113 réponses à ce sujet

[DAOfanado]

Cardboard World

 

Besides the huges issues with PC-Controls and even more casualization i have one concern that will probably stop me from playing within hours. Is this just in the beginning? Or since nobody posts about this am i the only one who cares about that?:

 

• there is no NPC-Interaction besides fixed interactions at all?!
• there is no Companion-Interaction besides fixed interactions?!
• NPCs generally act more like cardboard-walls than NPCs - they dont react to the player - they wont move - they are completely non-interactive?
• allmost all objects in the world are non interactive(chests, barrels etc.) - loot comes from random stuff lying on the floor instead of all thos barrels etc.?!

 

 

Maybe im the only one but this pretty much ruins the game for me. It feels as if i am running trough a huge dead world. Size simply cant compensate for the small interactdions that make it feel alive - which seems to be completely missing in this game.

 

Will this be better later on or is this a constant problem? How can this even be considered an RPG when there is no Interaction besides scripted interactions?

 

Fighting:

• This for me is just gamebreaking (besides the awful controls, the boring fight-mechanic (seriously wtf did they think - either make it a hack and slash or a tactical almost turnbased fight - but this mixture just combines the worst things of both worlds ...))

 

UI:

• the UI is ugly and looks completely out of place it looks like a SciFi-UI
• the Inventory is bad aswell it looks exactly like the awful Skyrim Design - which is great for consoles - but completley sucks for PC

Loot-System:

• costantly pressing a button just to see loot because its not where you would expect it (in actual chests etc. ...)
• constantly beeing remided of the awful out of place UI with the worst sound ever for an RPG (seriously i am 99% certain that sound is copy pasted from the motion tracker in Alien ...)

Romance System:

• Why even bother including a romance system when there are barely any options combined with some of the worst looking NPC-Faces i have ever seen?
• Not every Charackter should look like a supermodel - but some should at least look decent ... (i especially dislike that pretty much every charackter has short hair ...) (not to mention the general lack of fantasy apropriate themes - most of the hair styles are either awful or out of place (lots of undercut stuff etc.) sure add those but please also add fantasy hairstyles that look good (but i guess Bioware always failed when it comes to hair ...))

 

Am i the only one that feels like running arround in a cardboard-world?

[tostru]

Disagree on all points.

[JCAP]

I also disagree with all points.

[Giubba]

Not sure if trolling or just hating

[nici2412]

Agree with most of your points. Especially the lifless world is immersion breaking for me and unfortunaly bioware proved again that they can't create places, which feel alive.

First I was sad, that we won't have the opportunity to visit a big city, but only a small part of it. After spending 5 minutes in Val Royeaux i just wanted to get out of it. It was cold, sterile and lifeless. Basically Kirkwall 2.0.

Redcliffe Village was the same. There are tons of people there but 90% of them are just standing there and doing nothing. Other rpgs manage to give their citizens a daily routine, which really helps to give the npcs a personality and make the world feel alive, while in this game almost all npcs are just there for decoration purpose.

[DAOfanado]

@Giubba, JCAP, tostru

 

Would you mind to explain wh you disagree?

Will there be more interaction in the game later on?

 

Since when is posting critique automatically hating? I actually was what one would call a Bioware Fanboy - i really enjoyed most games before DA2. Sadly i never finished DAO (stopped after about 80 hours because of some geam breaking bug (game was constantly crashing)). Still obviously i enjoyed the game.

 

Thing is this game just feels "sterile" since most of the NPCs do nothing. I wouldnt even require them to do routines for all of them but would it be to much to ask to add some random dialogue and animations when you bump into them? This may sounds trivial but these are things that make the world feel alive or make it feel like a theater-stage where 99% of the stuff is "fake".

 

It really breaks my immersion if i am running arround in a citie with lots of NPCs but 99% of them are simply non interactive and wont even react to me at all.

 

This also appiles to the "barrel-problem" why are there so many barrels and chests if almost none of them are interactive and loot is randomly lying on the floor? Why cant i move objects. Physics for objects are standard since almost a decade now?

[Muspade]

I heard about this game called "life".

It's pretty good occasionally.

[RSX Titan]

Agree with most of your points. Especially the lifless world is immersion breaking for me and unfortunaly bioware proved again that they can't create places, which feel alive.
First I was sad, that we won't have the opportunity to visit a big city, but only a small part of it. After spending 5 minutes in Val Royeaux i just wanted to get out of it. It was cold, sterile and lifeless. Basically Kirkwall 2.0.
Redcliffe Village was the same. There are tons of people there but 90% of them are just standing there and doing nothing. Other rpgs manage to give their citizens a daily routine, which really helps to give the npcs a personality and make the world feel alive, while in this game almost all npcs are just there for decoration purpose.

You just described 90% of RPGs not named Ultima or TES. I fail to see the issue. Personally I'd rather talk to 10% of the NPC population then 100% with the same 4 generic lines of text recycled endlessly.

[DAOfanado]

You just described 90% of RPGs not named Ultima or TES. I fail to see the issue. Personally I'd rather talk to 10% of the NPC population then 100% with the same 4 generic lines of text recycled endlessly.

 

Well some did a rather good job. Even though Skyrim has tons of flaws small things like pushing over stuff and even the repetitive dialogues or bumping into NPCs adds life to the world. No one is asking for meaningful conversation. Also colision animations for example should be something easy to implement.

 

Thing is there should be some form of interaction with as much as possible. It adds to the feeling of beeing part of a world - at least for me. (i actually think skyrim is an awful game (which is an amazing game with mods))

 

As an example:

The beginning of DAI where you wake up in the bed. You move outside and there are tons of people standing arround - doing nothing - not reacting to you - non interactive and wont move even an inch if you bump into them. Its not bad if you just run from point A to B. But if you explore the world just seems sterile.

 

Im glad some people actually use a forum to discuss stuff. Why are so many people even joining a forum when they do nothing more than posting 3 words or try to attack others posters?

[Indoctrination]

Stop right there, criminal scum! This game is immune to criticism, so this topic is quite illegal! I'm taking you straight to fanboy jail! Maybe a few centuries of hard time will teach you not to have unauthorized opinions.

 

Let that be a lesson to anyone else who thinks it's okay to point out that 90% of the side quests in this game seem to play like a cheap rehash of The Old Republic.

 

As for the loyal members of the state who have been tainted by exposure to this topic, implement the standard emergency procedure. Cover your ears, close your eyes, and shout BEST GAME EVER until all dissent has been silenced.

[xkg]

 

Since when is posting critique automatically hating?

 

Some of more rabid fans here can't stand any kind of critque, different tastes and opinions is unknown concept for them.

It's like you are pissing in their cheerios so you better be ready to be labeled as a troll, hater etc... They can't counter some of the arguments so silly one liners is all they have.

[Paul E Dangerously]

The inventory is great for consoles? Is this Bizarro day? I hate to tell you, it's clunky as all hell. I'd love to slap the person that decided to put buy/sell on the buttons where previous category/next category used to be, personally.

 

I half agree with the loot system. I'm fine with it not necessarily being in chests, but I like actually being able to SEE it. I didn't miss loot very often in DAO or DA2. It's damn near invisible in a lot of cases in DAI, unless you're in a dungeon, where the highlight works.

[DAOfanado]

The inventory is great for consoles? Is this Bizarro day? I hate to tell you, it's clunky as all hell. I'd love to slap the person that decided to put buy/sell on the buttons where previous category/next category used to be, personally.

 

I half agree with the loot system. I'm fine with it not necessarily being in chests, but I like actually being able to SEE it. I didn't miss loot very often in DAO or DA2. It's damn near invisible in a lot of cases in DAI, unless you're in a dungeon, where the highlight works.

 

Arent list inventories in general way better for controllers than lets say a classical huge backpack?

[Maconbar]

 

 

Am i the only one that feels like running arround in a cardboard-world?

Am I the only one that hates the "Am I the only one ..." use in threads?

[nici2412]

You just described 90% of RPGs not named Ultima or TES. I fail to see the issue. Personally I'd rather talk to 10% of the NPC population then 100% with the same 4 generic lines of text recycled endlessly.

Just look at this city between 1:00- 3.24 and then compare it to the villages/city parts/camps of Dragon Age inqusition to see the issue.

 

Listen to the narrator at 1:56:

"It's a living, breathing eco system with thousands of inhabitants. Everyone in the city [...] have their day and night activities and past times. They make all of Novigrads four districts unique, characteristic places, worlds within a world."

 

That's exactly what I'm missing and why I'm saying that the (minor) npcs within inqusition feel like there are just decoration and not a part of the world.

I didn't even expect to create such big places, but at least they could have given this daily routine to to the people in small villages like redcliffe.

[AllThatJazz]

@Giubba, JCAP, tostru

 

Would you mind to explain wh you disagree?

Will there be more interaction in the game later on?

 

Since when is posting critique automatically hating? I actually was what one would call a Bioware Fanboy - i really enjoyed most games before DA2. Sadly i never finished DAO (stopped after about 80 hours because of some geam breaking bug (game was constantly crashing)). Still obviously i enjoyed the game.

 

Thing is this game just feels "sterile" since most of the NPCs do nothing. I wouldnt even require them to do routines for all of them but would it be to much to ask to add some random dialogue and animations when you bump into them? This may sounds trivial but these are things that make the world feel alive or make it feel like a theater-stage where 99% of the stuff is "fake".

 

It really breaks my immersion if i am running arround in a citie with lots of NPCs but 99% of them are simply non interactive and wont even react to me at all.

 

This also appiles to the "barrel-problem" why are there so many barrels and chests if almost none of them are interactive and loot is randomly lying on the floor? Why cant i move objects. Physics for objects are standard since almost a decade now?

It seems odd to me that you liked Origins, since that too had plenty of NPCs just standing around, and tons of characters/objects you couldn't interact with. In fact even more so - I've already, for example, been inside almost as many buildings just in Haven than I was able to go into throughout the whole of DAO.

 

Bioware have never really 'done' cities to the same degree as something like Assassin's Creed, nor have they ever done interactivity like TES - personally I'm okay with this, since the repetitive dialogue would get on my nerves in Skyrim. Your mileage may vary, obviously.

 

As far as your other problems are concerned - well, I agree that there should be more and longer hairstyles, and that tactical combat is currently a bit of a mess, though I don't mind the third-person fighting. I'm also not too fond of the pinging, though I find it more bearable since I remapped to the 'z' key. Inventory could be more clearly set out, yeah. But if I can cope with pre EE Witcher 1 inventory and Morrowind's horrible journal, I'll manage with this inventory and hope for a fix in the long-term.

 

Everything else - the UI (I've seen better, I've seen worse), companions (I like 'em. A lot - there's much more interaction with them, more dialogue options than we got in DA2, so far it's on a par with DAO for me.). And I don't feel as though the world is dead at all, no - it shows far more life than either previous DA, that's for sure (in my view, anyway).

 

I'm enjoying DAI very much, I think it's a lovely game - with flaws that I would like to see fixed, hopefully. I certainly don't have a problem with people expressing criticism, as long it's delivered in a calm and measured fashion and doesn't seek to put down those who disagree - and the same goes for praising the game. It seems to me, though, that just as some here would rather no-one be critical at all, there are some critics who would rather those who like the game not say so and go away - and those who do are called 'fanboys' and other derogatory terms. That's a shame, I think. It would be nice if people here felt free to offer both critique and praise without feeling censured for doing so

[RSX Titan]

Well some did a rather good job. Even though Skyrim has tons of flaws small things like pushing over stuff and even the repetitive dialogues or bumping into NPCs adds life to the world. No one is asking for meaningful conversation. Also colision animations for example should be something easy to implement.
 
Thing is there should be some form of interaction with as much as possible. It adds to the feeling of beeing part of a world - at least for me. (i actually think skyrim is an awful game (which is an amazing game with mods))
 
As an example:
The beginning of DAI where you wake up in the bed. You move outside and there are tons of people standing arround - doing nothing - not reacting to you - non interactive and wont move even an inch if you bump into them. Its not bad if you just run from point A to B. But if you explore the world just seems sterile.
 
Im glad some people actually use a forum to discuss stuff. Why are so many people even joining a forum when they do nothing more than posting 3 words or try to attack others posters?

Yeah I'd like for the world to be more organic as well but my point, which was poorly illustrated, is that most games suffer from this issue. The overwhelming response from developers has been to add crowds of NPCs that do nothing. I long for the days of Ultima but sadly those days are gone. DA:I is a great game but it has its issues just like every other game ever released. Considering the steps back that DA2 and ME3 were I think k DA:I is step in the right direction.

[Paul E Dangerously]

 

Bioware have never really 'done' cities to the same degree as something like Assassin's Creed, nor have they ever done interactivity like TES - personally I'm okay with this, since the repetitive dialogue would get on my nerves in Skyrim. Your mileage may vary, obviously.

 

It's a bit dated now, but Athkatla in BG2 was really damned big. And even the recent games had multi-zone cities. Seems as of ME2 and beyond they've really started to hate urban areas.

[Murloc Knight]

Dragon Age has always been like this so I already knew what to expect when before I played the game. Have you played oither dragon age games before?

[AllThatJazz]

It's a bit dated now, but Athkatla in BG2 was really damned big. And even the recent games had multi-zone cities. Seems as of ME2 and beyond they've really started to hate urban areas.

 

It was big, sure. Not exactly teeming with life and interactivity, though. Same with Baldur's Gate in the first BG (though I think that's the best city Bioware has ever done). That's what I meant by 'they don't do cities' - they've always done something that's more the idea of a city rather than a city itself, I guess.

 

I think part of the reason for this is the party mechanic and pathfinding. It would be a nightmare trying to navigate 3, 4 (or six, in the old days!) party members around a city with a dense population all bustling around. It isn't great in Skyrim with a companion - luckily, since Skyrim companions have all the charm and personality of a bowl of Allbran, it doesn't really matter if they get lost/stuck/dead. And games like TW, AssCreed - well, you're only moving one person around, so you haven't got to consider pathfinding to the same degree. (There's also the issue that, as lovely as Vizima was in TW1, it ran like a dog with two legs - even on a high-end machine, though that's a different concern).

 

But that party system is core to Bioware games - it's certainly one of the biggest reasons I play them - I personally wouldn't trade that mechanic, and the banter and interactivity that goes with it for busier cities and I suspect I'm far from alone in that - though again, dem opinions, eh? x

[ashwind]

Bioware is not known for creating organic crowded cites like Witcher, TES, Assassin Creed etc.

 

I can see that they are struggling with crowd display alone. When you enter RedCliff, you will notice frame drops and that is from just displaying all those static NPC. This has always been Bioware's weakness since as long as I can remember. It is a weakness and I acknowledge it. Game breaking, no. I am waiting for Witcher III next year to deliver that living breathing world that I too enjoy greatly.

 

Haven said that, when I am playing those games that has beautiful organic world.... I too feel empty because I do not have great companions... my characters in other game will not give a darn about any NPC/Companions because I simply do not find them interesting.

 

Of course in the future as hardware and software advances, I hope I can enjoy everything in a single game.

[tostru]

 
Haven said that, when I am playing those games that has beautiful organic world.... I too feel empty because I do not have great companions... my characters in other game will not give a darn about any NPC/Companions because I simply do not find them interesting.
 
Of course in the future as hardware and software advances, I hope I can enjoy everything in a single game.

Perfect summarisation. At the moment we can't have it both ways and so it comes down to what you prefer. A world with 'living, breathing NPCs that follow their own schedule' doesn't do anything for me. I don't care what most NPCs are doing.

[JCAP]

@Giubba, JCAP, tostru

 

Would you mind to explain wh you disagree?

I didn't explain because there was so much negativity in your post that I thought this was just another random hateful/troll thread.

 

Since that seems not to be the case, I will explain:

there is no NPC-Interaction besides fixed interactions at all?!

Well, I don't really know what are your standards for random NPC interaction. What do you want to do with them? Do they really need to do more than they need? Imagine an NPC that delivers you a message, do you want to discuss the weather with him?

 

there is no Companion-Interaction besides fixed interactions?!

 

I don't really see a problem here. The interaction with them is already good, what else do you want?

 

NPCs generally act more like cardboard-walls than NPCs - they dont react to the player - they wont move - they are completely non-interactive?

 

Yeah sure, it would be nice if they moved, but in the end, what does it matter? Those kind of NPC's just have the purpose to tell you "Hey, this area is populated". Besides, I find it very annoying when I want to get somewhere and some ramdom moving NPC gets in my way, like Skyrim.

 

allmost all objects in the world are non interactive(chests, barrels etc.) - loot comes from random stuff lying on the floor instead of all thos barrels etc.?!

 

I didn't get this one. What do you want to do with them?

Fighting:

• This for me is just gamebreaking (besides the awful controls, the boring fight-mechanic (seriously wtf did they think - either make it a hack and slashor a tactical almost turnbased fight - but this mixture just combines the worst things of both worlds ...)

Well, this is a matter of taste. For me, the only awkward element is having to hold down R or LMB. So there's no much to explain here, I simply disagree.

 

UI:

• the UI is ugly and looks completely out of place it looks like a SciFi-UI
• the Inventory is bad aswell it looks exactly like the awful Skyrim Design - which is great for consoles - but completley sucks for PC

- Matter of taste again, I think the UI is really well done (except the part I can't have more than 8 abilities at the same time). As for the aesthetics, I think is good enough, it's not a masterpiece but it's definetly not ugly.

- Why is the inventory bad? What could they have done to make it better? (side note: how is Skyrim design great for consoles????)

 

Loot-System:

• costantly pressing a button just to see loot because its not where you would expect it (in actual chests etc. ...)
• constantly beeing remided of the awful out of place UI with the worst sound ever for an RPG (seriously i am 99% certain that sound is copy pasted from the motion tracker in Alien ...)

- Most chests have loot, I don't really see your point there

- Matter of taste again, it doesn't bother me in the least.

 

Romance System:

• Why even bother including a romance system when there are barely any options combined with some of the worst looking NPC-Faces i have ever seen?
• Not every Charackter should look like a supermodel - but some should at least look decent ... (i especially dislike that pretty much every charackter has short hair ...) (not to mention the general lack of fantasy apropriate themes - most of the hair styles are either awful or out of place (lots of undercut stuff etc.) sure add those but please also add fantasy hairstyles that look good (but i guess Bioware always failed when it comes to hair ...))

- Barely any option... Let me ask you something, is Dragon Age a dating simulator or a RPG? You have 2 options for straight male, 4 for straight female and 3 homosexual options. I think this is good enough.

- Dragon Age is supposed to be a Dark Fantasy. I know, doesn't feel like one sometimes but that's what DA is at the core. DA is not a shiny full of exaggeration RPG. As a soldier, it makes sense Cassandra having short hair, if you were reffering to her.

 

TL;DR: I disagree with every single point you said. Pardon me for having a different opinion.

[llandwynwyn]

Bioware was really foolish on creating a huge world with no day/night cycle and lacking npc ai.
 
While I adore DAI and don't really mind this, it hurts the game. Especially because people will compare it to TW and Skyrim, and they're right in doing so.

They should've focused more on the important missions and party interaction.

[Chari]

I agree with everything except the "romance" part