410 réponses à ce sujet

[In Exile]

So by adding an additional software (Denuvo) are you not accomplishing just that? More opportunities for performance issues?

Maybe? It's hard to say. A lot of things are negligible.

[Applepie_Svk]

I don't have a clear understanding of how DRM software can limit or reduce game performance or brick a graphics card (as I have seen a couple people mention). Can someone explain?

Gups are used also for encryption, code breaking, so if denuvo uses some sort of demanding processes that you can bet that gpu will be tested.

[danielkrs]

Some reviewers claim the game is running fine on Ultra without any new drivers.

On the contrary http://www.pcgamesha...k-Test-1142136/

I don't speak german all that well but the graph is pretty self explanatory I think.
 

[Warlock]

The dev took that 5% out of his nether parts. But let's assume it's true, let's put it in perspective. How are you gonna see that 5% hit in performance? FPS? Okay, so let's say you're running it at 60 FPS, 5% of that is 3FPS, so you'd be running it at 57FPS instead. How terrible. You'd run it at 30FPS without Denuvo? So now you're running it at 28.5FPS.

I'm not saying you shouldn't be pissed on a matter of principle, but it's hardly a matter to cancel your preorder or indeed skip the game altogether.

[bztLL]

On the contrary http://www.pcgamesha...k-Test-1142136/
 

 

Without Drivers Battlefield 4 had WORSE performance.

[Kantr]

There are going to be some performance issues on pre-release versions as AMD and Nvidia havent yet released driver optimisations for the game.

[Warlock]

Don't forget the anti tamper uses CPU cycles, and that the actual limiting factor for the performance of a game nowadays is the GPU (unless your CPU is more or less from the stone age). What this means is that the CPU usually has a lot of power to spare while the GPU is taxed to the limit, so any process that takes CPU power and not GPU power will not be felt by the user.

[jboy732]

Fifa 15 has Denuvo and it does perfectly fine and as a bonus it isn't cracked yet. I think since EA has experience with this drm and they successfully pulled it off with Fifa 15 there should be no problem. 

[Lebanese Dude]

Don't forget the anti tamper uses CPU cycles, and that the actual limiting factor for the performance of a game nowadays is the GPU (unless your CPU is more or less from the stone age). What this means is that the CPU usually has a lot of power to spare while the GPU is taxed to the limit, so any process that takes CPU power and not GPU power will not be felt by the user.

 

But I want to run 20 programs in the background while playing DAI. Denuvo is not letting me do that! Thank you EA.

 

/s

[danielkrs]

But I want to run 20 programs in the background while playing DAI. Denuvo is not letting me do that! Thank you EA.

 

/s

Let's instead run a completely unnecessary protection just because it affects the CPU and not the GPU. Great logic.

[Gileadan]

As long as that thing is confined to DA:I's own exe and does not mess with any other part of configuration of my PC in any way, I'm fine with it... in a sigh and shrug way. If it acts up, I'll find the refund button in Origin's great game guarantee really quickly though.

[PromisedPain]

Pirates be butthurt because they cannot get the game for free. Denuvo has nothing to do with the performance in-game, there are only badly optimized games i.e Lords of the Fallen (As I expected from CI Interactive) and Denuvo has nothing to do with it. Fifa 15 runs just fine.

[rubynorman]

Fifa 15 runs just fine, you guys are being paranoid about a not-yet-released game or just trying to find a reason to hate/complain about it.

[Sylvius the Mad]

What we need is a formal.definition of "DRM". That would end the debate immediately.

If DRM is a tool designed to prevent you from distributing the software illegally, then Origin is clearly the DRM here, and Denuvo only acts as DRM insofar it might necessary to edit the executable in order to skirt Origin.

If DRM is defined more broadly as a tool to restrict the ways in which a user can use the software, then Denuvo clearly is DRM. Any anti-cheat tool would be.

[Ashen Nedra]

To Almostfaceman:

 

Steam is fine NOW. I remember that the DRM, online thing, whatever means devs/publishers use to protect their games almost made me gave up gaming back in the days (Bioshock 2 I could'nt play it was so painful, Warhammer 40k was a pain...).  I would never play a Blizzard game now as I won't use an Apple product for the same reasons. You pay for a thing and you are still pestered with technical limitations. No.

 

Piracy is not theft either legally or morally. The legal definition of theft is the unlawful subtraction of  a material thing in pretty much every law system I've had to study or work with. Not the same thing.  Nobody loses a thing.  Companies may or may not depending on other factors such as PR, quality of products, loses revenue.  The perfect counter-example to this stance being CD Project but also all the "AAA-independent" crows (often former employees of big companies) Bioware included.

 

The music majors fighting piracy is a perfect example of the same struggle in the past.  They euh... lost.

 

It's a question of both principles and technical expertise intertwined. If you want to fight piracy aggressively, have the decency to not impact the legitimate, paying customers with lousy and/or intrusive systems.

 

Also don't you think that the current multi-platforming trend which objectively (I won't even argue the point it's so obvious) makes the games as a general rule less good, less diverse, more streamlined and sometimes dumb-downed, has nothing to do with the non-voiced stance of publishers to promote console gaming? PC gaming being less profitable and the gamers community seen as a bunch of criminals, either now or in the future.  It's called maximizing profit.

 

Such aggressive commercial practices in the games industries also impact the developers.  Less artistic freedom, PR and marketing having the upper hand on creative ones, crunch times sometimes irresponsible or health threatening.  Same in all industries.

[SilentCid]

What we need is a formal.definition of "DRM". That would end the debate immediately.

If DRM is a tool designed to prevent you from distributing the software illegally, then Origin is clearly the DRM here, and Denuvo only acts as DRM insofar it might necessary to edit the executable in order to skirt Origin.

If DRM is defined more broadly as a tool to restrict the ways in which a user can use the software, then Denuvo clearly is DRM. Any anti-cheat tool would be.

 

Digital rights management controls who have access rights to the game. Like how Steam and Origin have their games tied to a user's account. Denuvo is only to prevent reverse-engineering or debugging the game exe code. It doesn't tell you that you need to install a driver like SecuRom, have activation limits, or force you that you need to be always online. Putting a command variable in the Dragon Age: Inquisition shortcut's target line isn't part of the anti-tampering part of Denuvo.

[Dark_Ansem]

Regardless, I still think it's a terribly coward move to make a statement such as this the day of release. share all information beforehand, no?

[bztLL]

Regardless, I still think it's a terribly coward move to make a statement such as this the day of release. share all information beforehand, no?

 

Ohhhhh this game have DRM, such a surprise, unbelievable

 

Also Bioware/EA didn't announce about Denuvo, it's just in the preload EULA

[danielkrs]

Ohhhhh this game have DRM, such a surprise, unbelievable

 

Also Bioware/EA didn't announce about Denuvo, it's just in the preload EULA

Denuvo is not a DRM, remember? And claiming that not announcing is better somehow, seriously?
Does anyone here know how exactly this protection operates and if not how are you so certain that it does not affect performance? Because Fifa 15 "runs fine" ? Lol

[Warlock]

Let's instead run a completely unnecessary protection just because it affects the CPU and not the GPU. Great logic.

 

Never said it's great logic, but it is what it is, and hardly a matter to cancel preorders and skip the game over.

[Kantr]

To Almostfaceman:

 

Steam is fine NOW. I remember that the DRM, online thing, whatever means devs/publishers use to protect their games almost made me gave up gaming back in the days (Bioshock 2 I could'nt play it was so painful, Warhammer 40k was a pain...).  I would never play a Blizzard game now as I won't use an Apple product for the same reasons. You pay for a thing and you are still pestered with technical limitations. No.

 

Piracy is not theft either legally or morally. The legal definition of theft is the unlawful subtraction of  a material thing in pretty much every law system I've had to study or work with. Not the same thing.  Nobody loses a thing.  Companies may or may not depending on other factors such as PR, quality of products, loses revenue.  The perfect counter-example to this stance being CD Project but also all the "AAA-independent" crows (often former employees of big companies) Bioware included.

 

The music majors fighting piracy is a perfect example of the same struggle in the past.  They euh... lost.

 

It's a question of both principles and technical expertise intertwined. If you want to fight piracy aggressively, have the decency to not impact the legitimate, paying customers with lousy and/or intrusive systems.

 

Also don't you think that the current multi-platforming trend which objectively (I won't even argue the point it's so obvious) makes the games as a general rule less good, less diverse, more streamlined and sometimes dumb-downed, has nothing to do with the non-voiced stance of publishers to promote console gaming? PC gaming being less profitable and the gamers community seen as a bunch of criminals, either now or in the future.  It's called maximizing profit.

 

Such aggressive commercial practices in the games industries also impact the developers.  Less artistic freedom, PR and marketing having the upper hand on creative ones, crunch times sometimes irresponsible or health threatening.  Same in all industries.

Piracy is still theft. You are stealing from them.

 

GoG choose to make their gmes non-drm because that's their ethics (used to be the only way to play games in poland during the cold war was piracy). EA is a huge company that has reposibiltiies to their shareholders and the executives have decided to use something to stop the pirating of their game.

 

Origin is about the same as steam. However I'm sure that Origin will let you play games offline a lot longer than steam does (2 months is all it takes for steam to not let you login while offline)

[riverbanks]

Does anyone here know how exactly this protection operates and if not how are you so certain that it does not affect performance? Because Fifa 15 "runs fine" ? Lol

 

We don't know how much it actually affects performance, but we do know that FIFA 15 runs perfectly well with Denuvo, while most of Lords of the Fallen's issues stem from it being a poorly optimized game that runs like crap in every platform. Performance issues that can be traced to graphics settings, stability issues that can be traced to memory leaks, none of that is cause by Denuvo. People just latched onto this excuse so they didn't have to admit the game they paid for had glaring development issues.

 

It's not a bad thing to be skeptical and want to check out how DAI runs, but Lords of the Fallen should not be used as a measure of how Denuvo affects performance or not, because that game was never going to run well in the first place, DRM or not.

[dlux]

Lol, and the 360 and PS3 versions have already been pirated.

Because the copy protection of the old consoles was hacked a long time ago.
 
PS4/Xbox One/PC + Denuvo won't be hacked for a very long time.
 

 

Some reviewers claim the game is running fine on Ultra without any new drivers.

On the contrary http://www.pcgamesha...k-Test-1142136/

I don't speak german all that well but the graph is pretty self explanatory I think.

 

The game runs perfectly fine in 1080p (or 1440p) + Ultra Details + 4x MSAA + High Quality AF. These are the absolute best graphics settings for either resolution. You need a powerful graphics card to run a game with these settings, which isn't different from any other game.
 
BioWare even released a new patch that improves performance for Mantle and DirectX. So those benchmarks are not even up-to-date anymore.
 
BTW, the testers didn't even notice that Denuvo or anything similar was even there.

 

Don't forget the anti tamper uses CPU cycles, and that the actual limiting factor for the performance of a game nowadays is the GPU (unless your CPU is more or less from the stone age). What this means is that the CPU usually has a lot of power to spare while the GPU is taxed to the limit, so any process that takes CPU power and not GPU power will not be felt by the user.

It might use CPU cycles, but it doesn't necessarily mean that the it will harm performance. Running the game in GPU limit (which you of course will) actually frees up CPU cycles, not to mention that a modern game engine like Frostbite 3 is multi-threaded. AMD's Mantle render also relieves the CPU of work, because substantially less draw calls have to be processed by the CPU.
 
If you are using a modern CPU the performance impact of Denuvo is practically negligable and possibly only even measurable. If you are still worried that Denuvo might hurt performance by hogging CPU cycles, then use an AMD graphics card and the Mantle renderer. With Mantle you can even underclock the CPU (= less CPU cycles are available) and the game will still run perfectly fine without any performance hit.

[RealityMachina]

On the contrary http://www.pcgamesha...k-Test-1142136/

I don't speak german all that well but the graph is pretty self explanatory I think.
 

It's a graph of how the game performs on maximum settings at 1080p.

 

With 4xMSAA (MSAA to my understanding is not something Frostbite handles well compared to say, SMAA, and doesn't help with some types of aliasing to boot) on as well.

 

And with unoptimized drivers.

 

I don't think it says what you think it says.

[llandwynwyn]

The dev took that 5% out of his nether parts. But let's assume it's true, let's put it in perspective. How are you gonna see that 5% hit in performance? FPS? Okay, so let's say you're running it at 60 FPS, 5% of that is 3FPS, so you'd be running it at 57FPS instead. How terrible. You'd run it at 30FPS without Denuvo? So now you're running it at 28.5FPS.
I'm not saying you shouldn't be pissed on a matter of principle, but it's hardly a matter to cancel your preorder or indeed skip the game altogether.

Are you kidding? For people on mid/low drops on fps are annoying.