28 réponses à ce sujet

[grumpymooselion]

When I first read the name Rift Mage, I figured it would be linked to the rifts that are opening up. I figured it would be a way for a Mage character to explore the power of the weird green energy coming from their hand. I figured the Rift spells would visually mirror the effects of the Rifts and be a specialization about using the fade, the rifts and your hand's power to more effect than a Rogue or Warrior character could, due to their lack of magical understanding.

 

That's just what the name brought to mind.

 

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What the specialization actually seems to be is an assortment of common spells from the prior games. Stone Fist? Any Mage in DA:O or DA2 could have had this. And it does spirit damage now. Because. The Firestormr spell? Just the DA2 spell, easily accessible fire spell that every Mage in DA2 had ready access to. Only now it requires focus instead of mana. Because.

 

Pull of the Abyss is a Force Mage ability from DA2, which just makes me wish the Rift Mage spec was a Force Mage spec instead, and Viel Strike sounds like a renamed Fist of the Maker (also Force Mage).

 

 

So I'm torn. On one hand some of the abilities make me wish this was a full on Force Mage spec. On the other hand, I just feel like this spec is a jumble of abilities from DA:O and DA2 (Stone Fist and Firestorm) that should have been in the base, non-spec, trees, available to every mage.

 

Most of all, if it's going to be a Rift Mage spec, it really seems like it should have been something unique and interesting, and, you know, related to the Viel Tears that are opening up all over the place, because that's what the name Rift Mage brought to my mind in the first place.

 

There doesn't even seem to be a visual link between the abilities. One ability is raining fire from the sky, another throwing a fist shaped rock at an enemy and pull of the abyss barely had a visual at all in DA2. There doesn't seem to be a theme here, there's nothing bringing it all together, it feels random.

 

I'm not really disappointed or complaining, some Force Mage abilities are better than none I guess, but this specialization confuses me. Like or dislike Knight-Enchanter and Necromancer, I know WHY they exist, but Rift Mage? I can't figure out why it exists. I see nothing special or unique about it. It could be any common school of magic from the abilities we see in it. I don't know what this could possibly bring to the story like Necromancer or Knight Enchanter could. It doesn't seem like a cohesive whole like those two specs where every ability seems to tie in with the others to some extent.

 

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I suppose that's why I'll still be taking Rift Mage, because it is an unknown, because I want to know what they thought was unique enough about this jumble of random (mostly unrelated) abilities that it needed to be a spec and have any mention in the story. I'm curious, but not because I'm eager or excited, but because, as the title of the thread says, "Rift Mage Confuses me."

[andar91]

Several of the specializations are rather messy. Don't think too hard about it. There was obviously a lot of switching around throughout development since we've seen abilities move trees quite a bit. Hopefully they'll be more coherent in the next game.

[grumpymooselion]

Several of the specializations are rather messy. Don't think too hard about it. There was obviously a lot of switching around throughout development since we've seen abilities move trees quite a bit. Hopefully they'll be more coherent in the next game.

 

I guess, but with two games under their belt we know they know how to make spell trees with a consistent theme. We've seen them put spells together in branches with other like spells. They didn't toss the Stonefist spell in DA2 into the healing spec or the force mage spec. Seems a bit weird, like they weren't sure what to do. Weird because we know they've known what to do for two entire games prior.

[Neuromancer]

rift mage is basically Jedi

[Emer Dareloth]

I agree with your assessment grumpy moose lion

It does seem like they weren't quite sure what to do with these spells.  I believe we saw early game footage of companions performing some of these spells despite them being a different specialization (like Vivienne casting Firestorm).  It is a bit of a disappointment, but despite being a hodgepodge of spells, they have some pretty powerful spells so I guess it's not a complete fail.

[andar91]

I guess, but with two games under their belt we know they know how to make spell trees with a consistent theme. We've seen them put spells together in branches with other like spells. They didn't toss the Stonefist spell in DA2 into the healing spec or the force mage spec. Seems a bit weird, like they weren't sure what to do. Weird because we know they've known what to do for two entire games prior.

 

I agree, it is disappointing and offputting. 

 

Luckily, I think the abilities we have will be a lot of fun. But I expect better out of the next game.

[Gill Kaiser]

It makes much more sense for Haste to be the Knight Enchanter's focus spell, and Resurgence to be the Necromancer's. Yet they're switched.

 

I think they didn't know what to do with some of the spec ability trees. For balance purposes, perhaps.

[grumpymooselion]

I agree, it is disappointing and offputting. 

 

Luckily, I think the abilities we have will be a lot of fun. But I expect better out of the next game.

 

Don't get me wrong. Raining down meteors on the heads of my enemies is going to be fun. Lots of fun. The spell is great. The spell is fine. I'm going to use the heck out of that spell. That's not my issue. I just have no idea why the spell is where it is. Stone First too, I used that spell all the time in DA:O (knockdown is always useful) and in DA2. I love the spell. I'll use the spell. I just don't know why it is where it is.

 

 

It makes much more sense for Haste to be the Knight Enchanter's focus spell, and Resurgence to be the Necromancer's. Yet they're switched.

 

I think they didn't know what to do with some of the spec ability trees. For balance purposes, perhaps.

 

I can see that one too.

 

 

rift mage is basically Jedi

 

Well, if it had all been Force Mage style spells . . . I'd agree. Stone First and Firestorm put me off that idea being what I get from it. I certainly wouldn't have minded a Mage Jedi spec though.

 

 

I agree with your assessment grumpy moose lion

It does seem like they weren't quite sure what to do with these spells.  I believe we saw early game footage of companions performing some of these spells despite them being a different specialization (like Vivienne casting Firestorm).  It is a bit of a disappointment, but despite being a hodgepodge of spells, they have some pretty powerful spells so I guess it's not a complete fail.

 

No, not a fail at all, in terms of the spells themselves. They're certainly useful spells. I think the flaw, mistep or failure, whatever one wants to call it,  is in managing to maintain and present a central theme or idea where the specialization is concerned. It's not the end of the world, just weird . . . and confusing.

[lastpawn]

OP, if you look at the themes for specs, there are two specializations for each class that make the class play somewhat differently, and a third specialization that is just a straightforward extension of the original class.

 

Rift Mage is just a straightforward extension of the original mage class. It doesn't make you play up close like KE, and it doesn't make you rely on DOTs like the Necro. It's just your everyday mage plus. 

 

Possibly these third specializations were not as fully thought out as the other ones.

[Jazzpha]

OP, if you look at the themes for specs, there are two specializations for each class that make the class play somewhat differently, and a third specialization that is just a straightforward extension of the original class.

 

 

Hadn't really thought about it that way, but you're right. Kudos for the observation!

[grumpymooselion]

OP, if you look at the themes for specs, there are two specializations for each class that make the class play somewhat differently, and a third specialization that is just a straightforward extension of the original class.

 

Rift Mage is just a straightforward extension of the original mage class. It doesn't make you play up close like KE, and it doesn't make you rely on DOTs like the Necro. It's just your everyday mage plus. 

 

Possibly these third specializations were not as fully thought out as the other ones.

 

Well that underlined bit is certainly what it feels like, especially when abilities like Stonefist were common in DAO and DA2, and even Firestorm was easily accessible to any Mage without a specialization in DA2. Like I said though, the abilities aren't bad. They're good, they're functional and I'll certainly use them. There's just no theme or cohesive portion to Rift Mage that brings it all together.

 

Playing as your everyday mage, plus a few extra abilities that an everyday mage in DA2 got without a specialization, doesn't really work when Specializations have for DA:O and DA2 been something specific, with a particular theme, and, to be honest, that's what specializations have been presented as here, only with more impact because the story will supposedly recognize it somehow . . . yet how to you recognize 'an everyday mage with a couple extra abilities we commonly see mages have such as Stonefist' as being something special or notable in the story?

 

Even with your explanation, it still comes off as confusing and more than a little random.

[themageguy]

It made sense to me when reading the description of the specialisation.

Pulling matter from the fade / stonefist and firestorm

Using the veil itself to attack enemies / veilstrike and pull of the abyss (which visually appears to conjure a small Rift!).

After that, it makes sense to me. And its powerful. Seems to compliment Inferno skills too.

[grumpymooselion]

It made sense to me when reading the description of the specialisation.

Pulling matter from the fade / stonefist and firestorm

 
Honestly if you take that as a theme, then nearly every mage spell in existence would be in the Rift Mage specialization. If anything making that note highlights the issue of Stonefist and Firestorm being common mage spells that should be in the base elemental trees every Mage has access to.
 

Using the veil itself to attack enemies / veilstrike and pull of the abyss (which visually appears to conjure a small Rift!).

I can't really agree, they just seem like the Force Mage spells from DA2, and make one wonder why the third tree wasn't just a Force Mage tree with more Force type spells to compliment them, with the Stonefirst and Firestorm spells being moved to the common elemental trees where they actually seem to fit. Don't get me wrong. I like the spells. I love the Force Mage spec, and seeing these spells again is great, I'll happily use them, but thematically the jumble of random spells in this specialization don't seem to belong together.
 

After that, it makes sense to me. And its powerful. Seems to compliment Inferno skills too.

 
It doesn't seem like a compliment to the Inferno spells, it seems to outright be an Inferno spell, and just makes me wonder why it isn't an Inferno spell.

 

Rift Mage: "They do lots of Random things."

 

Which is fine, I like things, and I have to stress again that the spells themselves are great, and certainly worth using, they just don't seem to fit together.

[Morroian]

It makes much more sense for Haste to be the Knight Enchanter's focus spell, and Resurgence to be the Necromancer's. Yet they're switched.

 

I think they didn't know what to do with some of the spec ability trees. For balance purposes, perhaps.

 

Or they just didn't put the time into this aspect that they should have, especially considering that its far more of a core aspect of the game than other parts they put a lot of work into.

 

I really don't see why they didn't just iterate off of what worked in the previous games rather than this makeover, especially considering that from the reviews combat hasn't improved much if at all.

[lastpawn]

Even with your explanation, it still comes off as confusing and more than a little random.

 

I don't disagree with that. I think it's just a case of choosing gameplay over lore.

 

It's also possible that these were the last specializations that were worked on, since they simply enhance the original class gameplay without significantly altering it.

 

I admit, I don't understand why a Stone Fist comes out of the Veil. I thought it was just... like... a rock, you know. I also lament that a Rift/Force mage doesn't have the Mass Effect Singularity spell. Love that thing.

[J-Reyno]

My expectations were right alongside yours, OP.  What you thought of the specialization is exactly what I thought and I just knew that I would run Rift Mage, whatever it actually turned out to be.  And I was wrong.  I lack any interest in the tree after learning about it.

 

Stonefist and Firestorm are "pulling matter from the fade" but it's like... there's no actual difference than just giving us the normal Stonefist and your run-of-the-mill meteor shower spell.  Not to mention that Stonefist does Spirit damage while Firestorm does normal Fire damage?? At the very least you'd think Firestorm might be some cool-looking green fire to really drive the concept home but... that's not likely to be the case.

 

Weakness being a mainstay of the spec is boring.  And while I have no doubt that Rift Mage can make for a competent build, it's not appealing to me at all.  

 

All we can hope is that BW does better in the future.  Not stressing over it as I've already been fully converted to Knight-Enchanter.  That spec completely flipped my expectations from "sounds neat or whatever" to "WOW that is cool!"

[Br3admax]

Your problem, OP, is that you think the way the game sets up skill trees was some kind of set in stone lore before now. It wasn't. Nothing canonically said Hawke or the Warden could actually do anything besides be a mage. Nothing says the average mage can do more than shoot fireballs one at a time. This is really a non-issue. 

[purple_zebralemon]

Maybe.. Rift mages use the rift to be, like a "jack of all trades"?? Eh I dunno. Lol

*Edited for spelling.*

[Adrianna]

Well we know pull of the abyss (in looks) appears to open a rift to pull enemies towards it.. so at least it looks fade related...

[DEANER555]

knight enchanter for me.mostly because of the combat that looks like a mix of warrior and rogue but only faster and better and in a spirit form!!(with high damage)

[Fredward]

I dunno, I kinda like it. It's not as rigidly defined as the others, it reflects the mutability of the Fade. It can be a lot of things. It's like the quintessence of magic. Definitely the spec I'll be choosing. Well probably. KE looks fun too.

[Bhaal]

Well for a pure mage it's THE Spec to go for, especially with the lightning skills. Though because of that name i was expecting something unique too.

 

To be honest only decent and unique mage spec is KE which looks and feels badass

[themageguy]

Honestly if you take that as a theme, then nearly every mage spell in existence would be in the Rift Mage specialization. If anything making that note highlights the issue of Stonefist and Firestorm being common mage spells that should be in the base elemental trees every Mage has access to.


I can't really agree, they just seem like the Force Mage spells from DA2, and make one wonder why the third tree wasn't just a Force Mage tree with more Force type spells to compliment them, with the Stonefirst and Firestorm spells being moved to the common elemental trees where they actually seem to fit. Don't get me wrong. I like the spells. I love the Force Mage spec, and seeing these spells again is great, I'll happily use them, but thematically the jumble of random spells in this specialization don't seem to belong together.


It doesn't seem like a compliment to the Inferno spells, it seems to outright be an Inferno spell, and just makes me wonder why it isn't an Inferno spell.

Rift Mage: "They do lots of Random things."

Which is fine, I like things, and I have to stress again that the spells themselves are great, and certainly worth using, they just don't seem to fit together.

Pyromancer may very well buff firestorms damage.
Pull of the abyss plus immolate looks a very fun combo.
Veilstrike and fire mine/glyph.

That's what i meant about complimenting each other.

I can understand that some people are annoyed that stonefist isn't a primal spell, firestorm isn't an elemental spell, etc but for me personally, it doesn't really bother me too much.
Pull of the abyss from the rift mage school looks much more visually appealing than rift mages version.

All this being said however, im alot more interested in the knight enchanter and necromancer specs. Especially the latter. I can finally create a mage who actively commands spirits and that's very satisfying for me. Plus walking bomb

[themageguy]

I don't disagree with that. I think it's just a case of choosing gameplay over lore.

It's also possible that these were the last specializations that were worked on, since they simply enhance the original class gameplay without significantly altering it.

I admit, I don't understand why a Stone Fist comes out of the Veil. I thought it was just... like... a rock, you know. I also lament that a Rift/Force mage doesn't have the Mass Effect Singularity spell. Love that thing.

Well Pull of the Abyss is SORTA like a singularity functions similarly enough.

Damn i cant wait til the next mass effect game

[Doctoglethorpe]

rift mage is basically Jedi

 

?_?

 

That's KE.