943 réponses à ce sujet

[Master Warder Z_]

I'll take a third option, please

 

Eh it's likely one or the other.

 

They ARE the strongest candidates for the throne and thus could grant the Inquisition the support it requires.

[efd731]

Eh it's likely one or the other.

They ARE the strongest candidates for the throne and thus could grant the Inquisition the support it requires.

Yeah, I can't really imagine briala being a valid option over those 2. Unless it's something like form a shadow government via threats and blackmail over celene. Can't imagine that working that well for gaspard.

[ladyofpayne]

Gaspard versus russian fanfiction. I've made translation.

 

With flapping lips... twirling lips

[Deco03]

It would be good if you could kill them both and, make Alistair emperor.

I liked you're post but like it even more because in my playtrough he's just a drunk, becoming my puttet at the head of the most powerfull army of Thedas, Vivienne will keep her role as advisor en make sure our drunk little fella keeps in line

[ladyofpayne]

[The Ascendant]

All hail the Emperor. Death to the False Empress!

[ladyofpayne]

Show us your face, Gaspie.

[Warden Commander Aeducan]

Oh so we get to meet Gaspard himself? Finally! I'm glad to see a literal confirmation. I know at some point we are going to see him and Celene in the Winter Palace, but I'm skeptical...until now, and here's hoping we can choose between him and Celene. I would hate to see BioWare shove a story down to our throat especially pro-Celene route.

[berrieh]

Doesn't really matter. Gaspard is very selective in his approach to oaths - if he swore a personal oath to the Emperor/Empress he'd just reason it out that his true oath is to Orlais, which coincidentally means that Gaspard should be in charge. 

 

Did we ever see Gaspard break an oath? 

 

Adopt an heir. If it works for Rome, I don't know why it wouldn't work for Orlais.

 

To be fair she is pretty young, she doesn't really have to think about it for a while. Or perhaps she has thought extensively about it and already has a plan? Hard to say.

 

In Masked Empire, it is made very clear that one reason that Gaspard is gaining ground among nobles and that Celene is losing her grasp on her rule is that people are uneasy about the lack of heir. It's also made clear that, in this respect, she is no "spring chicken." I do not personally believe inherited sovereignty to be a good method of succession anyway, but it seems to be the method they're looking for, lest the Game occur. Gaspard seizes on this weakness, but he offers her the bargain of marriage before pouncing. This would mean sharing her power, but it would also mean that she couldn't be displaced (the two of them together would be too strong). I do not believe he would continue with treachery to have her disposed (unless she started such a game), but I guess that could be argued. And it certainly is likely what she believes. 

 

The fact that Celene does not do this because of Briala, who she can never marry for a variety of reasons, is silly to me since I do not see why she cannot carry on with whomever she likes. Nobility does such things routinely. I understand how it could be used against her, but clearly it already is. Not marrying has not helped this or her position. Many people who are gay/lesbians in Thedas have political marriages, it seems; hell, many people have marriages with people they flat-out don't like for politics in Thedas;  I don't think it would be not honoring her orientation to have a political marriage. Thedas is not our world, and it doesn't have elections per se; it's also not Ancient Rome, which was a Republic, not a monarchy - in the case of Orlais, it has inherited succession and The Game. 

 

As to adoption, it does not seem that Orlais recognizes adopted or appointed successors. Celene isn't in the position to change that, nor does she attempt to. She wants to be Queen Elizabeth and just never worry about it in her lifetime, but she doesn't have the strength of Queen Elizabeth or the support. As such, a political marriage is a legitimate option. C'est la vie, as they say in Orlais. 

[Xilizhra]

In Masked Empire, it is made very clear that one reason that Gaspard is gaining ground among nobles and that Celene is losing her grasp on her rule is that people are uneasy about the lack of heir. It's also made clear that, in this respect, she is no "spring chicken." I do not personally believe inherited sovereignty to be a good method of succession anyway, but it seems to be the method they're looking for, lest the Game occur. Gaspard seizes on this weakness, but he offers her the bargain of marriage before pouncing. This would mean sharing her power, but it would also mean that she couldn't be displaced (the two of them together would be too strong). I do not believe he would continue with treachery to have her disposed (unless she started such a game), but I guess that could be argued. And it certainly is likely what she believes. 

 

The fact that Celene does not do this because of Briala, who she can never marry for a variety of reasons, is silly to me since I do not see why she cannot carry on with whomever she likes. Nobility does such things routinely. I understand how it could be used against her, but clearly it already is. Not marrying has not helped this or her position. Many people who are gay/lesbians in Thedas have political marriages, it seems; hell, many people have marriages with people they flat-out don't like for politics in Thedas;  I don't think it would be not honoring her orientation to have a political marriage. Thedas is not our world, and it doesn't have elections per se; it's also not Ancient Rome, which was a Republic, not a monarchy - in the case of Orlais, it has inherited succession and The Game. 

 

As to adoption, it does not seem that Orlais recognizes adopted or appointed successors. Celene isn't in the position to change that, nor does she attempt to. She wants to be Queen Elizabeth and just never worry about it in her lifetime, but she doesn't have the strength of Queen Elizabeth or the support. As such, a political marriage is a legitimate option. C'est la vie, as they say in Orlais. 

I don't really care if it's strategically sound or not, largely because I don't care about Orlais. I will not, however, allow Gaspard to assume power or force Celene to marry anyone she doesn't want to.

 

 

All right, that last line is absurd. I don't place much stock in bloodlines, but Gaspard's only claim is through attempted usurpation and civil war. He has nothing even vaguely resembling right.

[Spaghetti_Ninja]

The only question now is: will I have to kill Celene myself, or let fate take its course and simply not intervene when the assassin strikes?

[HellaciousHutch]

Why can't I kill Celene using the body of Gaspard, in turn, killing Gaspard in the process as well?

[EmperorSahlertz]

Why can't I kill Celene using the body of Gaspard, in turn, killing Gaspard in the process as well?

Because you are only the leader of a small organization, that either side, Celene or Gaspard, could easily destroy if they wanted to, without breaking a sweat or even losing too many men?

[Xilizhra]

Because you are only the leader of a small organization, that either side, Celene or Gaspard, could easily destroy if they wanted to, without breaking a sweat or even losing too many men?

A statement that strikes me as somewhat premature, I admit. It could well be true, but it's not guaranteed.

[Warden Commander Aeducan]

Because you are only the leader of a small organization, that either side, Celene or Gaspard, could easily destroy if they wanted to, without breaking a sweat or even losing too many men?

Yet both still need your support since...almost everyone in Thedas especially in Andrastrian nations view you as messiah or holy prophet and herald of bride of the Maker. They can try to destroy the Inquisition if they wished to, but since many see the Inquisitor as the most important figure, and since the Inquisitor is the only person who posses special ability to close the Breach...it will be unwise if they decide to go against the Inquisition much like the Inquisition against both Gaspard and Celene.

[EmperorSahlertz]

Yet both still need your support since...almost everyone in Thedas especially in Andrastrian nations view you as messiah or holy prophet and herald of bride of the Maker. They can try to destroy the Inquisition if they wished to, but since many see the Inquisitor as the most important figure, and since the Inquisitor is the only person who posses special ability to close the Breach...it will be unwise if they decide to go against the Inquisition much like the Inquisition against both Gaspard and Celene.

They don't "need" our support. They want it because it would send a powerful message. The civil war would play its course with or without the Inquisition.

 

The entire situation is a case of mutual support, however it is the Inquisition that actually needs the support, whereas Gaspard or Celene can go on without.

[john-in-france]

But Celene isn't the rightful heir, the statement is true...she discredited her cousins with stronger claims, to assume the throne. So really we have Celene or Gaspard or ? other person.

[EmperorSahlertz]

But Celene isn't the rightful heir, the statement is true...she discredited her cousins with stronger claims, to assume the throne. So really we have Celene or Gaspard or ? other person.

Anyone with a blood relation to the previous Emperor technically has a claim to the throne. It is all a matter of the strength of their army and their influence at court, which dictates how strong a claim they have.

[Warden Commander Aeducan]

They don't "need" our support. They want it because it would send a powerful message. The civil war would play its course with or without the Inquisition.

 

The entire situation is a case of mutual support, however it is the Inquisition that actually needs the support, whereas Gaspard or Celene can go on without.

The Orlais Civil War will indeed play its course even without the Inquisition, but as you said both Gaspard and Celene need a powerful message, an influential ally and even more reason to justify their cause to rally people behind them since the Inquisitor become a symbol of hope for many in Thedas. I'm not overestimating the Inquisition's power, but it's Gaspard or Celene cannot simply discard the Inquisitor easily.

"They want it because it would send a powerful message" It sound like you admit that while the Inquisition need support from Gaspard or Celene...they in turn also need your support.

[EmperorSahlertz]

The Orlais Civil War will indeed play its course even without the Inquisition, but as you said both Gaspard and Celene need a powerful message, an influential ally and even more reason to justify their cause to rally people behind them since the Inquisitor become a symbol of hope for many in Thedas. I'm not overestimating the Inquisition's power, but it's Gaspard or Celene cannot simply discard the Inquisitor easily.

"They want it because it would send a powerful message" It sound like you admit that while the Inquisition need support from Gaspard or Celene...they in turn also need your support.

No, Gaspard and Celene don't "need" the Inquisition's support (and I mean need as in, without it they'd be undone). They want it because it would be a powerful asset. The Inquisition literally NEEDS either's support, otherwise they will never gain the authority or troops it needs.

[Warden Commander Aeducan]

No, Gaspard and Celene don't "need" the Inquisition's support (and I mean need as in, without it they'd be undone). They want it because it would be a powerful asset. The Inquisition literally NEEDS either's support, otherwise they will never gain the authority or troops it needs.

It's a contradiction to say both Gaspard and Celene doesn't need the Inquisition's support if they want the Inquisition to be their powerful asset to aid their cause. If they are that powerful and doesn't need the Inquisition to end the Breach in Orlais then I suppose Celene or Gaspard just invite you for a tea and cake. The Inquisition literally needs Orlais's support while Celene or Gaspard literally need the Inquisition to deal with the Breach. Let's face the fact here, both need each other help or they are doomed.

[ladyofpayne]

[thesuperdarkone2]

I can only imagine the rage if Gaspard winds up being the Harrowmont choice

[The Baconer]

 

I really, really hope there's an option to tell these people to take off their plastic costume-closet **** when talking to me.

[EmperorSahlertz]

It's a contradiction to say both Gaspard and Celene doesn't need the Inquisition's support if they want the Inquisition to be their powerful asset to aid their cause. If they are that powerful and doesn't need the Inquisition to end the Breach in Orlais then I suppose Celene or Gaspard just invite you for a tea and cake. The Inquisition literally needs Orlais's support while Celene or Gaspard literally need the Inquisition to deal with the Breach. Let's face the fact here, both need each other help or they are doomed.

That is not a contradiction at all. There is a stark difference between wanting something, and needing it. Gaspard and Celene don't need the Inquisition to succeed in their endavours, however they both want the Inquisition, because it would strengthen their cause. The Inquisition is in far more dire need of either candidate, than they are of it.

 

While we as the players may be privy to far more knowledge than Gaspard and Celene, that doesn't really change the fact of how they see things. They DON'T need the Inquisition, but they can see the usefulness of it.