410 réponses à ce sujet

[Warlock]

HAHAHAHAHAHA! That's what Securom said. That's what Witcher 2's DRM said before good guy CDProjekt stripped it out (I forget the name). 

 

The truth is that the "anti-tamper" works by encrypting, which means it causes extra CPU cycles every time you access any part of the game. They aren't fooling anyone. 

 

No. The encryption is done on the origin client drm, not on the game per se. And while I can't be sure and don't have empirical evidence on this, I believe (and folks over at a certain russian cracking forums seem to agree) that the amount of CPU power this takes is orders of magnitude less than anything taken up by the game, so the difference is indistinguishable.

 

Now, we should still worry about this DRM as, as has been stated, mods are probably never gonna show up now. Unless this is cracked and people use mods with a cracked version of the game (legal or not). But please don't start again with the rootkit conspiracy... it could be there, but most likely isn't, and we'll know this when crackers are done with Fifa 15.

[Kourd]

@Derek

 

Thanks for posting this.

 

I'll choose not to fReAK OUt unless something blatant gets reported after launch.

 

[Travie]

To be clear, Denuvo is not DRM in the sense the DRM stands for Digital Rights Management (or Dogs Reading Magazines, or whatever you prefer). There is nothing in the Denuvo stuff that has to do with accounts or release date checking, or ownership or anything like that. It is not SecuROM. It is not Steamworks. It is not Safedisc, or any of the other DRM solutions that have been in the past. Origin is the DRM for Dragon Age: Inquisition in the exact same manner and settings as it was in Mass Effect 3. Nothing has changed here.

 

Denuvo is anti-tamper on the executable. This has nothing to do with mods or attempts to change textures or anything like that. Trying to hack the executable to cheat in multiplayer? This is what we are talking about.

 

Well, that's a relief about mods anyway. I'll believe the rest when the game comes out and we see more performance tests. 

[Bronson]

How many will avoid a game that has a draconian drm? How many will ask for a refund due to a draconian drm?

 

Very few, if any. Very few, if any.

[Warlock]

Now that I think about it, I seem to remember reading a comment by a reviewer over at the Neogaf thread about the game being a bit CPU intensive. I'll see if I can find the comment, and in any case it could be due to just the game being cpu intensive and not the protection, but... there.

[Derek French]

If someone's mod is going to be based on modifying the executable, then yeah, that won't work. If the mod is based on game data, then that has nothing to do with the anti-tamper system.

 

The mod challenge will be making data that works with the Frostbite engine for DAI.

[Derek French]

Now that I think about it, I seem to remember reading a comment by a reviewer over at the Neogaf thread about the game being a bit CPU intensive. I'll see if I can find the comment, and in any case it could be due to just the game being cpu intensive and not the protection, but... there.

Yeah, the only way you could scientifically show that any CPU usage was due to anti-tamper would be to benchmark with and without. Just looking at a CPU graph, you can't just point and say "There! That wasn't supposed to be there!"

 

Most of us have been running the same executable as our customers for a while now.

[Zippy72]

Ah - Self-modifying code maybe? If you have a quad core or multi-threaded CPU there will likely be enough spare cycles anyway.

[slimgrin]

To be clear, Denuvo is not DRM in the sense the DRM stands for Digital Rights Management (or Dogs Reading Magazines, or whatever you prefer). There is nothing in the Denuvo stuff that has to do with accounts or release date checking, or ownership or anything like that. It is not SecuROM. It is not Steamworks. It is not Safedisc, or any of the other DRM solutions that have been in the past. Origin is the DRM for Dragon Age: Inquisition in the exact same manner and settings as it was in Mass Effect 3. Nothing has changed here.

 

Denuvo is anti-tamper on the executable. This has nothing to do with mods or attempts to change textures or anything like that. Trying to hack the executable to cheat in multiplayer? This is what we are talking about.

 

My history has been the fewer layers of DRM the better. You may say it's just for the MP, but it's also another software component that can go awry for legitimate users. And let me guess, still a mandatory download?

[Kantr]

Less a mandatory download and more "Packaged with the game files"

[dlux]

I'm cool with Denuvo.... because I bought the game.

 

 

It is uncrackable at the moment, so I can understand why they are using it for DA:I.

[Ryzaki]

 

This is what their site says.

 

 

What is the Denuvo Anti-Tamper solution?

Denuvo Anti-Tamper technology prevents the debugging, reverse engineering and changing of executable files to strengthen the security of games. It is not a DRM solution, but rather, Denuvo Anti-tamper protects DRM solutions, such as Origin Online Access or the Steam license management system, from being circumvented.

How does it work?

The license management from Steam or Origin grants legitimate consumers access to the game and our Anti-Tamper solution ensures that these DRM systems are not bypassed.

Do you have any negative impact on the game or customer experience?

No, since only performance uncritical game functions are used in the Anti-Tamper process, Anti-Tamper has no perceptible effect on game performance nor is Anti-Tamper to blame for any game crashes of genuine executables.

What is the difference between DRM and Anti-Tamper?

A Digital Rights Management (DRM) system binds the game to a legitimate user account and allows the game to be played whenever and wherever the consumer wants to download and execute the game.
Anti-Tamper stops the reverse engineering and debugging of the DRM solution, but has no effect or limitation on the legitimate consumer. Anti-Tamper is completely transparent to legitimate game buyers and does not in any way impose activation limits, install drivers, or require a gamer to be "always on."

 

 

Okay I can live with this if the bolded is true.

 

And it better not **** with my daemon tools.
 

[Mightylink]

With the way of DRM at times slowing down game play and lowering enjoyment on the PC, I have started to move away from the pc to consoles. Got a PS4 as it gets closer to what I would experience on my PC.

Me too, diablo 3 on pc was bullcrap but it was so much better when I got it for consoles, works offline and everything. I used to like pc better, before the days of d3 and simcity... now I try to get every game I can on my consoles.

[Ryzaki]

To be clear, Denuvo is not DRM in the sense the DRM stands for Digital Rights Management (or Dogs Reading Magazines, or whatever you prefer). There is nothing in the Denuvo stuff that has to do with accounts or release date checking, or ownership or anything like that. It is not SecuROM. It is not Steamworks. It is not Safedisc, or any of the other DRM solutions that have been in the past. Origin is the DRM for Dragon Age: Inquisition in the exact same manner and settings as it was in Mass Effect 3. Nothing has changed here.

 

Denuvo is anti-tamper on the executable. This has nothing to do with mods or attempts to change textures or anything like that. Trying to hack the executable to cheat in multiplayer? This is what we are talking about.

 

Wait...

 

Does this mean we can't hack the single player either?

 

I do my speedruns with godmode

[Kantr]

Wait...

 

Does this mean we can't hack the single player either?

 

I do my speedruns with godmode

Godmode is console though, which is built into the game software.

 

Why would you use Daemon tools with the game?

[Ryzaki]

Godmode is console though, which is built into the game software.

 

Why would you use Daemon tools with the game?

 

Oh.

 

Edit: I'm talking about cheatengine version of god mode. Where they give you extra ability points as well.

 

Not with this game obviously I heard of securom screwing with people's copies of daemon tools. Edit: If you must know however I use a PS2 emulator on my PC. I use DT to make my isos.

[slimgrin]

 

It is uncrackable at the moment, so I can understand why they are using it for DA:I.

 

To appease investors?

[Derek French]

My history has been the fewer layers of DRM the better. You may say it's just for the MP, but it's also another software component that can go awry for legitimate users. And let me guess, still a mandatory download?

Well, since it isn't DRM, there is just Origin, just like on Mass Effect 3. I didn't say it was specifically for MP, I just gave hacking the executable for MP as an example. Yes, our game executable is a mandatory download.

[Derek French]

Okay I can live with this if the bolded is true.

The bolded is true.

[TKavatar]

It would have been great if SP and MP ran on separate exes, that way we could do whatever we wanted with the SP and left the MP alone.

 

And I guess modding abilities and combat related stuff is out of the question if those are used in MP. So much for MP not affecting the SP.

[Reznore57]

If someone's mod is going to be based on modifying the executable, then yeah, that won't work. If the mod is based on game data, then that has nothing to do with the anti-tamper system.

 

The mod challenge will be making data that works with the Frostbite engine for DAI.

 

I think in DA2 I had to modify the .exe file to have console command.

Is this going to be the same in DAI so no console command available , I ask because it wasn't really useful in DA2 but it's something I used a lot in Skyrim to resolve bugged quests.

 

I know the devs team are doing the best they can to resolve /avoid bug and glitch , but it's a really useful and easy to use tool to solve problems .

[Devtek]

I'm cool with Denuvo.... because I bought the game.

 

 

It is uncrackable at the moment, so I can understand why they are using it for DA:I.

Nothing stays "uncrackable" forever. They only want the "cushion" of the first month or two without a pirated release in order to get more sales (which is fine by me) but stopping legitimate customers from messing with the files of the game they just bought, that I'm not cool with. (I'm talking about SP not MP obviously)

[TKavatar]

I think in DA2 I had to modify the .exe file to have console command.

Is this going to be the same in DAI so no console command available , I ask because it wasn't really useful in DA2 but it's something I used a lot in Skyrim to resolve bugged quests.

 

I know the devs team are doing the best they can to resolve /avoid bug and glitch , but it's a really useful and easy to use tool to solve problems .

 

In BF4 I could open the console command without having to modify the exe. And even in DAO/DA2 I just had to modify the launcher config file to activate the console.

[Conduit0]

To be clear, Denuvo is not DRM in the sense the DRM stands for Digital Rights Management (or Dogs Reading Magazines, or whatever you prefer). There is nothing in the Denuvo stuff that has to do with accounts or release date checking, or ownership or anything like that. It is not SecuROM. It is not Steamworks. It is not Safedisc, or any of the other DRM solutions that have been in the past. Origin is the DRM for Dragon Age: Inquisition in the exact same manner and settings as it was in Mass Effect 3. Nothing has changed here.
 
Denuvo is anti-tamper on the executable. This has nothing to do with mods or attempts to change textures or anything like that. Trying to hack the executable to cheat in multiplayer? This is what we are talking about.

It doesn't matter if its not DRM in the traditional sense, what matters is the fact that its made by Sony DADC, a company with a proven history of creating anti-piracy software that harms legitimate consumers.

[Jaron Oberyn]

My main concern is whether or not this does in fact inhibit performance? People claim this was the case with LOtF. Was it? Or were they just shifting the blame from the developers onto the DRM?