719 réponses à ce sujet

[Dherelv]

I may have some important info on this.
 
In my game Viv ended up as the divine, even when she was my last choice ever to the place. I was actually trying to make Leliana the divine. I'm thinking it happened because she is something like the default choice, if the other two are ruled out by the inquisitor choices. That's my impression because of the following:
 
- I think i ruled out Leliana because although i hardened her in her quest, but i told her she did good retreating her scouts, and told her not to kill the traitor. I also never voiced support for her, i think my dialog choices didn't bring me there somehow. I also conscripted the mages but as prisioners, but i always choose the "it was needed" dialogs when asked. I think i ruled Leliana out for being too dubious about those choices and for not clearly/verbally supporting her.
 
- Cassandra was my romance so i did everything i could to dissuade her from the seekers and from the Chantry. My inquisitor is a non believer so you guess. Reading the OP now i see that i actually did all the items related to Cass that would allegedly help Leliana.
 
- I actually did the opposite to every single topic in the OP Template that would support Vivienne, except to aligning with Celene, but with Briala at her side. I have proof that none of that is needed to make her Divine, and that doing the opposite does not avoid it!
 
It's very unlikely that i will make another play through, not because i didn't enjoy the game quite the contrary, but because i just couldn't find the time. So, i'll have no means to confirm it.
 
I'll answer the form. Hope this helps you guys figuring it out!

 

(I edited because i got confused at the form's answer. It's right, now.)

 

Spoiler

Who became your divine? (Softened/Hardened if applicable)
Vivienne

Who did you side with mages/templars and under what condition. (Conscription, free)
Mages/Conscription

When speaking to companions regarding chantry, how did you respond? (i.e. Dorian, Vivienne) (i.e. chantry is fine, mages need to be free, chantry reformed)
Mages need to be free (most of it, as i can remember. I may have chosen differently few times but certainly not with Cassandra, Leliana or Vivienne). Certainly has this chat with Dorian and supported free mages.

Did you do any of the war table operations to support a divine candidate? Did any come up at all?
No. I never saw any operation regarding any of that. I did all the operations that became available to me, but none of those showed up, probably lack of requisites?

Did you support a divine candidate through dialogue with them?
I never had the chance to support Leliana, and i wanted her, so NO.

Who did you side with on the civil war?
Celene/Briala

Cassandra disband the seekers?
Yes, by my suggestion.

Leliana Kill/Spared Traitor at Haven/Sister at Chantry?
Killed

Leliana told she was right to keep her scouts safe, or that she was wrong?
That  she was Right.

[AhRealMonster]

I have question, so if you get "Support (whatever name)" on wartable does that mean the choice is already locked?

[CENIC]

I have question, so if you get "Support (whatever name)" on wartable does that mean the choice is already locked?

I'm pretty sure I've seen posts in this thread where people had multiple candidates' war table support missions on the table at a time.

And I've had (and completed) one candidate's war table support mission and had a different candidate win out in the end.

[Jaron Oberyn]

I may have some important info on this.
 
In my game Viv ended up as the divine, even when she was my last choice ever to the place. I was actually trying to make Leliana the divine. I'm thinking it happened because she is something like the default choice, if the other two are ruled out by the inquisitor choices. That's my impression because of the following:
 
- I think i ruled out Leliana because although i hardened her in her quest, but i told her she did good retreating her scouts, and told her not to kill the traitor. I also never voiced support for her, i think my dialog choices didn't bring me there somehow. I also conscripted the mages but as prisioners, but i always choose the "it was needed" dialogs when asked. I think i ruled Leliana out for being too dubious about those choices and for not clearly/verbally supporting her.
 
- Cassandra was my romance so i did everything i could to dissuade her from the seekers and from the Chantry. My inquisitor is a non believer so you guess. Reading the OP now i see that i actually did all the items related to Cass that would allegedly help Leliana.
 
- I actually did the opposite to every single topic in the OP Template that would support Vivienne, except to aligning with Celene, but with Briala at her side. I have proof that none of that is needed to make her Divine, and that doing the opposite does not avoid it!
 
It's very unlikely that i will make another play through, not because i didn't enjoy the game quite the contrary, but because i just couldn't find the time. So, i'll have no means to confirm it.
 
I'll answer the form. Hope this helps you guys figuring it out!

 

(I edited because i got confused at the form's answer. It's right, now.)

 

Spoiler

Who became your divine? (Softened/Hardened if applicable)
Vivienne

Who did you side with mages/templars and under what condition. (Conscription, free)
Mages/Conscription

When speaking to companions regarding chantry, how did you respond? (i.e. Dorian, Vivienne) (i.e. chantry is fine, mages need to be free, chantry reformed)
Mages need to be free (most of it, as i can remember. I may have chosen differently few times but certainly not with Cassandra, Leliana or Vivienne). Certainly has this chat with Dorian and supported free mages.

Did you do any of the war table operations to support a divine candidate? Did any come up at all?
No. I never saw any operation regarding any of that. I did all the operations that became available to me, but none of those showed up, probably lack of requisites?

Did you support a divine candidate through dialogue with them?
I never had the chance to support Leliana, and i wanted her, so NO.

Who did you side with on the civil war?
Celene/Briala

Cassandra disband the seekers?
Yes, by my suggestion.

Leliana Kill/Spared Traitor at Haven/Sister at Chantry?
Killed

Leliana told she was right to keep her scouts safe, or that she was wrong?
That  she was Right.

 

There aren't any default choices, it is based on your decisions throughout the game.

 

Hardening Leliana does not take her out of the running for divine candidacy. She is the only character that can have two very distinct divine endings, dependent on whether she's hardened or softened throughout the course of the game.

 

Even if you have Briala reconcile with Celene, Celene still remains on the throne which still shifts points towards Vivienne.

 

You conscripted the mages, which is another move that heavily favors Vivienne. I don't see how you thought these choices would net you another candidate? 2 of your major plot decisions put Viv on the throne. At that point, you don't even need to discuss it with her, and dissuading Cass from pursuing it further solidified Viv as the candidate. (Conscription puts points for both Cass and Viv, but Celene pushes it in Viv's favor).

 

The conversational support for leliana comes after her personal quest, and will be available to you after you return from the Arbor Wilds.

 

Basically your decisions you outlined above led to Viv taking the throne. You didn't do the opposite at all, you simply did the mage equivalent of what I did for the templars.

 

If you want Leliana you need to:

 

Ally with mages at Redcliffe

Put Briala on the throne

Don't exile wardens (unclear on whether this affects, but for good measure)

Get the nobility perk and use the special dialogue option when talking to Leliana after the Arbor Wilds that will open up the war table operation.

 

 

 

I have question, so if you get "Support (whatever name)" on wartable does that mean the choice is already locked?

 

No. You can do the wartable operation and still get one of the other 2 candidates if your previous decisions favored them.

[zeypher]

Hmm can i get Leliana if i ally with the mages, reconcile Celene and Briala and i exile the grey wardens?

[Uhh.. Jonah]

Cassandra became divine and now my DAMN tank is gone.

[Jaison1986]

So, if I do the following, will I get Leliana as divine?

 

- Support mages in Origins

- Support mages in DA2

- Make alliance with mages in Inquisition

- Force an truce with all the candidates for the throne

- Recruit the grey wardens

- Support Leliana as divine

[Wulfram]

Cassandra became divine and now my DAMN tank is gone.

Hmm, in my game I talked to her and she asked to still come along

[Shark17676]

Yeah, you have to talk to her in order to unlock her as a companion again.

 

I think it's approval-based, too.  If your disapproval rating with her is too high she won't return.

[Patchwork]

If you don't recruit Vivienne is she taken out of the running? 

[NM_Che56]

It all makes sense now.  Thank you!

 

And in retrospect, despite trying to have it go Aunt Viv's way, I'm glad Lele came out as the new Divine. 

[KarmicSynergy]

Those of us who had a Warden/Leliana romance and currently have an Inquisitor/Cass romance have a tough choice to make it seems. Do you choose happiness for your original character/romance or the current one? Damn, these choices. I want BOTH my Warden and Inquisitor to be happy and in love! Grr...lol.

[thesuperdarkone2]

Those of us who had a Warden/Leliana romance and currently have an Inquisitor/Cass romance have a tough choice to make it seems. Do you choose happiness for your original character/romance or the current one? Damn, these choices. I want BOTH my Warden and Inquisitor to be happy and in love! Grr...lol.

Well Leliana changes the rules to be with the Warden so they don't break up. However, Cass isn't as willing to bend the rules and breaks up with the Inquisitor. So choose Divine Leliana, the best divine.

[Azzanadra]

Alright well I REALLY want Leliana to be divine, mainly because I don't want my character to break up with Cass Plus I'm a Mage, so I hate Uncle "Vivienne" Tom.

 

These are my choices so far:

 

Kissed up to all characters, so I talked up the Chantry with Cassandra while calling it "useless" with Dorian. 

 

My responses to the Maker and Herald stuff was along the lines of "I don't know". 

 

Had Leliana spare the spy and had her feel good about retreating her scouts. 

 

Full alliance with the mages.

 

Kept the Wardens as allies. 

 

In the Cass personal quest, I think I supported her and did the romantic "I believe in you" option afterwards in Skyhold. 

 

Flip flopped my ideas with Vivienne. Originally I thought she was just another advocate for mage freedom, so I lost a lot of approval with her in the beginning by saying mages should be free and all of that. Later, when I realized her character, I began to agree with her views. Like I said, total kiss up for approval.

 

Forced Gaspard, Celene and Briala to work together. 

 

Got the Giselle Cutscene- is this an iimmediate"uh oh"? 

 

And that was the last quest I did, Wicked Eyes and Wicked Hearts. I am guessing this part is pivitol, for as I come back to Skyhold, I have the reverred mother saying how be need a new divine and all that. And after that I have another cutscene with Giselle talking to Cassandra. And that's when I found this thread. These dialogue choices will be important i assume, which ones should I pick in order to maximize the chance for Leliana to become divine? I tried going all "The Chantry doesn't need to exist" and all that, but that results in a lot of approval loss. (should I just go for these options despite approval loss? 

 

So at this point, is it still possible to make Leliana divine and what options should I choose in these cutscenes right after 'wicked Eyes and Wicked Hearts"?

 

EDIT: An additional question. Should I have Cassandra rebuild the Seekers? For role-playing purposes, I think my inquisitor would be sad if Cassandra left him afterwards. So is the Seeker order worth it or is the Inquisition the way to go now? Also, I am trying play generally as a "good", character. I gave the Mages and wardens a second chance but I don't want to lose Cassandra. If I want to change this, I will need to go back... 15 hours in my 60 hour playthrough... ughh... well its not like I will be playing anything else until The Witcher 3. 

[madzilla84]

I guess I just lucked out - I had no idea it was based on so many variables. I just thought it was whoever you supported, because I supported Cassandra and she became Divine. (Played as female mage) Here's my form:


Who became your divine? (Softened/Hardened if applicable)
Cassandra

Who did you side with mages/templars and under what condition. (Conscription, free)
Free mages

When speaking to companions regarding chantry, how did you respond? (i.e. Dorian, Vivienne) (i.e. chantry is fine, mages need to be free, chantry reformed)
Chantry can be good but needs to change, but there should still be circles, albeit with more freedom

Did you do any of the war table operations to support a divine candidate? Did any come up at all?
Got Cassandra or Vivienne, supported Cassandra

Did you support a divine candidate through dialogue with them?
Had convos with Cassandra and Leliana, told Cass I thought she'd be good and told Leliana no

Who did you side with on the civil war?
Reunited Celene and Briala

Cassandra disband the seekers?
No

Leliana Kill/Spared Traitor at Haven/Sister at Chantry?
'Hardened' Leliana by accident, she killed the traitor and the sister

Leliana told she was right to keep her scouts safe, or that she was wrong?
Don't remember

And I don't know if it makes any difference, but I was closest friends with Cassandra, though by the end I'd done all 3’s personal quests.

[rubynorman]

Got Cassandra as divine.

 

Who did you side with mages/templars and under what condition. (Conscription, free)
Free Mage

When speaking to companions regarding chantry, how did you respond? (i.e. Dorian, Vivienne) (i.e. chantry is fine, mages need to be free, chantry reformed)
Mages need to be in circle under control (most of it, as i can remember. I may have chosen differently few times but certainly not with Cassandra, Leliana or Vivienne). 

 

Did you do any of the war table operations to support a divine candidate? Did any come up at all?
Yes for cassandra

Did you support a divine candidate through dialogue with them?
I do for both of them tbh.

Who did you side with on the civil war?
Celene 

Cassandra disband the seekers?
No.

Leliana Kill/Spared Traitor at Haven/Sister at Chantry?
Killed

Leliana told she was right to keep her scouts safe, or that she was wrong?
 she was Right.

Allowed Wardens to stay and free

No romance Cassandra (romance josephine)

Got cutscene of mother gisele talk to cassandra. Supported her

[xnarcosysx]

I'm not getting vivienne to comment about the divine. I've talked l talked to leliana and cassandra both. I just finished vivienne quest with the snowy wyvern, but i decided to give her a regular one. Nothing comes up but to ask about her and what she thinks of our friends.

[thesuperdarkone2]

I'm not getting vivienne to comment about the divine. I've talked l talked to leliana and cassandra both. I just finished vivienne quest with the snowy wyvern, but i decided to give her a regular one. Nothing comes up but to ask about her and what she thinks of our friends.

Did you tell her that mages should be in the chantry? That's one of the factors that encourages her to try and be divine.

[xnarcosysx]

Did you tell her that mages should be in the chantry? That's one of the factors that encourages her to try and be divine.

All my talks I've been pro mages in chantry. Pro circle etc to influence her. After they came for one of the two I told cassandra that the chantry failed.

[LupoCarlos]

First PT, Leliana is Divine (romanced Cassandra):

 

1- Mages-Freed

2- Chantry is useless, go mage freedom.

3- Did Cassandra's war table mission first, then Leliana showed and did it too.

4- I told leliana and cassandra that they would make a great divine and that i'd support them.

5- Celene is empress

6- Seekers no more

7-8- Softened Leliana.

 

Second PT, Cassandra Divine (romanced Cullen, on bad terms with Cassandra):

 

1- Templars conscripted.

2- Chantry useless, go mage freedom.

3- No War Table mission showed.

4- I told Leliana she'd be a great divine, told Cassandra that she won't 

5- Celene is Empress

6- Seekers no more

7-8- Hardened Leliana

[xnarcosysx]

Did you tell her that mages should be in the chantry? That's one of the factors that encourages her to try and be divine.

I checked with vivienne right after the wicked hearts mission where the mother yaks to you. Does something else need to occur before she thinks about becoming divine? Good thing for the keep. 2nd PT that's gotten messed up even though I've followed things to a T.

[Jaron Oberyn]

I'm not getting vivienne to comment about the divine. I've talked l talked to leliana and cassandra both. I just finished vivienne quest with the snowy wyvern, but i decided to give her a regular one. Nothing comes up but to ask about her and what she thinks of our friends.

The Vivienne chat is just like Lelianas, in that it happens after the Arbor Wilds.

[Aramintai]

Does anyone find things like mages walking on the left side and templars on the right on the title screen; Left Hand and Right Hand; Cassandra standing on the right side of the throne, Leliana on the left after the game ends as symbolic? Vivienne stands in the middle btw, just as late Divine did. I find this deliciously symbolic, not that I agree that Vivienne should be the default choice (I make her worst fear come true by making her irrelevant in my pro-mage canon  ).

 

Anyways, my last playthrough I was bent on getting unhardened Leliana as Divine, so here it is:

-Played as a believer, but never agreed about being the chosen one

-Told Vivienne that rebel war benefits no one (gets you lots of intial approval with her)

-Unconditionally allied with mages

-Told Vivienne that mages should be free (this dialogue is a flag - if you choose and option to get mages back to the Chantry this will make her another option for the Divine)

-Reunited Celene and Briala

-Told Cassandra to let Seekers go

-Admired Cassandra's views on the Chantry matter (Chantry has a place, but needs reforms) in all dialogues (romanced Cassandra)

-Didn't take any options in dialogues to support any of the candidates (doing so will give you a war table mission)

-Told Leliana she'd make a good Divine

-Never told Vivienne that the Chantry should look for candidates outside the Chantry (this is continuation of the first flag - if you didn't give her an idea of mages in the Chantry back at Haven this is another chance to make her a candidate)

 

The only thing that bothers me is a slight oversight on devs part - even if you make it so that Vivienne is never a candidate for the Divine she still has party banter (with Cassandra, specifically) and some npcs comments as though she is.

[homeydontplaydat]

When exactly does the war table mission to support Leliana and/or Cassandra appear? After which conversation and what do I have to say to trigger it? Do I need an inquisition perk to get special dialogue options? I can never find any info about their war table quests other than that they are supposed to exist.

 

I have done 3+ runs and never received them. Getting Vivienne's is easy through dialogue, but I didn't even know Cassandra and Leliana had war table missions.

 

I completed 3 runs:

 

All my toons are female so romance is irrelevant for Cassandra, I assume. I would hate to think that my fling with Iron Bull had any bearing on who sits on the sunburst throne…

 

First run- I wanted Cassandra

 

1.) Got hardened Leliana

2.) let her murder people

3.) supported chantry reform

4.) sided with mages (allies) and kept wardens as allies

5.) Supported Celene only (no elves)

6.) Never received war table mission for anyone except Vivienne (didn't do it)

7.) I encouraged Cassandra to become divine

8.) I told her to reform seekers

9.) Discouraged Leliana from becoming Divine

10.) B**** did it anyway. ARGH.

 

2ND Run- wanted Vivienne

 

1.) Got Vivienne

2.) Agreed with her about Circle's necessity (Vivienne was my BFF)

3.) I supported circles & chantry reform

4.) Sided with mages (conscripted) and kept wardens as allies

5.) Supported Celene & Briala ( twisted love conquers… Orlais!)

6.) Never received war table mission for anyone except Vivenne (I did it)

7.) I avoided talking to Cassandra and doing all her personal quests

8.) I told her to reform seekers

9.) I avoided talking to Leliana and doing all her personal quests

 

3RD Run- wanted Leliana

 

1.) Got Cassandra

2.) Put the chantry down

3.) I supported mage freedom at every opportunity. I was annoying with it.

4.) Sided with mages (allies), told wardens to get the hell out of Dodge.

5.) Tried to get Gaspard, Celene, and Briala to work together, I don't think it worked out for Briala though…

6.) Never received war table mission for anyone- I avoided Vivienne

7.) I did some of Cassandra's quests- the Lord Seeker one. Not the others.

8.) I told her to reform seekers/make them better. Discouraged her from becoming Divine.

9.) I did Leliana's quests (she was softened). Supported her to become divine.

10.) And it went to CASSANDRA.

 

Conclusion: This is silly. I think there's a bug for it to be so unreliable with who becomes Divine. 

 

Also, reading other people's choices and outcomes, I have had drastically different choice combinations and some are even exactly the same- I ALWAYS end up with the opposite candidate of whom I should logically get. If I support Leliana I will get Cassandra and if I support Cassandra I get Leliana. Vivienne is the only one that I seem to have a modicum of control over and I'm pretty sure it's the war table quest that locked her in for me. I think there might actually be a bug, which would be unsurprising. It really shouldn't be this complicated. The game is too long and I have a life. It's annoying that some off handed remark to stupid Dorian might alter the course of WORLD EVENTS. Or maybe it's because I killed Ruck in the deep roads. I'll never know.

 

UPDATE: I completed my 4th run and got softened Leliana- which was my goal. The differences were that I stopped saying 'I don't know' about anything religion and said things like 'i don't believe in your gods' etc. I NEVER wavered on it. I also told Cassanda to 'forget the chantry' instead of rebuild the seekers. Though she ended up doing that anyway. I also reconciled Briala and Celene.

 

What I don't like about this system is that it feels like Bioware is imposing a 'type' onto our characters. For example, if I want Vivienne, I feel like I have to 'say certain things' or make 'certain choices' that might go counter to what I initially wanted for my toon's personality. It forces my inquisitor to conform to a certain type just to get the Divine I want. I suppose it's easiest if you just don't care either way.

[zeypher]

Can i ask what happens to the mages if they are conscripted and leliana is the divine?

 

Edit: Can leliana be even an option with mages conscripted. So far looking back there does not seem to have been a single case where this has happened. Mages conscripted and leliana as the divine.