1. You consider Isabela sleeping with you to be the super important plot point that should be included in the Keep? Pretty sure Isabela has forgotten about it by now 
2. You CAN say how you saved or didn't save Connor.
3. The Keep has choices that you actually picked in the game. The Warden hating elves or humans is not a choice in game, it's a pattern that only the player sees/plans.
4. The Keep has over, what, 300 decisions? I'd say that's plenty, and they are actively adding more with each update. They started with far less.
5. Also important to note that while the Keep has a lot of choices for you to make that help shape your worldstate and remake your playthrough, at the end of the day the Keep is there to help you carry over said worldstate to DAI and future titles, which means there has to be a priority in which decisions matter and which don't. For example, what Hawke told Leliana about what the divine should do doesn't matter, considering the beginning of DAI. They can't add everything, as it takes a lot of work and resources that we as users obviously don't get to see. I think it's safe to say that it's not as simple as just adding a picture on the tapestry and adding some text to it. There is a lot of backround work happening too.
6. Adding more choices for Awakening would be nice, yeah. I really don't think what we have now is anything to break your heart over though. They could have easily just said 'yeah sorry, new engine, no save importing, deal with it', but they didn't. I think we should be happy for all the hard work being put into the Keep. 
1. It happened to one of my Wardens and she hadn't forgotten it in DA2. 
The thing is, it happened. And at least one of the characters involved (Leliana) are in DA:I. The Keep are suppose to tell the story of my Warden and my Hawke, not just the important world decisions.
2. Not if it was with the mages or with blood magic or who went in to the fade. In fact you can't chose who went in to the fade at all in DAO. In Awakening it had effect on Oghren how he reacted if he returned to the fade.
3. But the Warden's character should be important for future games, should it not? If the Warden would be in a DLC shouldn't he be our Warden and not just a default Warden?
4. Over 300 variations. 133 Decisions (yes, I have counted. ).
5. I understand that. Still, Hawke and Leliana's talk was 3+ years before DA:I (do we know when the game takes place?) and if Leliana and Hawke met or would met in a DLC it could have been important. But sure, it's not the most important thing even if they did make a big deal of it when it happened.
6. Sure we should be happy but it's not an excuse that can used to lightly. First of all, they started with the whole "import save to see the world change from game to game" thing and that gives them some responsibility for the future games in the series. You could say the same thing about DA2, that we should be happy for all the hard work they did on the game and accept all the flaws but if we did that, we wouldn't be getting DA:I right now, not that I think they did that bad of a job with DA2 as most people seam to think, but it's important to voice what we are not satisfied with so that they can make it better.
You have to remember, it's not just adding choices. It's adding choices that will have an impact on inquisition. If Andraste Dragon isn't mentioned, it could mean that it wouldn't be mentioned in the game.
It's also about making the new save you create YOUR save. They talked a lot about it being your journey with your Warden and your Hawke. So that the save tell the story of your playthrough. As it is now, it doesn't. It only tell us about what was important for the game, not what was important for me! Wile some of the tiles just seam pointless (like returning a ring to a character you don't even remember in a sidequest that was barley a quest) compare to some of the things missing.
The other factor to consider is the risk of confusing more casual fans or people who have never played the previous games with too many things. At the moment the Keep has about a hundred and thirty tiles, and I don't think going over one-fifty for DAO/Awakening/DA2 would be the best idea.
At this point, I'd be happy if they added a tile for the Orlesian Warden, Velanna and Sigrun and just left it there. Everyone is going to have their own idea of which of the side decisions are important, but I think there's enough there to give texture and distinction to our worldstates without leaving people overwhelmed.
I agree that there are some tiles that are more important than others. The Orlesian Warden, Velanna and Sigrun (wasn't she suppose to be in DA:I?) are the most important ones missing from Awakening. But I think it's also important for the ability for us to make the saves ours and not just to make make distinction to the worldstates.
I do understand not wanting to overwhelm new players or scare them away and I agree that it can't be to complicated for them but that could be done with having an advanced mode and an casual mode for the Keep. The casual mode could hide the less important tiles wile the advanced could let you chose there also. The Keep were suppose to let you make a worldstate that was intimate and unique for you. Maybe one problem was that the devs sold the Keep to good and made it sound so much bigger and better than it actually are, or maybe they had bigger plans before.
1. I agree a lot of tiles aren't really necessary or should be combined with other tiles. Like the returns tiles in the Denerim section could probably be condensed down to 'How was the Landsmeet vote decided'?, with an option including the returns. A lot of things that were far more important to my characters and who they were aren't present, particularly the major origin choices and their relationship to their families, friends, and allies. I also agree that in some cases, tiles representing declaritive statements that do not reflect specific choices would be far more helpful in determining how characters should be represented in future games.
2. In the hero/player character sections, there should be character building questions. Questions like 'How did the Warden feel about the elves and the Dalish?' and 'What religion if any did the Warden follow?', 'Did the Warden actively fight slavery?' or more specific questions like 'Did the Warden favor mage independence?', 'Which best describes the Warden's general social demeanor? Sense of humor?' 'What was the character's primary personal motivation? (Justice, Compassion, Advancement, Greed, Survival)'. And relevant questionaires for Hawke, the Inquisitor, the Orlesian Warden, etc.
3. There need to be general character building questions that will allow the games to faithfully present our characters, so that in a given general scenario X, the game will know whether our characters would do A, B, C, compartmentalized so that it remains a clear, simple set of likely, consistent outcomes. So the process becomes streamlined, not the characters themselves. Then we could finally break this needless restriction on returning player characters. The Keep can do that. It's a lot less complex than trying to divine intent from sets of disparate scenarios the way the in-game system does. It opens up a lot more storytelling possibilities.
4. edit: Also, it's a lot less confusing for new people than specific scenarios from the game that they don't have enough context for. And since those declaritive options are about future portrayal and don't void any previous game options, there's no need for choice dependencies. A character that sold the elves into slavery but is declared to actively fight it, for example, would become a redemptive character in the future should they be present in a future scene where it's relative. It just becomes a new binary factor, with no cascading effects.
1. Exactly. I don't even remember the beggar that you returned the amulet to, but that is there over what happened to the slavers? And there are no choices from our origins (unless your a Dwarf, I think) or relationships to friends or family... or companions for that matter.
2. Precisely. The Wardens religion (Hawke's too, would have been nice), how the Warden was with the Dalish (one of mine was a racist but there's no way of knowing that now), how the City Elf (and Dalish) felt about humans (mine hated humans after what they did to her and her friends, and killing her husband to be), how the Warden thought about slavery (2 of mines were fighting it hard wile one didn't mind it) aso. Were the Warden funny or always serious? Why did the Warden do what he did? One of mine did most of what he did for revenge (and power) and said so all the time. He was also an cruel murdering bastard but how would you ever know?
3. Yeah. If the Warden are going to be in a future game or DLC (rumor has it that the only reason he isn't in DA:I are because they don't know how to get our Warden in it) then he/she need to be able to be OUR Warden and not an default Warden. The Warden will be heard of and felt in DA:I and he are suppose to have a big part in what happens in the background but there's no way for them to make it being our Warden since the game can't know him so it will be basic stuff.
4. I was thinking about this when going over the Keep. A new player will be looking like a big "?" when seeing some of the choices and not having a personality for the character that made the decisions. Like the thing with Anders in DA2. What new player would possible have any clue to whats going on there or how their Hawke should act if they haven't played the game?
The Keep is already to confusing for new players.
You lost me when you claim important things were not in the keep and then you mention Isabela from Origins. Why do so many people want that in the keep?
Because it happened to one or two of my Wardens and are part of their story. Because it involved 1 companions from DA2 and possible 3 from DAO. Because it is mentioned up to 5 times in DA2 (one were Isabela are just stating it, one if she romance Hawke and he/she was related to the Warden, one if Isabela met Alistair in DA2 and he was involved, one one if Isabela met Zevran in DA2 and he was involved, one if Isabela met Leliana in DA2 and she was involved). Because Isabela, Zevran, Alistair and Leliana might met again in the future or Isabela might met the Warden again.
We'll have to see how this all plays out in the game. I'm assuming that all the choices in the Keep have an impact on quests or characters in DA:I.
Stuff like whether or not Isabela slept with the Warden (or had a threesome or foursome involving him or her) probably isn't in the Keep because it wouldn't have an impact on anything in DA:I. The same with Jowan's fate. Do we even know whether Jowan or Isabela is in DA:I? They very well may not be, meaning there would be no reason to have a tile about either of those choices in the Keep.
But the Keep are not suppose to just be about DA:I. It's suppose to be about the future games and about creating a worldstate that show how we played the past games. They said that the Keep was mainly about us making our worldstate as personal as possible. If it only had to do with DA:I then they should take out 50+ decisions from the Keep that I am sure wont have anything to do about DA:I.
Because it establishes the nature of Isabella's relationship with the Warden, Zevran, and Leliana (and Hawke to Zev etc.) for any mentions or shared scenes in the future, like when she meets them in DA2. Character relationship details like that help bring the world to life.
edit: Yeah, not in DA:I if it's not there, but as an establishing factor if they ever come up again. The Warden and Zev aren't in DA:I directly, supposedly.
Yeah, exactly what I mean! It brings the world to life. MY world, YOUR world, our personal Dragon Age world! It's not about what's important for DA:I, it's what's important for US!
People are going to be unsatisfied because the keep ruins the suspense. As glitchy as the previous imports have been for BioWare games, people were excited to learn what would and wouldn't have an impact. Hell, there are things in Dragon Age II that I didn't even know got imported. So many variables. According to the wikia, the boon you selected actually did get referenced in that game.
With the keep being what it is, there is no surprise. If something isn't listed in the keep, Inquisition can't acknowledge it. So hopes get dashed and people are left unfulfilled. One of my more memorable playthroughs involved a city elf who was extremely despicable. I can't recreate that despicable personality in the keep. I can't sell my friends to slavery or allow them to get raped for money.
Yeah, exactly. There were a lot of surprises in DA2 and I lern more and more every time I play through it. Small things I had no idea would effect the game. Last time I played just some weeks ago I got a new quest in DA2 that were connected to Awakening that I could never have imagined would make a quest. But with the Keep and DA:I, we know what will happen (or not happen) because there are so much important stuff left out and even more less important stuff. And the personality of the Warden are no were to be seen.
I can list hundreds of things from the past games that I know will not have an effect in DA:I because of the Keep. And that's why it breaks my heart and that's why I am afraid that DA:I will not surprise me with reference from the past games that I wont see coming!
...ech .. I will say I have a couple very, very different Wardens that are going to look almost like gender flipped, aler-origin carbon copies in the Keep because most of what distinguishes them isn't in the Keep.
Better to be disappointed now that disappointed by DA:I itself. I like knowing, so we can have a voice in what's more important to us for future games.
Yeah, that's a big problem but if there were much more tiles about the little things then it would not be like that. And it is so sad that you are so right about it being lucky we can get disappointed now instead of getting the Keep just a week before DA:I and feel our hopes just wash away. But not knowing at all would mean there still would be surprises for you. Take Grad Theft Auto: San Andreas and the hundreds of hours people (me included) put on searching for supernatural eastereggs and hidden spooky things like UFOs, ghosts, serial killers on remote parking lots, Leatherface, Bigfoot and all the fun we had looking for it. In the end it turned out that there were nothing... absolutely NOTHING of that in the game (except a Ghost car that turned out just to be a spawning bug) but would it have been better if the devs had said from the start that there were nothing to find? Or a list of what eastereggs there were in the game? I say no and I think most of the people who were searching for it would agree.
I think we have to be careful about what the Keep is, what it does, and what gamers want/expect it to be.
1. It seems to me, its primary function (at the moment) is to carry forward decisions from DA:O and DA2 into DA:I. From that perspective, it can be argued the Keep has too many decision tiles, rather than too few. We know that some of the tiles in the Tapestry will not impact on DA:I because they've been added after the game was already finished and the shiny game disks were busy being packaged up for retail. There's a good and a bad side to that. When new Keepers go through the Tapestry for the first time, a few have said the number of decisions they have to recreate is pretty daunting and, when they play the game and discover that some of those have no effect on DA:I, they may feel that was time wasted. On the plus side, having decisions which are not reflected in DA:I does mean that, no, we don't know in advance exactly what decisions will or won't have repercussions for DA:I. In a way, the sheer number of choices here does preserve that element of surprise you get from a save game mechanism.
2. Its second function (again, at the moment) is simply to recreate a record of the decisions players made in DA:O and DA2 and, from that perspective, many Keepers are saying they want even more tiles added so that it reflects those games even more accurately and more completely, irrespective of whether those tiles have an impact on DA:I or not.
Trying to reconcile the wants of gamers with different (and conflicting!) objectives is always going to be a bit of a juggling act!
3. And then, of course, there are Bioware's own plans for the Keep. We know they have great plans for it to be so much more than it is at the moment, feeding into future games and add-ons, and there is even talk of it being automatically updated with decisions made. From that perspective, I suspect there's another juggling act to be done. On the one hand, the more content there is in the Keep, the more they have to draw on in the future. However, it can also be the case that the more content there is, the greater the chance of conflicts, bugs and glitches ... i.e. just as in the games!
4. Whether the Keep can ever be all things to all men is doubtful (in my opinion!). I certainly don't envy Bioware the task they've set themselves, but it is ambitious and I feel we should all wish them the best of luck!
1. It would have been good if they has said that but they made a big thing about it being so much more than just carry over decisions to DA:I. They hyped it up and made us think that almost everything we did in the old games would be in the Keep. They said it was better that the Keep had way to much that to little.
2. Yeah. This was not just for DA:I, it was for all the future games and most important it was a chance for us to create our worldstate as we wanted it to be and to reflect the hours we put on the game.
But it doesn't do that.
3. Yeah, and this is the problem. Big plans and dream, but not making them real in time for DA:I. The result is that we can predict what will be in DA:I and what will not. Also, not having it finished for DA:I risk there being problems with new tiles about the past conflicting with things that they do in DA:I. The Keep are suppose to make the future games less buggy or glitchy when it comes to past decisions but I see a lot or problems in the future. I hope I'm wrong.
4. Yeah, we should. This is as important to them as to us and it can be the future of RPG game-saves. Many RPG-devs that have not dared to make a continuing worldstate are looking at Bioware now to see if this is something to work on.
Sorry it took so long for me to respond to your replys. But it did also take me 2.5 hours to type it all. More replys will come. I just can't use more quotes than this.
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