82 réponses à ce sujet

[Lebanese Dude]

I see a lot of people on this forum complaining about side quest content and their relative uselessness.

 

Those same people bring up Skyrim, The Witcher, and other RPGs in comparison citing that those games have better side quests. They say that despite those games having fetch quests, they usually have more content than the "MMO" style of DAI. (WoW has more lore than TES could ever hope to achieve so I don't even understand this but whatever)

 

That's an observation, if not a completely misguided one.

 

Interesting that those games are mentioned, considering that all of those games are single character games that all have only one thing in common: The RPG genre. 

 

It's like comparing Saints Row to LA Noire. 

 

Skyrim has horrid voice acting and a relatively short (and sometimes irrelevant) main quest. It's entire premise is exploration and it excels pretty amazingly at it. Out of all these games, it allows the greatest degree of character roleplaying.

 

The Witcher has great storytelling, but mainly focuses on one character and their actions in the world. It's entire premise is playing as a preset character and shaping the world. So essentially you roleplay through your character.

 

Meanwhile, Dragon Age: Inquisition is a party-based narrative cinematic RPG with elements of open-world exploration. 

What's my point you ask?
 

You see there's thing called a word budget. Mr. Gaider explains it far better than I ever could here. 

To sum it up, writing is not a free-for-all. There has to be certain limits.

 

Consider this:

 

1) You have 12 companions, each of which offering hours of content and thousands of lines of dialogue in the form of quests, conversations, and banter.

 

2) You have a long main quest that has divergent paths.

 

3) You have TWO previous games that have an effect on the current world, leading to a different world state each time you play the game.

 

On top of all that, you are asking for "meaningful" side quests that are stories of their own.

 

Really now? Are the above listed NOT enough to justify the 60$ some of you keep hawking about with entitlement? You are asking for more?

Drown EAWare in the dregs!

 

It's not as if Dragon Age does not have those either. Admittedly there are a lot of side missions, but those are all entirely optional.

 

Would you have preferred if they were all clustered on some chantry board like in DAO? Do you prefer them be received from random locations in the world like in DA2?

At least those "meaningless" quests provide an element of exploration. They provide you with rewards to increase the power of your organization. They can serve for roleplaying. 

Considering that you bought DAI knowing full well that it's a relatively open-world RPG, you should have expected some grunt work. You should be able to at least do the bare minimum if it's so traumatizing to escort a druffalo.

 

At this point it seems most requests are spawned from gluttony rather than necessity.

[ORTesc]

And yet open world doesn't mean random fetch quests. You can have an open world game and still have meaningful missions that don't spam the map with "collect 10 apples". The fact is, Origins did do this better simply because there were less of these "fetch 10 apples" quests. And yes they existed. But most of the time everything you were doing had a cutscene at the end with a conversation to reward the player, even if the decision(s) didn't matter.

 

The fact is this game DOES feel very mmo-y. Anyone that's played The Old Republic can immediately see the inspiration. I mean, people can sit here and be a white knight all they want, and doesn't help anyone hiding what the game actually is - a solid rpg with issues.

[Lebanese Dude]

And yet open world doesn't mean random fetch quests. You can have an open world game and still have meaningful missions that don't spam the map with "collect 10 apples". The fact is, Origins did do this better simply because there were less of these "fetch 10 apples" quests. And yes they existed. But most of the time everything you were doing had a cutscene at the end with a conversation to reward the player, even if the decision(s) didn't matter.

 

The fact is this game DOES feel very mmo-y. Anyone that's played The Old Republic can immediately see the inspiration. I mean, people can sit here and be a white knight all they want, and doesn't help anyone hiding what the game actually is - a solid rpg with issues.

 

So your argument boils down to "there's too much of an optional thing"?

[ORTesc]

So your argument boils down to "there's too much of an optional thing"?

 

My argument remains that this is a solid rpg with issues. Is that really such a bad thing to say? Can we not fault the game for what it does wrong and praise it for what it does right? My opinion is that is that the sidequests in this game feel very grindy, even if optional (to a point). "put this in a tree halfway across the map" is grunt work when I just spent 40 hours building an army to save the world. And doesn't make sense and it IS lazy game development. That doesn't mean I'm saying the entire game is horrible or that the entire development team is lazy, it's not such a black and white issue. People seem to see extremes in a "good/bad" kinda way, and it can only be either or. Criticism has it's place in this industry beyond trolls and whining.

[Shaftell]

I don't have a problem with it. People automatically make silly comparisons to DAO. DAI is a bigger game than DAO and 2 put together. Expect filler. In such a vast game, not everything is going to be meaningful or have cut scenes. The game itself is fantastic. If you want to complain, complain about the bugs.

[Lebanese Dude]

My argument remains that this is a solid rpg with issues. Is that really such a bad thing to say? Can we not fault the game for what it does wrong and praise it for what it does right? My opinion is that is that the sidequests in this game feel very grindy, even if optional (to a point). "put this in a tree halfway across the map" is grunt work when I just spent 40 hours building an army to save the world. And doesn't make sense and it IS lazy game development. That doesn't mean I'm saying the entire game is horrible or that the entire development team is lazy, it's not such a black and white issue. People seem to see extremes in a "good/bad" kinda way, and it can only be either or. Criticism has it's place in this industry beyond trolls and whining.

There is no criticism. All you keep insinuating is that you are forced to do this optional content when you aren't.

 

There's an entire story and cast of characters to enjoy. The scope of this thread is the writing which many here feel they are at liberty to judge without any basis.

 

To claim that the writing of  DAI is a product of laziness is frankly stupid.

[ORTesc]

I don't have a problem with it. People automatically make silly comparisons to DAO. DAI is a bigger game than DAO and 2 put together. Expect filler. In such a vast game, not everything is going to be meaningful or have cut scenes. The game itself is fantastic. If you want to complain, complain about the bugs.

 

Why should I expect filler? What is the purpose especially when the game was delayed an entire year? Honestly, what is the purpose? To say the game runs at 90 hours instead of a meaningful 40? I don't understand why we're supposed to expect anything less than absolute quality from a developer that, at one point, was held with such high regard?

[ORTesc]

There is no criticism. All you keep insinuating is that you are forced to do this optional content when you aren't.

There's an entire story and cast of characters to enjoy. To claim that those are products of laziness is frankly stupid.

 

Did you read what I just said to you 2 seconds ago?

"That doesn't mean I'm saying the entire game is horrible or that the entire development team is lazy, it's not such a black and white issue."

 

I'm not saying the game is bad dude, it has issues. Nothing more.

[Aurok]

25 hours in. All I've seen so far is padding. Hope this improves.

[Lebanese Dude]

25 hours in. All I've seen so far is padding. Hope this improves.

 

Have you move past the Hinterlands?

[ev76]

The world is huge, spoiler : side quest heavy. I'm personally enjoying the side quests, most of them are tied to the story, for example, getting the stable master and horses for the inquisition, you have to put work in to help the farm. I also like how the mobs change within the world, you will see mages, then criminals, then Templars, go back later in the game you see vinatori, then dark spawn. Love that.

[ORTesc]

25 hours in. All I've seen so far is padding. Hope this improves.

 

Honesty. And you'll continue to see posts like this from people that aren't foaming at the mouth to product their precious Bioware. Again, trying to hide what this game is doesn nothing to help improve it or the developer that made it. People need to stop being a white knight and learn how to pick apart that which they enjoy without taking sides.

[Lebanese Dude]

Honesty. And you'll continue to see posts like this from people that aren't foaming at the mouth to product their precious Bioware. Again, trying to hide what this game is doesn nothing to help improve it or the developer that made it. People need to stop being a white knight and learn how to pick apart that which they enjoy without taking sides.

 

At least I foam in the mouth with reason.

 

Meanwhile you still haven't presented one decent argument. Irrational animus much?

[ORTesc]

I think I'm done here.

[Lebanese Dude]

I think I'm done here.

You never started to begin with.

[DarkKnightHolmes]

My advice? Screw the fetch quest. I just play missions that feel worthwhile.

[Lebanese Dude]

My advice? Screw the fetch quest. I just play missions that feel worthwhile.

 

Whenever I replay the DA and TES games, I only do the quests that I feel make sense for my character to do.

 

I don't think I've done the Slim Couldry or the Illegal Denerim quests for months...

[ev76]

My advice? Screw the fetch quest. I just play missions that feel worthwhile.

That's sound advice, me personally I'm doing as much as possible. I'm always thinking of the MAYHEM! Lol.

[Elhanan]

Have played 38 hrs, which includes 5 starts for the CC to try and get the look right for cut-scenes. And I am only 6th lvl in the Hinterlnds; the content is enormous! For me, it is much like SWTOR when I played it solo, but this time there is a party, can Pause and consider choices, tactics, etc. It is DA: the MMO for solo players.

So there are a lot of side-quests available. Personally, I choose the ones that fit my 'head canon' storyline, and can pass on those deemed to be minor. And again like SWTOR, many of the side-quests may be completed while playing and exploring for other quests. have only seen fit to ignore a single quest thus far, but may return when the area is secure.

Am quite pleased thus far.

[Lebanese Dude]

So there are a lot of side-quests available. Personally, I choose the ones that fit my 'head canon' storyline, and can pass on those deemed to be minor. And again like SWTOR, many of the side-quests may be completed while playing and exploring for other quests. have only seen fit to ignore a single quest thus far, but may return when the area is secure.

Am quite pleased thus far.

Exactly so.

[StingingVelvet]

I honestly cannot even fathom how people don't see the shift to MMO design in this game. It baffles me that you think it's inherent to the kind of game this is, or no different from previous games and other singleplayer RPGs.

[Lebanese Dude]

I honestly cannot even fathom how people don't see the shift to MMO design in this game. It baffles me that you think it's inherent to the kind of game this is, or no different from previous games and other singleplayer RPGs.

There's no multiplayer component in the campaign.

There is no online component in the campaign beyond importing a world state.

There is no faction reputation grinding.

There are no daily quests.

There are no weekly raids.

There are no LFG queues.

There is no PvP.

There isn't even a chatbox!!

 

When does the MMO factor in? Is it the part where there are fetch quests inherent in every RPG ever made?

 

Next thing you know we'll start calling DAI a hook-up app cause there are some romance elements involved. O wait some people already do that as well.

[StingingVelvet]

When does the MMO  factor in? Is it the part where there are fetch quests inherent in every RPG ever made?

 

World design is a big one. Tons of art and sights to see but no depth or anything to really find in any of it. Find a cool lighthouse on the edge of the swamp but the only thing it's good for is too look at. No one lives there, no loot is hidden in it, nothing. That's MMO design.

 

Quest design. Every quest in every RPG involves fetching, sure, but they dress that up using a myriad of methods that make it feel like more. Story, faction play, choice and consequence, multiple methods of completion, multiple outcomes, multiple quest NPCs with different goals, etc. etc. Even a simple quest like finding a sexbot in New Vegas allows you different paths and people to talk to in order to find it, repair it, deliver it, etc. And that's a simple fetch quest in that game, one of the simplest there is. In Inquisition every sidequest is: you click on the note or NPC, get a sentence or two about collecting X or killing Y, go do it without any further dialog or choice, then turn it in. That's MMO design.

 

I can't believe I have to explain this to RPG gamers.

[iheartbob]

I personally don't go out of my way to complete every single fetch quest right away. I will generally search for the more relevant markers on the map and then when I see one of those "deliver these flowers to the shrine" markers nearby, I will scurry up the nearby hill to do it because it is right there and convenient. And then I will not necessarily return to the original quest giver until, again ... it is convenient and I have a reason to be in the area. This makes the whole thing feel less "fetch" like to me. I often will leave and come back to an area several times before I turn in one of those fetch quests.

 

They are avoidable and there is still plenty of content to keep a person busy. Those quests are mostly for completionists who ... to be frank, enjoy that kind of gaming sadism.

 

There have been plenty of times I have just wandered around the various regions and happened to stumble into a random side quest that was probably given to me 20 hours or so in the game and just gone "Wow, this is beautiful and amazing."

 

People are just getting way too caught up in micromanaging the game. Go out, explore and enjoy. Stop worrying about every single fetch quest. Do them when they are convenient and you are already working on a more important mission. Or when you are bored because you just grinded your way through a harder portion of the main quest and you just feel like an easy frolic through a meadow or past a waterfall. And then one of those annoying shards you went crazy trying to collect in the beginning of the game will just magically be there and it won't feel like any trouble when you saunter on over to pick it up.

[Father_Jerusalem]

And yet open world doesn't mean random fetch quests. You can have an open world game and still have meaningful missions that don't spam the map with "collect 10 apples". The fact is, Origins did do this better simply because there were less of these "fetch 10 apples" quests. And yes they existed. But most of the time everything you were doing had a cutscene at the end with a conversation to reward the player, even if the decision(s) didn't matter.

 

The fact is this game DOES feel very mmo-y. Anyone that's played The Old Republic can immediately see the inspiration. I mean, people can sit here and be a white knight all they want, and doesn't help anyone hiding what the game actually is - a solid rpg with issues.

 

Anyone who dismisses people who are enjoying themselves playing this game as "white knights" is not someone whose opinion I actually care about, frankly.