Nope, all the armour meshes, animations and everything associated with the male elves just appeared on their hard drives out of thin air. No one lifted a finger to make it happen.
Hyperbole is fun, isn't it.
Yes it is. Because what they did is a horrible, horrible and then sone more, atrocious job. Rushed, botched, ignored. This is what it is.
Now they should work 24h/7d/xm until they get it fixed.
I went as far as to make measurement, and the width difference at the top of the pelvis is 10% I'm sorry, I can't help but consider such minor difference to result in a complaint how it'd make them "not functional bipeds"... downright absurd. Not in the least because this difference doesn't actually affect the hip joints and legs (and their stance) in general.
Whether that looks "weird" is another matter, and like I mentioned it looking "weird" may well be the whole point why it's not a 100% copy of human proportions. It's not the whole model being squeezed in this way though, the line where the taper starts is roughly along the bottom line of their underwear.
The body is made more narrow, that much is clear. But i'll reiterate: this may well be an actual intention and attempt to make some sort of "alien looking" anatomy for a species that isn't after all human, by deviating it from the "proper" human proportions. Thus giving it the "proper" human proportions could be viewed as counter-intuitive by some. And I really don't think the changes they have gone with make the resulting character less functional.
In any case I'd refrain from taking such differences as a sign "they don't know how to do stuff right", because they do get this stuff quite right in the models which are actually supposed to appear human.
First of all, you being pedantic about this does not invalidate everyone's complaints. Anyone who has used the character creator can attest that "minor differences" can make everything just look wrong because its out of proportion. Second of all, claiming this is artistic license is dubious given that it only affects the male PC model. All other elves are fine model wise unless they are put in PC armour. So no, its not artistic vision. Unless that artistic vision was that the Inquisitor is a strung out heroin addict at Skyhold.
Again, NPC elves are fine. Sera uses the human model when not in PC specific armour. Solas looks fine until you likewise put him in PC specific armour. The Skyhold outfit model doesn't even match the naked model. So there are effectively three different elf body models and which one is being used depends entirely on how said elf decided to dress themselves this morning.
That is not artistic license, that is shoddy workmanship.
So it's not about editing every elven mesh model but moving shoulders joints apart. That will fix those -noodle arms- in every equipment, since all the stuff dalish men using is rigged to the same skeleton, so arms wont stuck in the body like that -
It's like elven meshes are ok, but not skeleton they rigged to 
I like that he maintains an emotionless and unwavering gaze as his hand slowly drifts towards his crotch. >.>
So it's not about editing every elven mesh model but moving shoulders joints apart. That will fix those -noodle arms- in every equipment, since all the stuff dalish men using is rigged to the same skeleton, so arms wont stuck in the body like that -
SpoilerIt's like elven meshes are ok, but not skeleton they rigged to
If you are right then we should get it fixed in the first patch. This are glued arms, but will it fix broken arms, weirdly bending?
If you are right then we should get it fixed in the first patch. This are glued arms, but will it fix broken arms, weirdly bending?
That's what should happen if the problem lies in joints position:
I'm not 100% sure if that's the problem we have in the game, but i hope so coz it's not that hard to fix. I think >.>
I like that he maintains an emotionless and unwavering gaze as his hand slowly drifts towards his crotch. >.>
Yea, he's like: *Keep calm. Lady Pentagast won't notice, i suppose*
At the moment, all I'm asking for are just 2 things that will save all PC Elves:
1.
If its too much work to beef up the Male Elves a little, and since the Skyhold Pajamas shows off how monstrously anorexic they are.
Either modify the PJs for Elf Inquisitor or,
Let us wear equipped armors in the keep (this option being more appealing since most players of other races want the pajamas gone anyways:).
2.
Fix the broken arms and Vejita's Syndrome in and out of Dialogue scenes.
The PJs and the broken arms are the main killers for me and I'm sure for many of us too.
With the mired of crash to desktop, lack of banter and broken arms on my toon why would I play this game in its current state?
I'm just going to play other games and wait for a patch.
With the mired of crash to desktop, lack of banter and broken arms on my toon why would I play this game in its current state?
I'm just going to play other games and wait for a patch.
To be perfectly honest with you? There is no reason to play this game in its current state. RP elements are highly damaged in this RPG. As you have pointed out, game crashes, you don't get to hear your companions talk and then you are playing a broken model.
I guess i'm lucky, since everything works fine for me in the game. Been there for around 170 hours 
no crashes, no sound problems, banter works just fine. Even managed to buff visuals by downsampling and cinematics tool.
Only problems i noticed so far are poor broken bodies and awful acting, facial expressions are soooo bad. Seems like most animations available in game are unisex too making some characters move so weirdly.
That's something we have to live with.. BUT noodle arms MUST be fixed. Tthere's no way developers will ignore the problem.
About other bugs and glitches, I hope they are making a big big patch to fix CTD/sound/banter/etc, so everyone who wants to play will do so, without problems. I hope they will make possibility to save character appearance as well so i can replay the game when they fix elves and make sure everything is pretty and stable.
P.S.: lots of -hope- ._.
Female elves fare no better. It's like they took the human model and moved the weight slider all the way to "super model skinny" without making adjustments for height. It's especially noticeable in Skyhold when s/he is romping around in those ugly beige pajamas. 
It's really sad, as much time as was spent in the story and landscape ...the hair, face, and body models seem to be lacking. 
Female elves fare no better. It's like they took the human model and moved the weight slider all the way to "super model skinny" without making adjustments for height. It's especially noticeable in Skyhold when s/he is romping around in those ugly beige pajamas.
Of all things to cut, they have decided to cut character models. How ridiculous is that. The worst part about it all is that I'm truly eager to play this game, explore, learn the new lore but BioWare does not help by keeping patch in the dark.
If the "pedantry" demonstrates that the complaint is quite invalid then yes, that's actually what it does.First of all, you being pedantic about this does not invalidate everyone's complaints.
You may be confusing two factors here:Second of all, claiming this is artistic license is dubious given that it only affects the male PC model. All other elves are fine model wise unless they are put in PC armour. So no, its not artistic vision. Unless that artistic vision was that the Inquisitor is a strung out heroin addict at Skyhold.
Here's a counterpoint to ponder:That's what should happen if the problem lies in joints position:
Spoiler
I'm not 100% sure if that's the problem we have in the game, but i hope so coz it's not that hard to fix. I think >.>
Here's a counterpoint to ponder:
Does the change in Sera's arm shape appear similar, if not identical with your drawing? Her joints don't change, though. What changes is the mesh put over these joints.
Since apparently the modders have in the meantime figured out how to export models from the game, someone bored enough can perhaps export/load these two into some 3d program and have a look if there's anything different between them.
1- Female elves don't have problems like elven men do.
2- Sera has human mesh/body/proportions/skeleton.
3- There might be a problem with wrong weighting/mesh but then why every armor elven guys equip has exact the same issue (clipping arms into the body).
There lots and lots reasons for those -noodle arms-, but i do 3D and rig (i'm not pro or something. No show off) so i will repeat myself saying the problem lies in skeleton those meshes rigged to. In my opinion.
And yes, it's something developers know better than we do.
As far as i know it's not yet possible to export rigged mesh, i'm really interested in getting the model so i can see what's going on.
Peace 
1- Female elves don't have problems like elven men do.
2- Sera has human mesh/body/proportions/skeleton.
3- There might be a problem with wrong weighting/mesh but then why every armor elven guys equip has exact the same issue (clipping arms into the body).
There lots and lots reasons for those -noodle arms-, but i do 3D and rig (i'm not pro or something. No show off) so i will repeat myself saying the problem lies in skeleton those meshes rigged to. In my opinion.
And yes, it's something developers know better than we do.
As far as i know it's not yet possible to export rigged mesh, i'm really interested in getting the model so i can see what's going on.
Peace
I would rather get it fixed before you learn what is going on. Fixed it tomorrow. Tommorrow is 3th week anniversary
So the pic:
Lets say:
1- I made human model and i am all happy the way it looks.
2- I want and i make pose/animation for that model.
3- I want to make elven race by simply scaling/moving some bones my human model rigged to. So what will i get? Elven body i'm ***ok*** with............. But what will happen to that pose i made before? See for yourself.
Kinda reminds me what happens with dalish dudes in the game
I would rather get it fixed before you learn what is going on. Fixed it tomorrow. Tommorrow is 3th week anniversary
Agreed.
----------------------------
So i tried to edit mesh, not skeleton:
1. Human model with the pose i made before.
2. New elven model made by editing mesh, not skeleton. No clipping.
So the pic:
SpoilerLets say:
1- I made human model and i am all happy the way it looks.
2- I want and i make pose/animation for that model.
3- I want to make elven race by simply scaling/moving some bones my human model rigged to. So what will i get? Elven body i'm ***ok*** with............. But what will happen to that pose i made before? See for yourself.
Kinda reminds me what happens with dalish dudes in the game
Agreed.
What a nice reconstruction of events. So, it looks like multi million company allowed their graphics to botch the model work. Truly low standards of dlivery.
I love how people will defend bad work by claiming its a design choice. That's like how we programmers claim its a feature when a bug happens.
As a soon to graduate student already working as an intern in this industry, if I had brought that model to my teacher or employer and claimed it was a design choice, they would have slapped me and made me redo it.
NEWS---- PC PATCH: RELEASE DATE: 9.12.2014----NEWS
If it won't gest fixed in the upcoming patch then there won't be any excuse left for BioWare.
NEWS---- PC PATCH: RELEASE DATE: 9.12.2014----NEWS
If it won't gest fixed in the upcoming patch then there won't be any excuse left for BioWare.
Thanks for attempting to keep the issue of the "noodle arms" on topic Surinen. It seems that over the past few days we've had a lot of new folks (or at least I hadn't seen them until recently lol) who are more concerned with the artistic approach of the elves rather than the bug/glitch that is the atrocious bendy, broken arms. How skinny or masculine the elves are at this point in time is extremely unimportant and should be saved for a later discussion or suggestion to Bioware, most likely to be considered for the next game in line. Perhaps the title of the forum helped to inadvertently deviate the focus. I can see where everyone is coming from though, I myself am not as happy with the severe thinness they've adopted (Fenris, I feel, is still the best example of how they SHOULD be. Hell, Solas looks great too), but this is not an issue that needs "fixed". Nothing is broken about Bioware's chosen design; the male Dalish Elf's arms during cutscenes and/or while wearing certain armors in the field however, IS.
Thoughts out of the way, do you have a link to the news Surinen? Was it just mentioned off-hand, or is there an article somewhere?
Thanks for attempting to keep the issue of the "noodle arms" on topic Surinen. It seems that over the past few days we've had a lot of new folks (or at least I hadn't seen them until recently lol) who are more concerned with the artistic approach of the elves rather than the bug/glitch that is the atrocious bendy, broken arms. How skinny or masculine the elves are at this point in time is extremely unimportant and should be saved for a later discussion or suggestion to Bioware, most likely to be considered for the next game in line. Perhaps the title of the forum helped to inadvertently deviate the focus. I can see where everyone is coming from though, I myself am not as happy with the severe thinness they've adopted (Fenris, I feel, is still the best example of how they SHOULD be. Hell, Solas looks great too), but this is not an issue that needs "fixed". Nothing is broken about Bioware's chosen design; the male Dalish Elf's arms during cutscenes and/or while wearing certain armors in the field however, IS.
Thoughts out of the way, do you have a link to the news Surinen? Was it just mentioned off-hand, or is there an article somewhere?
Thank you! On this page you will find twitter links: http://forum.bioware...#entry18003175 to be specific this post: http://forum.bioware...ay/?p=18002369 Pity, though, some people consider this bug and my 'obsession' with it as something less important than other game breaking bugs. I don't know if they have bought RPG game or just a case of pretty fireworks and farming. How can anyone say 'merely immersion'
People are being silly if they think its a issue that doesn't need to be fixed. You see your character a lot in cutscenes. I mean that is a lot of the game to be honest. If its broken in all the cutscenes that detracts a lot. And its not like you can ignore the problem by just playing non-male elf...Solas has it too, just not as severely noticable.
I understand some people are less into cosmetics then others. But if something is not working as intended (aka a bug) then it deserves to be fixed no matter what it is. Sure there is some pretty critical bugs, but something as cosmetically huge as this is not something that can be ignored.
I for one hope it is addressed for all the people here that want to happily play their male elves. *crosses fingers*
It does get a little annoying when people pop in and tell us the broken arms are not a bug and don't need fixed. I think we have gathered plenty of in-game evidence that it is in fact a bug.
I mean, yeah I complain about the skinny arms. But I can live with it. I just want the arms to stop doing weird things in cutscenes.
So...2 days. In 2 days, we'll see if Bioware took our issue to heart as well. I just hope this patch doesn't break the game for me (took a lot to get it to run without a lot of lag ).
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