19127 réponses à ce sujet

[Peregrinus]

@Bethgael   I think it's definitely got something to do with the Frostbite 3 game engine. Battlefield 4 which uses the same engine has similar issues as DAI but not as bad. 

[Postem]

PS3 - Tight fit / crashes / bugs

XBOX360 - Tight fit / crashes / bugs

PC - Nvidia/High-end cards crashes / console port quality / bugs

PS4 - Stable

XBOX1 - Stable

 

This is considered acceptable for release

3 months later - still the same - so yup, EA level quality

 

In other words it's best to buy the game after 1-2 years and once community patches/fixes are out like in TS3, it's EA

 

Do you think community will be able to fix this crap to an acceptable extent? Looks how crippled Simcity reboot is, and how further it was tight locked to sell dlc. No one can make any good mods or fix the crap that glassbox engine is.

[Bethgael]

Do you think community will be able to fix this crap to an acceptable extent? Looks how crippled Simcity reboot is, and how further it was tight locked to sell dlc. No one can make any good mods or fix the crap that glassbox engine is.

 

I've said it further up the thread but it bears repeating: EA Games has never created a franchise (sports titles don't count), so the only thing they're concerned about is squeezing the $ out of the established ones from the companies they take over. As a result, their execs don't understand the concept of a "long term market share" (to clarify: when I say "long term", I mean decades, not a few financial quarters. I used the example above of how Morrowind, released in 2002, still has pressed copies selling in game stores. 12-13 years after release. Because of mods. That's the sort of "long term" companies should want). EA's goal is to get the fastest short-term profit, turn over the franchise, attempt to copy others' success (again, like in the case of Bethesda/Skyrim, without understanding how that game/company became a success in the first place) without doing the legwork for it.

 

As a result, EA's reputation is as a franchise killer. Ultima, Maxis, C&C... now, DA.

 

Short term gain = long term failure, every time. You can't get so paranoid about "cutting piracy" (thereby making games difficult to mod) and short-term profits that you gimp your franchises to the point no one wants to play them any more. And, eventually, you will run out of successful medium-sized companies to buy--partly because the EA sales model has become so exploitative and insidious it is now difficult for smaller companies to grow. They're not only destroying their own market, they're stupidly outplumbing their future investments. Sure, this quarter's bottom line looks healthy--they spent a lot on false advertising and have invested heavily in the short-term console market (and the true PC sales figures are not available, because the ones that are around do not include Origin downloads/digital sales). The future? Not so bright, if they keep this kind of thing up.

 

The major difference between console and PC players is not which one's "better", it's that PC players, traditionally, tend to keep going back to older games (especially if they're moddable), whereas console gamers like to move on to the next best thing once they're done with the game they're on. That's a generalisation, I know, but it's also the nature of the hardware. Short-term console sales may be good, but it's in the PC that long-term sales strategies lie. So, pissing off your PC market? Never a Good Idea.

 

There is a huge difference between companies that create games and companies that exploit current markets. Bethesda, for example, is the former. EA is the latter.

[Peregrinus]

@Bethgael  You forgot Pandemic.  I loved those guys/gals.    

[Bakgrind]

I've said it further up the thread but it bears repeating: EA Games has never created a franchise (sports titles don't count), so the only thing they're concerned about is squeezing the $ out of the established ones from the companies they take over. As a result, their execs don't understand the concept of a "long term market share" (to clarify: when I say "long term", I mean decades, not a few financial quarters. I used the example above of how Morrowind, released in 2002, still has pressed copies selling in game stores. 12-13 years after release. Because of mods. That's the sort of "long term" companies should want). EA's goal is to get the fastest short-term profit, turn over the franchise, attempt to copy others' success (again, like in the case of Bethesda/Skyrim, without understanding how that game/company became a success in the first place) without doing the legwork for it.

 

As a result, EA's reputation is as a franchise killer. Ultima, Maxis, C&C... now, DA.

 

Short term gain = long term failure, every time. You can't get so paranoid about "cutting piracy" (thereby making games difficult to mod) and short-term profits that you gimp your franchises to the point no one wants to play them any more. And, eventually, you will run out of successful medium-sized companies to buy--partly because the EA sales model has become so exploitative and insidious it is now difficult for smaller companies to grow. They're not only destroying their own market, they're stupidly outplumbing their future investments. Sure, this quarter's bottom line looks healthy--they spent a lot on false advertising and have invested heavily in the short-term console market (and the true PC sales figures are not available, because the ones that are around do not include Origin downloads/digital sales). The future? Not so bright, if they keep this kind of thing up.

 

The major difference between console and PC players is not which one's "better", it's that PC players, traditionally, tend to keep going back to older games (especially if they're moddable), whereas console gamers like to move on to the next best thing once they're done with the game they're on. That's a generalisation, I know, but it's also the nature of the hardware. Short-term console sales may be good, but it's in the PC that long-term sales strategies lie. So, pissing off your PC market? Never a Good Idea.

 

There is a huge difference between companies that create games and companies that exploit current markets. Bethesda, for example, is the former. EA is the latter.

 

 

Another thing that can be added is when EA buys a company they also buy their fan base as well in the hopes that they will buy other EA branded products and not just say as an example Bioware products.

[Sailfindragon]

I am a Nvidia (GTX 970) user and don't have any of the issues that have been mentioned. I must be one of the lucky ones.

[Bethgael]

Another thing that can be added is when EA buys a company they also buy their fan base as well in the hopes that they will buy other EA branded products and not just say as an example Bioware products.

 

Indeed.

 

Instead, what happens is that the child subsidiary, as EA guff them up (or as they adopt EA's core values), become recognised as "yet another EA franchise I'll now stop buying."

 

You can see exactly when it happens, too. For example, people started turning off the Sims (around Sims 2 at the start, but certainly when the latest simcity dropped)--Maxis became EAxis. Now, it's EAware (for those who haven't adopted my typo *grin*). Since DA:I's release, Bioware has now ceased to be its own entity that people trust despite EA, and is now "just another EA company, will grab the next game at a discount if I can be arsed with them at all". That makes me incredibly sad.

[DisturbedJim83]

That would be fair enough--if one of the problems wasn't that the game doesn't work "as intended" with an entire Vidcard subset. A popular one.

 

I don't have a nVidia card, so my game runs, even if the Origin app often gives me a CTD (and the game "milestone" saving itself as I go into the War Room makes it CTD--every freaking time. Thank Fluffy it doesn't "milestone" save too often, but I wish I could turn those off). I certainly feel for the poor nVidia users, though.

 

 

 

They do. Millions of WoW subscribers that can be invited to/apply to beta test every game Blizz has. I've beta'd on 4 of their releases (not including WoW EP betas and stress tests) in the last 8 years.

 

Bethesda does the same thing. "Apply to beta test ESO/Skyrim" etc.

Bioware could do the same thing, just as cheaply. They had us test the Keep for free, they could have done the same with DA:I. The trouble is that EA Games is too paranoid about leaks.

Thing is the bolded part is quite common and Started with Nvidia and their "Gameworks" a lot of games that feature that tech such as Watchdogs etc run much slower on AMD GPU's.Of course Nvidia claims that theirs nothing nefarious about it that being said it gimps AMD GPU's enough that Nvidia is able to charge a price premium for their cards.

[GODzilla]

I am a Nvidia (GTX 970) user and don't have any of the issues that have been mentioned. I must be one of the lucky ones.

 

That's great news for you.

[Peregrinus]

 

 

Thing is the bolded part is quite common and Started with Nvidia and their "Gameworks" a lot of games that feature that tech such as Watchdogs etc run much slower on AMD GPU's.Of course Nvidia claims that theirs nothing nefarious about it that being said it gimps AMD GPU's enough that Nvidia is able to charge a price premium for their cards.

 

Nvidia reminds me of 3DFX at their height of popularity.  I think they have become very bullish with their business tactics.  I wish they would cooperate with AMD and make Mantle a more utilized API since it benefits both AMD and Nvidia cards instead of just the one. 

[Bethgael]

Thing is the bolded part is quite common and Started with Nvidia and their "Gameworks" a lot of games that feature that tech such as Watchdogs etc run much slower on AMD GPU's.Of course Nvidia claims that theirs nothing nefarious about it that being said it gimps AMD GPU's enough that Nvidia is able to charge a price premium for their cards.

 

And it's yet another long-term idiocy.

 

We're no longer at the technological time when people choose between beta and VHS and whoever gets the most wins. I mean, for pity's sake, Microsoft already were called out years ago in court for that sort of anticompetitive garbage.

 

Old thinking, never good for technology.

[They call me a SpaceCowboy]

I am a Nvidia (GTX 970) user and don't have any of the issues that have been mentioned. I must be one of the lucky ones.

 

I have a 660. I experienced the ctd with the Directx error a couple of times, in the same scene. After upgrading the driver to the beta version, I had no problems.

[DAOnut]

I am thinking my best DAI experience has been without any patches.  I bought the game from Origin online, so if I delete and re-install I am sure it will be the latest patched version.  If I re-buy the game on a physical disk, install from disk, then after it verifies my account with Origin will I be able to go into offline mode to prevent any patches?  As this is a PC, it would have been nice to be able to download whichever patch worked for me and just run with that version, I do not understand all these automatic updates.

[Sylveria_Relden]

I am thinking my best DAI experience has been without any patches.  I bought the game from Origin online, so if I delete and re-install I am sure it will be the latest patched version.  If I re-buy the game on a physical disk, install from disk, then after it verifies my account with Origin will I be able to go into offline mode to prevent any patches?  As this is a PC, it would have been nice to be able to download whichever patch worked for me and just run with that version, I do not understand all these automatic updates.

 

There's an option in the settings in Origin to prevent "game updates" as well as Origin updates too. If you uninstall DA:I, turn OFF the setting for game updates then re-download it will prevent it from patching.

[DAOnut]

There's an option in the settings in Origin to prevent "game updates" as well as Origin updates too. If you uninstall DA:I, turn OFF the setting for game updates then re-download it will prevent it from patching.

Thanks, I just found this in the Origin app, in the General tab.  My concern now is if I delete the game then re-install, will it be the base game (patch zero) or will it install the game with the latest patch already bundled?  I also found the option "keep game installers", I will have to experiment to see if that will maybe store the base game in a patch-zero condition.  My favorite patch was #2, but I do not see anyway to selectively update to just that point.   

[Sylveria_Relden]

Thanks, I just found this in the Origin app, in the General tab.  My concern now is if I delete the game then re-install, will it be the base game (patch zero) or will it install the game with the latest patch already bundled?  I also found the option "keep game installers", I will have to experiment to see if that will maybe store the base game in a patch-zero condition.  My favorite patch was #2, but I do not see anyway to selectively update to just that point.   

 

Good question- honestly, I don't know, but it's worth a shot, I think. If you "beta test" this for us we'll have a conclusive decision though

[spacefiddle]

@Bethagael and others - 

 

You make some very good points and have some strong insights.  The thing you must bear in mind, however, is that as far as profitability is concerned, it's working.

 

EA will never be short on cash as long as it has the sports title monopoly.  You dismiss it, but you may not realize that EA negotiated some quiet exclusive licenses reaching back to 2004 or so, that gives them a complete lock on official-franchise sports games.  That monopoly is what launched them into the financial stratosphere; eliminating any possibility of competition.

 

It really doesn't matter how many developers EA buys and eviscerates.  As long as there are hitmakers willing to sell their IP to EA, EA will be able to milk them for all they're worth, and for quite a while.  You say people "soured" on The Sims.  It's EA's most profitable title to date, outside the sports monopoly.  DLC turned off many who appreciated the creativity of earlier iterations, and the community creations it spawned.  Many, many more shlorped down that DLC like there was no tomorrow, having no experience with earlier modes of play and falling very easily for "just a few more bucks gets you more shiny trinkets."

 

There is a far darker side to the Sims and the obsessive game play it emphasizes and exploits, but that's a whole 'nother topic.  The pinnacle of the dark art it spawned are the mobile games that players will spend thousands on.  For pixels on a phone.

 

You may note the inclusion of multiplayer in Mass Effect and now Dragon Age.  Again, monetization beyond the AAA box price, and again, eagerly consumed by folks who know no other model and don't really stop to consider how the nickel and dime micro adds up.  And beyond that, again the darker side where the IWIN button appeal of immediately "winning" something shiny wins out over the trouble and effort of accomplishing something yourself - the lab animal who presses the button to get a pleasurable dose of something bad for them.

 

As long as they have the sports monopoly, and as long as content creators willingly sell themselves to EA to get microed and monetized to hell and back again, and above all as long as players are willing to pay hundreds or thousands of dollars on content one used to reasonably expect from a single $60 purchase and maybe an expansion for another $20 - $30, you can expect this train to keep on chuggin'.

[CatatonicMan]

PC guys, come on. We all know we're the master race here.

Of course PC is going to have crashes. We all have different rigs and cards and drivers. Do you know how impossible it is for any developer to compensate for each every single one?

 

You're not wrong, at least in spirit. Modern games are complex as hell, and it's inevitable that some bugs and glitches will slip through. This is especially true in big, open world games. Throw in hardware, software, and driver variations and it only gets worse - everything becomes an edge case.

 

That said, there is a line between an expected amount of bugs, and an excessive amount of bugs. DA:I pretty clearly falls on the excessive side (think Skyrim excessive). Worse, there's not even an SDK available to allow the community to fix the bugs (though they're trying regardless).

 

Further, that doesn't even address the problems that arise from intentional design decisions. 

• The shitty UI? That's intended.
• Awful tactical mode? It was designed that way.
• Terrible PC controls? That's a feature, not a bug.
• Wonky combat? Awesome button.

You can't blame those poor decisions on the diversity of PC hardware.

[They call me a SpaceCowboy]

Thanks, I just found this in the Origin app, in the General tab.  My concern now is if I delete the game then re-install, will it be the base game (patch zero) or will it install the game with the latest patch already bundled?  I also found the option "keep game installers", I will have to experiment to see if that will maybe store the base game in a patch-zero condition.  My favorite patch was #2, but I do not see anyway to selectively update to just that point.   

 

I'm pretty sure it will install the latest build, including all patches. Let us know though

[Sylveria_Relden]

http://forum.bioware...ame/?p=18525677

[Sylveria_Relden]

@Bethagael and others - 

 

You make some very good points and have some strong insights.  The thing you must bear in mind, however, is that as far as profitability is concerned, it's working.

(snipped to conserve screen real estate, not to detract from content)

 

If it's working- let's keep doing it right?

 

Except- there's an issue with eventual consequence here, which is something people seem to have forgotten. Sure you can cheat, lie, steal and screw your customers over for a quick buck. But how long will it last? What will be the eventual consequence to the industry for doing so?

 

These are the questions which never seem to get asked... Good business strategy doesn't focus on the short-term gain ONLY but also on long-term gains and residual income over time. It seems over the last 20-30 years and with the dotcom craze of people getting rich quick overnight, business strategy has formed a new way of thinking- which is, "the quicker we squeeze what we can out of customers, the sooner we can retire and sip martinis in Tahiti."

 

One word for you... Enron. 

[Gundar3]

GODzilla, can you find me the original quote, or article for that sig of yours?

 

And because I'm at the point of outright resentment now, I'll spill my spaghetti here just a bit.  

 

The silence is deafening on this board.  It actually sickens me - not just in the betrayal of the PC community, the traditional Bioware fanbase, the internal destruction of Bioware the company, or the mockery of current Bioware titles that have a hard time classifying themselves as RPGs; but that you actually don't justify your actions.  You say nothing at all.  You sit there, behind your wall of purchased awards, counting your money, willfully ignoring ANYTHING that contradicts what you want to hear.  Frankly, like a  child.

 

Bioware/EA, Booware, EAware, whatever you want to call yourself now, I want to see you actually defend this game, and your corporate actions. 

 

Stay away form attacking us as people (if you can), and just defend.  You've called us "homophobic".  You've called us "entitled".  You have called the community of people that previously came around here to talk about the positive and negative aspects of this game "toxic", because they pointed out the flaws in this game, and sometimes,YOU, the developers...  I suppose this post makes me a "villain" now doesn't it?

 

I want you to defend, from a design standpoint, the transition of making the great RPGs that you are known for making, into multi-player slugfests.

 

Defend, from a design standpoint, the broken release of this game - some players can't even touch though they bought it.

 

Defend, from a design standpoint, the absolute pandering of special interest groups, specifically GLBT.  This one is special, because I can't believe that you pulled the wool over our eyes so easily.  What purpose does Krem actually serve in the game, other than to be made a spectacle for the player - something to stare at and say "wow"?  And Dorian, full of interesting views and ideas, a great character that you relegate to "daddy issues".  Defend this.

 

Defend the PC controls (which by now, we know you aren't going to patch) which limits the very usability, of some classes, and EVEN SOME DISABLED GAMERS THAT WORKED FINE IN THE PAST.

 

Defend the retconns, both the more "subtle" ones of culture of Thedas, to the removal of healing magic.

 

Defend all the mechanical hindrances you placed on PC, so that Xbox and Playstation didn't look better.  Yes, we know that EA forced you to use the Frostbite engine, by threatening to withhold budget.  I'm looking at the 60 FPS issue.

 

Defend the position, that focus of DLC content is relegated to multiplayer, leaving those of us who see the cut content from the single player in the dust - 3 months later.

 

Defend against the issues from 500 pages of posters.

 

You know what, legitimately defend your game of the year awards. 

 

The biggest launch in the history of Bioware...  you launched on 5 platforms.  If each of them scrapes 1 million congrats, you beat the ME3 launch.  Maybe next time you can work an ANDROID release?  5 platforms, of which only 2 work, and the PC is serviceable.  What a joke.

[DAOnut]

Thanks, I just found this in the Origin app, in the General tab.  My concern now is if I delete the game then re-install, will it be the base game (patch zero) or will it install the game with the latest patch already bundled?  I also found the option "keep game installers", I will have to experiment to see if that will maybe store the base game in a patch-zero condition.  My favorite patch was #2, but I do not see anyway to selectively update to just that point.   

 

 

Good question- honestly, I don't know, but it's worth a shot, I think. If you "beta test" this for us we'll have a conclusive decision though

 

Just about finished downloading again and ready for the re-install.  Which files can I look at to determine which version/patch its running??