47 réponses à ce sujet

[Revan Reborn]

I really don't see the need for a remastered Mass Effect trilogy. The games all came out last generation and Mass Effect 3 is barely two years old. I was playing Mass Effect 1 a few months ago and it is far from being unplayable.

 

What I personally would love to see is KotOR I and KotOR II remastered! Yes, I know Obsidian developed KotOR II. However, EA has exclusive rights to the Star Wars property for games, and since BioWare is part of EA, well you can figure out the rest.

 

KotOR I and KotOR II are iconic games. I would love to see BioWare develop a KotOR III at some point (still trying to forget the stench that is SWTOR). A remastered edition would be a great way to bring these amazing experiences back to a new generation and show how BioWare storytelling and Star Wars make for the ultimate experience.

 

Who wouldn't want to replay KotOR I and KotOR II in the Frostbite engine, 1080p resolution, 60fps, with lightsabers and force powers? We get BioWare story too? I'm already sold. Make it happen BioWare!

[CronoDragoon]

Only if KOTOR II gets the restored content integrated.

[Luke Pearce]

I would rather than than a ME remastered trilogy! KOTOR is my #3 Favourite game of all time and my favourite Bioware game!

[Revan Reborn]

Only if KOTOR II gets the restored content integrated.

I'm all for that. Heck, I wouldn't mind if BioWare just finished the work Obsidian wasn't able to with the game. It would be a great game of bringing complete closure to the experience. It just boggles my mind a KotOR I/II remake (not a re-release) hasn't even been considered.

[Revan Reborn]

I would rather than than a ME remastered trilogy! KOTOR is my #3 Favourite game of all time and my favourite Bioware game!

Exactly. I think a remastered ME trilogy would make more sense during ME1's tenth year anniversary at least. KotOR, on the other hand deserves it and certainly the iPad re-release and the SWTOR nod barely did anything to honor the game.

[DarkKnightHolmes]

Oh hell yes, I'd love it if this came true. Really doubt it'll ever happen but I'd pre-order instantly.

[Revan Reborn]

Oh hell yes, I'd love it if this came true. Really doubt it'll ever happen but I'd pre-order instantly.

That's what I really don't understand. BioWare already has a great game they made that would be incredible if they remastered. They can keep the story and the characters exactly the way they are. Just improve the visuals and gameplay and they have an easy money maker. KotOR I is the reason BioWare even became popular on consoles, as they were solely a PC developer before that. This would also be a great way to promote Star Wars Episode VII alongside Star Wars Battlefront. There is just too much money and nostalgia to be had by not doing a remastered KotOR.

[DarkKnightHolmes]

That's what I really don't understand. BioWare already has a great game they made that would be incredible if they remastered. They can keep the story and the characters exactly the way they are. Just improve the visuals and gameplay and they have an easy money maker. KotOR I is the reason BioWare even became popular on consoles, as they were solely a PC developer before that. This would also be a great way to promote Star Wars Episode VII alongside Star Wars Battlefront. There is just too much money and nostalgia to be had by not doing a remastered KotOR.

 

I think Bioware just likes working on their own IP these days to care.

[aries1001]

KOTOR is Bioware. KOTOR 2 is Obsidian. I'm not even sure who owns the rights to these game now? Lucas Arts? Or Disney? As Disney bought the rights to Star Wars from George Lucas for like a gazillion dollars (hmm, maybe not that much, but wasn't the price in billions of dollars?). In order to have restored KOTOR 1 and KOTOR 2 lots of legal papers will have to get shuffled around...

[Revan Reborn]

I think Bioware just likes working on their own IP these days to care.

It's certainly easier for them from a storytelling perspective to use their own franchises. However, BioWare's first MMO was SWTOR, which is a spiritual successor to KotOR I and II, so they certainly acknowledge Star Wars' importance in their company.

 

This would certainly be something for BioWare to consider to avoid people getting burnt out on Mass Effect or Dragon Age. Both franchises have had their fair shares of ups or downs, and remastering something that is already great and iconic would be great for BioWare's reputation.

[Revan Reborn]

KOTOR is Bioware. KOTOR 2 is Obsidian. I'm not even sure who owns the rights to these game now? Lucas Arts? Or Disney? As Disney bought the rights to Star Wars from George Lucas for like a gazillion dollars (hmm, maybe not that much, but wasn't the price in billions of dollars?). In order to have restored KOTOR 1 and KOTOR 2 lots of legal papers will have to get shuffled around...

I'm aware. I acknowledged the distinction in the OP. LucasArts no longer exists, so the rights would belong to Disney at this point. Disney paid 4.2 billion dollars for Lucasfilm and LucasArts as well as Star Wars and Indiana Jones.

 

Again, I already explained this would not be an issue in the OP as EA has an exclusive 10-year deal with Disney to make AAA Star Wars titles. BioWare is owned by EA, and obviously BioWare has a history working with Star Wars, so there shouldn't be issues. This would be a win for BioWare, EA, and Disney as it would be a smashing success and would be great promotional material for Episode VII.

 

Obsidian might object to BioWare remastering KotOR II, but I'm fairly certain something could be worked out as both these great titles deserve to be remastered for a new generation to play and enjoy.

[Revan Reborn]

It has been quite a while and it would open up both games to people who didn't have the chance to play them before. KOTOR never came to any PS console for example. 

Exactly. It was only available on the original Xbox and PC. There is a large portion of the gaming community who may never have even experienced how amazing KotOR was. Outside of SWTOR, which only barely pays respect to KotOR, it's unfortunate BioWare hasn't tried to remaster this iconic RPG.

 

A remastered KotOR makes a lot more since than a remastered ME as I believe it would appeal to more people (being Star Wars and not everyone has played it) and it is so old that a remake would be incredible. Mass Effect is still relatively recent as the first game hasn't even hit its tenth year anniversary yet.

[Kabooooom]

I don't really get this whole remastering games thing. What's the point, except to cash in? I still play SNES rpgs and enjoy them. Graphics dont make a game "unplayable" by any stretch of the imagination.

[ZipZap2000]

I think it's Disney isn't it? Never played this games but I've seen a few posts about remastering them around.

[Revan Reborn]

I don't really get this whole remastering games thing. What's the point, except to cash in? I still play SNES rpgs and enjoy them. Graphics dont make a game "unplayable" by any stretch of the imagination.

It's simple. Remastering is taking an iconic game and realizing it in new generation technology. I also never stated graphics made a game "unplayable." I stated the antiquated gameplay and horrendous real-time/turn-based/queue system in KotOR I and KotOR II make the games unplayable. Not to mention it's an absolute nightmare just trying to get KotOR I and KotOR II to run on a current Windows operating system.

 

Also, this wouldn't just be a game for fans who have played KotOR before. Arguably they wouldn't mind if the game remained the same (although I bet quite a few would like to see improvements). This is more about spreading and sharing the joy that was KotOR to an entirely new generation of gamers who never played it (if you didn't own a PC or original Xbox, you likely never played KotOR).

 

I think it's Disney isn't it? Never played this games but I've seen a few posts about remastering them around.

Disney owns Star Wars now. It was still owned by GL when BioWare made KotOR and Obsidian made KotOR II. Disney has a deal with EA where the latter can make AAA Star Wars games for the next ten years, so this wouldn't be an issue for BioWare to actually achieve if they wanted.

[Kabooooom]

It's simple. Remastering is taking an iconic game and realizing it in new generation technology. I also never stated graphics made a game "unplayable." I stated the antiquated gameplay and horrendous real-time/turn-based/queue system in KotOR I and KotOR II make the games unplayable. Not to mention it's an absolute nightmare just trying to get KotOR I and KotOR II to run on a current Windows operating system.

Also, this wouldn't just be a game for fans who have played KotOR before. Arguably they wouldn't mind if the game remained the same (although I bet quite a few would like to see improvements). This is more about spreading and sharing the joy that was KotOR to an entirely new generation of gamers who never played it (if you didn't own a PC or original Xbox, you likely never played KotOR).

Disney owns Star Wars now. It was still owned by GL when BioWare made KotOR and Obsidian made KotOR II. Disney has a deal with EA where the latter can make AAA Star Wars games for the next ten years, so this wouldn't be an issue for BioWare to actually achieve if they wanted.

Still dont see the point. Can new gamers not appreciate old games, however antiquated they may be? Are kids these days seriously that lame that they can't appreciate older games the way they are?

Should we remaster Chrono Trigger for the XBONE so that a new generation can experience it? No, the game is awesome as it is. In fact, changing it would probably ruin things. Should we remaster Xenogears? How about FFVI? Metal Gear Solid? The original Legend of Zelda on the NES? Any game that hasn't held up as tech progresses?

Or, conversely, should we create new titles in the vein of the old, either direct sequels or spiritual successors, and celebrate the success of older games in their original form? I'm much more supportive of the latter.

KoTOR doesn't need to be redone. It is perfectly fine the way it is. The battle system is clunky, yes - but so what? Did it make it unplayable years ago? No? Then why should it make it unplayable now? Because other games are superior in that regard? Seriously?

If you want to play it, buy an Xbox and buy the game. Both are cheap as can be. Instead of an endless cycle of remaking old games every ten years, here's an earth shattering idea: How about we use our imaginations to create brand new stories? If we dont, the gaming franchise will probably stagnate and be paralyzed by a lack of originality. It's already halfway there, as it is.

[Revan Reborn]

Still dont see the point. Can new gamers not appreciate old games, however antiquated they may be? Are kids these days seriously that lame that they can't appreciate older games the way they are?

Should we remaster Chrono Trigger for the XBONE so that a new generation can experience it? No, the game is awesome as it is. In fact, changing it would probably ruin things. Should we remaster Xenogears? How about FFVI? Metal Gear Solid? The original Legend of Zelda on the NES? Any game that hasn't held up as tech progresses?

Or, conversely, should we create new titles in the vein of the old, either direct sequels or spiritual successors, and celebrate the success of older games in their original form? I'm much more supportive of the latter.

KoTOR doesn't need to be redone. It is perfectly fine the way it is. The battle system is clunky, yes - but so what? Did it make it unplayable years ago? No? Then why should it make it unplayable now? Because other games are superior in that regard? Seriously?

If you want to play it, buy an Xbox and buy the game. Both are cheap as can be. Instead of an endless cycle of remaking old games every ten years, here's an earth shattering idea: How about we use our imaginations to create brand new stories? If we dont, the gaming franchise will probably stagnate and be paralyzed by a lack of originality. It's already halfway there, as it is.

This isn't a matter of appreciation or not. Video games evolve and innovate overtime and the old gets replaced with the new. The combat in KotOR was a necessary evil due to technological limitations at the time. As we have seen with DAI, there is a lot more in terms of features that BioWare could incorporate to truly revolutionize the gameplay experience for the better.

 

Square Enix is a perfect example of a company that has been evolving their gameplay in Final Fantasy. While diehard fans certainly loved the turn-based combat, the majority of the gaming community did not. That's why we have seen a turn away from the turn-based days of FFVII and a turn towards real-time action-oriented combat in FFXV.

 

The entire point of a remastered edition would be missed if the gameplay wasn't re-envisioned for the standards of present day. People are still able to purchase the original KotOR and KotOR II on PC, as the anniversary edition including both games was released last year. A remastered edition is taking an iconic game and re-imaging it with new gen technology and ideas.

 

If people simply want to keep the old, there are mods for that, and there are plenty. KotOR absolutely needs to be redone. Even at the time the combat and even navigation were painful and behind the standards of other RPGs in the industry. In comparison to RPGs today, specifically BioWare games, it is inferior. As I stated before, even at the time of its release the combat was not good. Time has not aged the game well and I have many friends who have refused to play the game due to the archaic gameplay. I can tolerate it as I played the game when it first released. Those who never did cannot, on the other hand. This is why a reinvention would be necessary not specifically for old fans, but for new ones.

 

Huh? I have KotOR I and KotOR II on the original Xbox and PC. I'm posing this idea because I believe KotOR is a great franchise that should be given attention and exposure. Unless you had an original Xbox or bought the game on PC back in 2003, you likely never played KotOR. That's an absolute shame as it is arguably one of the greatest RPGs ever made. Certainly, the story alone is one of the best told. I really don't understand why this is hard for you to understand. Games evolve because they get better due to technology and standards of the industry rising. Why does KotOR not deserve to receive the same treatment other remastered editions receive?

 

You are more than welcome to play the original KotOR if you'd like. This isn't for you specifically. This is to celebrate an amazing franchise and expose it to those who may never have had the chance to play the games before. Not changing the gameplay would make it difficult for newcomers to enjoy the experience. It absolutely needs to be updated. People on these forums complain about ME1's combat being obsolete, and KotOR I is four years older than that.

[Sifr]

Does anyone else find it somewhat amusing that people are generally more kinder to KOTOR II than DA2 in general?

 

Kotor II had a good story, but wasn't as well received as the first game because Obsidian were forced by LucasArts to give it an early release, leading to a ton of stuff being cut out, a lot of bugs at launch and basically being unfinished?

 

DA2 meanwhile had a good story, but wasn't well received as the first game because Bioware were forced by EA to give it an early release, leading to it having a ton of stuff cut out, a lot of bugs at launch and was barely finished?

 

If KOTOR II were to get a remastered do-over in Frosbite, shouldn't DA2 be allowed to have one? Sure, one is a decade old and the other is only three years, but if the argument is that Frosbite would improve gameplay, story and combat in a way that the original was unable to do, then doesn't the same argument apply to a DA2 redux?

[Revan Reborn]

Does anyone else find it somewhat amusing that people are generally more kinder to KOTOR II than DA2 in general?

 

Kotor II had a good story, but wasn't as well received as the first game because Obsidian were forced by LucasArts to give it an early release, leading to a ton of stuff being cut out, a lot of bugs at launch and basically being unfinished?

 

DA2 meanwhile had a good story, but wasn't well received as the first game because Bioware were forced by EA to give it an early release, leading to it having a ton of stuff cut out, a lot of bugs at launch and was barely finished?

 

If KOTOR II were to get a remastered do-over in Frosbite, shouldn't DA2 be allowed to have one? Sure, one is a decade old and the other is only three years, but if the argument is that Frosbite would improve gameplay, story and combat in a way that the original was unable to do, then doesn't the same argument apply to a DA2 redux?

KotOR II actually improved on many gameplay mechanics and systems that KotOR I started. DA2, on the other hand, went backwards and was much less ambitious and less expansive than origins. They have nothing in common.

 

I'd also argue personally that KotOR II's story was better than KotOR I. It was much more complex as well as darker, and showed us a side of Star Wars we had never seen before. KotOR I, while it had an amazing twist, was as predictable as one could expect from a Star Wars story.

 

I don't believe anyone would criticize the story of DA2 either. That's not why most people were disappointed by the game. It was purely gameplay and lack of environments.

 

You answered your own question. KotOR II was is two generations old. DA2 is only one generation. The latter hardly needs to be remastered as it's still entirely playable and fine the way it is. It has flaws, but it doesn't need to be remastered.

 

Remastered editions typically happen for games that are ten years old or more. Dragon Age, is also an ever-growing franchise still receiving sequels. KotOR is dead as a doornail, and we likely will never see a KotOR III thanks to SWTOR.

 

Also, quite a few people have never experienced KotOR. If you didn't have an original Xbox or played on PC back in 2003, you likely never touched it. Everybody has played DA2.

[Sifr]

 

I'd also argue personally that KotOR II's story was better than KotOR I. It was much more complex as well as darker, and showed us a side of Star Wars we had never seen before. KotOR I, while it had an amazing twist, was as predictable as one could expect from a Star Wars story.

 

This I definitely agree on.

 

While many people don't like SWTOR because of Revan's treatment in both the game and novel (hopefully Shadows of Revan will go some way to fixing some of the derailment), I was actually more annoyed with how easily they just offed the Exile, who I think had a far more interesting character and backstory.

 

While the Jedi Knight is the one that has more ties to the story of Revan, the Exile and the novels, I actually think the Sith Inquisitor was the more interesting class in the game as it was the only one that really gave us something new that we'd not seen before, since it explored the more mystical side of the Force, both light and dark.

[Revan Reborn]

This I definitely agree on.

 

While many people don't like SWTOR because of Revan's treatment in both the game and novel (hopefully Shadows of Revan will go some way to fixing some of the derailment), I was actually more annoyed with how easily they just offed the Exile, who I think had a far more interesting character and backstory.

 

While the Jedi Knight is the one that has more ties to the story of Revan, the Exile and the novels, I actually think the Sith Inquisitor was the more interesting class in the game as it was the only one that really gave us something new that we'd not seen before, since it explored the more mystical side of the Force, both light and dark.

The Revan book was amazing. SWTOR's depiction of him, however, is not. Shadow of Revan already fails by making Revan (if it is him) the obligatory enemy of both the Republic and the Sith. I lost faith in that game respecting one of the most incredible Star Wars characters a long time ago. As far as the Exile's exit, that was more politics than anything else. She was created by Obsidian, and Obsidian (when making KotOR II) did not consult BioWare at all in terms of story and continuity. There was a major fight and drama with respect to it.

 

Suffice it to say, when BioWare got the job to make SWTOR, they made it their mission to "correct" any faults on the part of Obsidian with KotOR II. That is why the Exile's role is much more subdued in the novel and the game. It came down really due to creative differences and BioWare not having the same opinions Obsidian had on the Old Republic time period. I thought all of the class stories were just okay (some better than others). They don't even come close to comparing to KotOR I or KotOR II though, which is a shame.

[Kabooooom]

This isn't a matter of appreciation or not. Video games evolve and innovate overtime and the old gets replaced with the new. The combat in KotOR was a necessary evil due to technological limitations at the time. As we have seen with DAI, there is a lot more in terms of features that BioWare could incorporate to truly revolutionize the gameplay experience for the better.

Square Enix is a perfect example of a company that has been evolving their gameplay in Final Fantasy. While diehard fans certainly loved the turn-based combat, the majority of the gaming community did not. That's why we have seen a turn away from the turn-based days of FFVII and a turn towards real-time action-oriented combat in FFXV.

The entire point of a remastered edition would be missed if the gameplay wasn't re-envisioned for the standards of present day. People are still able to purchase the original KotOR and KotOR II on PC, as the anniversary edition including both games was released last year. A remastered edition is taking an iconic game and re-imaging it with new gen technology and ideas.

If people simply want to keep the old, there are mods for that, and there are plenty. KotOR absolutely needs to be redone. Even at the time the combat and even navigation were painful and behind the standards of other RPGs in the industry. In comparison to RPGs today, specifically BioWare games, it is inferior. As I stated before, even at the time of its release the combat was not good. Time has not aged the game well and I have many friends who have refused to play the game due to the archaic gameplay. I can tolerate it as I played the game when it first released. Those who never did cannot, on the other hand. This is why a reinvention would be necessary not specifically for old fans, but for new ones.

Huh? I have KotOR I and KotOR II on the original Xbox and PC. I'm posing this idea because I believe KotOR is a great franchise that should be given attention and exposure. Unless you had an original Xbox or bought the game on PC back in 2003, you likely never played KotOR. That's an absolute shame as it is arguably one of the greatest RPGs ever made. Certainly, the story alone is one of the best told. I really don't understand why this is hard for you to understand. Games evolve because they get better due to technology and standards of the industry rising. Why does KotOR not deserve to receive the same treatment other remastered editions receive?

You are more than welcome to play the original KotOR if you'd like. This isn't for you specifically. This is to celebrate an amazing franchise and expose it to those who may never have had the chance to play the games before. Not changing the gameplay would make it difficult for newcomers to enjoy the experience. It absolutely needs to be updated. People on these forums complain about ME1's combat being obsolete, and KotOR I is four years older than that.

I've played the original KotOR and loved it. It's one of my favorite games of all time. I'm not sure why you were under the impression that I didn't play it, except perhaps because you can't fathom why I think remastering it is a pointless idea.

You also used my own argument in favor of yours - but it doesn't really work that way. With Final Fantasy, although they are starting to remaster older titles now, for decades they simply improved on them in the way that you describe. They created new stories and attempted to innovate with each release. And that's exactly what should be done. For everything.

The gameplay of KoTOR is no more irritating than the gameplay for any number of older titles. How old are you, if you dont mind me asking? My earliest experience with playing games was on the Atari, and I grew up with the NES and Sega, followed by SNES, Playstation, 64, XBOX, etc.

I ask because I have been wondering if this is something that the younger generations are bothered by more than I am - this obsession with gameplay mechanics and graphics, describing older games as "unplayable" because they don't stack up to current standards.

I think its stupid, quite frankly, but in that regard I can understand your point about remastering it so that others with more...picky tastes can experience how fantastic of a story it is. So, I concede that with that single point, remastering it would be alright.

[Kabooooom]

Here is essentially the crux of our two points of view, and they are simply differences of opinion on aesthetics:

You lament that new generations of gamers can't experience the great stories of older games because they can't get past the gameplay or graphics.

I lament that they can't appreciate the older games as they are, despite their gameplay and graphics.

Such things dont bother me. Indeed, it seems infantile to me. But, perhaps that's just because I grew up playing these games. I distinctly remember a time in my life when I was playing a game on Genesis and thought "wow, these graphics are so realistic!". Perhaps my expectations are just lower than yours.

[Revan Reborn]

I've played the original KotOR and loved it. It's one of my favorite games of all time. I'm not sure why you were under the impression that I didn't play it, except perhaps because you can't fathom why I think remastering it is a pointless idea.

You also used my own argument in favor of yours - but it doesn't really work that way. With Final Fantasy, although they are starting to remaster older titles now, for decades they simply improved on them in the way that you describe. They created new stories and attempted to innovate with each release. And that's exactly what should be done. For everything.

The gameplay of KoTOR is no more irritating than the gameplay for any number of older titles. How old are you, if you dont mind me asking? My earliest experience with playing games was on the Atari, and I grew up with the NES and Sega, followed by SNES, Playstation, 64, XBOX, etc.

I ask because I have been wondering if this is something that the younger generations are bothered by more than I am - this obsession with gameplay mechanics and graphics, describing older games as "unplayable" because they don't stack up to current standards.

I think its stupid, quite frankly, but in that regard I can understand your point about remastering it so that others with more...picky tastes can experience how fantastic of a story it is. So, I concede that with that single point, remastering it would be alright.

I never suggested you didn't play KotOR. On the contrary, I assumed you did as I don't see why anyone who hadn't would call for the same old game to remain untouched.

 

I'm 23-years-old. I grew up with the SNES as well as the Sega Genesis. I've also owned a N64, Gamecube, PS One, PS2, Xbox, Xbox 360, Xbox One, but now I'm primarily a PC gamer. As I've stated before, I can actually play KotOR I and KotOR II as they are, because I played them when they originally released. For those who never experienced the games, it would be more difficult to adjust to the dated graphics and non-responsive gameplay. I know quite a few individuals who I've recommended KotOR I and II to and they refuse to play them because of how old they are. It's just a reality for some folks. I also see it as terribly unfortunate because they are missing out on some of the best stories ever told in an RPG, especially if you love Star Wars.

 

Here is essentially the crux of our two points of view, and they are simply differences of opinion on aesthetics:

You lament that new generations of gamers can't experience the great stories of older games because they can't get past the gameplay or graphics.

I lament that they can't appreciate the older games as they are, despite their gameplay and graphics.

Such things dont bother me. Indeed, it seems infantile to me. But, perhaps that's just because I grew up playing these games. I distinctly remember a time in my life when I was playing a game on Genesis and thought "wow, these graphics are so realistic!". Perhaps my expectations are just lower than yours.

I understand your perspective. I still look back at The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind and KotOR I with nostalgia. It's not until I load them up how old they really are and how my expectations have changed significantly with the evolution of gaming. I can appreciate older games, but I know not everyone can. Humans are visual creatures, and it's a known factor that the prettier the experience is, the more enticing it is. Same goes for a more engaging combat system that doesn't feel like it was created ten years ago. I suppose I shouldn't necessarily use the word "better" in the sense of remastering these games, but rather "updating" to more appropriately fit the tastes of the industry now.