450 réponses à ce sujet

[jellobell]

The amount of eye rollage I've experienced while reading all these posts from people defending the use of ugly characters is staggering.

[Semipro]

Why can't Dorian be bisexual. Seriously. I read part of a thread wrong and thought he might swing either way and it turns out he doesn't.

 

Dammit. Hes really good at being a charming, smarmy bastard thats just so good you'll let him get away with it because hes so damn good.

 

Granted I'm glad people are getting options and all that but...Cullen, Blackwall, Solas, and Bull are such literal tropes its hilarious.

 

The dutiful man, the father figure, the dreamer nerd and the alcoholic jock....what options we have indeed.

 

I mean Josephine can go either way, it would have been nice if Dorian could swing a bit too, but instead we get Bull on the swing shift from what I've read...which...is kind of horrifying in its own right.

[SpiritMuse]

I'm actually ashamed to be a part of the "straight male" demographic because of this... I read this great article about a week ago that touched upon the subject of gamers and the feeling of entitlement. Nothing reminds me of this more than this topic right now. It's always "GIVE US" and "WE DESERVE"....
 
Sit down, seriously. You're embarrassing yourself.

Is there any way you can point me towards that article? I'd like to read it.

[SurelyForth]

Why can't Dorian be bisexual. Seriously. I read part of a thread wrong and thought he might swing either way and it turns out he doesn't.

 

Dammit. Hes really good at being a charming, smarmy bastard thats just so good you'll let him get away with it because hes so damn good.

 

Granted I'm glad people are getting options and all that but...Cullen, Blackwall, Solas, and Bull are such literal tropes its hilarious.

 

The dutiful man, the father figure, the dreamer nerd and the alcoholic jock....what options we have indeed.

 

I mean Josephine can go either way, it would have been nice if Dorian could swing a bit too, but instead we get Bull on the swing shift from what I've read...which...is kind of horrifying in its own right.

 

I think you are seriously underestimating the complexity of Cullen, Blackwall, Solas, and Bull. But especially Solas and Bull.

[Xetykins]

As a straight female gamer only blackwall appeals to me and possibly the only romance i will ever do. Then theres Dorian where everytime he speaks the song You were there by southern sons plays through my head. Unrequited love ftw. See i have all these options but really it all boils down to personal taste it does not matter how many options you have.

[Rykoth]

I feel like, if you don't choose your character's romance as your own sexuality, but instead look at it from the point of view of "what makes a good story," then options will open up to you immensely.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

Oh that's complete BS.  It's not just the video game industry that has beautiful women.  It's TV shows, movies, even books generally describe their characters as good looking.  When was the last time you read a book with an overweight main character?  Seriously.  When we engage in fantasy stories we don't want to have to see ugly characters.  RPG games have always been like watching movies or reading books, only we get to choose some of the actions along the way.

 

It's no wonder that people are balking at the ugly women we have to chose from.  It takes away from the enjoyment of the story.  You can take some morally superior high road that makes you feel special, but it's dumb.  People are looking for attractive people in their escapes from reality.  We're not looking for more reality. 

 

The amount of eye rollage I've experienced while reading all these posts from people defending the use of ugly characters is staggering.

 

Its funny how the tell us that its realism when it comes to Cassandra...

 

Yet here we have Cullen and Blackwall, who are both seasoned warriors that have seen plenty of shite...and Cullen looks like a male model who has access to some top notch trimmer to get that 5'o clock shadow...Even though Cullen has been through 2 Circle f***ups...Blackwall's face looks so smooth and his beard looks so well groomed...Even though he travels alone and on his own for the most part and have fought in the army...Even Solas looks good and smooth for someone his age and for someone who spends their time in ruins a lot...Only Iron Bull is realistic in this sense...

 

Realism my arse...More like its realism when it is convenient for them, otherwise its all fantasy...Its pathetically appalling that straight males cannot have their fantasy but the women can...Double standards ftw...

[Bayonet Hipshot]

Flavor is important, flavor is what make the game feel organic and alive, romances are one of the ways to achieve it, but somEthing like a random house actually having a kitchen, a fire, a desk and a bed also provides flavor;

 

*reminds himself of the bunkers in ME1 filled with servers and TBM heads*

 

 

Sadly, the statu quo in the industry about beauty standards is what conditioned all those people into only one way to think things.

 

Hopefully if other companies join Bioware into shaking things up, more people will grow to accept it.

 

Yes, its social conditioning if straight men in general like women to look a certain way but it is female choice and empowerment if they get their pick of good looking, masculine, manly men...all of which are traditional standards of female beauty...

 

Welcome to the modern world...Where male general preferences for something is a flaw that needs fixing or constant shaming or shaking things up...But female general preferences are celebrated and allowed to exist...

[Rykoth]

This is why people use the term "check your privilege." Seriously.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

Are you guys kidding?

Cassandra is so gorgeous and cute, I wish I could lesbian romance her. (I normally play as male characters, by the way.) Yes, she did seem gruff and boring 'soldier woman fanatic' at first, but if you bother to talk to her, you'll see her girly side. Come on, you guys romanced Morrigan, you know this drill about appearances and first impressions! And Josephine is adorable and adorable and so pretty my mouth was open the first time I met her. And yes, I also romanced Morrigan and preferred Hardened Leliana to unhardened.

Obviously they appeal to some people. But maybe not you. Bioware just have never done one-size-fits-all. As much as I absolutely love and adore Morrigan, I wouldn't want to see a repeat of her character. More variety is better. LI's aren't always to your taste, and they have no business needing to be so. Exactly none of the DA2 romances were to my tastes, heck, although I had fun romancing all of them anyway. And then there's all the way back to BG2 and KOTOR....

(I romance both sexes despite not being interested in romances IRL because my character =/= me, by the way. Yes, I am aware of and respect people who play games as themselves, we've got our own playing styles. But whenever this topic comes up there's this general assumption that EVERYONE must play according to their own sexual orientations. Straight girls only wanting to see straight girl romances and so on and so forth. So I figure I should mention this, just so you know where I'm standing and what may give me biases.)

 

tl;dr, some people didn't like either Morrigan or Leliana back in DA:O (at first sight, the bad practical girl : good idealistic girl dichotomy), some people didn't like either Isabela or Merrill back in DA2 (at first sight, the virgin and the wh*re dichotomy), and some people didn't like Cassandra or Josie in DA:I (at first sight, the tomboy and the lady dichotomy). It just means this time it's your turn to deal with it.

As for the amount of romances straight ladies get.......well, I think it's about time they get some recompense for all the Grand Shafting they've been getting over the years.

 

So you do not want to see a repeat of her character...Yet raise no issue about Cullen who is essentially Alistair 2.0 without the monarchy crap and Blackwall who is the third male Grey Warden romance we have had...

 

Somehow you never mention the need to not a repeat there...Funny...

 

What Grand Shafting have these straight ladies been getting from Bioware ? This is a Bioware game. As I recall, we have always had romance options that were relatively equal in regards to both sexes and these romance options always appealed to the average men and women in a Bioware game...

 

Seriously, what Grand Shafting have women been getting in the video game industry that is sufficient enough to make a company who is supposedly for equality try to push forward an agenda of double standards ? Women still get their buff hot male characters,  women had strong female characters like Bayonetta, Lara, etc...Women get to buy the games men buy, at the same price...

 

 

[ShieldWarden]

 

 

I just came across this yesterday! "After hitting a low hanging door frame." I was laughing so hard at the different comments that were left at each one.

 

I'm really glad I resisted my completionist urges and just went to Val Royeaux. I might have been 9 hours into the game, but it's definitely reinvigorated me.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

This is why people use the term "check your privilege." Seriously.

 

What privilege do I have exactly ?

 

I am an Asian man from a backwater of a country, I am part of the minority group there, I do not have the option of just looking pretty and expecting some woman to marry me or romance me because I have a dick (ps, women have that option), I have a higher chance of dying early and a higher chance of being a victim of violent crime (men of all places live shorter lives and are victims of violent in far more numbers than women are)....

 

What privilege do I have exactly ? 

 

Check your privilege is a phrase used by those with no argument to make but still want to feel that they have something rational and logical to say...

[ShieldWarden]

Oh that's complete BS.  It's not just the video game industry that has beautiful women.  It's TV shows, movies, even books generally describe their characters as good looking.  When was the last time you read a book with an overweight main character?  Seriously.  When we engage in fantasy stories we don't want to have to see ugly characters.  RPG games have always been like watching movies or reading books, only we get to choose some of the actions along the way.

 

It's no wonder that people are balking at the ugly women we have to chose from.  It takes away from the enjoyment of the story.  You can take some morally superior high road that makes you feel special, but it's dumb.  People are looking for attractive people in their escapes from reality.  We're not looking for more reality. 

 

The amount of eye rollage I've experienced while reading all these posts from people defending the use of ugly characters is staggering.

 

This is the most vain, shallow post I have ever read in my life. What... did you come from Hollywood or something? 

[Vapaa]

Yes, its social conditioning if straight men in general like women to look a certain way but it is female choice and empowerment if they get their pick of good looking, masculine, manly men...all of which are traditional standards of female beauty...

 

Welcome to the modern world...Where male general preferences for something is a flaw that needs fixing or constant shaming or shaking things up...But female general preferences are celebrated and allowed to exist...

 

I said PEOPLE not just men.

[Vapaa]

When we engage in fantasy stories we don't want to have to see ugly characters.

 

FFS the characters are not ugly, and if you want "not ugly" (whatever that means) you have your Inquisitor to fill the sport.

 

And and for me "engaging in fantasy" is more about the in game world, how it's built, what you can do in it, and who you meet in it...attractive characters (by what standards ?) are rather low on the list.

 

The amount of eye rollage I've experienced while reading all these posts from people defending the use of ugly characters is staggering.

 

Your aubsurdly high standards of beauty must be fun to have around

[Rykoth]

Us men - Straight Men - are catered to in EVERYTHING. EVERYTHING. HBO? They show breasts, they rarely show manparts. Same with any premium show. Same with most movies.

 

Most video games? Women are objectified. Women are treated like sexual objects to be rewards for men.

 

I am THANKFUL that Bioware doesn't cater to us like that, because what it means is (in context of a dark fantasy) we have more realistic characters and thus BELIEVABLE romances.

 

Any guy who thinks he's being ignored needs to check himself, and go play another one of the THOUSANDS of games tailored to our gender. I'm quite happy that Dragon Age is the way it is. You should be too.

[AWTEW]

What privilege do I have exactly ?
 
I am an Asian man from a backwater of a country, I am part of the minority group there, I do not have the option of just looking pretty and expecting some woman to marry me or romance me because I have a dick (ps, women have that option), I have a higher chance of dying early and a higher chance of being a victim of violent crime (men of all places live shorter lives and are victims of violent in far more numbers than women are)....
 
What privilege do I have exactly ? 
 
Check your privilege is a phrase used by those with no argument to make but still want to feel that they have something rational and logical to say...

Lol, you don't have the option? Wow, I wonder why ...

[Bugsie]

 

This is the most vain, shallow post I have ever read in my life. What... did you come from Hollywood or something? 

I had to laugh about the book comment especially.

 

Seriously, sounds like they don't read very widely and have never watched a tv drama/crime series from the UK.  A confederacy of dunces indeed.

[Vita Brevis]

I am an Asian man from a backwater of a country, I am part of the minority group there, I do not have the option of just looking pretty and expecting some woman to marry me or romance me because I have a dick (ps, women have that option), I have a higher chance of dying early and a higher chance of being a victim of violent crime (men of all places live shorter lives and are victims of violent in far more numbers than women are)....

And sexism ain't gonna get you anywhere.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

And sexism ain't gonna get you anywhere.

 

Sexism of what ? Of having a specific preference for what I find attractive ? Do you know what the word sexism even means ?

[Avejajed]

You didn't address his point, at all.

That's because I don't care how much he thinks everyone's out to get him by not providing him with enough romance options.

His point sucks.

[Semipro]

And sexism ain't gonna get you anywhere.

 

Not understanding what its like to be male in Japan or China is probably also not a good place to make an argument from. Being male in eastern cultures is not all that privileged unless your family is wealthy. Its generally a situation of being forced to work til you die because that is what is expected of you. Some parts of China and Japan are slightly more progressive than others same as it is in any part of the world but accusing someone of sexism without understanding why their world view might be valid to them is not fair. 

 

Though in fairness bogging down this topic with arguments about sexism is not very productive at all given as that topic has been beat to death in every valid medium it can be beat to death in.

 

Most people complaining about their "options" here are simply unhappy that the characters they might like aren't on their side of the gender preference fence...thats pretty much the entire crux of the argument, sexism and misandry and misogyny should probably just check itself at the door cause its not a productive discussion ever.

[Vita Brevis]

Though in fairness bogging down this topic with arguments about sexism is not very productive

Yea, it's not really productive to cry a river about how hard life in your country is since freaking Bioware has nothing to do with it.

[Semipro]

Yea, it's not really productive to cry a river about how hard life in your country is since freaking Bioware has nothing to do with it.

 

All I'm saying is some people have valid world views because its valid to the world they live in. I did not say it was BioWare's fault. But that doesn't make someones world view irrelevant either. If we have to be socially conscious and respectful of everyone...then that really should include everyone...not just the LGBT community.

 

I have two male friends in Seoul, they will be lucky if they ever marry, they live in apartments the size of an American bedroom closet, they work ungodly amounts of hours and the hours they don't work they spend at the cafe playing games to escape their lives....its not fair to discount these people simply because they don't fit in the currently trendy box.

[Vapaa]

its not fair to discount these people simply because they don't fit in the currently trendy box.

 

That depends, if they go out of their way to whine on an online forum about how "ugly" (srsly ?) video game characters are, then it's on them.