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[FreshRevenge]

If you play the Legacy dlc after her death than there is a nice cutscene. You need to play it to find out what I am talking about. But her death bothered me a lot because I didn't really have a choice. I kept thinking I did something wrong. So seeing that I had no choice to watch her die was frustrating and sad.

[KaiserShep]

That is a nice scene. It's too bad it's just all in Varric's head. Heh.

 

[KaiserShep]

Hah, it was sort of a general [joking] response to the claims that DA2 was all an exaggeration made up by Varric.

 

 

On a sidenote, the family wasn't utilized enough for my tastes. I loved Carver, Bethany, Leandra, and even Gamlen. This is where DA2 was superior to DAO for me -- it was a long version of one of DAO's origin stories. I just wish there was even more. Maybe I'm asking for too much?

 

I agree with this. Gamlen was an insufferable git, but I found him to be a convincing enough character that I could imagine Hawke begrudgingly caring about, and both Bethany and Carver were very valuable parts of the game. Leandra was the weakest link unfortunately, because she just didn't have enough to say. Bethany was easily the most valuable family member and companion to me (when she was around) because she would be the stable center of Hawke's life, well above Aveline. In Act 1, I always took Bethany on every single quest with the exception of the Deep Roads.

 

I admit to being just a wee bit bugged that Bethany is not mentioned in the epilogue. I wouldn't expect the Hawke siblings to part ways unless Bethany/Carver was a Grey Warden.

[steamcamel]

I'm playing this game now because I want to catch up on the lore for DAI.

 

Got a question - whats the point of killing Hawkes mother? Is it a cheap way to create conflict about mages? I mean, why? Doesn't even fit in the story. And Hawke doesn't seem to upset about it. And his uncle - ok his reaction was ok - but his statement  "I'll tell your sister"? Are you kidding me?

 

 

I was like WTF? Where'd this come from?

 

So you decided to post a major spoiler in your title thread? What a marvellous idea.

[Silfren]

I would however say the potential for Leandra's death was poorly handled, in the grand scheme of things. Not a cheap means to create conflict, but definitely something Bioware could've worked with better.

 

As for how Hawke reacts, that's one of the beauties of the tonal dialogue. You can headcanon Hawke became a sad clown afterwards... or is so filled with anger and resentment (at himself/herself and the world) that he/she lashes out at people, or just wants to be a good person afterwards.

 

Oh, no argument from me there at all.  I loved that they actually went there...and then they completely dropped the ball.  Especially since the original story involved putting Hawke into a dilemma.  I can appreciate why they felt they had to scrap that idea, but there was just so damn much potential with that storyline and they blew it all. 

[Jester]

Yes it was. To inflame and prejudice the player against Circle mages without regard for context. And against Orsino with his contrived connection to Quentin via a letter without context that honestly feels OOC for Orsino.

Yeah, because Orsino totally wasn't a blood mage, with knowledge about how to turn yourself into a Harvester (gained from his correspondence with Quentin, who was both a master blood mage and a necromancer).

Those were all Templar lies and manipulation...Except they were not. 

Face the fact, that the leader of the Kirkwall's Circle of Magi was an extremely experienced blood mage, with vast knowledge on the subject matter, and Meredith was right from the very beginning.

 

 

I'm playing this game now because I want to catch up on the lore for DAI.

 

Got a question - whats the point of killing Hawkes mother? Is it a cheap way to create conflict about mages? I mean, why? Doesn't even fit in the story. And Hawke doesn't seem to upset about it. And his uncle - ok his reaction was ok - but his statement  "I'll tell your sister"? Are you kidding me?

 

 

I was like WTF? Where'd this come from?

This is a continuation of a story thread starting in Act I, when Hawke investigates one of Quentin's first murders. 

It's not a "cheap way to create conflict". At this point, this conflict is quite well established. It is a way to involve a player personally to the other side of the conflict - because at this point, Hawke is involved with 'free' mages (Merill, Anders, perhaps Bethany), but not so much with the Chantry/Templar point of view (perhaps Carver, or to some degree Fenris and Sebastian). You need to see the horrors that out-of-control mage can inflict (as you already saw by this point what corrupted Templars might do - 'Tranquil solution' and everything connected to it). What Quentin does is repulsive, and seems more horrible than anything that a regular murderer might do.

[Keroko]

Yes it was. To inflame and prejudice the player against Circle mages without regard for context. And against Orsino with his contrived connection to Quentin via a letter without context that honestly feels OOC for Orsino.

 

Orsino's been shielding blood mages from day one, this was hardly out of character for him.

 

 

The problem there is that Quentin isn't even representative of mages. Why get mad at mages because of him? He uses an extremely rare and ingenious form of necromancy. Plus, he's batshit insane.

 

He isn't even representative of blood mages. He's in a class of his own. I think of blood mages more like Hadriana. Not Quentin or Tarohne. Or at least, Hadriana represents the typical threat they pose (sacrifice, draining others for their own gain).

 

He's representative of how dangerous mages can get if left unwatched. Just as Alrik was an example of how dangerous it is for templars to be unaccountable.
 

[elrofrost]

I apologize about the title. I assumed, since I was in the "story" section of the forums it didn't matter.

I understand what the writers were trying to do. But madness isn't exclusive to mages. And why choose his mother?  Get a couple of mentions from your teammates and all is done and forgotten.

 

I mean, frankly, from a player point of view I didn't care about his mother. I barely spoke to her. Now killing the sister would've meant more to me, as a player. That's why I was so confused by the mother. I was like, "what's the point?"

 

And that brings up another scene - end of Act 2. In front of the Viscounts building, one of the "hurt" mages in your sister. Who Orsino  heals. And Hawke's reaction is like, "What's up sis?" LOL. All the dialog choices were like that. 

Anyway. I'm really playing the game to build my story at the Keep. So I suppose the "unusual" writing is ok. The fighting is fun at least. And there's lots of lore to read.

[thats1evildude]

Hawke bears his pain stoically.

[Cyrus Amell]

I apologize about the title. I assumed, since I was in the "story" section of the forums it didn't matter.

I understand what the writers were trying to do. But madness isn't exclusive to mages. And why choose his mother?  Get a couple of mentions from your teammates and all is done and forgotten.

 

I mean, frankly, from a player point of view I didn't care about his mother. I barely spoke to her. Now killing the sister would've meant more to me, as a player. That's why I was so confused by the mother. I was like, "what's the point?"

 

As with so many aspects of Dragon Age 2, Leandra's death was poorly handled. I think it has to do with the fact that it was so easily preventable and it gave little chance for the players to absorb the scope of the tragedy.

 

Compare that to, say, the death of the Dragon Age: Origin Human Noble's mother and her murder at the hands of Howe's men-at-arms. The tragedy in question was beyond our ability to control (we would have to have been psychic to divine Rendon Howe's intentions), it had a clear purpose in the story (to show us that power comes with risks), and we were given clear closure (ability to kill Arl Rendon Howe in Denerim).

 

Now, Leandra Amell's death was far more preventable and far less tasetful. The killer could have been caught earlier if we had been allowed to tear through the foundry were we last saw him and she should have been smart enough not to have been alone in Lowtown at night. Her murder felt more like a punishment to the player for failing to perform some side function which is a bad way to perceive a story-based tragedy. We do kill the mage, but he is an insane maniac and killing him is more like putting down a wild dog than vengeance. We are not even given a proper ending scene akin to our vengeance on Howe, we just see Hawke throw a knife at a skeleton (somehow dispatching it). And Orsino's involvement was so badly introduced that I completely missed it the first time. I mean, he was a perfectly stand up guy for 99% of the time we were with him.

 

It really was a wretched and forced way for Bioware to try and give the player a reason to consider siding with the Templars while getting rid of Leandra's character so they could focus what little was left of their production time on the rest of the game. I did like Leandra Amell, it takes a special woman to raise three children while on the run from Templars after abandoning a life of privilege and comfort - and in the end she was simply treated as a prop.

[BobZilla84]

In my opinion Leandra's death wasnt even needed to be honest seriously both Carver & Bethany both can potentally die so your characters loss is covered already.But as so many have said the whole thing was a rather pathetic attempt to connect Hawke to the Mage/Templar Story Arc and while it succeeds it felt ham fisted.

 

I mean damn the entirety of DA2 Hawke was a glorified observer and then B-Ware tried to make Hawke relevant and in my opinion all it did was reinforce the fact DA2 was a rushed Piece Of S°°°.

[Cyrus Amell]

See, that's where I'll disagree. I still love the game, despite this. 

 

But it could have been better, right?

[Cyrus Amell]

Yeah. 

 

I guess I'm just a fan of Thedas in general though, and so I'll have fun with that. Despite some bad plot points, I still like the world. It'll take a bonafide stinker of a game to change that. DA2 wasn't it.

 

 

The setting was never in danger, just our approval of a single product. They rushed DA2, they didn't even have time to come up with a better name, and the game suffered for it. Leandra Amell's death is simply a symptom of a greater problem, but it is an acute point of focus. They should have let her die during the waiting years, perhaps dying of old age or some sickness that befuddled even Anders, so that Hawke could have had time to move on from her death off-screen. She deserved more as a character mind you, and could have proven an asset in maneuvering Kirkwall politics. But there was no politics, just a trite and short story about the Champion's connection to the Mage-Templar conflict.

[Silfren]

I apologize about the title. I assumed, since I was in the "story" section of the forums it didn't matter.

I understand what the writers were trying to do. But madness isn't exclusive to mages. And why choose his mother?  Get a couple of mentions from your teammates and all is done and forgotten.

 

I mean, frankly, from a player point of view I didn't care about his mother. I barely spoke to her. Now killing the sister would've meant more to me, as a player. That's why I was so confused by the mother. I was like, "what's the point?"

 

And that brings up another scene - end of Act 2. In front of the Viscounts building, one of the "hurt" mages in your sister. Who Orsino  heals. And Hawke's reaction is like, "What's up sis?" LOL. All the dialog choices were like that. 

Anyway. I'm really playing the game to build my story at the Keep. So I suppose the "unusual" writing is ok. The fighting is fun at least. And there's lots of lore to read.

 

Well, either sibling already had their stories written.  One could just as easily say why NOT choose Leandra? 

[Ryriena]

It was a half assed way to make Hawke side with the Templars even when you had a mage sister and father that was out of the circle. It did little to the story nor should it have kept my Hawke there to solve a unwinnable conflict. In fact, it also was a bit contrived, when the murder of your mother was making a zombie out of your dead mother for his dead wife. I actually laughed at the walking zombie ploy they pulled with this, as I saw it as a cartoonish way to show the worst of magic.

When a normal killer could do much worst and has in the real world as their is a guy that would make a suite out of his victims skin and he was the person that inspired the villain Leather Face in Texas Chainsaw Massacre

[SpiritMuse]

The biggest problem for me was that we didn't really see a lot of Leandra before that. There weren't very many extended conversations or personal quests by which to get to know her and come to care for her as a player. So her death really isn't a very powerful moment for the player.

[Ryriena]

I also agree, that I never really got an emotional attachment with Leandra, as I did with Carver or my LI. At best, I felt more attached to my Uncle, than my own mother in the game even if he did steal my mothers money, which I don't blame him, since the blight is the only reason she came back to Kirkwall. I found it sad that my own character felt more attached too her uncle than her own mother.