1942 réponses à ce sujet

[esper]

Well, I personally prefer mages mostly because I like playing a mage myself, and I like imagined my PC and my LI doing all sort of weird magic things together in their free times.

 

[Seraphim24]

I think I understand it well enough based on your recent comments here and in those horrible outfit discussions from before. You think human nature is sexual and thus demisexuality or asexuality are just a construct of an aggressively puritanical society. That's the only reason I can see that you'd keep hammering on about biology and natural sexual impulses in this thread, whether you have the courage to say it so bluntly or not.

You should understand that people are able to understand your ideas just fine and still think they're stupid. If I have the right of it here, I'd be inclined to agree. Or at least, I certainly doubt you've actually done any credible research to back that claim, but rather it's just something you "know" about human nature because you're ****** Plato over here.

And just because something is clear to you doesn't mean it's actually correct. You shouldn't flatter yourself in thinking your ideas are just too deep for others to understand. Either your ideas are **** or your communication is, choose one.

 

There's nothing really complicated, the more people screw around sexually, generally the less desirable by society they are, it's just how it is.

 

Is that simple and clear enough for you? (And everyone else?) I don't mean to be mean, or to misunderstand, or hurt, but I can't understand certain things.. I can't understand the ways sex and sexuality is treated in all these weird contrary... complex ways.

 

Moreover, it's not that human nature is sexual and demisexuality is a construct of a puritan society, it's really the reverse, having frequent and continuous amounts of sex is often seen as the norm, whereas the reverse (wanting sex to be more meaningful, etc) is not.

[Seraphim24]

The outfit discussion was for how you divide between people who screw around a lot and yet try to persuade you otherwise by studying some tumblr blog that instructs them to lash out against "objectification" and so forth with little rhyme or reason and people who in reality probably don't screw around much at all (which ended up being mostly demi/asexual identifying people)

 

The objective was to see how much theory and ideas were just being borrowed from tumblr by Bioware and their fans and how much of that was an innate desire, on the whole, it was higher than nothing but somewhat average. Countless people failed that test which isn't really the most rigorous one you can apply. The gap between the stated goals and preferences and reality was very high, (I mean, it looked high to me, I wasn't really expecting a different result).

 

The only thing that surprised me really was while Bioware and most of their fans were pretty dead set on seeing and desiring a decent amount of porn, there were a handful (people in this thread for example) that took awhile to break.

 

I must confess I'm still not really sure why everyone is so cranky.

[Seraphim24]

Thank Dio.


You really should just figure out what you want to say completely before you post, for once.

Also, lol, ok man.

 

Tissue paper was just a way of saying people "not willing to take a stand," but I figured it might be taken more negatively than that (even though hey tissue paper is great for what it is), so I changed it.

 

My point is you can't defend anything without taking a stand, which is basically what Bioware has been avoiding for some time now.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Seriously, can this subject please be dropped. I don't want this thread locked because of this. 

[Seraphim24]

Well what do you guys want to talk about then anyway? The perspective on sex is a critical and important issue here.... I don't think DA:I really gets it right at all to be honest too much fixation on following the mainstream...

 

I must confess I'm still not really sure why everyone is so cranky.

[daveliam]

I must confess I'm still not really sure why everyone is so cranky.

 

And that's the crux of the situation.  "Everyone is so cranky" with you in multiple threads, yet you continue to have a mindset that everyone else is wrong, you are always correct, and that your 'truths' are just 'too real' for everyone to handle.  You seem to have almost no interest in any self-reflection.  I like to give people the benefit of the doubt, but it's clear to me that this one is a lost cause.

[Seraphim24]

And that's the crux of the situation.  "Everyone is so cranky" with you in multiple threads, yet you continue to have a mindset that everyone else is wrong, you are always correct, and that your 'truths' are just 'too real' for everyone to handle.  You seem to have almost no interest in any self-reflection.  I like to give people the benefit of the doubt, but it's clear to me that this one is a lost cause.

 

I don't really know what to say to this part...

[bondari reloads.]

What would a proper representation of sexuality in a game such as DAI look like? If you can rate that game, there must be a ranking of examples of which some do a better job at it and others less so.

On another note, has there ever been a game with a (allegedly) demisexual character? If the OP gave examples, my apologies; I'm bad at keeping up with threads.

[Seraphim24]

What would a proper representation of sexuality in a game such as DAI look like? If you can rate that game, there must be a ranking of examples of which some do a better job at it and others less so.

On another note, has there ever been a game with a (allegedly) demisexual character? If the OP gave examples, my apologies; I'm bad at keeping up with threads.

 

There wouldn't be a representation of sexuality, it wouldn't be a chart, there wouldn't be anything, there wouldn't be sex, there wouldn't be anything.

 

Again this is tumblr-esque bull****, or something.. sorry I don't mean to be crass, it's just I keep getting the sense there isn't an original idea here but rather borrowed ones, which just makes me sad. Want to have a great sexual moment? Don't have it be about sex.

 

If we could just have a focus on characters, their natural relationships with each other, and things of that nature that would be nice...

[Lady Artifice]

Not really. They could be Mage, Rogue, Warrior, or even a Noncombatant. 

 

I like the idea of more prominent noncombatant characters in the series. 

 

I'm partial to druid and/or monk myself.

 

A Druid type in DA might be fun. I've been thinking about Avvar Shamans, personally.

 

For some reason it makes me think of Serault, the setting of The Last Court? There's a lot of magical phenomenon there that doesn't need to be precedented by established lore. A Druid type from there might work.

[bondari reloads.]

Depiction, then.

I won't look those other threads up, sorry. But off the top of my head I think that Pillars of Eternity would probably fit the bill - no romances, let alone sex scenes (kinda weird in isometric view anyway) although the setting still acknowledges the existence of and need for sex by having a brothel (funded by a forum, NeoGAF, no less) and spends a fair amount of resources on depicting it.

You even happen upon a female patron pointing out to some guy she was there for another woman. I can't remember if there was a brothel in BG1, but the latter conversation certainly would not have happened in BG1 in that way.

[Seraphim24]

Depiction, then.

I won't look those other threads up, sorry. But off the top of my head I think that Pillars of Eternity would probably fit the bill - no romances, let alone sex scenes (kinda weird in isometric view anyway) although the setting still acknowledges the existence of and need for sex by having a brothel (funded by a forum, NeoGAF, no less) and spends a fair amount of resources on depicting it.

You even happen upon a female patron pointing out to some guy she was there for another woman. I can't remember if there was a brothel in BG1, but the latter conversation certainly would not have happened in BG1 in that way.

 

Pillars and it's BG inspiration are pretty solid examples. Generally speaking as far as gaming goes Black Isle and such have always been pretty solid.

 

None of these things are horrible compared to gaming, the above average is rated in the whole of media across all genres and forms in human history, that's a tough act. In gaming the best examples come though the middle between Wasteland and the kind of very bare bones PC-RPGs of the 80s and these super sweltering franchise things like Mass Effect with stuff like Fallout 2, or even possibly Fallout 1, or Planescape Torment were pretty solid and still some of the best examples in gaming. In those instances, they start to blur and become indistinct as relatively universally appreciated and enjoyed (the kind of weird ways gaming and so on handles sex just kind of faintly disappear)

 

You know it sounds weird but Conan the Barbarian (the movie) while being kind of rife with all sorts of sexy over the top things (an orgy scene of all things) I actually found to be pretty insanely romantic. After that various Warhammer and Witcher and Dark Fantasy franchises as well as GoT are decently romantic, it starts to slide a bit once you hit Tolkien, which despite having the relatively sexless aspects substitutes by being galactically violent at the same time.

 

Anyway, since you showed interest in my point I shall list a few examples

 

1. Zelda and Link (from A Link to the Past only)

2. Fei and Elly (from Xenogears)

3. Rena and Claude (Star Ocean 2)

4. Alicia and Welkin (from Valkyria Chronicles). I'd say Selvaria and the Emperor also qualifies despite being on the other side.

5. Myuria and Lucien (from Star Ocean 4)

6. Wander (and his GF, can't remember her name) from Shadow of the Colossus

7. Alucard and Maria (from Symphony of the Night only), that one like Zelda and Link is mostly just kind of hinted at.

8. The PC and Gillian the Barmaid from Diablo 1 (yeah, heavily implied, but I'm quite serious, it was charming conversation at least)

9. Triss and Geralt from the Witcher 2

10. Rosa and Cecil from FF4

11. Celes (as I discussed earlier) and Locke from FF6

12. Cloud and Aeris (or Tifa, even) from FF7

13. Zidane and Garnet from FF9 as well as Beatrix and Steiner from FF9.

14. Will and Kara from Illusion of Gaia, a handful of things from other Quintet games I'm forgetting probably.

15. Lenneth and Lucian (from Valkyrie Profile)

16. I think you could argue Mario and Peach from SMG1 (not 2) was in that category also, although extremely implied and has all the goofy Mario stuff. I would say it's the only Mario game that would qualify.

17. Lunar Silver Star Story Complete (Dyne and his GF first, but also Luna and Alex later). (I don't think Lunar Eternal Blue was in the same category)

18. Mother 3 (Flint and Hinawa)

19. Annah or even Fall From Grace and the male PC in Torment, I don't think that one had a solid one from a female perspective though.

20. Ys I and II Adol and Feena.

 

BG2: Irenicus and Ellesime (messed up thought it was), NWN (Aribeth and Fenthic, also messed up), Arthas and Jaina (from WC3 only, also... recurring trend.... gets messed up).

 

Also I've been ragging on DA forever, but not so much ME for the simple reason I think ME has always done a better job with these kinds of things. Ashley and the male PC is pretty solid from ME1, Kaidan is all right for females, maybe not quite as solid in spirit as Ashleys.

 

I think ME2 and 3 went off the rails a bit though.

 

None of these are examples which would necessarily represent my personal ideal, but I don't think you could find a single over-sexed moment anywhere in any of them, it just wasn't the focus, and yet they are also games. Generally speaking, a number of them start strong and then go all horribly wrong though, but there are a few that are consistent throughout.

 

Now, as far as media generally

 

1. Most Disney Renaissance movies (Beauty and the Beast, etc)

2. Murron and William Wallace (Braveheart)

3. Fifth Element girl and Bruce Willis (pretty bad I can't remember their names but those two)

 

... I mean honestly as far as media generally there's just so much more to contemplate, I think that's probably enough right there really.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Wait, what's that a list of? 

[Malthier]

You really should just figure out what you want to say completely before you post, for once.

Also, lol, ok man.

 

You'd think a person who believes that they alone understand what common sense is would be more decisive about what they post

 

Well at least he's dropped the pretense of being supportive of this topic

 

 

Again this is tumblr-esque bull**** 

 

 

 

Finally being honest

 

 

You want a great sexual moment? Don't have it be about sex, at all

 

 

And more revolutionary logic

 

Or maybe you just really need to look up what sexual means

[Hanako Ikezawa]

On another note, has there ever been a game with a (allegedly) demisexual character? If the OP gave examples, my apologies; I'm bad at keeping up with threads.

Well, I made one example of a potentially demisexual video game character: Master Chief Petty Officer Spartan John-117 from the Halo franchise. 

I should make more example posts. Thanks for reminding me of that.

[bondari reloads.]

Star Ocean 2 and W2 are the only games in your list that I've (partially) played aside from the old Infinity games, so I can't comment on the rest, but the bath scene between Geralt and Triss was very explicit, much more so than any scene in DAI, while we get a fade to black with Rena and Claude (luckily).

This only goes to show that there are a lot of possibilities, none of them wrong, and always open for discussion. I enjoy PoE a lot, myself.

And that's enough of me derailing this thread.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I like the idea of more prominent noncombatant characters in the series. 

Yeah, Bioware has shown they are capable of writing prominent noncombatants, like Joker, Samantha, and Steve from the ME trilogy or the advisers in DAI. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Kefka, can you please stop posting off-topic posts? 

[Seraphim24]

I'm just posting to people who have asked me questions are otherwise responded with interest (and they aren't off topic by the way)

 

I'm merely counting down the moments to the point where people ignore me for all the wrong reasons as they have pretty much my entire life which I believe we're down to about maybe only 1 or 2 people left now, so it shouldn't be much longer.

 

Obviously you hit that point a bit ago, as well as Artifice, Puddi, Malthier, and liam, but Bondari was still talking and that was actually an extremely important and valuable for myself, forgive me learning more about myself and having positive experiences though, like I said, it won't be much longer though if you'll indulge me that long.

 

For what it's worth that was a lot more than I ever expected, at least I had a few conversations in whole life where people showed even the slightest interest in things I have to say (even though it was pretty much for negative reasons, it's better than nothing)

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I'm just posting to people who have asked me questions are otherwise responded with interest (and they aren't off topic by the way)

 

I'm merely counting down the moments to the point where people ignore me for all the wrong reasons as they have pretty much my entire life which I believe we're down to about maybe only 1 or 2 people left now, so it shouldn't be much longer.

 

Obviously you hit that point a bit ago, as well as Artifice, Puddi, Malthier, and liam, but Bondari was still talking and that was actually an extremely important and valuable for myself, forgive me learning more about myself and having positive experiences though, like I said, it won't be much longer though if you'll indulge me that long.

 

For what it's worth that was a lot more than I ever expected, at least I had a few conversations in life where people showed even the slightest interest in things I have to say (even though it was pretty much vitriol the whole time).

I'm not ignoring you, it's just you have not talked about demisexual characters in here for pages, and your last few comments have been essentially rants about various things. 

 

You said earlier you would make a thread to discuss the things you've been discussing recently. I humbly request that you do so. That way you can explain more clearly what you wish to discuss while this thread isn't off-topic. Or just take it to PMs.