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Give us Blood magic (petition)


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#76
Sinuphro

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its shameful that bioware did not implement blood mage specialization in DAI. But the most annoying part of it all was that during DAI's development period everyone had complained about making npcs react to your blood magic. In short the devs and creators knew people loved the blood magic spec but wanted it implemented better. Instead of doing what the majority of their customers wanted, instead they took it off. They had 3 years plus to develop DAI yet they could not implement this key thing that their hardcore DA customers had been asking for??

 

Bad decisions like this is going to cause them problems with their upcoming future releases. The fact that they removed something a lot of customers like is already another strike against bioware. For their sake they need to pray that the other contents of the game are worth it or else they might receive another backlash like what happenned for DA2 and ME3


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#77
KoorahUK

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its shameful that bioware did not implement blood mage specialization in DAI. But the most annoying part of it all was that during DAI's development period everyone had complained about making npcs react to your blood magic. In short the devs and creators knew people loved the blood magic spec but wanted it implemented better. Instead of doing what the majority of their customers wanted, instead they took it off. They had 3 years plus to develop DAI yet they could not implement this key thing that their hardcore DA customers had been asking for??

 

Bad decisions like this is going to cause them problems with their upcoming future releases. The fact that they removed something a lot of customers like is already another strike against bioware. For their sake they need to pray that the other contents of the game are worth it or else they might receive another backlash like what happenned for DA2 and ME3

Shameful? Lol, No.

Bad Decision? No.

 

Pissed off ex Blood Mage player? Yes.

High Drama? Definitely Yes. 

 

Sorry but this isn't a mistake at all. From a plot perspective, having a Blood Mage lead the Inquisition would never, ever be tolerated. Cassandra would kill you, Cullen would probably try but he's no where near as bad ass as Cassandra so would probably fail. The Chantry would never support you, most of the mages the Templars are fighting would not support you (they are fighting to be liberated from the Cirlces, not to freely practice Blood Magic). 

Once it became known the Inquisition was led by a Blood Mage most of the population would live in fear of it. I think that would be an interesting game to be honest, but its not the story BioWare are telling so no, Blood Mage as no place as a specialisation in this game. I miss dual wield Warrior and Berzerker but I don;t think its BioWare's duty to serve me exactly what I have enjoyed in every game. 


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#78
Semyaza82

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its shameful that bioware did not implement blood mage specialization in DAI. But the most annoying part of it all was that during DAI's development period everyone had complained about making npcs react to your blood magic. In short the devs and creators knew people loved the blood magic spec but wanted it implemented better. Instead of doing what the majority of their customers wanted, instead they took it off. They had 3 years plus to develop DAI yet they could not implement this key thing that their hardcore DA customers had been asking for??

 

Bad decisions like this is going to cause them problems with their upcoming future releases. The fact that they removed something a lot of customers like is already another strike against bioware. For their sake they need to pray that the other contents of the game are worth it or else they might receive another backlash like what happenned for DA2 and ME3

   Got to say, that seems a pretty massive over reaction. And while the forums are in not really a very good gauge of customer opinion generally (the majority of people who buy and play the games never set digital foot here) the fact there are  more people saying they are glad Blood Magic isn't back should be a sign that it's inclusion isn't something the 'majority of their customers' wanted. 

   They didn't include Blood Magic for story reason - story reasons that make perfect sense. You might not like it but plenty of other people do.


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#79
efd731

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They had three years to produce the game we'll all be playing in 8-11 days, and personally I can't fault them for NOT** looking at the games current content and saying "you know what would really please the fans, rewriting the vast majority of this including the main plot, to give bloodmagic a valid reason to be an option instead of something that gets you killed ASAP. We should also remove all class/race/spec reactivity to make room for the ridiculous amount of dialogue to have even a fraction of the necessary commentary on your character using blood magic" "seems good" says dev #2...yeah, this convo that never happened, there's a reason it never happened.
Edit: also, it can't have been removed if it never existed in the game in the first place. And if you think those three years allowed the game to have time for every single thing you personally like, you're probably right. What you're missing is that it would be a horribly made game that almost no one would want to play except you.
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#80
Han Shot First

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Story should always trump gameplay.

 

In other words if it does not make sense within the story for the protagonist to be a blood mage, then that spec should not make it into the game. From everything we've heard about the game so far I think Bioware made the right choice. It would not make a lick of sense for a blood mage to be leading the Inquisition at a time when demons were pouring out of the Fade. Blood Magic is pretty much the demonic school, and its likely the mage allies/minions of the Elder One are going to blood mages themselves.


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#81
Pasquale1234

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The only game where it made sense to allow a Blood Mage spec was DAO, because "whatever it takes to quell the blight". Even so, you'd think there would have been more reaction to it - and, really, if it's acceptable because blight, then Jowan could have been made conscriptable.

Even being a Mage in DA2 took a lot of gameplay / story separation, and really stretched the limits of suspension of disbelief. To make a big deal about Tarohne, Grace turning to BM, Anders' constantly riding Merrill about it, etc. - made a BM Hawke pretty unbelievable.

In addition to reactivity / believability issues, there is also the fact that the party will not be insta-healed after each combat. A BM spec in a game where health restoration is limited would be, yanno, insane.

#82
Han Shot First

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The only game where it made sense to allow a Blood Mage spec was DAO, because "whatever it takes to quell the blight". Even so, you'd think there would have been more reaction to it - and, really, if it's acceptable because blight, then Jowan could have been made conscriptable.
 

 

Originally they planned on having consequences for being a blood mage, but sadly for whatever reason it didn't make it into the game.

 


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#83
Pasquale1234

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^^ Love that clip.

They prolly pulled it to avoid angering any players who would choose the spec.

Allowing a BM spec also puts a lot of limitations on the companion characters - they would need to try to avoid writing characters intolerant of BM.

#84
Asdrubael Vect

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Originally they planned on having consequences for being a blood mage, but sadly for whatever reason it didn't make it into the game.

 

damn wynne is the most stupid marasmus idiot ever as a merethari and elthina was...we is save her and others and she is do that, after what we done and she is even posessed by demon and we do not send her to templars or execute

 

...ehh... but wait, why i am surprised.. it is entirely her fault for what happened in circle tower :D

 

i think i will execute wynne as i do with lelianna in my keep canon, they deserve it :D wynne does not deserve to be a "hero of thedas who fight with warden"

 

 

execute everyone who is go against you and doing the right job how it must be done...do that in DAO do in DA2 and will do in in DAI..."deal and support or get out of here and not interfere, or die and no one spare you no matter how you will beg for it when you loose"©

 

never undertand why we cant simply execute grefoir and his lefted templars and gain mages suport..even logain planed this

 

and in the end as we know chanry templars will be exiled from ferelden anyway and ferelden have strugle with orlais so it is no difference at all



#85
Ares_mito

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I want Bloodmage as much as other specs back healers included I cannot accept that something you could do during all the DA story line is simply removed. "Ok from Inquisition on mages cannot heal anymore" is not a good justification try to balance this feature instead introducing a cap to the health one can restore with magic and removing that MMORPG like resurrection mechanism that is no sense for me!



#86
Xilizhra

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Signed, most definitely, as the necromancer really isn't an adequate substitute.



#87
Tragoudistros

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Not necessary :) have you seen the Necromancer tree?

In many related means, you get many of the same skills. I am very pleased!!
http://m.neogaf.com/...=930619&page=32
sure it's not the same, but it will, oh, so do!!

#88
wicked cool

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Add me to petition. Add it in dlc such as wardens keep. Finding necromancer lacking

#89
Chrumpek

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Yes, bring blood magic back, it's integral part of dragon age story, the constant temptation for every mage to tap into that forbidden power, bargain and pact with demons.

 

Someone here said that it's lazy of them to not include it and the other replied that it's because of that he won't agree - well it is , if it doesn't have place in DAI becase of no recognition or npc interaction than it is exactly that, lazy of not making it. I don't see any problems with adding some quite voices sounds from time to time or a increasing chance of loosing control of character the more you cast it in singe battle. Hell stupid WoW had soem weapons that whispered you.

 

Anyways Blood magic was ridiculously overpowered, especially in dragon age 1, dunno if people forgot or just didn't know how to use it - it basically enabled you to keep on tons of self buffs, while dchain casting powerful spells.

 

bring back some way pelase :>



#90
SpiritMuse

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I don't see any problems with adding some quite voices sounds from time to time or a increasing chance of loosing control of character the more you cast it in singe battle. Hell stupid WoW had soem weapons that whispered you.

 

 

That would be an entirely new game mechanic to build into the game. Not a simple thing to do. And if you lose control of your character, what would that mean exactly? That you became an abomination? Wouldn't that just be game over then?

 

The reason they left it out this time around is that it would color the reaction of pretty much every npc you meet. Blood Magic is and should be Serious Business in the world of Dragon Age. Blood Magic is considered the most dangerous form of magic, and Blood Mages are seen by most as irredeemably evil. So you'd have to encounter some serious consequences in the world as a Blood Mage PC, but so far it's been mostly glossed over. Almost every other person you meet who is a Blood Mage is hunted or killed on sight by Templars, but the PC gets off scot free. No one even really comments on it. It's a segregation of story and gameplay that is stretching the boundaries of the suspension of disbelief more and more. 

 

Besides, even if they did react appropriately, what would that mean, really? They try to kill you or run you out of town as soon as they find out? Would be hard to be an inspiring leader of the Inquisition if you're considered a Big Bad yourself. Would be hard to be a leader at all if your followers wouldn't follow you because they think you've crossed the moral event horizon.

 

I want to see Blood Magic back, too. But only if they handle it properly. Which seems to be what they want to do. So I'm sure we'll see it again sometime.


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#91
Sinuphro

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Not necessary :) have you seen the Necromancer tree?

In many related means, you get many of the same skills. I am very pleased!!
http://m.neogaf.com/...=930619&page=32
sure it's not the same, but it will, oh, so do!!

saw the necromancy tree. it is lacking. how can a necromancy skill no have spells to animate dead souls to fight with you for some time???



#92
Lee80

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You didn't put OFFICIAL in all caps in the tittle, this will never work out. 



#93
thats1evildude

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I remember many people complaining that "no one cared I was a maleficar." I'd rather not have those whiners come back.

 

So I don't support this cause.



#94
KaiserShep

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I believe that no Dragon Age game really works properly with this spec unless the game forces you to play a mage, taking away the extra variables that come with being one of the "mundane" classes, and I don't think BioWare is ever going to do that.


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#95
Chrumpek

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That would be an entirely new game mechanic to build into the game. Not a simple thing to do. And if you lose control of your character, what would that mean exactly? That you became an abomination? Wouldn't that just be game over then?

 

The reason they left it out this time around is that it would color the reaction of pretty much every npc you meet. Blood Magic is and should be Serious Business in the world of Dragon Age. Blood Magic is considered the most dangerous form of magic, and Blood Mages are seen by most as irredeemably evil. So you'd have to encounter some serious consequences in the world as a Blood Mage PC, but so far it's been mostly glossed over. Almost every other person you meet who is a Blood Mage is hunted or killed on sight by Templars, but the PC gets off scot free. No one even really comments on it. It's a segregation of story and gameplay that is stretching the boundaries of the suspension of disbelief more and more. 

 

Besides, even if they did react appropriately, what would that mean, really? They try to kill you or run you out of town as soon as they find out? Would be hard to be an inspiring leader of the Inquisition if you're considered a Big Bad yourself. Would be hard to be a leader at all if your followers wouldn't follow you because they think you've crossed the moral event horizon.

 

I want to see Blood Magic back, too. But only if they handle it properly. Which seems to be what they want to do. So I'm sure we'll see it again sometime.

 

---------------------------

 

Oh ye I understand your points, as for the voices and mind control - the former would be just scripts added to randomly play some creepy stuff when your out of combat or reach certain point in the story. About the mind control - what i was thinking was an increasing chance to loose control of character, the more blood magic spells are cast during a single encounter, lets say at the start its 0% after 3 casts it becomes 5% then every next cast increases by another 5%. When you loose control basically makes your PC one more enemy for companions to kill. It's like in DAO when you basically died just here u also become enemy. Of course it could be stacking debuff numbers could be tweaked or some other kind of penalty - could be even linearly tied to the story as in your corruption progresses with campaign and you have to deal with the demon at some point - you know like most linear rpgs do.

 

As for consequence - look at merril, everybody in the party knew what she was up to but they just dealt with it until you had to do some quests about it , could be same here for PC. Those consequences could loose you some of the companions, or not let you recruit a group for inquisition and so on. You could even not use blood magic spells at some areas for npc not to notice - the possibilities are endless.

 

If blood magic would bring dire repercussions that would only enrich the story and get you more immersed. Just like in DAO you couldnt recruit all groups, in ME2 your companions could die, here you could also loose them or some assets.

 



#96
Chrumpek

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I believe that no Dragon Age game really works properly with this spec unless the game forces you to play a mage, taking away the extra variables that come with being one of the "mundane" classes, and I don't think BioWare is ever going to do that.

That is such a backwards thinking, it's sad.



#97
PhroXenGold

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Personally, I think you should be able to chose blood magic as your specialisation. And then, you are immediately executed by Cass. Game over.


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#98
Guest_Juromaro_*

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its shameful that bioware did not implement blood mage specialization in DAI. But the most annoying part of it all was that during DAI's development period everyone had complained about making npcs react to your blood magic. In short the devs and creators knew people loved the blood magic spec but wanted it implemented better. Instead of doing what the majority of their customers wanted, instead they took it off. They had 3 years plus to develop DAI yet they could not implement this key thing that their hardcore DA customers had been asking for??

 

Bad decisions like this is going to cause them problems with their upcoming future releases. The fact that they removed something a lot of customers like is already another strike against bioware. For their sake they need to pray that the other contents of the game are worth it or else they might receive another backlash like what happenned for DA2 and ME3

The only reason the Hero of Fereldan was allowed to use blood magic was because(according to lore) Grey Wardens are allowed to use whatever means available to end a blight.

 

The only reason Hawke was allowed to use Blood Magic was because He/She was the Champion of Kirkwall, with enough gold, power and popularity with the people to be a free mage blatently using magic in FRONT of a Knight Commander of the Templars.

 

 

The Inquisitor being able to use blood magic would as Koorah put it wouldn't be successful, half your team would abandon/kill you, all your allies would abandon/kill you. And the only option you'd have left is to join the bad guys(which should totally be an option by the way).



#99
SpiritMuse

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Oh ye I understand your points, as for the voices and mind control - the former would be just scripts added to randomly play some creepy stuff when your out of combat or reach certain point in the story. About the mind control - what i was thinking was an increasing chance to loose control of character, the more blood magic spells are cast during a single encounter, lets say at the start its 0% after 3 casts it becomes 5% then every next cast increases by another 5%. When you loose control basically makes your PC one more enemy for companions to kill. It's like in DAO when you basically died just here u also become enemy. Of course it could be stacking debuff numbers could be tweaked or some other kind of penalty - could be even linearly tied to the story as in your corruption progresses with campaign and you have to deal with the demon at some point - you know like most linear rpgs do.

As for consequence - look at merril, everybody in the party knew what she was up to but they just dealt with it until you had to do some quests about it , could be same here for PC. Those consequences could loose you some of the companions, or not let you recruit a group for inquisition and so on. You could even not use blood magic spells at some areas for npc not to notice - the possibilities are endless.

If blood magic would bring dire repercussions that would only enrich the story and get you more immersed. Just like in DAO you couldnt recruit all groups, in ME2 your companions could die, here you could also loose them or some assets.


I get the mechanics you're proposing. But would anyone want to play a spec that randomly makes you lose control of your character? And really, the lose control part is basically when you become an abomination, right? And that's supposed to be irreversible. So, game over for your MC, no?

As for Merrill, yeah, all the party members tolerate her. But most only do so out of loyalty to Hawke. Anders, Fenris and Sebastian, for instance, have serious problems with her Blood Magic, and would absolutely turn her in if not for Hawke. There's actually a party banter between Sebatian and Fenris about how they should really turn in all those mages they've been running around with but they don't because neither wants to antagonize Hawke.

The repercussions you suggest are pretty much the kind of thing I'd expect to see. But some of those are big things that would impact the entire story, it would become an entirely different game. Just for one spec of one class. So I get why they didn't add it in this time.

That got me thinking though, if they did want to implement a spec that would make you insta-hated/feared, it would work better if they had one of those for every class. Warrior, for instance, has the Reaver spec which seems to be pretty close to what Blood Magic is for mages. If Reavers became more well known they might gain a feared status not dissimilar from Blood Mages. And for Rogue you might have a spec that represents them joining/allying with a particularly feared group of assassins, or something to that effect. That way each class would have an "evil" spec, so that content could be used for more than one spec of one class, and people could access it even if they don't play a mage.

#100
Chrumpek

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I like hopw together we resolved the issue Spiritmouse, that would actually be easier, much easier to implement if all 3 classes (rogue/mage/warr) had that one resentful spec. Wish they did something like that and not just remove it altogether because your char would be considered evil.