180 réponses à ce sujet

[Exia001]

It does indeed sound stupid that one would judge a game before its out, the funny thing is you'll **** for a while but you'll buy it anyway so...Whats the point? Some seem to forget that Bioware have worked bloody hard to bring us exactly what we wanted and thats how you repay them?...By telling them you are disappointed with a game they spent 3 years working on and you haven't played it yet?



Fool

[Falklol]

Wow, after 32 hours of playing I just realised there wasn't any inventory when I opened this thread. A game that can draw me in like that, is one good ****ing game in my opinion.

Sorry if it's a bit off-topic, just had to say it.

[DarkSpiral]

I've only seen vids, of course, but the gameplay LOOKS a lot like Gears of War did.  Which was a TPS.  I don't think GoW qualified as an RPG, but it was a fine story.

[stylepoints]

Lonely_Fat_Guy wrote...


the world is grey, not just black and white.

you cant put everything on a label.

and the DnD Choatic good also doesnt listen too law but his own mind, your character seems more lawfull

DEFINITELY not lawful, I've got no problem shooting some scumbag in the face if he deserves it, doesn't mean I'd kick some poor girl's kitty too. I like to follow my own moral code apart from the law. I might punch some people here and there, but in the end I have a heart of gold!

Can't wait for the day where a game can discern WHY you are mean to some people and nice to others. Could make things much more interesting.

Modifié par stylepoints, 25 janvier 2010 - 10:26 .

[Lonely_Fat_Guy]

handheld wrote...

Lonely_Fat_Guy wrote...

Terror_K wrote...

You seem to be confirming a lot of my fears... and then some. The more I read about this game, the more I fear I'll just regret purchasing it, regret all those hours of playthroughs and regret getting into the IP in the first place. It seems like some bad dream... like BioWare have been replaced by some newer development company who just want to soup it all up for the younger crowd and have taken out most of the stuff that made the original great. I used to be angry and concerned, but now I'm starting to feel saddened and helpless.

wow, i must restrain my self from cursing at your stupidity.

play the game first before listening to whiners and then whine about it as well.

The so called deep rpg elements in ME1 weren't that deep at all. its not a baldurs gate game, it was already a simplified rpg with much story driven plots

now they streamlined the combat (thank god) that whas verry lacking in this game and they kept (what ive seen in reviews even expanded) the rich story that makes this rpg.

alot of choices alot of dialoge alot of ROLE PLAYING! roleplaying games dont need to have a (morinicly) (Handheld can not understand what you were trying to say here) insane dificult leveling system where you can do everything. it depends on the game.

the things they cut im actually happy with, they were excessive and didnt make sense, you have cerberus watching your back i dont think buying a new armor should be a problem since cerberus is filthy rich and is  sponsering you.

all i see is very dumb people already crying over something they didnt even play. boohoo this changed boohoo that changed,.....get over it, try it yourself first and then make an objective opinion of it.

/rant

and the op: you say review? did you play it? no? then dont be such a cry baby

Handheld has corrected the Life threatening spelling error's in your post.

thanks 

just for refrences im dyslectic and dutch, so english is not my native tounge.
if your wisdom needs some more wisdom http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyslexia
and even this wiki doesnt have all the facts.

but thanks again im just ahppy if my point comes acrouse

[handheld]

stylepoints wrote...

Lonely_Fat_Guy wrote...


the world is grey, not just black and white.

you cant put everything on a label.

and the DnD Choatic good also doesnt listen too law but his own mind, your character seems more lawfull

DEFINITELY not lawful, I've got no problem shooting some scumbag in the face if he deserves it, doesn't mean I'd kick some poor girl's kitty too. I like to follow my own moral code apart from the law. I might punch some people here and there, but in the end I have a heart of gold!

Handheld is pretty sure that the chaotic good character is a character who does the right things without restricting himself to being the ultimate good guy. Handheld akins anti heroes to this sort of behavior.

[handheld]

Lonely_Fat_Guy wrote...

handheld wrote...

Lonely_Fat_Guy wrote...

Terror_K wrote...

You seem to be confirming a lot of my fears... and then some. The more I read about this game, the more I fear I'll just regret purchasing it, regret all those hours of playthroughs and regret getting into the IP in the first place. It seems like some bad dream... like BioWare have been replaced by some newer development company who just want to soup it all up for the younger crowd and have taken out most of the stuff that made the original great. I used to be angry and concerned, but now I'm starting to feel saddened and helpless.

wow, i must restrain my self from cursing at your stupidity.

play the game first before listening to whiners and then whine about it as well.

The so called deep rpg elements in ME1 weren't that deep at all. its not a baldurs gate game, it was already a simplified rpg with much story driven plots

now they streamlined the combat (thank god) that whas verry lacking in this game and they kept (what ive seen in reviews even expanded) the rich story that makes this rpg.

alot of choices alot of dialoge alot of ROLE PLAYING! roleplaying games dont need to have a (morinicly) (Handheld can not understand what you were trying to say here) insane dificult leveling system where you can do everything. it depends on the game.

the things they cut im actually happy with, they were excessive and didnt make sense, you have cerberus watching your back i dont think buying a new armor should be a problem since cerberus is filthy rich and is  sponsering you.

all i see is very dumb people already crying over something they didnt even play. boohoo this changed boohoo that changed,.....get over it, try it yourself first and then make an objective opinion of it.

/rant

and the op: you say review? did you play it? no? then dont be such a cry baby

Handheld has corrected the Life threatening spelling error's in your post.

thanks 

just for refrences im dyslectic and dutch, so english is not my native tounge.
if your wisdom needs some more wisdom http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyslexia
and even this wiki doesnt have all the facts.

but thanks again im just ahppy if my point comes acrouse

Handheld thinks you need not worry Handheld merely did it so your post would be easier to read by the other forumites Handheld meant no offense if you were offended just know that Handheld himself is always kind and courteous to the other forumites and will continue to do so.

[handheld]

Handheld also wishes to say there is alot more to cerberus than meets the eye and asks that all of Handhelds fellow paragon forumites keep an open mind Handheld went into the game and expected to absolutely hate cerberus however after playing for a while Handheld has changed his mind a bit and doesnt think some of the people of cerberus are all that bad.

Modifié par handheld, 25 janvier 2010 - 10:31 .

[Junebug88]

"If I want to blow up stuff, I go play an FPS and I don't care so much about dialogue and storyline. Conversely, if I feel like playing a story-based game, I don't expect too much emphasis on frantic combat... and ammo management."



And who says a game cant emphasis on both? Why does BioWare have to stick industry standards and choose between one or the other?

[BouhPwet]

Thanks for the replies, there are interesting and valid points in there.

To those who asked: Yes, that "review" is based on actual, real gameplay. No, I havent finished the whole game yet, but played enough missions to get a good feel of it. (I can already feel all the heat coming about the fact that I'm not supposed to have played it yet ; there are numerous posts about that elsewhere, I'll let that aside for the moment.)


Armor customization: Indeed, it's possible to heavily customize the appearance of the armor (make it pink if you want), with some impact on stats ; but that is all there is to it. Being somewhat more of an RPG-er myself, I prefer a DA:O-like approach where you sometimes have to make a decision about going with armor X or armor Y; choice that will have an impact on how some encounters play out.

Same goes for weapons. I prefer to have a choice and, there too, feel like the decisions that I make for my gear and that of my teammates can have an impact on the game/fights.


Inventory: Granted, BioWare obviously went for streamlining, and managing an overly cluttered inventory can become annoying in the end. But, I do believe there's a middle ground: a system where (a) the loot would be "controlled" (not too many drops, and no "vendor loot"), ( the selection at merchants limited, etc. After all, part of the attractiveness of an RPG is the "action-reward" mechanic. It doesn't have to be "à la Diablo" where every kill rewards you with XP and an item. But a compromise between the old ME1 system and the current one would be better, imho.


Level up: Here again, some middle-ground would be nice. Granted, each point spent in ME1 felt like it brought little. But here, it's almost the opposite... The progression is in fairly big "steps", which can make one mission challenging, and then the next one feel a bit too easy because you just unlocked a level 4 power.


"Fire away!"

[Marlina]

BouhPwet wrote...

Same goes for weapons. I prefer to have a choice and, there too, feel like the decisions that I make for my gear and that of my teammates can have an impact on the game/fights.

About this, ME1 was terrible at it. Gear customization had VERY LITTLE impact on gameplay, especially for your teammates (they were pretty useless regardless of what you gave them)
Best upgrades were shredder and armor piercing rounds and frictionless materials. Everything else sucked by comparison. It seems what you want is more the ILLUSION of choice rather than something substantial, if you go by ME1.

[stylepoints]

handheld wrote...


Handheld is pretty sure that the chaotic good character is a character who does the right things without restricting himself to being the ultimate good guy. Handheld akins anti heroes to this sort of behavior.

Right. Just as an example. Say you meet some Dbag like Udina from ME1. I punch him in the face, he deserved it. Then some downtrodden nice guy asks for help and I help him. I get 1 good guy point and 1 bad guy point now. I am effectively "neutral" in the game's eyes now. 

Theoretically a perfect system would discern that I am not neutral in any way, I would want it to eventually see where my moral compass lies and judge me accordingly. If I act very strongly on my morals, and they are consistent, I would like one day for games to recognize where my moral compass points and adjust accordingly, or at least acknowledge it.

ME does a decent job by basically making every incident isolated. People really don't treat you differently for other non connected events. So each story has it's own little progression of good vs. bad. It would be nice however for the events to all become interconnected with a system for determining one's true motives.

Basically in these games. People that treat me with respect and are good at heart, I am nice to. People that are jerks or just "bad guys" get treated very badly.

[Junebug88]

I will admit that for the first few missions i was lucky enough to play, i found myself less involved with my level/weapon upgrades and more involved with my character and story. I'm not sure if that's a good or bad thing for most people, but i found it enjoyable.

[SurfaceBeneath]

I think that at the very core of the issue, most of the people that are going to be / are disappointed with this game are those that enjoy micromanagement.



Now, I'm not saying micromanagement is bad. I love it depending on the game (especially in turned based strat games like Alpha Centauri or Civ #). I think that it is undeniable that Mass Effect 2 does remove a lot of the micromanagement that was in the first game. The reason for that is because those micromanagement aspects of the game were not good, nor did they enhance the game. Bioware, looking for ways to both make the game more fun and more accessible, decided to axe most of the redundant or pointless micromanaging in Mass Effect 2. In a game like Mass Effect, that is trying to bridge the line between shooters and RPGs, I think it was a good move. Micromanagement and shooters are like oil and water. They just don't mix. So Bioware axed those parts of the game and included other RPG elements that mix better with a shooter type game.



OP, I take back what I said. From your second post it seems clear that perhaps you did play the game, but maybe expected something different.

[Spaghetti_Ninja]

These people really have a lot of nerve. The game comes out TOMORROW. But they have no shame about posting long-indepth stories about how they have been playing the last few days.



It's shamelessness brought to a whole new level.

[Lonely_Fat_Guy]

stylepoints wrote...

Lonely_Fat_Guy wrote...


the world is grey, not just black and white.

you cant put everything on a label.

and the DnD Choatic good also doesnt listen too law but his own mind, your character seems more lawfull

DEFINITELY not lawful, I've got no problem shooting some scumbag in the face if he deserves it, doesn't mean I'd kick some poor girl's kitty too. I like to follow my own moral code apart from the law. I might punch some people here and there, but in the end I have a heart of gold!

Can't wait for the day where a game can discern WHY you are mean to some people and nice to others. Could make things much more interesting.

i agree with you 1 hundred percent.
this will how ever give you alot of trouble.

i condone the killing of phedofiles, while it isnt a socially accepted penalty. so thats bad or good?
and bioware shoudnt, coudnt,woodnt want to touch that subject. if they would send out a game that says its ok too kill buttholes who stole from you, they might get  a whole foxnews kinda problem again.

hmm while typing this it might be possible its there game and there assumptions so why not?

but the ME paragorn renegade isnt bad or good its abit more then that, it also gives renegade points for doing the right thing and the smart thing.

[DarkSpiral]

[quote]handheld wrote...

the world is grey, not just black and white.

you cant put everything on a label.

and the DnD Choatic good also doesnt listen too law but his own mind, your character seems more lawfull [/quote]

DEFINITELY not lawful, I've got no problem shooting some scumbag in the face if he deserves it, doesn't mean I'd kick some poor girl's kitty too. I like to follow my own moral code apart from the law. I might punch some people here and there, but in the end I have a heart of gold!

[/quote]


Handheld is pretty sure that the chaotic good character is a character who does the right things without restricting himself to being the ultimate good guy. Handheld akins anti heroes to this sort of behavior.

[/quote]

Nah, Robin Hood is Chaotic Good.  He's no anti-hero, because The Law is evil.

Anti-heroes tend to be those that do good things using "evil" methods.  The Punisher kills drug dealers, murders, and the like.  And ol' Frank Castle is probably Lawful Neutral.  His personal code of conduct doesn't waver, even if it isn't exactl in agreement with the laws of the land.

[handheld]

stylepoints wrote...

handheld wrote...


Handheld is pretty sure that the chaotic good character is a character who does the right things without restricting himself to being the ultimate good guy. Handheld akins anti heroes to this sort of behavior.

Right. Just as an example. Say you meet some Dbag like Udina from ME1. I punch him in the face, he deserved it. Then some downtrodden nice guy asks for help and I help him. I get 1 good guy point and 1 bad guy point now. I am effectively "neutral" in the game's eyes now. 

Theoretically a perfect system would discern that I am not neutral in any way, I would want it to eventually see where my moral compass lies and judge me accordingly. If I act very strongly on my morals, and they are consistent, I would like one day for games to recognize where my moral compass points and adjust accordingly, or at least acknowledge it.

ME does a decent job by basically making every incident isolated. People really don't treat you differently for other non connected events. So each story has it's own little progression of good vs. bad. It would be nice however for the events to all become interconnected with a system for determining one's true motives.

Basically in these games. People that treat me with respect and are good at heart, I am nice to. People that are jerks or just "bad guys" get treated very badly.

Handheld agrees with this Handheld would also like to point out that most chaotic good characters only kill if there is a viable enough reason or if the enemy is going to ruin a major plan or perhaps betray them Handheld would always play a chaotic good character in NWN2 as that is what Handheld felt was the most realistic thing to him.

Handheld himself feels that in ME2 if you keep yourself doing both paragon and renegade choices as Handheld has then you are effectively doing whats right while removing whats wrong which is essentially a chaotic good character yes.

[stylepoints]

And to Bouhpwet. Your choice of armor slots is just as important if not moreso than your armor choice in ME1. Which helm do you want, the one that adds 5% health or the one that adds 10% headshot damage. Those are fairly large differences especially when you consider how many slots there are.



Your weapon choices are made on the fly with the special ammunition. Facing synthetics? get out the disruptor ammo. Facing organics? Get out the shredder rounds.



And the group makeup now makes much more difference than before. Also weapon swapping, Considering most effects don't work on shields, you need to get an effective weapon out or have a teammate that can disable shields. In ME1 you could just run around as a biotic with singularity gobbling up entire armies regardless of what they were. Even though there is less fiddling with your guns in an inventory screen, they moved the strategy to the battlefield where it belongs and is more interactive.

[handheld]

[quote]DarkSpiral wrote...

[quote]handheld wrote...

the world is grey, not just black and white.

you cant put everything on a label.

and the DnD Choatic good also doesnt listen too law but his own mind, your character seems more lawfull [/quote]

DEFINITELY not lawful, I've got no problem shooting some scumbag in the face if he deserves it, doesn't mean I'd kick some poor girl's kitty too. I like to follow my own moral code apart from the law. I might punch some people here and there, but in the end I have a heart of gold!

[/quote]


Handheld is pretty sure that the chaotic good character is a character who does the right things without restricting himself to being the ultimate good guy. Handheld akins anti heroes to this sort of behavior.

[/quote]

Nah, Robin Hood is Chaotic Good.  He's no anti-hero, because The Law is evil.

Anti-heroes tend to be those that do good things using "evil" methods.  The Punisher kills drug dealers, murders, and the like.  And ol' Frank Castle is probably Lawful Neutral.  His personal code of conduct doesn't waver, even if it isn't exactl in agreement with the laws of the land.



[/quote]


Handheld knows thats not entirely true a chaotic good character can go either extreme either using bad means to do a good cause or using a good cause to stop bad things.

Handheld thinks robin hood is the perfect example of an anti hero as Robin Hood stole things from the wealthy who were hording their money and gave it to the poor essentially doing a bad thing for a good cause.

[DarkSpiral]

handheld wrote...

Handheld agrees with this Handheld would also like to point out that most chaotic good characters only kill if there is a viable enough reason or if the enemy is going to ruin a major plan or perhaps betray them Handheld would always play a chaotic good character in NWN2 as that is what Handheld felt was the most realistic thing to him.

Handheld himself feels that in ME2 if you keep yourself doing both paragon and renegade choices as Handheld has then you are effectively doing whats right while removing whats wrong which is essentially a chaotic good character yes.

So...that would make Mordin Chatoic Good, yes?  That line from one or the other vid that Bioware released has him talking abou the many ways to help.  Heal some, kill others, etc.

[Lonely_Fat_Guy]

handheld wrote...


Handheld thinks you need not worry Handheld merely did it so your post would be easier to read by the other forumites Handheld meant no offense if you were offended just know that Handheld himself is always kind and courteous to the other forumites and will continue to do so.

no, dont worry none taken.

i even added smileys too try to make sure it doesnt come off as sarcastic or offended.

just wanted to clearfy myself why its so crappy