172 réponses à ce sujet

[spnccarman]

The warden dying isn't cannon, if you read the article the guy said he messed up making his world state and accidentally put it to where the warden died. 

[GodBrandon]

I want Leliana to tearfully bring up how her bae sacrificed himself to end the blight.

[J-Reyno]

I want a few things:

 

 - a non-trivial offscreen role

 - An explanation of why my Warden and Leliana have remained separated

 - Closure for my Leliana/Warden romance, preferably allowing them to be together

 

I know that some don't want them to tamper with the Warden's disappearance because it allowed them to headcanon their fate.  But for me that doesn't quite work, because for my Warden to stay away from Leliana without a very good reason is in major conflict with his character.  When BW brought her back they opened my Warden's book again so I'm hoping for proper closure in Inquisition.  

 

That said, I'm going in expecting to be disappointed in some way.

[Ulathar]

Some mentions here and there will be fine with me. In my main playthrough the Warden married Anora, so I'm mostly looking forward to hearing what she has to say about how that went/is going. ;-)

[Vilegrim]

The Warden went to have a pint with Revan at a secret Bioware facility in northern Canada.
They ended up in bed together. A new IP was born. Coming to a Console near you 2016.

Considering what TOR has done to Revan and the Exile.......

[bluebullets]

Considering what TOR has done to Revan and the Exile.......

ugh. I don't even want to ask. i don't play swtor

[Pohleetakal]

The Wardens in my various playthroughs covered dwarf, human, and elf, and it would obviously be interesting to hear the political ramifications of a Warden being dwarven or elven.

 

At the very least, I would like the consequences of my Warden's actions and his/her current situation (eg, my Human Female Noble was Queen with Alistair) to be referenced in more than just an incidental fashion.

[straightdave2000]

I would love it if it was like a Michael Bay sequence. Our warden is cover in like darkness and behind him there's this huge explosion and it's like "bawaoooooo" then we like a bunch darks pawn come out and run to attack him, but before they reach him/or her he/or her takes off their cloak and reveals this awesome set of shiny as heck warden armor and  a flash of light the screen goes white and you only hear the sounds of battle. After that it shows the warden walking away again but this time there is a bigger explosion and it says on the screen "prepare for download able awesomeness,  2015"

[sylvanaerie]

I still say the disappearance was best.  They disappeared to the average Thedas person, not to Bioware. Having them disappear allows you to make any story you want for them.  All these people hollering for more...

 

What do you want?  Obviously, the Warden didn't 'stay in eternal devotion, locked at the hip to their love interest'.  He just disappeared.  He could be on the coast fishing and walking along the beach in sandals, a big kahuna to all the surfer kids.  He could be on a long cruise playing shuffleboard with pirates.  He could be off in the hills continuing to fight the good fight against the Architect's agents, Cory and other nefarious darkspawn. 

 

With his disappearance, you can make up ANY story and Bioware can't say "no" unless they want to clarify what happened.  In this case, head canon really can be canon.

 

Once he turns up.  That's it. 

 

And I guarantee, those who wanted definitive answers will be sorry they got them, because no matter what it is, it won't be half as awesome as anything you could dream up for them yourself.

[sylvanaerie]

Maybe, Syl. But I still think it would have been better to simply roll credits at the end of Awakening. The inclusion of the "disappearance" in DA2 instead, for me, leaves a mystery to be solved; that is where the doubts creep into my mind, anyway.

 

But why?  Why does every little thing have to be answered?  Why can players not accept "he disappeared" and see the opportunity of giving him your own little send off.  In the plethora of possibilities, Bioware can't foresee every single instance.  Hell, we got people on other threads whining about "Leliana should be a decapitated corpse in the Temple of Andraste" or "Morrigan should be raising my kid".  If Bioware catered to every single demand, their story would be so permanently bogged down, they would never be able to give it any cohesion.  

And every single player assumes their 'choices' on their 'canon' warden should be carved in stone like sacred runes.  When really, the only choice that matters in the game is "Did you kill the Archdemon".  Not even who killed it matters.  But just that you finished the game.

 

You can bet, if Bioware does come up and say "This is what happened to your warden" the backlash on the boards from everyone screaming "Not my warden!  My warden wouldn't do that!" would put ME3's ending debacle to shame.

 

I'd say the disappearance is a mistake, but if they did leave the warden in status quo (In the mirror with Morrigan or traveling with Leliana or ruling Ferelden with Anora/Alistair) people would demand to see them in this capacity.  Not even satisfied with a cameo, they would demand to also play him/her and frankly after Origins, Awakenings, numerous DLCs all darkspawn centered, I was sick of the wardens and darkspawn.  Having Hawke fight things like bandits, mages, Qunari and templars was pretty damn refreshing.

 

Now, the Inquisitor gets cool new fade creatures and giants and dragons, crazy red lyrium templars and mages.  More dragons then in previous games!  Dragons, people DRAGONS!  Of all sorts, I heard they toss more than just fire breaths at you!

 

I, for one, look forward to the new character and new challenges.  I don't want to go back to plodding Origins combat and boring mannequin faced Warden.  

[Apo]

Half the game will take place in Fereldan, you know the whole country that suffered a Blight 10 years ago (not to mention civil war, elves/werewolves, the throne crisis in Orzammar and other stuffs) and this country was saved by a warden that became the Hero of Ferelden and became "a beacon of hope" for its subjects (Varrick mention this in the narrative part of the Keep).

And since our wardens were young (early 20 at least), and the taint taking 20 to 30 years to go on their calling we can assume that the warden is still alive if he/she didn't kill the archedemon himself/herself.

 

But with the Keep we discovers that Hawke played a crucial role in the mage-templar war and he became some sort of a legend, and him/her bein shown in a lot of trailers and some comments that he/she will be involved with the Inquisition throughout the game makes me wonder if Bioware really wants us to care more about Hawke and forget about the warden

 

But since we know that we will not have physical appearance of the warden, I wonder how the mentions will be handled and some of the comments here and there are disappointing regarding the fate of our beloved warden

 

(and sorry if there's mistakes my english is not perfect )

[dsl08002]

ok first what I want to hear in References is this:

 

Talking to either morrigan or Leliana who will be key members should mention the warden at least 2 times and each conversation should have context, and not a simply quick reply. In my case of World state: Morrigan might say how good friend the warden was, and Leliana who was my LI  should be the main focus and should have more context that shouldn't fit in one sentence. Quick cameos can have quick replay. but not a NPC who is showing up more than 1 occasion.

 

It is also important that LI like morrigan and Leliana are ACTIVE as NPC when we have a mission that concerns the Warden.

 

Then regarding story about the warden himself I can tell you what I don't want see or hear:

 

1. Story will end up like a wild goose chase.

2. More questions and very few answers.

[sylvanaerie]

ok first what I want to hear in References is this:

 

Talking to either morrigan or Leliana who will be key members should mention the warden at least 2 times and each conversation should have context, and not a simply quick reply. In my case of World state: Morrigan might say how good friend the warden was, and Leliana who was my LI  should be the main focus and should have more context that shouldn't fit in one sentence. Quick cameos can have quick replay. but not a NPC who is showing up more than 1 occasion.

 

It is also important that LI like morrigan and Leliana are ACTIVE as NPC when we have a mission that concerns the Warden.

 

Then regarding story about the warden himself I can tell you what I don't want see or hear:

 

1. Story will end up like a wild goose chase.

2. More questions and very few answers.

 

Okay so...How about we do this:  

 

Leliana starts every convo in Skyhold with an ode to her lover the Warden (let's ignore the fact that she was 1 of 4 potential love interests and that would only work on some imports).  All conversations with her will start with "Once, the Hero of Ferelden and I..." and goes on for at least 3 minutes about the time they solved the Broken Circle, even if all you wanted to know was "How did the spying operation against that gang of Red Templars go..."  Leliana, despite being advisory, following you around, just so she can sing the praises of the Hero of Ferelden, because no one can possibly be as awesome as he was--giving the Inquisitor such a inferiority complex he throws himself on his sword for the sheer despair of not being such an awesome protagonist.

 

Morrigan refuses to speak to the Inquisitor unless you hear all about the Hero of Ferelden from her first, all her banters discussing the warden and how awesome he was to give her the Old God Baby she wanted (ignoring that it could have been Alistair, Loghain or no baby at all).  

 

There will be no less than 10 missions encompassing 30 hours of extensive game play revolving around the fate of the Hero of Ferelden because the Inquisitor must drop everything, because, you know, trifling matters like 'saving the world' are insignificant compared to the Hero of Ferelden's Mysterious Unknown Fate.  Instead she must prioritize assisting Morrigan or Leliana in tracking down their AWOL beau, both of whom will insist on going, jealously catfighting constantly about "who the Warden liked more". 

 

At which point, those 13 bald hairstyles in CC become more plot relevant--and understandable--since the Inquisitor would pull her hair out in sheer frustration.

 

Would that be enough mention of the warden for you?  Or do you require more?  

[dsl08002]

Okay so...How about we do this:  
 
Leliana starts every convo in Skyhold with an ode to her lover the Warden (let's ignore the fact that she was 1 of 4 potential love interests and that would only work on some imports).  All conversations with her will start with "Once, the Hero of Ferelden and I..." and goes on for at least 3 minutes about the time they solved the Broken Circle, even if all you wanted to know was "How did the spying operation against that gang of Red Templars go..."  Leliana, despite being advisory, following you around, just so she can sing the praises of the Hero of Ferelden, because no one can possibly be as awesome as he was--giving the Inquisitor such a inferiority complex he throws himself on his sword for the sheer despair of not being such an awesome protagonist.
 
Morrigan refuses to speak to the Inquisitor unless you hear all about the Hero of Ferelden from her first, all her banters discussing the warden and how awesome he was to give her the Old God Baby she wanted (ignoring that it could have been Alistair, Loghain or no baby at all).  
 
There will be no less than 10 missions encompassing 30 hours of extensive game play revolving around the fate of the Hero of Ferelden because the Inquisitor must drop everything, because, you know, trifling matters like 'saving the world' are insignificant compared to the Hero of Ferelden's Mysterious Unknown Fate.  Instead she must prioritize assisting Morrigan or Leliana in tracking down their AWOL beau, both of whom will insist on going, jealously catfighting constantly about "who the Warden liked more". 
 
At which point, those 13 bald hairstyles in CC become more plot relevant--and understandable--since the Inquisitor would pull her hair out in sheer frustration.
 
Would that be enough mention of the warden for you?  Or do you require more?

Absoloutley you are correct on every single way. It is nice to see that one person has the right good sense

[bluebullets]

But why?  Why does every little thing have to be answered?  Why can players not accept "he disappeared" and see the opportunity of giving him your own little send off.  In the plethora of possibilities, Bioware can't foresee every single instance.  Hell, we got people on other threads whining about "Leliana should be a decapitated corpse in the Temple of Andraste" or "Morrigan should be raising my kid".  If Bioware catered to every single demand, their story would be so permanently bogged down, they would never be able to give it any cohesion.  

And every single player assumes their 'choices' on their 'canon' warden should be carved in stone like sacred runes.  When really, the only choice that matters in the game is "Did you kill the Archdemon".  Not even who killed it matters.  But just that you finished the game.

 

You can bet, if Bioware does come up and say "This is what happened to your warden" the backlash on the boards from everyone screaming "Not my warden!  My warden wouldn't do that!" would put ME3's ending debacle to shame.

 

I'd say the disappearance is a mistake, but if they did leave the warden in status quo (In the mirror with Morrigan or traveling with Leliana or ruling Ferelden with Anora/Alistair) people would demand to see them in this capacity.  Not even satisfied with a cameo, they would demand to also play him/her and frankly after Origins, Awakenings, numerous DLCs all darkspawn centered, I was sick of the wardens and darkspawn.  Having Hawke fight things like bandits, mages, Qunari and templars was pretty damn refreshing.

 

Now, the Inquisitor gets cool new fade creatures and giants and dragons, crazy red lyrium templars and mages.  More dragons then in previous games!  Dragons, people DRAGONS!  Of all sorts, I heard they toss more than just fire breaths at you!

 

I, for one, look forward to the new character and new challenges.  I don't want to go back to plodding Origins combat and boring mannequin faced Warden.  

my decisions SHOULD be canon....

My killing Liliana SHOULD be canon. If it cannot be canon, it should not be presented as a choice.

As for morrigan raising my kid, that is beyond my control and she can do as she likes (she has free wiill)

 

I should not be presented a choice unless it is canonizable. If Liliana is a big plot thing, do not allow me to kill her- simple.

[bluebullets]

Okay so...How about we do this:  

 

Leliana starts every convo in Skyhold with an ode to her lover the Warden (let's ignore the fact that she was 1 of 4 potential love interests and that would only work on some imports).  All conversations with her will start with "Once, the Hero of Ferelden and I..." and goes on for at least 3 minutes about the time they solved the Broken Circle, even if all you wanted to know was "How did the spying operation against that gang of Red Templars go..."  Leliana, despite being advisory, following you around, just so she can sing the praises of the Hero of Ferelden, because no one can possibly be as awesome as he was--giving the Inquisitor such a inferiority complex he throws himself on his sword for the sheer despair of not being such an awesome protagonist.

 

Morrigan refuses to speak to the Inquisitor unless you hear all about the Hero of Ferelden from her first, all her banters discussing the warden and how awesome he was to give her the Old God Baby she wanted (ignoring that it could have been Alistair, Loghain or no baby at all).  

 

There will be no less than 10 missions encompassing 30 hours of extensive game play revolving around the fate of the Hero of Ferelden because the Inquisitor must drop everything, because, you know, trifling matters like 'saving the world' are insignificant compared to the Hero of Ferelden's Mysterious Unknown Fate.  Instead she must prioritize assisting Morrigan or Leliana in tracking down their AWOL beau, both of whom will insist on going, jealously catfighting constantly about "who the Warden liked more". 

 

At which point, those 13 bald hairstyles in CC become more plot relevant--and understandable--since the Inquisitor would pull her hair out in sheer frustration.

 

Would that be enough mention of the warden for you?  Or do you require more?  

This is just obnoxious and overblown.

Fact is, Liliana as a LI would mention the warden, (even if she is busy with the crisis) and would probably want his help saving the world. she would likely send out her own agents to look for him and perhaps even ask for the Inquisitors help, either as a high-approval friend, or to strengthen the Inquisition.

[qOjOp]

I don't have much hope for anything truly significant - Bioware gave up on the Warden, it seems

But if it was up to me to make the Warden's appearance without them actually appearing then I would make lots of mentions, notes, news about them doing important stuff (helping Alistair as a queen, or dealing with the darkspawn as a commander or taking care of his and Morrigan son) and return or recall consequences of some quests we did in DA:O and DA:A (that dwarfess and her child we could help in the Orzammar, orphanage etc) 

And a big monument in their honour. Or statue, or anything in some city

 

Something like that?....

I did that to honor my Grey Warden for all that he did for Ferelden.

 

 

And I did one for the Ultimate Sacrifice playthrough...

 

[sylvanaerie]

This is just obnoxious and overblown.

Fact is, Liliana as a LI would mention the warden, (even if she is busy with the crisis) and would probably want his help saving the world. she would likely send out her own agents to look for him and perhaps even ask for the Inquisitors help, either as a high-approval friend, or to strengthen the Inquisition.

First of all, yes it's just obnoxious and overblown.  It's meant to be.  As obnoxious and overblown as the demanding post I responded to.  IN fact, the poster I responded to responded in precisely the manner I expected him to, not taking a word of it seriously.  It's not meant to be taken seriously.  I'm sorry if you did.

 

Any attempts at reasonable discourse, like "wait and see what Bioware has in mind" are falling on deaf ears.  Ever get the feeling you're banging your head against a brick wall?  It's kind of like that.  Being supportive and reassuring doesn't help posters who still insist their warden should be smack dab center of the Dragon Age Universe.  There is a difference between taking Bioware to task for glaring plot flaws (living Leliana for instance--though I'm even willing to hear what, if any explanation, is given for that, so my jury is still out) and demanding Bioware do the story your way.

 

Leliana should mention the warden if she is his love.  I expect in the 2 world states I romanced her to hear something about him.  But I don't require multiple conversations about a character my Inquisitor doesn't know personally or long game time devoted to finding a needle in a haystack quest as it were.  At this time, Leliana doesn't know where he is.  Spending time looking for one man/woman when that time can be better spent dealing with the crisis at hand makes no sense.   If I found out she was using resources I earmarked for something dealing with my issue to go track down her beau, I'd be incensed. I'd treat that along the lines of someone embezzling money from me.

 

That said, I would not be averse to hearing that famous ballad Leliana was said to have composed in the event of a dead warden who romanced her.

 

If Morrigan's child comes up, I'd like to hear about it--though considering the OGB is only present in some world states, I won't hold my breath on that one.  I still think Leliana is your closest bet to getting mention in game about him, but anything could happen.  Leliana likes spinning tales--a contest of coolest stories you know told by our 2 bards in Skyhold would be an awesome cutscene--sort of a duel of "The Tale of the Hero of Ferelden" vs "Hard in Hightown".  Or if Alistair is encountered, I'm sure he will mention a romanced warden. 

Bioware never said "we're going to completely ignore the warden and we will never ever ever discuss him again".  You will get to hear something about him.  Even if he isn't physically present in game, you will see the effects of the deeds he's done reflected in the world around you.  

 

 Since some of the adventure is taking place in Redcliffe, I'm sure people there will talk about him to some extent depending on if you saved the town or not.  We may even get to drink some ale and swap stories in the Grey Warden's Rest Inn if Bella is in charge there.

 

And if that's not enough for you, there's always fanfiction.  I got Surana out of my system a long time ago though it took 6 fanfics to do it.  I loved my warden too, but let him have his 'ride off into the sunset a hero' ending.  

 

Considering Bioware's track record for 'returning companions', I'd rather have my 'head canon' ending for her.  I don't look for it to be a happy or satisfying ending.  And I'm a bit nervous what is going to happen to my Hawke in Inquisition.

[dsl08002]

First of all, yes it's just obnoxious and overblown.  It's meant to be.  As obnoxious and overblown as the demanding post I responded to.  IN fact, the poster I responded to responded in precisely the manner I expected him to, not taking a word of it seriously.  It's not meant to be taken seriously.  I'm sorry if you did.
 
Any attempts at reasonable discourse, like "wait and see what Bioware has in mind" are falling on deaf ears.  Ever get the feeling you're banging your head against a brick wall?  It's kind of like that.  Being supportive and reassuring doesn't help posters who still insist their warden should be smack dab center of the Dragon Age Universe.  There is a difference between taking Bioware to task for glaring plot flaws (living Leliana for instance--though I'm even willing to hear what, if any explanation, is given for that, so my jury is still out) and demanding Bioware do the story your way.
 
Leliana should mention the warden if she is his love.  I expect in the 2 world states I romanced her to hear something about him.  But I don't require multiple conversations about a character my Inquisitor doesn't know personally or long game time devoted to finding a needle in a haystack quest as it were.  At this time, Leliana doesn't know where he is.  Spending time looking for one man/woman when that time can be better spent dealing with the crisis at hand makes no sense.   If I found out she was using resources I earmarked for something dealing with my issue to go track down her beau, I'd be incensed. I'd treat that along the lines of someone embezzling money from me.
 
That said, I would not be averse to hearing that famous ballad Leliana was said to have composed in the event of a dead warden who romanced her.
 
If Morrigan's child comes up, I'd like to hear about it--though considering the OGB is only present in some world states, I won't hold my breath on that one.  I still think Leliana is your closest bet to getting mention in game about him, but anything could happen.  Leliana likes spinning tales--a contest of coolest stories you know told by our 2 bards in Skyhold would be an awesome cutscene--sort of a duel of "The Tale of the Hero of Ferelden" vs "Hard in Hightown".  Or if Alistair is encountered, I'm sure he will mention a romanced warden. 
Bioware never said "we're going to completely ignore the warden and we will never ever ever discuss him again".  You will get to hear something about him.  Even if he isn't physically present in game, you will see the effects of the deeds he's done reflected in the world around you.  
 
 Since some of the adventure is taking place in Redcliffe, I'm sure people there will talk about him to some extent depending on if you saved the town or not.  We may even get to drink some ale and swap stories in the Grey Warden's Rest Inn if Bella is in charge there.
 
And if that's not enough for you, there's always fanfiction.  I got Surana out of my system a long time ago though it took 6 fanfics to do it.  I loved my warden too, but let him have his 'ride off into the sunset a hero' ending.  
 
Considering Bioware's track record for 'returning companions', I'd rather have my 'head canon' ending for her.  I don't look for it to be a happy or satisfying ending.  And I'm a bit nervous what is going to happen to my Hawke in Inquisition.

And you think that you needed to respond to that with the same coin. You simply had to.

If you find my post odd then dont respond to it and simply ignore it and move on.

[Shahadem]

ugh. I don't even want to ask. i don't play swtor

 

Completely butchered Revan. There was nothing left of the character by the time SWTOR was done with her.

 

I don't really care about the Exile since I think that the plot in KOTOR 2 is irreconcilable with KOTOR 1 and with the general concept of the Force in Star Wars. KOTOR 2 simply doesn't make sense in light of what KOTOR 1 implies happened and had to happen prior to KOTOR 2 and prior to KOTOR 1. So KOTOR 2 is more like an alternate universe KOTOR 1 than a sequel to KOTOR 1.

 

I don't want Bioware to even vaguely mention the Warden because I know they will get her wrong.

[Navoletti]

probably the writers have scary of add the warden and ruined the importance of the looser hawke.

 

developers need understand the 90 % of people hate the looser hawke and the importance of this sh... character in the game not change this

[Ap0crypha]

@bluebullets: Ugh, don't even remind me about that. I REFUSE to acknowledge those two as Revan and the Exile--to me, Revan while always be a DS female who wanted to hunt down the Jedi With Extreme Prejudice for what they did to her, and the Exile a LS male who wanted to reform the Jedi Order, not bugger off to regions unknown. LucasArts going LOL NOPE YOUR DECISIONS DON'T MATTER is probably what spawned my intense hatred of "canon" and stuff being forced on me.

 

On-topic: I honestly would have been happy only getting the occasional mention of the Warden after Witch Hunt. Thedas is a big place--no need for everyone of importance to meet each other. Just an occasional remark would do, something like "I hear there's a new cult dedicated to the worship of a reborn old god, and that the Hero of Fereldan sponsors it".

 

But then Bioware had to make a BIG DEAL out of him disappearing, so now I'll feel upset if I do see him (because it won't match up with my image) and upset if I don't (because you can't just hint at something that important and then drop it). Honestly, what I'm hoping for is you hear that the Warden is off investigating darkspawn or something related to the Elder One, and you get frequent written reports from them detailing what they learn. That way they could be active in the plot without actually appearing.