277 réponses à ce sujet

[lichg]

In any case, most if not all of those things got fixed but for some reason they continued to mess with the combat system and while opinions may vary on the style you prefer at the end of the day if you got the game over the hype they made about the tac cam and how better the tactical aspect of the game is you were being lied to. Its not an opinion. It was a lie but it can be fixed.

[mmoblitz]

I have changed to normal mode and don't use Tactical camera at all.  My party still wipes a lot, but with the right party and builds it is possible to kill the big bosses.  I have taken down a dragon by using a party of all mages.  Perhaps the lose of behaviors is a direct result of using the Frostbite 3 engine?   I need to ask my cousin what he knows about it.  He is a software engineer in the gaming industry.  He warning me about the PC version game long before release and I didn't listen.  Shame on me.

[keyip]

Really getting pissed off trying to control my party >:c

[Razir-Samus]

Dude.

There were people who liked DA2. There was also a HUGE number of people who didn't like it, it got mediocre reviews, mediocre sales, and in the end, Bioware themselves scratched planned DLCs for it and went on to change the formula.

 

The "nitpicked" flaws are anything but nitpicks, just some of the top of my head:

- tiny world

- reused maps

- waves of enemies

- disjointed story, weak antagonists, plot holes (to the point EVEN BIOWARE MAKES FUN OF ORSINO'S ACTIONS IN YOUR TALK TO VARRIC IN DA:I)

- no item descriptions

- no exploration

- no companion customization etc etc.

- max. 5 minute quests (talk to NPC, teleport somewhere, kill 5 mobs, go back)

-  etc etc etc

 

(apart from the story, which is an opinion I can strongly argue, everything else listed there are FACTS)

 

Also, DA2 came out in 2011.

In the same year we got Skyrim, Dark Souls and Witcher 2 and they all made DA2 look like Tetris.

To be honest, I thought KOA:Reckoning was easily a better game than DA2 as well.

h-h-h-h-h-hyperbole!!!!! love it.

[PillarBiter]

KOA was glorious.

 

In any case, the game is enjoyable and fun to me, but it has it's flaws. 

Witht his many flaws, I'm honestly asking myself if some bioware joker accidentally deleted the latest build and all copies went out with the build from a year ago

Honestly. This could've used another year. 

 

If they even had to cut freaking tactics settings? Serouisly? I don't know Much about AI programming, but shouldn't it be easier to program that than having a complete AI control a player smartly?

[lichg]

bioware please respond it just doesnt make sense

[Ageyth]

for a game that was clearly aiming to have more fast paced action packed combat, the lack of tactics ruins it by making the rest of the party dumb as a bag of rocks. I really do miss the DA:O tactics, especially the many mods to expand it. heck, they could have at least added different levels of "preferred" skills, and ability to use other potions/tonics, etc. defend is also pretty broken, stands by person and waits for them to get hit... yeah, real good tank there. warriors seem to do an awful job, ranged characters end up in melee too often getting themselves killed by attacking random targets not being tanked, mages won't revive most of the time... stand there casting whatever spell they choose. I despise the tactical view, but switching characters makes my inquisitor waste abilities or do something stupid.

 

my guess is they thought it was too complicated for casuals to understand a full featured customizable AI system, but even that could have been alleviated by giving simple presets like "tank" "ranged" "melee" "support" etc, while still offering manual customization.

[Hexoduen]

To quote AngryJoe regarding tactical options in Inquisition:

 

"The behaviour screen for your companions gives you only a pathetic five options, they're pretty simplistic, not what I expect, useless unfortunately..."

[lichg]

Angryjoe didnt even mention the tactics menu tho.. i guess he thought it was so minimalistic it didnt rlly exist

[Pewps]

The lack of tactics really killed combat for me. I can't imagine the frustration that would happen by playing this game on Nightmare. 

[Hexoduen]

Angryjoe didnt even mention the tactics menu tho.. i guess he thought it was so minimalistic it didnt rlly exist

 

Yeah I'm assuming AngryJoe is talking about both the behaviour screen and the tactics menu, since there really is only 1 option in the tactics menu (simple list of abilities) and then we have those 4 options in the behaviour menu.

 

I'd love to have the real tactics menu from DA2 back.

 

[Icy Magebane]

To quote AngryJoe regarding tactical options in Inquisition:

 

"The behaviour screen for your companions gives you only a pathetic five options, they're pretty simplistic, not what I expect, useless unfortunately..."

Thanks for the heads up.  I hadn't realized his review was out yet... I'm going to go watch that now.

 

Anyway, I agree with almost this entire thread... the tactics system was great and I have no idea why they got rid of it.  I've also noticed the AI doing a lot of stupid things, particularly the rogues who seem to always need to be rescued.  The warriors often stop attacking, but that seems more like a glitch than anything else, although if we had a proper tactics system in place, this probably wouldn't be an issue (although actually it was for Anders in DA2... but he was the only one and I'm 99% sure he was glitched).  The mages are fine, but they don't really have anything too complex to worry about, just Barrier and ranged elemental magic.  I don't even know for sure if we have actual combos anymore... just "detonators" and "incapacitators" that work the same way regardless of the specific abilities involved... at least, I haven't noticed any variation.. tbh, I don't even know if I'm doing extra damage or not when I use Energy Barrage on a "Chilled" enemy. 

 

I guess my overall point is that as much as I enjoyed the tactics systems of the previous games in the series, I don't know if DA:I's combat is complex enough to justify it...  maybe on Nightmare difficulty, but anything lower and equipment seems to make up for the deficiencies in the AI.

[StrangeStrategy]

I am a bit disappointed with the overly-simplified tactics as well, I want the old tactics back instead of disabled/enabled/preffered, I mean come on. On my mages, I have all tactics disabled so I can micro them, otherwise they just don't do well.

 

Is there even a way to change behaviours to cautious/ranged/aggressive/etc. anymore? My mages and archers don't seem to care when they're in the thick of things.

[Hexoduen]

I guess my overall point is that as much as I enjoyed the tactics systems of the previous games in the series, I don't know if DA:I's combat is complex enough to justify it...

 

To highlight another point from Angry Joe; DA:I's combat is more action oriented, and thus does not require as much tactical thought from the player. So no, maybe it isn't complex enough to justify it. I'd still like the tactics menu back though, then I'd crank the game up to nightmare

[Icy Magebane]

To highlight another point from Angry Joe; DA:I's combat is more action oriented, and thus does not require as much tactical thought from the player. So no, maybe it isn't complex enough to justify it. I'd still like the tactics menu back though, then I'd crank the game up to nightmare

I know what you mean.  This game was brutally punishing when I wandered into the Fallow Mire at level 6 on Hard, and I had to micromanage the whole team for even small groups of enemies.  After a certain point, however, the game gets a lot less challenging, most likely due to the lack of level scaling and how OP you can make your equipment.  Once that happened, I no longer noticed when warriors didn't help me fight, although every now and then rogues were still a problem since they can't block or dodge effectively on their own and they don't generate Guard (although I probably could have just made them some weapons to do that...).  I'm sure that it's a different story on Nightmare with Friendly Fire, however... at that point it's probably best to disable most offensive abilities and stick to tactical camera... I wouldn't trust the AI in that case.

 

So basically, the lack of tactics mattered a great deal more to me about 80 hours ago... xD  Now my mage pretty much does all the fighting and I don't care what my party is doing so long as they don't drink all the potions.

[Hexoduen]

I know what you mean.  This game was brutally punishing when I wandered into the Fallow Mire at level 6 on Hard, and I had to micromanage the whole team for even small groups of enemies.  After a certain point, however, the game gets a lot less challenging, most likely due to the lack of level scaling and how OP you can make your equipment.  Once that happened, I no longer noticed when warriors didn't help me fight, although every now and then rogues were still a problem since they can't block or dodge effectively on their own and they don't generate Guard (although I probably could have just made them some weapons to do that...).  I'm sure that it's a different story on Nightmare with Friendly Fire, however... at that point it's probably best to disable most offensive abilities and stick to tactical camera... I wouldn't trust the AI in that case.

 

So basically, the lack of tactics mattered a great deal more to me about 80 hours ago... xD  Now my mage pretty much does all the fighting and I don't care what my party is doing so long as they don't drink all the potions.

 

Yes, for me combat revolves around either turning off the AI and micromanaging everything when it's difficult, or simply button-mashing the enemies while my companions 'tactically' use the following pattern, here explained by user Nefla:

 

Warriors: Taunt attack taunt attack
Mages: Barrier attack barrier attack
Rogues: Die repeatedly

[Frozenkex]

Ive thought about this , and I think I'm never gonna be okay with having complex tactics like in DA2 and DAO. I rather have no tactical view like in DA2 but have the tactics, really. They made a big deal about bringing back the tactical view, which definitely hasnt been implemented well in PC version, yet bringing back the proper tactics would be the bigger deal for someone like me whos into tactical gameplay. 

[lichg]

Shameless bump. Said all i wanted and just waiting for a sign from them they acknowledged

[TKavatar]

Shameless bump. Said all i wanted and just waiting for a sign from them they acknowledged

 

They're never going to acknowledge it. I sent a PM to Allan before the game released and still no reply. People have tweeted Mike Laidlaw and other devs and got silence in response. 

[lichg]

Just need big numbers and keep it on the front page til they cant ignore it

[TEWR]

I will say I'm disappointed in the tactics menu. It's... not even worth the name of "tactics". AI can make up for it, but this was a rather.... backwards approach to it all... to strip it down to so few things.

 

But then, I've said for years that Bioware doesn't really know how to make truly engaging gameplay. They'll take one step forward and four steps back IMO. Doesn't help that PC users hold command is broken, which renders Blackwall's excellent means of holding a chokepoint (that Champion ability of his) useless because the old fucker won't stand still.

 

It's all the same though. Most gaming companies don't really know how to do it.

[Jaizek]

Has there been any news on if they will be fixing this ghastly tactical menu yet? My companions went complete mental and just auto attack everything, They WILL NOT use any Preferred or Enabled abilities what so ever.

 

Man I wanted to play nightmare so bad but it has now been changed to "You got Trolled" mode.

[lichg]

Also i cant seem to tell them when to use their granades and tonics or what ever so they waste it on single targets and weak fodders.

[lichg]

Btw, about the no healing thing. Did they try to mimic the souls series or something by limiting our ways to heal up and forcing us to use potions? And that the only way to get the potions back is by going back to your camp?

Because you need a good combat system to make that fun. :X

[Vanth]

I can totally see why it has such a low metacritic score. Taking tactics out of the game, when it was the main feature of the series, is a bit like releasing a GTA game with all the cars removed.