34 réponses à ce sujet

[Bann Duncan]

It may be (and probably is) just me but my entire party is being mowed down pretty easily, even at casual, and I've played both previous games with all classes and difficulties. Did combat get considerably more difficult in DA:I? I'm guessing not, considering no one else seems to think so.

[eratis]

I'm up on hard, running a DW rogue with an archer in the party at all times (party comp of s/s warrior, mage w/ barrier, archer, and my rogue). I haven't experienced major difficulties overall. I am finding I can't venture out for hours without a potion restock. Probably between 5-10 standard fights before returning to a camp. Rifts almost always need a restock after closing them. Granted, I haven't tried maining a warrior or mage yet, but the difficulty feels about right for stumbling around the game for the first time.

 

What has your experience been like?

[Bann Duncan]

I just spent 40 minutes in a boss battle. On casual. At least that battle I won... More often than not I barely last at all, or my party is killed by the last opponent standing.

 

I have never been in this position with any game before, let alone a DA one.

 

EDIT: To be clear, I mean the battle took me 40 minutes, not a series of deaths/reattempts.

[DV-01]

Spec Stealth, Dex Passives, Dodge % Chance, Use Parry. Evade (haven't used)- Upgrades that give bonus stealth or decrease the wait time - Sleep gas helps CC

 

With Stealth I get through most challenges on hard that are not triple my level.

[Irx]

Playing on hard and so far I have to actually manually manage the party maybe only 1 of 5-8 fights, the majority of difficulty comes from controls though.

The only time I was killed is the boss of the prologue section due to inexperience.

[rocketmunkey]

I'm playing a DW rogue and he's just fine. He's spec'd out for pure damage, and as long as Cass keeps the aggro, I can flank and mow through mobs fairly easily. I do take damage, but that's where potion management comes in.

 

It also helps to know where your strengths lie. Stealth and flank; if they turn, stealth again. You're not a tank, you shouldn't ever be doing face-to-face damage.

 

To answer to OP's topic question - I do not feel that Rogues are underpowered at all.

[Capeo]

I always play on normal first run through and I'm finding the difficulty to be on par with previous games. I'm running a DW rogue and I find it powerful. As others have said, abuse stealth. Only time my party has died (or even come close for that matter) was on a rift I was woefully under-leveled for and when I got ambushed by a dragon.

[TurkeyJ]

Yes, imo.  Guard and barrier are just too important, and the rogue has no analog for it.

 

An archer doesn't seem to have enough damage premium over a mage to justify the lack of utility.  DW has some nice glass-cannon damage, but is close to one-shot territory in the harder difficulties.  Surely usable, but requiring quite a bit of micro and selfish defense skills.  There's an argument to be made for a rogue's CC, but the mage has CC in spades as well,  

 

Rogue's aren't broken, but it's hard to justify their party slot over any extra barrier mage or a guarded warrior. 

[Bann Duncan]

Yes, imo.  Guard and barrier are just too important, and the rogue has no analog for it.

 

An archer doesn't seem to have enough damage premium over a mage to justify the lack of utility.  DW has some nice glass-cannon damage, but is close to one-shot territory in the harder difficulties.  Surely usable, but requiring quite a bit of micro and selfish defense skills.  There's an argument to be made for a rogue's CC, but the mage has CC in spades as well,  

 

Rogue's aren't broken, but it's hard to justify their party slot over any extra barrier mage or a guarded warrior. 

 

Yeah... I'm kind of stuck at this point. (Former DW warrior who went 2H warrior in DA2, so I thought I'd do DW rogue.) I'll spec archer to see if that's any better.

[yankblan]

I play archer, and I love it. I got the preorder fire bow, so that helps. But remember to play at range (Solas & Varric have a bad habit of charging in).

I use stealth to reposition behind enemy lines or evade aggro. Use caltrops in choke points; also people tend to bypass passive to have more abilities, but these give great overall permanent buffs, and a +3 bonus to a particular stat. I say once you have 5-6 attack slots, invest in upgrades that boosts damage or shortens cooldowns.

One passive I like, is one where your damage increases by 5% for each successive it; so when your abilities cool down, hold that trigger!

[SpaceV3gan]

Playing DW Rogue feels punishing now (at least on PC). Closing the distance, placing your character at a proper angle and holding/spamming the mouse key to attack has complicated a whole gameplay that in the past only involved a few clicks.
I assume archers are more popular than dual wielders now due to this fact, but I haven't played them yet.
The DW damage output is good, but not as Boss-tearing as it was on the previous games. All in all, I am honestly considering to restart as a Mage.

[Duelist]

Yeah... I'm kind of stuck at this point. (Former DW warrior who went 2H warrior in DA2, so I thought I'd do DW rogue.) I'll spec archer to see if that's any better.

From this quote alone I'm getting the impression that you're using your Rogue like a Warrior.

A few things to keep in mind.
- Rogues have always been slow burners. The early going can be rough but once set up properly, a good Rogue can become a one man army.

- Prioritize targets. I usually start with the enemy mages or if there are none, then hit the archers. That's just me though.

- Knockout Powder. It sets Varric up for Long Shot and you up for Twin Fangs or can be used for a hit and run.

Others can probably offer better advice than I but I do hope this helps.

[Bann Duncan]

It's not that actually. My rogue gets good DPS and survives decently. (I've played a lot of melee rogue in the past two games).

I'm definitely going to try the suggestions in this thread. Thanks!

[Back Lot Basher]

So far, I've gone into the first part of the Hinterland with both an Archer Rogue and 2 Handed Warrior.  They both seem to have pros and cons.  Once I learned that I had to stay at long range with the archer, it started to work a lot better.  The Long Shot can hit for 500+ damage, so I really have to use it on other archers and mages.  I also abuse the cloaking to get party members up when they go down.

[Lulupab]

Controlling a dagger rogue will inevitably cause more potion usage because you are a squishy melee who will get wrecked if you make mistakes. I suggest archers on first playthrough.

[GhoXen]

I'm using Varric a lot on Nightmare. In combat they are definitely less useful than mages, however, outside/before combat they have an amazing amount of utility.

 

I can utilise hit and run tactics to take out a few troublesome foes in a pack before engaging. I can set up lots of traps and pull enemies into them. At super long range, they also snipe better than mages.

[zeypher]

So they got rogues right, class that provides lot of utility and still being ok at combat. 

[phoenix fang55]

I don't know about DW rogues currently, I have loved them in the past, and will play one eventually, but I started as a dalish archer, and I'm more than satisfied with what I can do, I have mobility, my first strike does massive damage, and my second strike does quite a bit more, I can keep enemies at bay by using explosive shot to knock them down, and leaping shot is just fun, gets distance and does decent aoe damage, I'll actually advance on a group of targets, and then spray them with that while at the same time instantly backing off. Eventually I'll add in stealth so its great. Looking at DW trees, you might be better focusing on stealth first and taking the dw skills a little later.

[Hexcaliber]

It is not so much that the rogue is weak but his options feel limited, having the class split between ranged or melee was always a mistake. As is limiting the melee rogue to daggers only, why the hell can they not wield axes and maces too this time out. Why? Because Bioware were lazy designing the classes, much easier to limit rogue to daggers and focus all melee skills around their use. I really cant help but feel there should be a ranger class, keeping bow away from rogue all together and freeing them up to flesh out both archetypes more, but I guess that required a little too much effort.

 

Of the three classes Mage is a walk in the park and way more powerful than either Rogue or warrior and it is clearly imbalanced. While we may control a party of four, most players will class their main and leave the ai to cover the other slots in the party. I believe that if Bioware's story writers were not quite so accomplished, then this series would not have done nearly as well within this genre, as their designers leave a lot to be desired.

[Bann Duncan]

The last console BioWare game I owned was Jade Empire nearly a decade ago, but on a whim I plugged in an Xbox controller and playing DW rogue was a lot more like I remember from PC Origins and II. Bizarre, but it's gotten considerably smoother!

[JohnnyEdge]

I started the game on nightmare difficulty with a DW rogue and found him to be unplayable.  On console anyways, the positioning just isn't accurate enough.  You use an attack, and he leaps out in front of an enemy, taking damage and messing up his positioning, and now you have to walk all the way around your enemy again to start doing flanking damage.  Plus to use his CC you need to be close to melee range, so you again need to walk over to your target if it is a ranged target you are trying to stun.  

On top of very little party buffs and being so brittle, DW rogue I think is unplayable on nightmare.

[eratis]

DW rogue definitely takes some getting used to. Proper use of stealth is an absolute must; I'm also using upgraded Flank Attack not as an attack but an aggro dump. The -threat passive is nice too.

They really sit in the same niche as the DW rogue in DA2 - unparalleled single target burst - but it's a high risk playstyle that seems to only really cohere under the player's direct control, with teammates to set up crazy cross class combos.

[Bann Duncan]

I've been at the trebuchet for an hour. Fun times!

[Calimwulf]

Don't forget your Tank. The better built your tank is, the esier a job your rogue will have. I kept upgrading my rogues weapons, it got to the point where the tank was never able to hold aggro and my rogue started wilting like a flower in a hot oven.

[eratis]

You don't need to down the boss to finish the trebuchet section. Just interact with the wheel.