth and a villian with great publicity is the type of evil I'm looking for. Someone who's not at all unwilling to crack a skull open if something they need is inside it but they won't just do it for the evilulz if it's unnecessary since they're well aware a good reputation is helpful and being loved is better than being hated.
"Whatever it takes" would mean chasing power at the expense of all things, like saving the world for example. One of the common tropes for a villain is the one whose lust for power ends up threatening the universe.
"Whatever it takes" would mean chasing power at the expense of all things, like saving the world for example. One of the common tropes for a villain is the one whose lust for power ends up threatening the universe.
You can use the same whatever it takes for X justification for noble characters like Loghain. Everything is dangerous in extremes.
And yeah that is a common trope. It's also a common fallen heroes trope. It's by no means a foregone conclusion.
If Bioware ever made an rpg where the protagonist can truly be evil though, then I could see a LI attracted to them for their power/influence/wealth. I guess they sorta did a half arsed version in Kotor?
DAVID XANATOS AND KIMBLEE (manga ver.) PLZ!!!!*run away*
"Whatever it takes" would mean chasing power at the expense of all things, like saving the world for example. One of the common tropes for a villain is the one whose lust for power ends up threatening the universe.
If the world is going to be completely destroyed then there is nothing to enjoy, power or not. Power in itself is meaningless, power is means to acquire things that actually matter.
If Bioware ever made an rpg where the protagonist can truly be evil though, then I could see a LI attracted to them for their power/influence/wealth. I guess they sorta did a half arsed version in Kotor?
Jade Empire let you have evil LIs (granted you had to persuade most of em to be evil but they were there and it's one of my favorite games because of it). But no KOTOR2 did it but that wasn't BW. KOTOR just let you be evil with Bastila but she got driven dark by Malak. Fem Revan was forever alone if DS tho. (But honestly considering she was stuck with freaking Carth that was a blessing in disguise)
I know BW can do evil Lis because they've done them before. And to me it was done well (Sky was anyway. Silk Fox was also pretty good. Dawn Star was a hot mess tho).
As a male in Kotor you can rule the galaxy with evil bastila. Not that it felt very natural
The thing is though who really wants to be with a complete dick? You ever hear the warning of never dating someone who's rude to waiters?
In real life? Heck NO
In fiction? Hello YES!
I though the purpose of games is give us a chance to do something we don't do in RL?
Plus a few tropes could make some potential drak/evil LI
Magnificent Bastard Noble Demon Affably Evil
As a male in Kotor you can rule the galaxy with evil bastila. Not that it felt very natural
Yeah I edited that in when I remembered XD I was more fond of DS FemRevan. I was mixing it up with KOTOR2's influence mechanic (which I loved DS Atton is 
)
In real life? Heck NO
In fiction? Hello YES!
I though the purpose of games is give us a chance to do something we don't do in RL?
Plus a few tropes could make some potential drak/evil LI
Yeah this. (the bolded)
If I meant any of the DA companions in real life I'd run in the opposite direction. They're murderers at best for the most part. In fiction though? If it's interesting hell yeah.
"Whatever it takes" would mean chasing power at the expense of all things, like saving the world for example. One of the common tropes for a villain is the one whose lust for power ends up threatening the universe.
But that's just moralizing. It's perfectly reasonable to have an intelligent villain who realizes the danger in limitless lust of power. David Xanatos being a great example.
They still can't be a complete dick though, more like a flawed character
If I meant any of the DA companions in real life I'd run in the opposite direction. They're murderers at best for the most part. In fiction though? If it's interesting hell yeah.
Are you kidding? If Alistair was real I'd have so many children by now
I suppose I can imagine a few scenarios where it's believable 2 immoral people wind up together- things like a junky couple robbing people and doing whatever it takes to get their next fix, and an ambitious and power hungry couple doing whatever it takes to further themselves (Macbeth?), etc. but all of them don't work with a protagonist out to save the world.
That's odd because we can have that in Origins. My Warden romanced Morrigan, made choices that had a greater chance of furthering himself both politically and against the arch demon. Killed the mages for lolz with Morrigan, cared enough about her to find the grimoire and "kill" Flemeth. Left Redcliffe to burn to weaken Arl Eamon and killed his son partially because he was possessed but also..politics and because he wanted to punish Isolde. Freed that rapist Arl just to get him to lend a voice at the landsmeet. Took the Dark ritual because he didn't want to die even while thinking that he could be unleashing a possible future threat to the world, chopped off Alistair's(had him at Friend) head for political power and married Anora. Morrigan had her own reasons for going with the Warden and her ambition to have a God baby was just as great as my Warden's ambitions for power. They still saved Fereldan and ended the blight.
They still can't be a complete dick though, more like a flawed character
Are you kidding? If Alistair was real I'd have so many children by now
As long as that flaw isn't woobiefied I'm good.
Hell no. Alistair acts like a sulky child at moments and waffles as much as Seb several times. I like him but no in real life I would not date him. He also is very take take take when it comes from the PC doesn't even remember her whole family got slaughtered wholesale while talking about Duncan and god forbid you say a negative thing about the man who may have conscripted you. He barely offers the PC any support (hell I felt more emotionally supported by Wynne and I don't like Wynne!)
He's a good person if flawed but no his flaws are not something I'd tolerate.
That's odd because we can have that in Origins. My Warden romanced Morrigan, made choices that had a greater chance of furthering himself both politically and against the arch demon. Killed the mages for lolz with Morrigan, cared enough about her to find the grimoire and "kill" Flemeth. Left Redcliffe to burn to weaken Arl Eamon and killed his son partially because he was possessed but also..politics and because he wanted to punish Isolde. Freed that rapist Arl just to get him to lend a voice at the landsmeet. Took the Dark ritual because he didn't want to die even while thinking that he could be unleashing a possible future threat to the world, chopped off Alistair's(had him at Friend) head for political power and married Anora. Morrigan had her own reasons for going with the Warden and her ambition to have a God baby was just as great as my Warden's ambitions for power. They still saved Fereldan and ended the blight.
Doing evil things in bioware games tends to make your character seem schizophrenic, but if you're happy with it and Morrigan is evil enough for you then I guess the request is invalid?
They still can't be a complete dick though, more like a flawed character
Ok imagine this:
A guy is coming back home and meets a random person in the alley. He brakes that persons legs and steals their money. Then uses the money to buy his girlfriend flowers, and to spend a nice evening at the restaurant together. Now imagine that this persons girlfriend would do the same, and they are in a loving relationship.
Doing evil things in bioware games tends to make your character seem schizophrenic, but if you're happy with it and Morrigan is evil enough for you then I guess the request is invalid?
How is my character schizo? Because he did some morally questionable things while at the same time working to save his country? How would he benefit from being King of a ruined country? How could he be the hero and sit on the throne of a wasteland? Why wouldn't he want to strengthen the Wardens, an organization he is commander of? In Origins, you can flat out not be a nice person from the very start of the game. That doesn't mean you're gonna be a complete moron and get yourself killed and country destroyed.
I don't see the request as invalid. Some people didn't experience the relationship with Morrigan because she was cut off to female wardens, I also think my evil power hungry couple play through worked because he was a Cousland. Also, Morrigan didn't challenge the Warden as much, unless the Warden wanted to be good all the time. I think some people are tired of the whole "Fix me I'm broken" LIs which we had in Alistair, Leliana, Zevran (sort of), and then the entire DA 2 LI cast. Mixing it up would be nice.
I'm not referring to your character specifically, but decisions like telling on Mouse in Thane's loyalty quest and killing mages for lulz seem really really out of place. I think someone was talking about stupid evil before
They still can't be a complete dick though, more like a flawed character
Well, it's a YMMV whether or not they're a dick. Mostly, I think people want LIs who are nice to them, with everyone else far more easily falling into the "meh" category.
As long as that flaw isn't woobiefied I'm good.
Hell no. Alistair acts like a sulky child at moments and waffles as much as Seb several times. I like him but no in real life I would not date him. He also is very take take take when it comes from the PC doesn't even remember her whole family got slaughtered wholesale while talking about Duncan and god forbid you say a negative thing about the man who may have conscripted you. He barely offers the PC any support (hell I felt more emotionally supported by Wynne and I don't like Wynne!)
He's a good person if flawed but no his flaws are not something I'd tolerate.
To be fair I think the lack of support is Bioware's design obsession with allowing people room for headcannon by never touching on the PC's subjective state.
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