27 réponses à ce sujet

[Natureguy85]

I've been looking forward to Inquisition coming out but have not purchased it yet because I simply have too much going on right now to spend the $60 and play it as much as I'd like. So I'll wait a bit and probably get in once the new year starts. I've seen a few videos and reviews and the latest gameplay video mentioned something concerning that I hadn't heard before. The poster said the combat controlled like an MMO, or as I'd put it, an action RPG, in that you have to click the mouse to do basic attacks. Someone I work with that owns the game just told me I can't select what skills the other squadmembers use.

 

Are these things true? I know there is a tactical view, so can I still just tell the character to attack another character and have him/her go do it? I'm sure the other party members do this but what about my selected character? I certainly don't want to have to click to do basic attacks. Are there different attacks, such as light vs heavy, mapped to different buttons? (And I don't mean specific skills). I was expecting combat to be like Origins and DA:2, not this. Can I set up tactics for the team to follow?

 

 

 

Secondly, what do people think of the art and aesthetic? Note that I am not asking about graphics quality. For example, I hate the goofy art that is the character portraits by their heath/stamina/mana bars. I think they look stupid and preferred the actual facial models from Origins. I also dislike that the Inquisitor just gets a hand instead of a face.

 

How is the overall aesthetic? From the few videos I have seen, mostly showing either a forest or fields, the game is very bright. What about elsewhere? Does it look like world falling apart, as it is supposed to be? Do you get the impression that the mage/templar war and the rifts are actually affecting people's lives?

 

I really liked the aesthetic of Origins. I felt like there was a war going on. Lothering was a great example. The criers in Orzammar were a nice touch for the conflict between Behlen and Harrowmont. The world felt dark and harsh. I'm worried that Inquisition will have the same problem Diablo 3 has of losing that aesthetic quality.

[House Lannister]

You can pick what your squadmates uses, not sure where he got that from.

At the moment it's better than Origins.

[Cyonan]

For your basic attack you either have to click or hold down the button. There is no more auto attack.

 

Companions will use their abilities naturally when you aren't controlling them, but you can still swap to them and control them like in previous Dragon Age games.

 

As for the aesthetic I'm finding it fine. The forest is just one area among many(it also happens to be the first major area, so it gets shown a lot right now). It's not "all dark all the time", but then I would argue that neither was Origins or DA2 anyway.

[Natureguy85]

For your basic attack you either have to click or hold down the button. There is no more auto attack.

 

Companions will use their abilities naturally when you aren't controlling them, but you can still swap to them and control them like in previous Dragon Age games.

 

As for the aesthetic I'm finding it fine. The forest is just one area among many(it also happens to be the first major area, so it gets shown a lot right now). It's not "all dark all the time", but then I would argue that neither was Origins or DA2 anyway.

 

Well lets just say that this guy I work with often doesn't know what he's talking about, but since I don't have the game, I had no ability to say otherwise. That's good to hear.

 

You're right that DA:O wasn't dark all the time, but the question is this; does the world feel like it's actually being affected by the crisis? Is there any of the grit that Origins had?

[Natureguy85]

You can pick what your squadmates uses, not sure where he got that from.

At the moment it's better than Origins.

 

In what way(s)?

[Cyonan]

Well lets just say that this guy I work with often doesn't know what he's talking about, but since I don't have the game, I had no ability to say otherwise. That's good to hear.

 

You're right that DA:O wasn't dark all the time, but the question is this; does the world feel like it's actually being affected by the crisis? Is there any of the grit that Origins had?

 

The world definitely likes reminding you that it's all gone to hell, although being an open world there's also a fair bit more room for those side quests that don't really have much to do with everything going on that may or may not be interesting in their own right.

 

Overall I'd say they did a good job of it, although maybe not quite as good as Origins for this specific thing due to the nature of the open world. On the other hand, there is also a lot more things to explore out in the world.

[StingingVelvet]

It is very much an action RPG now. You can get some tactics going but it's not needed and much more limited. You're just going to be running through the woods hacking up random spawns, very few encounters are designed or tactical. The controls are much more of an action game style... click mouse to attack, walk up to things and hit activate to use, etc. etc. It is not like Origins at all.

 

And the quests and areas are very MMO-like. Huge WoW influence on this game.

[Quibber123]

I think the combat is what they wanted DA2 to be. There's one normal attack button that you hold down and 8 (you're only allowed to assign up to 8) abilities. There is no dodge mechanic built directly into the movement system like in DA2, but there are abilities for mage and rogue that work very well at creating distance. The shield wall ability is now something you have to hold down (actually warrior feels pretty neat because of this as pulling the shield up seems to animation cancel) and the two-handed works by holding down too (using a pad at least definitely plug one in if you can the PC controls are pretty rough). The tactical camera is a mess at worst is mildly useful to see enemy weaknesses at best. Also in a cave it did this (basically never use it inside) when I decided to randomly switch to tactical view.

If you're in tactical view your party does auto attack but the zoom is so bad that it's not helpful. It is a very different game from Origin's, but it being different is not a bad thing at all I actually am enjoying it a lot! It actually feels a lot like GW2 in many ways.

[Natureguy85]

It is very much an action RPG now. You can get some tactics going but it's not needed and much more limited. You're just going to be running through the woods hacking up random spawns, very few encounters are designed or tactical. The controls are much more of an action game style... click mouse to attack, walk up to things and hit activate to use, etc. etc. It is not like Origins at all.

 

And the quests and areas are very MMO-like. Huge WoW influence on this game.

 

Ugh, that was my fear. I am fine with action RPGs but that's not what I want from Dragon Age. I'm sure I'll still play it, but I feel much better about waiting. Why "fix" what isn't broken?!

[StingingVelvet]

Ugh, that was my fear. I am fine with action RPGs but that's not what I want from Dragon Age. I'm sure I'll still play it, but I feel much better about waiting. Why "fix" what isn't broken?!

 

Yeah that's how I feel. I am still enjoying it but also am sad I am not getting a real sequel in style and gameplay to Origins. DA2, for all its flaws, was still the same kind of game.

 

Oh well.

[Cyonan]

It is very much an action RPG now. You can get some tactics going but it's not needed and much more limited. You're just going to be running through the woods hacking up random spawns, very few encounters are designed or tactical. The controls are much more of an action game style... click mouse to attack, walk up to things and hit activate to use, etc. etc. It is not like Origins at all.

 

And the quests and areas are very MMO-like. Huge WoW influence on this game.

 

The amusing thing about this is that if you played Origins in action cam(which was very doable) it played even more like WoW than Inquisition does, as WoW doesn't have the "spam/hold click to attack" thing going on.

 

but yes, they messed up tactical mode.

[StingingVelvet]

The amusing thing about this is that if you played Origins in action cam(which was very doable) it played even more like WoW than Inquisition does, as WoW doesn't have the "spam/hold click to attack" thing going on.

 

but yes, they messed up tactical mode.

 

I more meant the WoW influence in the quests and world design. Large zones with a level range filled with banal quests with very little dialog or plot. "Hey we need ram meat, go get ram meat." "Thanks for the ram meat." Most of them don't even have that much, they're just letters or collection quests.

 

The combat isn't MMO-like really, more Dragon Age mixed with a true action game into some weird hybrid.

[LuPoM]

Unfortunately control wise, you are in direct control of the character you select and YES you are able to choose which abilities your companions will use, from the tactical AI (how many slots there'll be for orders are influenced by the character stats) but in Tac View you can give more orders (like to hold ground, defend a point etc...) and also tell them which ability to use on which enemy, but as soon as you'll get out of the tactical view, you're in direct control of your character.

 

The art style varies.. It does give a strong sense of destruction and rupture where the hit was more catastrophic, and being so open it varies much, from areas that are barely touched by this catastrophe to areas deeply influenced.

Caves and underground areas are depicted good in my opinion, and having it so open it gives, still imho, a good view on the mages - templars wars where each group not only fights inland, but also has their own territories where they gather.

 

I was a bit let down like you that I couldn't click to have my character do basic attacs, so I decided to try with a controller and it really feels better, control wise. Tonight after work I'll try again with Keyboard and Mouse as I want to try to get a better hang of it, and I like it more the way it handles the inventory than the controller itself. As a melee character (shield and weapon warrior) you always need to move and follow your target to hit it, mages feels this far less and archers finally are nice to play!

 

I think that most of the issues k+m wise are easily fixable via patch..

[Natureguy85]

Can I set situational tactics as I could in Origins? I mean the actual tactics menu where you could, for example tell your archer to run from melee combat or to swap to melee weapons, or tell your healer to heal any party member that got below 25% HP.

 

One thing I did like was the ability for archers to move and shoot. The jumping around was a bit too much as I hated how the characters would fly around arcade style in DA:2 vs the more realistic feel of combat in Origins, but I like that you can sidestep or back away while you shoot.

[Natureguy85]

I more meant the WoW influence in the quests and world design. Large zones with a level range filled with banal quests with very little dialog or plot. "Hey we need ram meat, go get ram meat." "Thanks for the ram meat." Most of them don't even have that much, they're just letters or collection quests.

 

The combat isn't MMO-like really, more Dragon Age mixed with a true action game into some weird hybrid.

 

http://tvtropes.org/...TwentyBearAsses

[Cyonan]

Can I set situational tactics as I could in Origins? I mean the actual tactics menu where you could, for example tell your archer to run from melee combat or to swap to melee weapons, or tell your healer to heal any party member that got below 25% HP.

 

One thing I did like was the ability for archers to move and shoot. The jumping around was a bit too much as I hated how the characters would fly around arcade style in DA:2 vs the more realistic feel of combat in Origins, but I like that you can sidestep or back away while you shoot.

 

They've changed the whole tactical gameplay around, which I imagine is going to be the worst part for you because it's honestly pretty bad compared to Origins. They way it is now is:

 

In the actual Tactics menu, you can only set each abilities to disabled for no use, enabled for use, or preferred to have them use it more often.

 

They also have the behaviours menu as well now. In this you can set party members to using healing potions when they get below a certain amount(and if you want, make it so that they wont drain all your potions this way). You can also set targeting behaviour which is just following or defending a party member of your choice, or the currently controller character. Lastly, there is an option to get them to stop using abilities that cost mana/stamina if it falls below a certain percentage.

 

Overall it's nowhere near as good as what Origins had going on. There is no more "If <scenario happens>, use <ability>", and I'm not sure why it was ever removed.

[satans_pet_penguin]

The controls are awful and it makes combat a chore. The combat is simplified and some awful hybrid between action and tactical oriented. It's not as involved or satisfying as Origins. I would hold on on buying until they fix the controls and tactical cam.

[Natureguy85]

The controls are awful and it makes combat a chore. The combat is simplified and some awful hybrid between action and tactical oriented. It's not as involved or satisfying as Origins. I would hold on on buying until they fix the controls and tactical cam.

 

Done. Thanks!

[Diomed]

The controls on PC or horrible, wait for a patch.

[adembroski]

I'll try to answer point by point. I'm only about 10 hours in, but I hope I can be of help.

You don't have to click for each attack. Rather, you must hold the attack button down for continuous attack. There is no click and let him go. You can either you R or Right Mouse.

You can switch between party members just as in the previous games.

Combat isn't much different from DA2, except in that you have to hold the button. There aren't different kinds of attacks mapped to buttons. You can still pause and issue commands, and you can use the tactical view. 

As for the tac mode... it's rough, honestly. It's too zoomed in to give you much of an overview, and once moving combat moves too fast to really control much. I'm not a fan of it. However, you can kinda-sorta play tactical simply through the normal view through the pause-and-command method. You don't get the nice top-down view, but it works much better as far as I'm concerned.

Tactics have been simplified to a ridiculous degree. You get a list of abilities the character can use, and you get to set their frequency. That's it. If the character finds himself in a situation where a given skill might be useful, he'll choose between the highest priority skills that are appropriate. There are behaviors you can set for when to take potions and a few other things, but it's really limited. This might be my personal greatest disappointment with the game.

Personally, I really like the art style that you hate. There's a flavor too it that's all DA. Always takes me back to the DA:O intro, which was one of my best memories as a gamer. That said, I think if you can get over that, the art design looks just fine. If I've got a complaint it's that the character faces are creeping into the uncanny valley. There's definitely some artifacts of Frostbite in there... graphical hiccups, but I haven't seen anything too distracting. Occassional late loading character models, things flying rapidly across the screen you can't quite make out. It's pretty rare. I'm on one of the at-risk graphics cards, and after having a few early crashes, it seems to be all worked out.

The world feels more alive than DA:O or DA2... NPCs wander, talk to each other. It's not quite Skyrim level AI for NPCs, but it's improved. Again, I'm not terribly far in, so take this with a grain of salt... I definitely see signs that the mage-templar war is having an effect. It's the rift I'm concerned about so far... but then, the area I'm in is pointedly not that affected by them yet.

On the whole, I'm pleased with the game so far. I'm disappointed in the scaling back of the tactical game in favor of more action oriented gameplay, the PC controls are rough, but I'm getting accustom to them (unless you like using the last knuckle on your left pinky a lot, I suggest remapping pause immediately), and I desperately want a walk toggle, but there's what seems to be a pretty deep and interesting strategic long game to mitigate some of that. 

As someone who proclaimed loudly that this was definitely Bioware's last chance to keep me as a customer, so far, they seem to have earned my $60. ME4 might be back on the table for me, we'll see:)

[Sith Grey Warden]

When I play in tactical view, it feels like DAO, just with a smaller camera. I'm selecting abilities for my squad members to use based on what the situation requires, monitoring positioning to maximize utility of friendly AoEs, and doing a lot of managing that feels like DAO.

There are drawbacks, such as the smaller camera angle, the inability to move by direction keys while in tac view, and the "hold" command being a bit wobbly. Overall, I so far (23 hours in) find the combat to be almost as good as DAO's.

Outside the combat, it's a really good game. The storytelling's as good as DAO, but reinforced by a richer world with more to explore and more lore to uncover. The aesthetic is generally good, not as cartoonish as DA2. If you liked DAO, then this game is probably worth getting.

[Ponendus]

I think some are overplaying the 'bad' a bit here. It is different, yes. Auto-attack requires you to hold down the left mouse button, but while you are doing that you can still activate the abilities on the hotbar while doing so. Honestly I wasn't a fan of that when I first jumped in but I got used to it in like 10 minutes, and now it's just second nature.

 

Early in the game, it feels like lots of 'list' or 'fetch' quests, but honestly once you go do the next big story quest everything gets better. The key is to just lose yourself in the landscape - I have stumbled across mini-storylines several times and I wasn't directed to them at all. Yes there are still fetch quests, but you really don't have to do them, you gather the power you need doing whatever it is that makes you happy in the game world. Having said that, not all quests are 'MMO-like', there are plenty that are heavily story driven too.

 

The point is, just choose what you want to do and go with it, there is plenty to have fun with.

 

Aesthetically, I prefer this game. Yes the character portraits are more abstract art based - but honestly I found that charming rather than a setback. It really isn't that big of a deal. The world definitely feels like it is in danger, but the environments in some areas aren't really affected no. I still got the 'feel' that something wasn't right and so on though. The characters in the world when you talk to them definitely give you the sense that they are suffering, but it's not quite as dark and ominous as DAO was.

 

Tactics are not the same. There are some tactics available but the deep 'if-->then' statements customisation is gone - and I admit I miss that. It would be good for them to reintroduce that level of customisation in future games.

 

I am a massive Dragon Age fan, and I admit at first I was taken aback with how different this is, but now that I have found that Dragon Age flavour is indeed still there with great companions, interesting story and so, so, so, so much lore to discover, I am having a blast - ultimately that was what I always really loved about this series and that is there in spades. It's on par with DAO for me in terms of how much I like it - but they are different games in some respects.

 

Early on, I thought I wasn't going to like it - my advice is give it a chance, let the past go a little bit and you might just find you will really be glad you did.

[Swordfishtrombone]

^What Adembrosky said.

 

I don't think that I've seen anyone who's not been disappointed with the change to tactics - or rather, the near-total removal of customization of tactics for characters.

 

The very few settings we can customize, aren't nearly enough to make your characters act rationally in combat. For example, you have to set which character each character "follows" - meaning that they target that character's target. You can set it to "controlled character", or any named character in the party, including the character you set the tactic for themselves (this "follow myself" option is essentially "attack nearest")

 

If you set it to following any particular character, then they'll keep attacking that character's target even when they are being attacked by someone else, rather than responding to the threat.

 

Archers and mages don't seem to know to retreat, when faced with melee attack. There no longer is a basic setting to set the character's approach to battle. In the earlier games, you could set your squishy party members to "ranged", and they'd try to keep their distance from enemies. Nothing like that in DA:I.

 

I REALLY don't understand this design decision. It doesn't seem to have anything positive going for it. At the very least, if they had to get rid of the tactics customization, they could have set the default tactics your companions use to be at least as good as a good player could set their companion tactics to be in DA:O or DA2.

 

The game isn't bad. It just suffers from a clunky combat system that sucks much of the joy from combat that was there in DA:O and DA2. I don't know what was gained with the removal of auto attack. How is me having to hold a button down, rather than selecting a target and having my character attack it with basic attack until instructed otherwise, improving things, or making the game play any more enjoyable? It isn't. At the moment, combat does feel a bit like a chore - to the point that when wondering the wilds, I would hope that random encounters were much less frequent.

 

There's good to the game too - the environment seems interesting, and there's much to explore, and the little I've seen of the story so far, it is engaging too. The graphics are nice (be sure to set mesh to high though - any lower setting for that graphics option results in ultra-shiny hair, for some reason. I mean like polished metal shiny).

 

It's interesting enough that I keep going to the game and playing it, even though it suffers from the problems detailed above. I just find myself taking fairly frequent breaks from playing, whereas I could easily keep playing DA:O, and even DA2, for long sessions without tiring of the game. I think that the clunkyness of combat is what I just need a break from, after a while.

[hexaligned]

I just simply play the game in tactical mode, the camera controls like crap but I still enjoy it a lot more than the action RPG game play.  I also disable all party member tactics, but I did that for DAO and DA2 as well. 

 

If you are trying to play it as a hybrid action/tactical game like you could in the previous games you are going to have issues.  If you want to play exclusively as one or the other, you are going to be fine (if  you can stomach the camera).

[Natureguy85]

I'll try to answer point by point. I'm only about 10 hours in, but I hope I can be of help.

You don't have to click for each attack. Rather, you must hold the attack button down for continuous attack. There is no click and let him go. You can either you R or Right Mouse.

 

Eww. I want my tactical RPG back. If I want that type of game, I have Guild Wars 2 to play. I will also buy Shadows of Mordor when the price drops. Why fix what isn't broken? I understand that sequels sometimes change the game type, but big changes are generally separated longer, such as Fallout 2 to Fallout 3. People complained about the changes over the course of the Mass Effect series, but at least those were still 3rd person cover shooters. Why change from a tactical RPG to an action RPG? I admit I did like controlling my Warden primarily rather than constantly pausing and issuing four individual orders, though sometimes I needed to do that. However, if the tactics are dumbed down, I can't leave my party to do what I want, especially if I don't see something like an enemy spellcaster off in the corner. In DA:O, I could tell Dog to Overwhelm enemy mages and he'd just do it. I want that

 

 

As for the tac mode... it's rough, honestly. It's too zoomed in to give you much of an overview, and once moving combat moves too fast to really control much. I'm not a fan of it. However, you can kinda-sorta play tactical simply through the normal view through the pause-and-command method. You don't get the nice top-down view, but it works much better as far as I'm concerned.

Tactics have been simplified to a ridiculous degree. You get a list of abilities the character can use, and you get to set their frequency. That's it. If the character finds himself in a situation where a given skill might be useful, he'll choose between the highest priority skills that are appropriate. There are behaviors you can set for when to take potions and a few other things, but it's really limited. This might be my personal greatest disappointment with the game.

 

I also don't really understand the "tactical view". Is it really a big shift? It's been awhile for me, but wasn't it simply a matter of changing the camera angle in Origins? There was no two different modes but rather was left to the player on how to play it. I'm with you that far worse than no auto attack is the simplification of tactics. I loved that I could set several situational instructions to each character.

 

 

 

Personally, I really like the art style that you hate. There's a flavor too it that's all DA. Always takes me back to the DA:O intro, which was one of my best memories as a gamer. That said, I think if you can get over that, the art design looks just fine. If I've got a complaint it's that the character faces are creeping into the uncanny valley. There's definitely some artifacts of Frostbite in there... graphical hiccups, but I haven't seen anything too distracting. Occassional late loading character models, things flying rapidly across the screen you can't quite make out. It's pretty rare. I'm on one of the at-risk graphics cards, and after having a few early crashes, it seems to be all worked out.

The world feels more alive than DA:O or DA2... NPCs wander, talk to each other. It's not quite Skyrim level AI for NPCs, but it's improved. Again, I'm not terribly far in, so take this with a grain of salt... I definitely see signs that the mage-templar war is having an effect. It's the rift I'm concerned about so far... but then, the area I'm in is pointedly not that affected by them yet.

 

There is nothing "DA" about those portraits. In Origins they were the actual character models. In DA:2., they were at least the right faces, eve if it was a poor display. The art looks goofy to me.

 

I'm glad to hear the world looks alive and affected by the premise of the setting.

 

 

 

On the whole, I'm pleased with the game so far. I'm disappointed in the scaling back of the tactical game in favor of more action oriented gameplay, the PC controls are rough, but I'm getting accustom to them (unless you like using the last knuckle on your left pinky a lot, I suggest remapping pause immediately), and I desperately want a walk toggle, but there's what seems to be a pretty deep and interesting strategic long game to mitigate some of that. 

As someone who proclaimed loudly that this was definitely Bioware's last chance to keep me as a customer, so far, they seem to have earned my $60. ME4 might be back on the table for me, we'll see:)

 

I'm with you as far as Bioware being on thin ice. I am not going to get DA:I for awhile yet.