733 réponses à ce sujet

[10K]

Craft armor that generates guard it's OP. Find fade touched obsidian stone.

[BroBear Berbil]

One thing that's really frustrating me is how much enemies move around, especially animals. I'll be attacking something the tank has taunted and then it just starts shuffling around and I'm suddenly being cleaved. Doesn't help that you can't strafe while attacking, or that evade without any direction pressed rolls you forward. On nightmare a single cleave like this takes 50% or more of my health so I'm using quite a few potions.

 

Only level 7 and I know melee rogue is a late bloomer but I'm not sure I can stand to get it to that point.

[SpaceV3gan]

From what people have been writing here it seems that the DW Rogue has a ton of potential, likely the best DPS in the game, as one could expected from it.
My main issue however is getting up close and moving around the crowd of enemies and attack manually, with mouse and keyboard. This game is poorly optimized for PC. Every step and swing needs to be done manually, while the previous two games were a matter of a few clicks.
I wonder how many successful DW players here are running around on keyboard and mouse.

[l3loodpimp]

once well geared and with a few level mele rogue can be good at soloing 1 weak archer that will tear your mage or tank apart if left untouched.... Yet the range rogue can do as good as the counterpart mele rogue, and  don't have to sit on the side jerking off once his burst done.

 

The game mechanic from do not favor mele unless you're a warrior. And even then, block and slash is kinda weak, and there will be multiple times when non tanking warrior also have to stare at the group working hard while he's being used as a buffbot.

 

although, I have a tip for your guys with evade, pause the game, then you will be able to choose the direction of the combat roll. Otherwise, Im pretty sure you're character will always do a front roll.

[mutantspicy]

It seems like Bioware took a page or two from Dark Souls when it comes to melee combat. Removal of defense stat (meaning whether an attack is a hit or miss is purely based on visual feedback), correctly timing blocks and parries (parries more so since it actively drains stamina), even limited healing. But the system kinda crumbles for rogues when they don't incorporate some reliable dodge mechanic as well, which true twitch-based action RPGs like Dark Souls will have. 

I feel like if Evade and flank attack should have a way quicker cool down, and it would be nice if evade followed a direction based on a move command. I haven't gotten Parry yet seems like I should after reading this thread.  

 

But I will add I do have Easy to Miss, and it does seem more often than not as long as I don't face up an opponent they focus on my tank's aggro, and forget about me.  However, you can't just stand there whacking on someones back.  you need to get your licks in and get out.  

 

In general tho I agree this seems like the hardest class to play and the game mechanic isn't doing us any favors, but I switched to a controller and everything is much better that way.  Still the dodge mechanic needs to be more readily available for this class.  That said it, so far for my money the DW rogue is the funnest to play.  You just die alot.  I have no idea how I'm gonna take out a dragon, with this guy.

[Shallyah]

So what do you want, just afk behind mobs until they die to insane amounts of damage in Nightmare?

 

I love the way you have to play smart to deal decent damage as a melee damage class. I hope they don't change it. 

 

 

I'm playing Nightmare with a two-handed weapon warrior and it's being a blast, partly because you don't just afk behind monsters killing them, there is a lot of tactical choices and many things to react to if you want to succeed. If you just want to afk behind monsters and kill them with automatic backstab critical hits, play a lower difficulty mode. Nightmare is out of your reach, as it should.

[cyph]

I'm playing DW rogue on nightmare and it's actually much easier than 2H warrior. You only need 2 combos for the rogue, and the rest escape abilities. Once you put guard on hit dagger, it's game over. Rogue with the right support staff, 1 warrior and 2 mages is unkillable. You will not require any pausing for trash mob. She can't even get hit at all. Flask of freeze and time stop from the mages, enemies just don't last long enough. Even elite enemies go down in a few seconds at most.

[cyph]

One thing that's really frustrating me is how much enemies move around, especially animals. I'll be attacking something the tank has taunted and then it just starts shuffling around and I'm suddenly being cleaved. Doesn't help that you can't strafe while attacking, or that evade without any direction pressed rolls you forward. On nightmare a single cleave like this takes 50% or more of my health so I'm using quite a few potions.

 

Only level 7 and I know melee rogue is a late bloomer but I'm not sure I can stand to get it to that point.

 

In the early goings, it's tougher so switch to bow.

[uptown_cougar]

So far I have only played on nightmare and my main is a DW rogue. I found it difficult at first, but after I learned to play it the DW rogue is clearly viable. You can dish out massive damage and have several tactical options. I do wish the weapon switching was implemented as it would allow for even more versatility and another tree to spend points in.

 

The warrior classes are fun, but sometimes feel a little too easy even on nightmare. Rogue can be very rewarding.

[brazen_nl]

I feel like if Evade and flank attack should have a way quicker cool down, and it would be nice if evade followed a direction based on a move command. I haven't gotten Parry yet seems like I should after reading this thread.  

 

But I will add I do have Easy to Miss, and it does seem more often than not as long as I don't face up an opponent they focus on my tank's aggro, and forget about me.  However, you can't just stand there whacking on someones back.  you need to get your licks in and get out.  

 

In general tho I agree this seems like the hardest class to play and the game mechanic isn't doing us any favors, but I switched to a controller and everything is much better that way.  Still the dodge mechanic needs to be more readily available for this class.  That said it, so far for my money the DW rogue is the funnest to play.  You just die alot.  I have no idea how I'm gonna take out a dragon, with this guy.

 

Evade does follow direction. You have to push a direction key and then push evade. But, with all the stealth and Easy to Miss you don't really need it. The only problem is AoE. The same goes for attacks. If you hold the direction key while eg. auto-attacking, you will jump in that direction like DA2.

[Nightdragon8]

I have to seriously wonder if this is more to a Mouse Keyboard issues.

 

But so far as it goes. DuelWeild Dragon age Origins was fun not really that flashy but Origins wasn't all that flashy expect for the mages.

 

DA2 Dagger rogues where fun as hell. I even did a run where My Hawke and Isabella was ruling the battlefield after getting the first spec skills. It was fun it was flashy.

 

DA:I And honestly Melee is a chore. Dagger rogues while there skills are 'flashy' are exteremly squishy, and the fact that evading and getting out of the way of bosses that do alot of AOE, which seems to be EVERYBOSS. And getting and staying in the I think 3 degree arc that doesn't get hit by EVERY attack.

 

So far all everyone is saying is "get X item and that fixs that" That shouldn't be how the game should be played and it shouldn't have to be used as a work around. For an obviously broken system.

 

And for all of you who are saying "Action RPG" looks at allt he "Action RPG" and even MMOs out there and see how they did it. Much more fluid much more fun. Wildstar/Tera very action RPG and to be honest a TON easier to use. Heck even 'Smite' is less annoying and its an action 3rd person MOBA.

[prosthetic soul]

God I wish Assassin had Thousand Cuts instead of Tempest.  Tempest is a good effective specialization but it gets so boring after a while with its passive abilities.  I have to take the specialization every play through though because Thousand Cuts. 

 

ITS THOUSAND CUTS MAN. 

[cyph]

DW rogues don't really need specialization although tempest flasks are useful for both offense and invincibility. For bosses, just use the roll away to escape their AOE attacks. With two mages who can cast freeze, the dual wield tree will allow you to combo after combo. Take all the passives for extra damage, crit, and flanking bonus from all trees. Seriously, mages prime with ice then 50% backstab, 50% flank bonus, 50% poison, then 30-50% crit for flanking depending on gear, elites fall like dominoes shatter combos? Rogues don't require specialization to excel, they are OP, perfect for real time play on nightmare.

[lastpawn]

Now that I've had more time to play DW Rogues...

 

If it wasn't for numerous bugs (Flank Attack on uneven terrain, Stealth occasionally not activating, etc.) Rogues would be, if anything, incredibly powerful in the hands of a skilled player. Even with the bugs, once one gets the right equipment, the game becomes trivial. Then again, the game becomes trivial for all classes with the right equipment (and some, like KE, don't even need "the right equipment" to be broken).

 

If anything, I'd advise skilled players to NOT min-max, it's a quick way to make the game too easy.

[Giantdeathrobot]

Now that I've had more time to play DW Rogues...

 

If it wasn't for numerous bugs (Flank Attack on uneven terrain, Stealth occasionally not activating, etc.) Rogues would be, if anything, incredibly powerful in the hands of a skilled player. Even with the bugs, once one gets the right equipment, the game becomes trivial. Then again, the game becomes trivial for all classes with the right equipment (and some, like KE, don't even need "the right equipment" to be broken).

 

If anything, I'd advise skilled players to NOT min-max, it's a quick way to make the game too easy.

 

Admitedly, that is true for the vast majority of RPGs.

 

But yeah, to echo others, Guard on Hit does wonders for DW rogues. It lets them eat the occasional AoE attack, and sustain their DPS which is really second to none. Tempest is just the cherry on the OP sundae.

[Lucrece]

Rogue is a late bloomer. Starts out really badly but once you get gear and the ability perks to pull off combos you do far more damage than any other class.

 

The only thing I would say is broken is trying to flank enemies. Even when I target lock a dragon leg and try to flank it it's such a pain, the legs are constantly moving and my character's autoattack moves me away from the back part.

 

On top of that, some enemies like the gurg or other long bodied enemies have really bad hitboxes which don't let you backstab successfully a lot of the time.

 

Flanking strike just fails a lot of the time.

 

Your party members can body block you, it's really annoying trying to flank sometimes when they bunch up on the enemy.

 

Enemies move faster than you in combat so you can't even chase a moving enemy and will miss twin fangs a lot of the time. I find the sprint key only works when you are mounted, there's no way to run after a moving enemy.

 

Sometimes when enemies are knocked on the floor you can't even hit them.

 

Despite the really annoying failure of flanking strike and missing twin fangs out of stealth on moving enemies, I'm enjoying my rogue a lot more in late game.

 

I think my low point in this game was fighting the Hinterland dragon at lv10 with regular gear and lv9 followers. It was terrible and just a chain of stealth>ress retarded mage AI.

 

But the other fights my rogue does really good damage and it's just babysitting the retarded mage AI who insists on walking over puddles of fire/lightning and getting next to the dragon so they get a leg/tail swipe and eat a breath.

 

My rogue barely needs potions.

 

I also recommend getting the 4 extra potions perk, improve your healing mist grenade asap and as a tempest you got 12 healing potions plus 4 healing mists for you and 3 for each party member so you actually got 13 extra potion heals on top of you 12 regular healing potions.

 

Add to that Cassandra 10% party damage reduction as templar plus the 10% damage resistance perk.

 

I made the terrible mistake of using my fade touched obsidian early and now I can't find any, but guard on hit is stupidly strong on a rogue because you hit so fast, the guard stacks up and you become as tanky as a warrior.

 

I WOULD RECOMMEND YOU SAVE ALL YOUR FADE TOUCHED OBSIDIAN FOR LV20+ ARMOR/WEAPONS, THE SAME GOES FOR THE 5 EXTRA HIT HIDDEN BLADES PROC MATERIAL TOO. THESE TWO ITEMS ARE INCREDIBLY STRONG BUT RARE AND ARE WASTED ON LOWER LV GEAR.

[Khevar]

Just for poops and giggles, I brought 4 rogues (Inq, Varrick, Sera, Cole) to attack the Keep in Crestwood. We were level 11. I respecced everyone to dual daggers / subterfuge.

OMFG things died fast. Basically I would go after the weak mobs first, stealth out, then pick off any big guys remaining.

I ran into trouble with the leader, as he was a 2-hander, and could spot my stealthed guys. But I basically kited him around the roof until abilities came off CD, leapt in then evaded back out.

If it weren't for the "energize" and "smash" doors that make you take a balanced team, I would play the rest of the game this way.

This was on NM, but no friendly fire (AOE daggers). I didn't have any guard on hit gear, and my regen potions weren't upgraded. I can only imagine how unstoppable these 4 would be with some fade-touched obsidian/silverite, and with regen potions that do AOE healing (since they'd be close enough to heal each other)

[Wompoo]

Yea it is weak... I miss the DA:O rogue, with the right build I could have her dex/tanking and that was the most fun I've had with a rogue in a lot of years (since my Neverwinter halfling parry rogue)... the biggest issue with DA:I is the skill trees, they feel like a shadow of what they could of been imho... just wish they had kept on refining and improving on the original game's trees, because now they all feel shallow and just a little to simplified. (on a positive, no excessive sustains to manage).

[Jackal19851111]

My rogue is decidedly extremely OP from my perspective - just the way I like it for a level 22 character. She kills dragons so fast half the time I can't be bothered reviving fallen party members, and impossible to hit (evade is an essential skill). Just requires micromanagement unfortunately, as I can't fine-tuned her tactics, she dies easy when left to her own AI.

[Selea]

I wonder how many successful DW players here are running around on keyboard and mouse.

 

I do. You really need to get used to it because at first it surely is counterintuitive if you are used to playing DA:O or DA2. Moreover there are clearly some issues with the control scheme (especially on tac cam) atm, but I'm sure they will get addressed pretty soon. For example I don't know why but if you play with a controller it's easier to hit (and it has nothing to do with easiness on controlling the character movement); you see this very well with Spirit Blade on a KE when using K&M: many times the chaining of attacks stops because the character tries to reposition itself, resetting the chain (hence disrupting the flow), while this never happens if you use a controller. I don't know why that's the case but hitting targets in melee flows much better with a controller and for this many are using it instead than K&M. I really hope these sort of issues will get fixed asap by the devs (I'm sure they are working on it).

Anyway imo the DW rogue is the most strategic class to play (and given this if you like planning and playing strategically, as me, the most fun class to play in the game) since you have to always take in consideration the environment, picking the best targets and the best moment to attack etc. etc. Once you get the flow, however, you can literally empty a room in just a moment and even 360 degrees attacking targets can be dispatched quite easily (still I personally think it is a bug that they have a full circle hitbox instead than a cone one because it doesn't make much sense from a gameplay perspective). It is literally like dancing to and fro, dispatching targets of opportunity and with big targets do a spike at the right moment then go away and repeat (hit and run). It's very easy to kill everything very fast with minimal damage in this way and, as I said, it is very fun (and rewarding).

Two quick hints: equip a dual bladed dagger (AOE) in the main hand (not in both hands however because the animation is tied to the main hand and AOE daggers have less single target damage) as the animation changes and you press forward while attacking (this makes actively hitting targets much easier even when they are moving). Also +guard on hit is extremely powerful on a rogue (also if lately I skip on it altogether because it makes the game too easy, similar as having Fade Shield on a KE; not broken as the latter but still too powerful for my tastes).

P.S: If you want to use +guard on weapons be sure to not use it on both because it doesn't stack and on the contrary many times it makes the +guard bugs out and not work altogether.

[Zenthar Aseth]

From what people have been writing here it seems that the DW Rogue has a ton of potential, likely the best DPS in the game, as one could expected from it.
My main issue however is getting up close and moving around the crowd of enemies and attack manually, with mouse and keyboard. This game is poorly optimized for PC. Every step and swing needs to be done manually, while the previous two games were a matter of a few clicks.
I wonder how many successful DW players here are running around on keyboard and mouse.

Playing a DW rogue using keyboard and mouse and it's very fun and powerful. Level 5 right now, restarted from a Knight Enchanter because that was too easy. 

 

Not sure what people mean by "late bloomer", I've been doing great damage since level 2 or so. Rogue has tons of evasion abilities, things that make you invisible after you deal damage, blocking, etc. I love that it takes a bit of player involvement to play it well, and the damage you can do is rewarding.

[Zhen Dil Oloth]

I've got a level 7 DW rogue and had absolutely no problem at all with him until I got to the envy demon. Tried to beat him at least ten times to no avail, and that was on normal. I've played enough of origins, though I'm definitely no DA combat expert, but still, that should not be happening. In my fury I finally respeced to archer and beat him on the first try without even breaking a sweat. There should not be such a night and day difference between any onne spec/role/class and another. Now I'm almost 20 hours into the game and am either stuck with a spec I never intended to play, or I have to reroll. That is, unless Bioware rolls out a patch in the next 24 hours. Very frustrating. 

 

Comments like this makes 0 sense to me. 

 

I finished the game with an Elf Rogue/Assassin with Dual Daggers.

 

No patching needed.

 

Players really just need to learn to play a Rogue.

[OG Swift]

There are repec items you can buy to change over to an Archer.

DA: I does seem like DA 2 in that the best party tends to be 1 tank + 3 ranged characters. 2 archers + 1 mage for more DPS or 2 mages + 1 archer for more Barrier and crowd control.

 

1 tank + 3 ranged characters are valid for me as well.

 

I just wish their AI would not be completely fu**ed up because they don't care whether they are battered by melee enemies or not (not mention the fact that archers keep using Leap Shot while being completely safe thus burning stamina on crap.

[Magma_Axis]

1 tank + 3 ranged characters are valid for me as well.
 
I just wish their AI would not be completely fu**ed up because they don't care whether they are battered by melee enemies or not (not mention the fact that archers keep using Leap Shot while being completely safe thus burning stamina on crap.

Use tac cam to move them away, or get better aggro management. Turn off leaping shot in tactics menu
I know the AI is bad, but there are things we can do to minimize the damage

[Zhen Dil Oloth]

But wouldn't it be better to play a damage dealing class/spec that doesn't have a "you're doing it wrong" restriction?

 

Are mages or DPS warriors restricted in such a way where they shouldn't be attacking a large # of enemy types?

???

 

Every class has a "your doing it wrong" restriction.

 

If you saw someone complain that his Mage keeps on dying because he goes into melee witha Dagger and is not casting any spells..... would you agree that the Mage class needs a buff?? or you would just tell him that he is doing it wrong??

 

If you saw a Warrior using only a knife and no armor because he want to pretend that he is Tarzan........would you agree that the Warrior class needs a buff?? or you would just tell him that he is doing it wrong??

 

Sadly..... too many people are clueless when it comes to playing a Rogue.

 

Many decades ago many were clueless about playing a Rogue in D&D (called a Thief at the time).

 

They tried to make it easier on players by making various kits like the Swashbuckler allowing players to actually play their Rogue as if it was a Fighter class.

 

Then later on 3rd Edition made it so that you could play the Rogue as a Fighter even more by removing the need to hide in shadow to make a backstab attack. They replaced backstab for sneak attack so that all the Rogue needed to do now was flank the ennemy. 

 

But in the long run..... it did not teach players how to play a Rogue

 

All it did was re-enforce players into playing the Rogue like another Fighter class.

 

Heck in NeverWinter Night..... I was able to make what I called the Super Rogue. 

Essentially a Strenght based Rogue dual wielding Bastard swords.

 

Sadly players clueless about how to play a Rogue seems to be an eternal problem.

 

We had that problem in D&D many decades ago.

We had that problem in AD&D.

We had that problem in Bladur's Gate/Icewind Dale.

We had that problem in NWN.

We had that problem in DDO.

We had that problem in LotRO.

 

And now.... we have the same problem with DA;I.