655 réponses à ce sujet

[Xilizhra]

Aduno as a lesbian i quite like looking at women myself. 

yeah i admit everyones brain chemistry is different.

As do I. Though there's hardly anything wrong with tactile, and it can be situational.

[Rifneno]

Lol.  Man.  I don't generally post anymore (or even read here, but this was shared in another forum because wow) but I've just got to chime in...
 
The western puritan culture is an unhealthy attitude we need to get over as a society.  It should, in no way, be encouraged.  The human body is not horror and seeing nipples will not turn children into perverts.  Let me tell you a little story.  I have this niece, nice girl, raised by a religious puritan of a mother (I don't call her sister for many reasons).  She was about ten when this happened.  While on the Internet looking for some flash games, some malware from her hypocritical porn-watching mother popped up some pornographic ads.  They were actually fairly tame by most standards.  She just about had a breakdown.  This kid was bawling her eyes out, thinking she'd committed some great sin by accidentally seeing something.  She literally thought she was going to hell forever because of this.  She was hysterical for days.  That is what this puritan garbage breeds.  This is the attitude the prudes foster.  It makes me sick.
 
This was designed as a game for adults.  Adults should be able to handle adult themes.  Violence, language, and yes, sex.  If you can't handle it, that is your problem and no one else's.  Deal with it.  I'd love to pay double for a version of the game that lets me execute Cullen the second he shows his face and give his spot to someone else.  But I don't get that.  Do you hear me crying and moaning that they need to confirm to my whims?  No, because I deal with it.  Maybe this isn't the game for you.  Ever think about that?  I don't like running around shooting cops, so I don't play Grand Theft Auto.  I didn't go to the GTA forums and start asking that they confirm to my moral standards.  Because that would be ridiculous.
 
As someone said earlier on... the game is done.  It's hitting the shelves in a few days.  We're long past the point of changes being possible.  The game will have nudity.  And if the past has shown us anything, BW will likely pull a lot more punches than they'll throw.  So deal.

[Foxhound2121]

I'm not sure I understand why some people say "it's a Mature game so of course it has to have nudity in it." Like nudity is some golden standard of maturity? Is it not possible to have a mature game without nudity in it?

 

It's more like it shouldn't be a surprise since it's a game for adults.

 

Anyway, to keep into context, let's remember that's it's not just a mature game. It's a game with a mature rating, with romance characters, and with love scenes. Really, nudity is an eventuality here.. 

Saying it doesn't have to be there ever in all romance scenes is silly. Maybe one or two couples story-wise decide to dry hump with clothes on, but not all.  

[R0vena]

There will be nudity in the game? I guess, I really managed to keep myself spoiler-free.

Anyway, to the subject, don't care much, if it is there - ok, if not - no big deal, either. But I would trade the sex-scene for more romance talk any day, in DA 2 especially it seemed we barely had any before we were called to action.)

[daveliam]

I'm not sure I understand why some people say "it's a Mature game so of course it has to have nudity in it." Like nudity is some golden standard of maturity? Is it not possible to have a mature game without nudity in it?

 

No one said that all mature games have to have nudity.  They are saying that since it is a mature game, nudity is not out of place or unacceptable.  If it were rated T, then I could imagine the confusion and possibly outrage at nudity being included.  But it's a game specifically designed for ages 17 and up.  Including nudity in a game with this intended audience isn't wrong.  It's not necessary, but there's nothing wrong with it.

[WildOrchid]

snip

 

Poor girl... :/

 

There will be nudity in the game? I guess, I really managed to keep myself spoiler-free.

Anyway, to the subject, don't care much, if it is there - ok, if not - no big deal, either. But I would trade the sex-scene for more romance talk any day, in DA 2 especially it seemed we barely had any before we were called to action.)

 

It's been said the romances now are more complicated and in-depth than before.

[R0vena]

 

It's been said the romances now are more complicated and in-depth than before.

Thanks, that's good to know.)

[robertthebard]

There is no society hang up about seeing boobs, either, after having sex with someone. 1658 was a long, long, long, time ago.

I didn't realize that the Mass Effect scandal concerning the Liara sex scene happened that long ago, and, shamefully, I didn't realize I was that old.

This whole thing boils down to "People will respect my views, or they're out of line". Sorry to disappoint. I have 2 Warning points because when I feel a view is out of line, I say so. This view is out of line. People come from varying backgrounds, with varying tolerances. I bounced in strip clubs for years. I've seen every kind of boob from "are you sure you're a girl" to "are those real". I don't think that people not wanting to see them in a video game need help. I do, however, believe that people that are willing to go on the warpath about having them do.

The reality is, quite simply that we don't need them in a game for the game to be good. We don't need sex in a video game for it to be good. Baldur's Gate was plenty good, so good that it's been remade for modern hardware, and it was never about "get in so and so's pants". "But everyone else is doing it" isn't exactly a strong argument either. What if the subject is jumping off bridges, or lighting cats on fire? Does this mean we should all jump on the bandwagon? Give me a game that engages me with the story, and I can live with a fade to black love scene.

[Br3admax]

Lol TIL: Fox News represents society. Extreme right is not a dying minority.

[Rifneno]

I didn't realize that the Mass Effect scandal concerning the Liara sex scene happened that long ago, and, shamefully, I didn't realize I was that old.

This whole thing boils down to "People will respect my views, or they're out of line". Sorry to disappoint. I have 2 Warning points because when I feel a view is out of line, I say so. This view is out of line. People come from varying backgrounds, with varying tolerances. I bounced in strip clubs for years. I've seen every kind of boob from "are you sure you're a girl" to "are those real". I don't think that people not wanting to see them in a video game need help. I do, however, believe that people that are willing to go on the warpath about having them do.

The reality is, quite simply that we don't need them in a game for the game to be good. We don't need sex in a video game for it to be good. Baldur's Gate was plenty good, so good that it's been remade for modern hardware, and it was never about "get in so and so's pants". "But everyone else is doing it" isn't exactly a strong argument either. What if the subject is jumping off bridges, or lighting cats on fire? Does this mean we should all jump on the bandwagon? Give me a game that engages me with the story, and I can live with a fade to black love scene.

Seems to me that the warpath is you puritans making a stink over some minor nudity, not in others demanding it be there.

 

How about you light that strawman on fire instead?  Nobody ever said a game has to have nudity to be good.  It doesn't need graphics either.  I played plenty of excellent MUDs back in the early 90's.  By your "logic", we should also do away with graphics and go back to text-based games.

[phantomrachie]

The reality is, quite simply that we don't need them in a game for the game to be good. We don't need sex in a video game for it to be good. Baldur's Gate was plenty good, so good that it's been remade for modern hardware, and it was never about "get in so and so's pants". "But everyone else is doing it" isn't exactly a strong argument either. What if the subject is jumping off bridges, or lighting cats on fire? Does this mean we should all jump on the bandwagon? Give me a game that engages me with the story, and I can live with a fade to black love scene.

 

Nudity doesn't equal seeing characters have sex though.

 

I sometimes walk around my house naked, that doesn't mean I'm about to have sex, just that I forgot to bring up the clean clothes from the drier. 

 

I don't think anyone is asking to actually see characters have sex, at least I'm not, I simply don't want BioWare to shy away from showing a part of a persons body if it fits the context of the scene.

 

The post sex conversation is an example of this; for some characters it made sense that there were dressed during it, Isabela for example wasn't staying the night, but for others the fact that they magically had their underwear back on was annoying.

 

Shepard and Liara were enjoying their last night together in ME3, the sex scene was sweet, ending in a fade to black when things got past some light touching, but I knew enough to know that they were naked. Then Shepard wakes up and she is wearing her bra, so at some stage in the night, after having sex with Liara for the last time, she got up, put her underwear back on and went back to sleep.

 

That was very annoying.

[robertthebard]

Seems to me that the warpath is you puritans making a stink over some minor nudity, not in others demanding it be there.
 
How about you light that strawman on fire instead?  Nobody ever said a game has to have nudity to be good.  It doesn't need graphics either.  I played plenty of excellent MUDs back in the early 90's.  By your "logic", we should also do away with graphics and go back to text-based games.

Puritan? Did you even read my post, or are you so determined that it's "your way or the highway" that you ignored it, and chose to just continue your warpath? I'm aware of what games do and don't need. I played RPGs before there were MUDs. Hell, I played them before there were computers in every household. But, that doesn't really come around to the topic here very well, does it? I mean, here you are now arguing that we don't need nudity in games, in a topic that is about how much we do. So are you changing sides now?

I just want to be clear here, how does bouncing in a strip club equal Puritan? It seems to me that we're getting to the root of the problem, and it isn't morality...

My "logic" is that people have different viewpoints, and they're all valid. I understand your compulsion to view it differently. I don't, and I won't. If that bothers you, report me, you'll be better off that way than trying to convince me that you're right. All that will do is garner me another board warning. Respecting that others have a differing viewpoint isn't a "strawman", except to those that would rather not respect other's points of view.

[Rifneno]

Puritan? Did you even read my post, or are you so determined that it's "your way or the highway" that you ignored it, and chose to just continue your warpath? I'm aware of what games do and don't need. I played RPGs before there were MUDs. Hell, I played them before there were computers in every household. But, that doesn't really come around to the topic here very well, does it? I mean, here you are now arguing that we don't need nudity in games, in a topic that is about how much we do. So are you changing sides now?

I just want to be clear here, how does bouncing in a strip club equal Puritan? It seems to me that we're getting to the root of the problem, and it isn't morality...

My "logic" is that people have different viewpoints, and they're all valid. I understand your compulsion to view it differently. I don't, and I won't. If that bothers you, report me, you'll be better off that way than trying to convince me that you're right. All that will do is garner me another board warning. Respecting that others have a differing viewpoint isn't a "strawman", except to those that would rather not respect other's points of view.

Speaking of FOX News, do you work there?  Because I don't know anyone else who uses the word "war" so frequently, so meaninglessly, and so inaccurately.

 

You seem to think your bouncer story earns you some gold star of credibility.  Let me assure you, it does not.  You are not an expert on the subject, you are not special, and your word means no more than anyone else's.  If anything, I find myself questioning your credibility based on the way you took my off-hand comment about MUDs and tried to turn it into a game of one-upmanship.

[AlanC9]

Bioware never shows the actual act, and it seems even logical that before that begins people are still in their underwear. In their underwear afterwards? Okay that is weird, but right before? That seems to imply it was a spontaneus thing rather than "let's have sex now, so first take off your clothes and THEN we will have foreplay."

The afterwards part is what looked silly in ME3. Well, that and the infamous shower scene.

[robertthebard]

Speaking of FOX News, do you work there?  Because I don't know anyone else who uses the word "war" so frequently, so meaninglessly, and so inaccurately.
 
You seem to think your bouncer story earns you some gold star of credibility.  Let me assure you, it does not.  You are not an expert on the subject, you are not special, and your word means no more than anyone else's.  If anything, I find myself questioning your credibility based on the way you took my off-hand comment about MUDs and tried to turn it into a game of one-upmanship.

What are your qualifications? Do you have a degree in internet discussion or something? Maybe you believe you can cyber bully me into compliance? So it's on to the "I can't refute the argument, so I'll just throw out personal attacks until he shuts up" phase now? I was effectively banned from these boards for about a month because I refused to acknowledge a board warning for not doing that. Good luck. In case you're unable of comprehending what that means, which would be hardly surprising, since you don't seem to know what puritan means. Allow me to expand your vocabulary, in the right way. It does not mean "he disagrees with how important nudity in a game is to me, so he's a puritan", especially in context with our little exchange. If this offends you, good, maybe you needed to be offended. It's really your issue, not mine.

Oh, and not having credibility with people like you? That's a good thing where I come from.

[phantomrachie]

Roberthebard & Rifneno

 

Please take your argument off this thread & on to the PMs.

 

This thread has already gotten 1 warning from a mod and I'd rather it not get locked due to your bickering.

 

There is a very interesting conversation going on here and it can continue only if we stick to the topic at hand.

[Iakus]

Lol.  Man.  I don't generally post anymore (or even read here, but this was shared in another forum because wow) but I've just got to chime in...
 
The western puritan culture is an unhealthy attitude we need to get over as a society.  It should, in no way, be encouraged.  The human body is not horror and seeing nipples will not turn children into perverts.  Let me tell you a little story.  I have this niece, nice girl, raised by a religious puritan of a mother (I don't call her sister for many reasons).  She was about ten when this happened.  While on the Internet looking for some flash games, some malware from her hypocritical porn-watching mother popped up some pornographic ads.  They were actually fairly tame by most standards.  She just about had a breakdown.  This kid was bawling her eyes out, thinking she'd committed some great sin by accidentally seeing something.  She literally thought she was going to hell forever because of this.  She was hysterical for days.  That is what this puritan garbage breeds.  This is the attitude the prudes foster.  It makes me sick.
 
 

 

Wow, that's a lot of reductio ad absurdum there...

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

Im honestly surprised this thread hasn't been locked yet with all the angry arguing happening, i still don't see the huge deal, if your so against seeing any type of nudity then you should avoid the romances

[Rifneno]

Roberthebard & Rifneno
 
Please take your argument off this thread & on to the PMs.
 
This thread has already gotten 1 warning from a mod and I'd rather it not get locked due to your bickering.
 
There is a very interesting conversation going on here and it can continue only if we stick to the topic at hand.

Yes, you're right. Sorry about that.
 

Wow, that's a lot of reductio ad absurdum there...

Ahh yes, everything looks more grandiose when you say it in Latin. I think I'll stick to English and let my points speak for themselves instead.

I think the argument you're looking for is "anecdotes aren't real evidence." Which, unlike reduction to absurdity, is actually true. So it's got that going for it.

Point, actually. I figured it pretty much self-evident that the western culture's prudishness was unhealthy. But if you wish, here, this took me all of 7 seconds at google to find. It compares some very... unprudish countries with America and how studies show that in everything from teen pregnancy to HIV, they're doing magnitudes better. So yes. Prudish culture is unhealthy.  Basic human nature: make something forbidden and people will want to do it more.

[BronzTrooper]

@Rifneno & robertthebard

 

What exactly is the point of your argument?  It seems like you both have similar opinions about nudity in gaming, but robert is saying that just because people have differing views it doesn't mean that their opinions don't matter.  Why all the hate towards each other?

[AlanC9]

Yes, you're right. Sorry about that.
Ahh yes, everything looks more grandiose when you say it in Latin. I think I'll stick to English and let my points speak for themselves instead.

That's a little unfair, don't you think? Unless education's really changed in the last few years, logical fallacies are still taught by their latin names. I don't really know why it's taught with a bunch of latin phrases and stale metaphors, unless maybe it's to maintain backwards-compatibility with earlier texts.

[Iakus]

 

Ahh yes, everything looks more grandiose when you say it in Latin. I think I'll stick to English and let my points speak for themselves instead.

I think the argument you're looking for is "anecdotes aren't real evidence." Which, unlike reduction to absurdity, is actually true. So it's got that going for it.

Point, actually. I figured it pretty much self-evident that the western culture's prudishness was unhealthy. But if you wish, here, this took me all of 7 seconds at google to find. It compares some very... unprudish countries with America and how studies show that in everything from teen pregnancy to HIV, they're doing magnitudes better. So yes. Prudish culture is unhealthy.  Basic human nature: make something forbidden and people will want to do it more.

Reductio ad Absurdum is, in fact, a thing.  THough I suppose "straw man" works as well, if you prefer sticking to English.

 

And claiming that everyone who doesn't care to see nudity in a game is just a "western puritanical" prude is a pretty clear example.  Not to mention insulting. 

[Foxhound2121]

Reductio ad Absurdum is, in fact, a thing.  THough I suppose "straw man" works as well, if you prefer sticking to English.

 

And claiming that everyone who doesn't care to see nudity in a game is just a "western puritanical" prude is a pretty clear example.  Not to mention insulting. 

 

If you don't care, then what's the problem?

[Iakus]

If you don't care, then what's the problem?

As I've said, I'm a fan of fade-to-black.

 

Nudity isn't a deal-breaker for me.  But it's not my preference.