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Canonized ME3 ending choice versus "Ark Theory" versus anything else: The ongoing debate continues ITT!


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#76
Kabooooom

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I made a map some time ago, based on the cutscene, that shows what parts of the Milky Way are left unaffected. That map also doesn't consider that the galaxy is not 2D, so there is a lot of space left. Here it is


This map presumes that every single relay in the network is shown in-game. Not even close. That region of empty space is no doubt filled with relays. The entire galaxy would be affected, except perhaps in a few secluded regions behind dormant relays.
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#77
Mcfly616

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The crucible energy hits the whole galaxy. Let it go...



#78
chris2365

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This map presumes that every single relay in the network is shown in-game. Not even close. That region of empty space is no doubt filled with relays. The entire galaxy would be affected, except perhaps in a few secluded regions behind dormant relays.

 

True, but judging by the way the beams are spreading, it seems to affect only the primary relays, which are the ones shown in the map. These primary relays are the ones traversing great distances. Yes, there are many more relays than what is indicated, but according to what we see, these smaller, short distance relays aren't affected. That's why his map makes sense.

 

Not to mention the fact that, according to Liara, there is a lot more unexplored space than simply a few systems behind dormant relays. If I remember right, she says we've explored or charted only the a few major regions of space, and there are big portions of the milky way that remain unexplored.



#79
Mcfly616

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And yet, the Crucible doesn't discriminate based on regions of space we have or haven't explored.


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#80
Han Shot First

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I'd be most interested in a post-Destroy sequel. I also think Destroy is Bioware's best option if it were to create a sequel, as the Reapers are out of the way for new villains and unlike Synthesis it was never implied that it results in a utopia.

 

I do think the Ark ship rumors are interesting though.

 

I have no interest in prequels or Reaper War sidequels.


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#81
Mcfly616

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It'd be interesting to see the rise of our new synthetic enemy. 



#82
Probe Away

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When you think about it, there are really only 3 choices Bioware would need to address in a post-ME3 Milky Way (assuming no Shep and co):

-   RGB

-   Quarians vs Geth

-   Genophage

These are all big choices in the context of the trilogy and establishing a starting point for ME4, but in terms of what subsequently happens in ME4?  Not so much.

 

I honestly feel that if they just picked canon decisions for these and then established those decisions early in the new game, this would actually be the least contrived way to have a fresh start.  Once the consequences were established, the player would be free to play a brand new story set, say, 100-200 years later in the MEU.  No hiding from known parts of the galaxy, no ark theory, no handwaving the endings into the same outcome.

 

A possible fourth choice to address is the Rachni, although that could really be ignored because ME3 already established that some Rachni survived regardless of Shep's choice in ME1.  And it's not like they need to play any role in ME4.



#83
Heimdall

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I honestly feel that if they just picked canon decisions for these and then established those decisions early in the new game, this would actually be the least contrived way to have a fresh start.  Once the consequences were established, the player would be free to play a brand new story set, say, 100-200 years later in the MEU.  No hiding from known parts of the galaxy, no ark theory, no handwaving the endings into the same outcome.

Least contrived way, yes, but it also means starting off the new game telling players that their previous choices will be ignored and overwritten.  Its a tradeoff.



#84
Drone223

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Least contrived way, yes, but it also means starting off the new game telling players that their previous choices will be ignored and overwritten.  Its a tradeoff.

The only choices that would be overwritten are the ending and Udina being councilor the rest won't be relevant to the next game.



#85
B.Shep

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Least contrived way, yes, but it also means starting off the new game telling players that their previous choices will be ignored and overwritten.  Its a tradeoff.

It's necessary to move forward, the 3 choices change the galaxy too much to be left open. Just like they did with Revan and Jedi Exile to advance SW:TOR story...

 

Unless of course the game doesn't take place in the future... :unsure: :wacko:



#86
fyz306903

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A direct sequel would be great, but basically everything Bioware has said about ME4 implies that it's not a sequel. They've always talked about ME4 being a 'fresh start', and I think that means that, so as to not annoy loads of ME fans, they're just going to set the story in a way that none of the choices in the original trilogy are relevant. 


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#87
Vazgen

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This map presumes that every single relay in the network is shown in-game. Not even close. That region of empty space is no doubt filled with relays. The entire galaxy would be affected, except perhaps in a few secluded regions behind dormant relays.

That's exactly what allows them to create a separate area without having to deal with the trilogy events in any major way. Say that there were a lot of relays but they were only connected through one key relay that was inactive/damaged during the Reaper war. All the area from the trilogy will be locked away, all the races will stay and there is a lot of potential for exploration. This fits with the idea of a "new region of space" and new Citadel-like hub teased on N7 day as well as tweets about Citadel not being included at the moment (most likely we won't get to visit the Citadel in ME:Next).

#88
fyz306903

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That's exactly what allows them to create a separate area without having to deal with the trilogy events in any major way. Say that there were a lot of relays but they were only connected through one key relay that was inactive/damaged during the Reaper war. All the area from the trilogy will be locked away, all the races will stay and there is a lot of potential for exploration. This fits with the idea of a "new region of space" and new Citadel-like hub teased on N7 day as well as tweets about Citadel not being included at the moment (most likely we won't get to visit the Citadel in ME:Next).

But wouldn't that create a plot hole? If the reapers both created the Mass relays and want to wipe out all space-faring organics, wouldn't they either: fix the inactive mass relays to check that there wren't any organics 'hiding on the other side'  follow any organics in an 'ark' through the mass relay or just attack the whole glaxy through FTL travel?

basically, what I'm saying is if the species in the ark colonised a 'new home' in an uncharted part of the Milky Way galaxy, how would they protect themselves from: a. the reapers and b. the results of the crucible in ME3? Don't get me wrong, I'd prefer ME4 to be set in the Milky Way galaxy, but how would they solve the reaper/crucible problem? 



#89
T-Raks

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The only choices that would be overwritten are the ending and Udina being councilor the rest won't be relevant to the next game.

 

Agreed with the bold part. Udina is dead, so he is out of the equation for the starting point. Control and destroy are the same for the survivors, so there is only one choice Bioware's writers had to make going forward:

 

Whether they think that the same next conflict can also arise after the synthesis ending or whether that is the one of the three RGB choices that immediately leads to a parallel universe path.



#90
von uber

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The problem with synthesis is that there will be reapers, husks, banshees, brutes, scions etc everywhere.

Synthesis is a no go for a sequel.

#91
dreamgazer

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The problem with synthesis is that there will be reapers, husks, banshees, brutes, scions etc everywhere.

Synthesis is a no go for a sequel.


Unless the Reapers simply deactivated their minions after the war. They can't be seen anywhere in the slides, after all.

#92
T-Raks

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The problem with synthesis is that there will be reapers, husks, banshees, brutes, scions etc everywhere.

Synthesis is a no go for a sequel.

Yeah, why should there be any reaper forces when they have fulfilled their mission?



#93
Iakus

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Yeah, why should there be any reaper forces when they have fulfilled their mission?

Why were there geth after they stopped serving the quarians?



#94
T-Raks

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Why were there geth after they stopped serving the quarians?

Not comparable at all.



#95
von uber

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Yeah, why should there be any reaper forces when they have fulfilled their mission?


Synthesis makes them self aware. They are no longer minions. This is clearly shown in the ending with the husks.
Whether you like it or not synthesis means there are reaper troops about as individuals.

That'll be a fun MEN.

#96
Heimdall

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It's necessary to move forward, the 3 choices change the galaxy too much to be left open. Just like they did with Revan and Jedi Exile to advance SW:TOR story...
 
Unless of course the game doesn't take place in the future... :unsure: :wacko:

The three choices didn't leave the fate of the Galaxy open, they were quite clear about what they meant in the long term in the EC. All the closure is already there.

Is there anyone that actually likes what they did with Revan and the Exile?
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#97
Heimdall

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The only choices that would be overwritten are the ending and Udina being councilor the rest won't be relevant to the next game.

The endings, and the Genophage, and the fate of the Quarians and Geth.

Udina was merely an example of a choice that was hand waved and made a lot of people angry.
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#98
Vazgen

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But wouldn't that create a plot hole? If the reapers both created the Mass relays and want to wipe out all space-faring organics, wouldn't they either: fix the inactive mass relays to check that there wren't any organics 'hiding on the other side'  follow any organics in an 'ark' through the mass relay or just attack the whole glaxy through FTL travel?

basically, what I'm saying is if the species in the ark colonised a 'new home' in an uncharted part of the Milky Way galaxy, how would they protect themselves from: a. the reapers and b. the results of the crucible in ME3? Don't get me wrong, I'd prefer ME4 to be set in the Milky Way galaxy, but how would they solve the reaper/crucible problem? 

Why would it? The Reapers just finish the harvest in one place and then move to another part of the galaxy via their 'conventional' FTL drives. Surely that's not that far-fetched to not to work :) 

Even Refuse can be counted in that way, if we find some immensely powerful weapon making us able to fight the Reapers conventionally and destroy them when they finally arrive



#99
Iakus

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Not comparable at all.

Totaly comparable.  they knew what their purpose was.  Now they find a new purpose.



#100
Paridave

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So you think they're going to go Invisible War, and blend all the outcomes into a single mishmash?

Yep.  Think about all of the possibilities that would open up.  Think about all of the prejudices which would suddenly come in to play.  What would the Synthetics think about those who didn't synthesize?  And those who destroyed the Reapers?  Surprise, they're not all gone, and even though they're now controlled, they're still responsible for billions and billions of deaths, and they're just a Relay away.  Whole systems might be quarantined.  Bioware likes being on the cutting edge of social issues, something like this would be right up their alley.  Besides, it lets them keep the ME3 ending without writing it off.  In fact, it almost makes that ending acceptable.