218 réponses à ce sujet

[Medhia_Nox]

@Lord Parbr:  How do you know it isn't?&

[LordParbr]

@Lord Parbr:  How do you know it isn't?&

past experience, and current data

[wtfman99]

I'd say the issue isn't so much that barrier has kind of taken over in place of the heal spell but rather we are now limited to 8 slots.

 

I'm just gonna play the game and i'll see what I think.

[finc.loki]

Nothing has changed, on previous games and on higher difficulties the only way to play a DPS mage was having 2 mages in the party with one being support and the other DPS. You must do the same if you want to play a DPS mage or simply have a DPS mage in the party. Having 2 mage is almost always better than 2 warrior or 2 rogue because there are too much mage spells and one mage can never have all.

This is the reason why I think there will always be 2 mages in my party.

A warrior with sword and board (Cassandra, will romance her), I will spec the warrior as champion and all the guard abilities to Cassandra will always have guard up, more or less. That will make her exceptionally strong as a tank.

Then if I play Archer I will have two mages with different DPS abilities and both having barrier, that way a barrier will be up pretty often. When or if I play a mage myself I will still bring another mage and that one will be specced with barrier and the heal/revive spell. I will go fully DPS.

 

I don't plan to play on higher difficulty than normal. But I play in real time so normal might be the best for that.

[brazen_nl]

I'm with you on this but to be fair Xil was specifically talking about having a 4 mage party. 

 

Its worth noting though that 2 mages with only 2 points spent in Barrier each will allow a mage party to ping pong barrier almost constantly, received damage and mana management being the variables on the barriers duration. 2 points is hardly a heavy investment. 

 

If you can detect in Tactics that Barrier is up. Else, it becomes a manual thing which I find majorly annoying. I don't like to micro manage even through I play Nightmare.

[brazen_nl]

Please take it to messages if you guys feel the need to vent.
 

 

But, but, if they take it to PM, no one can see they're such tough guys!

[brazen_nl]

The only thing I would like to have seen would have been something like Mass Effect where when you brought up your HUD on Shift, your squad's abilities showed up on the screen so you ddn't have to go from one to the next and tactic wise it was faster. That would definately be more convenient but not a game breaker.

 

That would be nice, yes.

[LordParbr]

That would be nice, yes.

There would be 32 abilities on the screen...

[brazen_nl]

There would be 32 abilities on the screen...

And?

[LordParbr]

And?

and that would make that kind of thing infeasible

[brazen_nl]

and that would make that kind of thing infeasible

 

Why? It's digital, you can put anything you want on the screen. Put the four bars on top of each other for all I care. It's nice to see everything at once on the screen, although I don't really use it much. It was compulsory for ME1 since you couldn't drag squadmate's talents to the quickbar.

[looonah]

In DA:O this translated to bringing 3 mages and permanently paralysis locking everything. I'm not sure if that counts more as playing strategically or breaking the game to get around the overtuned mobs.

I only brought one mage. Morrigan. 

[Itkovian]

one problem with that reasoning.. it's based on the idea that temp hp doesn't exist when in fact it does. they remove the basic spam heal spell to get rid of "infinite hp" then added a bunch of way to add hp over your normal health bar so you have infinite hp anyway... can you say epic fail.

 

This is missing the point, which is NOT to remove the spam heal.

 

The point is to have a system where each fight doesn't need to be a possible party wipe, or else it's meaningless. By requiring "proactive" defenses like barriers and guard, and greatly limiting actual healing, individual fights no longer need to be life-threatening. Instead, they just need to be difficult enough to require you to use some of your finite resources (healing potions) if you're careless.

 

Or, to put it another way: fights no longer have to kill you to be a challenge, they just have to hurt you. This forces you to use up potions, or go into the next fight while injured.

 

This allows for better and more reasonable pacing in encounter design, and introduces resource management as a more important mechanic. The goal being, of course, to make the whole experience more fun.

[Medhia_Nox]

@Itkovian:  So... tabletop RPG game design.

 

Que - but this isn't tabletop.  3....2....1... GO.

[Neuromancer]

This is missing the point, which is NOT to remove the spam heal.

The point is to have a system where each fight doesn't need to be a possible party wipe, or else it's meaningless. By requiring "proactive" defenses like barriers and guard, and greatly limiting actual healing, individual fights no longer need to be life-threatening. Instead, they just need to be difficult enough to require you to use some of your finite resources (healing potions) if you're careless.

Or, to put it another way: fights no longer have to kill you to be a challenge, they just have to hurt you. This forces you to use up potions, or go into the next fight while injured.

This allows for better and more reasonable pacing in encounter design, and introduces resource management as a more important mechanic. The goal being, of course, to make the whole experience more fun.

Put this way I really do like it! I've always been into battles of attrition and the like.

However I am still sad that healers are gone. I wish there was a way to incorporate then without trashing the survivability factors.

Honestly one of my favorite things in gaming IS that feeling of danger and adrenaline rush when being chased and stuff.

[KoorahUK]

Put this way I really do like it! I've always been into battles of attrition and the like.

However I am still sad that healers are gone. I wish there was a way to incorporate then without trashing the survivability factors.

Honestly one of my favorite things in gaming IS that feeling of danger and adrenaline rush when being chased and stuff.

Then I think you'll have a lot more fun with this than you think. 

 

Put it this way, use what's available to you and see if it fits. You may actually love the Barrier dynamic; its often a lot different playing than it is watching. If you don't like it... be creative

[Neuromancer]

Then I think you'll have a lot more fun with this than you think.

Put it this way, use what's available to you and see if it fits. You may actually love the Barrier dynamic; its often a lot different playing than it is watching. If you don't like it... be creative

Aye. I am fully going to go info the ice tree and be a necromancer.

My every intent is to CC lock enemies and essentially cushion my team from death... By using ... Death...

Plus I already fancy Iron Bull and then I like Black wall and Cassandra. So my team was pretty beefy from the get go. Not for any particular strategy I must add!

I really just like these three characters.

We'll see how me, a male, zombie raising Elsa, fares in my HIGHLY warrior biased party...

[Medhia_Nox]

I truly believe using Guard and Healing Grenades + Healing Potions + Health on Hit + Con/Hit Point Gear will make Barrier totally unessential if you don't want it to be. 

 

The reason they put in things like Healing and Revive Grenades is so that people who don't want a mage in the party can have utility.

 

You want to play for mages?  Focus one on barriers... focus two on DPS - focus one on CC and you'll probably be totally fine.  Cause you'll STILL have all those extra things (minus guard) that warriors can get. 

[Neuromancer]

I truly believe using Guard and Healing Grenades + Healing Potions + Health on Hit + Con/Hit Point Gear will make Barrier totally unessential if you don't want it to be.

The reason they put in things like Healing and Revive Grenades is so that people who don't want a mage in the party can have utility.

You want to play for mages? Focus one on barriers... focus two on DPS - focus one on CC and you'll probably be totally fine. Cause you'll STILL have all those extra things (minus guard) that warriors can get.

Wat we have life steal!?

Oh geez. I didn't know that

[seraphymon]

This is missing the point, which is NOT to remove the spam heal.

 

The point is to have a system where each fight doesn't need to be a possible party wipe, or else it's meaningless. By requiring "proactive" defenses like barriers and guard, and greatly limiting actual healing, individual fights no longer need to be life-threatening. Instead, they just need to be difficult enough to require you to use some of your finite resources (healing potions) if you're careless.

 

Or, to put it another way: fights no longer have to kill you to be a challenge, they just have to hurt you. This forces you to use up potions, or go into the next fight while injured.

 

This allows for better and more reasonable pacing in encounter design, and introduces resource management as a more important mechanic. The goal being, of course, to make the whole experience more fun.

The goal also comes with the frustration of running back to heal and requip. Which will vary depending on the player. but it will happen. and just 1 time is 1 time too many..

 

Also, because of this.. that means no more spirit healer or bloodmage specilization if this design choice decides to stick around post DAI

[aeoncs]

The most amusing side effect of topics like this one really is, that we get so see the exact same few people nitpick and complain over and over and over [...] and over again. BSN sometimes makes me feel like I've been watching Groundhog Day for weeks on end.

[n7stormrunner]

The most amusing side effect of topics like this one really is, that we get so see the exact same few people nitpick and complain over and over and over [...] and over again. BSN sometimes makes me feel like I've been watching Groundhog Day for weeks on end.

 

 

no one, ever said, we were a sane bunch.

[Morroian]

The most amusing side effect of topics like this one really is, that we get so see the exact same few people nitpick and complain over and over and over [...] and over again. BSN sometimes makes me feel like I've been watching Groundhog Day for weeks on end.

 

One of the reasons why is that there is so little transparency about why these changes have been made.

[seraphymon]

The most amusing side effect of topics like this one really is, that we get so see the exact same few people nitpick and complain over and over and over [...] and over again. BSN sometimes makes me feel like I've been watching Groundhog Day for weeks on end.

Just like the same few people defend every issue  to the death like a herd of sheep to Bioware.

[aeoncs]

Just like the same few people defend every issue  to the death like a herd of sheep to Bioware.

 

If the shoe fits, wear it. Right?

And there's a difference between being an annoying little nitpicker who nags and nags without pause, lacking any kind of reasonable ground, having not yet played the game, and reserving judgement until it's actually due. But I do understand why you can't seem to grasp that simple concept.