339 réponses à ce sujet

[Catilina]

Yeah, I was having a moment there were I just lost in petty anger, lol. This topic annoys me to no end...

Yes, what I was thinking.

[Deebo305]

I always love how Vivienne threads devolve into debates about racism and black women with straight hair

Oh BSN....

[Derrame]

it makes sense, as far as i know, she is mourning the death of her man

[Catilina]

it makes sense, as far as i know, she is mourning the death of her man

Its nonsense! Of course, because she black!

 

Mourning ... bullshit. ;)

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I believe Josephine was said to have been based on Latino/Latina people, wasn't she (which is probably a gross oversimplification, and of course there are black Latin people)? I could be wrong though, but some of the fans I've interacted with have said they don't see her as black (themselves being PoC of all sorts) and I vaguely recall statements that were of the vein of saying she wasn't intended as being black

Josephine is the Thedas equivalent of Italian, since she is of Antivan descent and Antiva is inspired by Venician Italy hence why she has an Italian accent. 

[Biodron]

Josephine is the Thedas equivalent of Italian, since she is of Antivan descent and Antiva is inspired by Venician Italy hence why she has an Italian accent. 

the antivians are based of spaniards, I can't really tell about the country because we never saw it in game, but the people there speak spanish.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

the antivians are based of spaniards, I can't really tell about the country because we never saw it in game, but the people there speak spanish.

No, it isn't. At least not according to David Gaider. 

Yes, Antiva is a fictionalized version of a medieval Italian city-state like Venice. It's not a perfect comparison by any means, but then none of the Thedas nations are meant to be. They're inspired by real-world history, but that's where it remains.

 

[Biodron]

 

No, it isn't. At least not according to David Gaider. 

 

 

I said the people who leave there, they also they speak spanish. Also Feynriel's father say something in spanish if you are a mage, and he has a spanish accent.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I said the people who leave there, they also they speak spanish. Also Feynriel's father say something in spanish if you are a mage, and he has a spanish accent.

I'm not denying that part. You said they were based off Spaniards, and I'm just saying the devs stated that Antiva is based on Italy, not Spain.

[TEWR]

it makes sense, as far as i know, she is mourning the death of her man

 

Thing is the way she was written goes into a longstanding series of black women being either deemed unromanceable in media portrayals or they only exist in the role of being someone's Mistress.

 

It's less about the character themselves and more about the writer, who may consciously or unconsciously -- in BW's case, unconsciously -- bring in problematic writing elements when it comes to black characters or other PoC.

[BaaBaaBlacksheep]

I think they should make more romance options for now on.

[BaaBaaBlacksheep]

Thing is the way she was written goes into a longstanding series of black women being either deemed unromanceable in media portrayals or they only exist in the role of being someone's Mistress.

It's less about the character themselves and more about the writer, who may consciously or unconsciously -- in BW's case, unconsciously -- bring in problematic writing elements when it comes to black characters or other PoC.

I think they did that on purpose by writing Vivienne with Bastien for not players to romance her, and even in Trespasser she's still isn't interested by blowing you off and laughing at your face. It's obvious it is something about black women that they don't like as a romance interests, if they do they have to be a sapphire or a Jezebel stereotypes. BioWare these days........

[GoldenGail3]

I think they did that on purpose by writing Vivienne with Bastien for not players to romance her, and even in Trespasser she's still isn't interested by blowing you off and laughing at your face. It's obvious it is something about black women that they don't like as a romance interests, if they do they have to be a sapphire or a Jezebel stereotypes. BioWare these days........

Isabela.

[GoldenGail3]

Thing is the way she was written goes into a longstanding series of black women being either deemed unromanceable in media portrayals or they only exist in the role of being someone's Mistress.
 
It's less about the character themselves and more about the writer, who may consciously or unconsciously -- in BW's case, unconsciously -- bring in problematic writing elements when it comes to black characters or other PoC.

Also, Isabela.

[BaaBaaBlacksheep]

Isabela.

Technically she was white at first @ DA: Origins, they just darken her skin up (look like an Indian or Moorish Spaniard) in DA2, and they make her as a "black woman" to portray her as a Jezebel stereotype that everybody sleeps with.

[lynroy]

Isabela appeared to be Caucasian in DAO because of the engine lighting. She was always meant to have dark skin. 

[GoldenGail3]

Technically she was white at first @ DA: Origins, they just darken her skin up (look like an Indian or Moorish Spaniard) in DA2, and they make her as a "black woman" to portray her as a Jezebel stereotype that everybody sleeps with.

Still, Isabela.

[TevinterSupremacist]

On a different note:

A shame you can't make Vivienne tranquil.

[Catilina]

On a different note:

A shame you can't make Vivienne tranquil.

But you can dress up her in the Grey Warden mage uniforms! I think it is more painful for her!

Spoiler

 

[GoldenGail3]

On a different note:
A shame you can't make Vivienne tranquil.

At this point; N7Phantom's argument makes very little sense and he really likes to push it. It's his own fault he gets mauled by people on here; it's his fault he loves to push the non existence issue he claims is racism. Yeah; at this point I just say Isabela to all of his agrumenets, renderings them useless.

[BaaBaaBlacksheep]

At this point; N7Phantom's argument makes very little sense and he really likes to push it. It's his own fault he gets mauled by people on here; it's his fault he loves to push the non existence issue he claims is racism. Yeah; at this point I just say Isabela to all of his agrumenets, renderings them useless.

As I said before you don't have to believe any word I say, I spoke my peace and my own observation of things that I see. I'm the "read between the lines" type, and I know that bringing up race that makes people uncomfortable, but it is what it is.

[TEWR]

Also, Isabela.

 

True, Isabela is a black woman as a romance interest. And even then, while she was a black woman, her skin wasn't as black as Vivienne's (which is when it's no longer a matter of debate. Even now people still debate about Isabela). And that's what I meant. When you see characters with skin as dark as Vivienne's, how often are the women cast in a role where they can be romanced and aren't treated as being a Mistress to someone?

 

But one black woman among an ensemble of white love interests (with the exception of Zevran, arguably Sebastian depending on who you ask, Fenris, and Josephine -- none of whom are black themselves, though certainly PoC) doesn't really mean a whole lot. 

 

It's a drop in the barrel.

[Xilizhra]

True, Isabela is a black woman as a romance interest. And even then, while she was a black woman, her skin wasn't as black as Vivienne's (which is when it's no longer a matter of debate. Even now people still debate about Isabela). And that's what I meant. When you see characters with skin as dark as Vivienne's, how often are the women cast in a role where they can be romanced and aren't treated as being a Mistress to someone?

 

But one black woman among an ensemble of white love interests (with the exception of Zevran, arguably Sebastian depending on who you ask, Fenris, and Josephine -- none of whom are black themselves, though certainly PoC) doesn't really mean a whole lot. 

 

It's a drop in the barrel.

I think Dorian is also not supposed to be white? His father is definitely Thedas' version of Indian.

[GoldenGail3]

As I said before you don't have to believe any word I say, I spoke my peace and my own observation of things that I see. I'm the "read between the lines" type, and I know that bringing up race that makes people uncomfortable, but it is what it is.

I do that too. Isabela is black, just not black enough for you. That's pretty much why you choose to make this an issue. And we're in a cold climate, of Ferelden and Orlais. Think on this before awenering me back.

[GoldenGail3]

True, Isabela is a black woman as a romance interest. And even then, while she was a black woman, her skin wasn't as black as Vivienne's (which is when it's no longer a matter of debate. Even now people still debate about Isabela). And that's what I meant. When you see characters with skin as dark as Vivienne's, how often are the women cast in a role where they can be romanced and aren't treated as being a Mistress to someone?

She's black but not black enough? I see how it is....