34 réponses à ce sujet

[Hamztein]

I posted this in another forum but decided to post here too to help those who seek more info on this spec...

 

I have been playing as a necro for a while and has been a lot fun. I saw another post where a guy said is a weak class, "useless" was the word. Well its not for everyone, but is very strong.

Necromancers are about 2 things: DoTs (damage over time) and spirits.


Skills and how they work:

The main source of damage, Walking Bomb is a very strong skill that goes for 200% damage per second (400% instant in the cast) + 600% at the end of 10 seconds. The nearby enemies get the same debut after the explosion (so can be, but not often, endless after 1 single cast).

Of course you will find yourself often recasting because the target died before the explosion or with no enemy close by. Thats the beauty of the second most used skill "Spirit Mark".

Spirit Mark goes for 150% damage per second and if the target dies before the time ends (12 seconds) the target becomes a spirit fighting for you for 45 seconds (its a lot). This spirit will do 175% weapon damage per hit, and he will fight with his own weapon (if he was an archer, he will shot arrows, if he was a wolf, he will bite, etc).

AND, Walking Bomb and Spirit Mark stacks... you will see 2 DoTs ticking at same time... so its 375% damage per second, with a 600% at end of 10 seconds and a spirit for 45 seconds when he dies.

I found that is great with rifts... you target the strongest (dmg dealer, not defensive enemy) target and make him a spirit, and for the rest of the fight you have him fighting for you. The same with big pulls of mobs... you can create spirits, distribute DoTs and see explosions consume everyone. It is really easy to create spirits, in like 98% of the encounters.

The third and optional skill is a fear debuff, does panic for 6 sec and 50% weapon damage per second. The good thing is that a passive makes panicked enemies take 15% more damage (skipful), and armor reduction 20%. So, panic people before going for DoTs is a good idea, but also you have freedom to replace with something you like better.


Passives other than damage to panicked:

One that gives you health and mana after a enemy dies nearby... great for survival, saved me a few times, and saved me from using pots because i find myself often full health after a fight that i was damaged a few times. Without this i needed to use pots after a lot of encounters.

One passive gives you 20% damage increase after a enemy dies nearby... its great too.

And at last, Simulacrum turns you into a spirit if you die. You fight as a spirit (using you skills normally, with NO cooldown!) and after 10 seconds you really die... so this can save you from a few situations helping companions in the cleaning job before you really dies.


Synergy with other trees:

I strongly recommend you to use at least the first 2 passives from spirit tree... one to give you another chance if you are close to death (shield) and one for less aggro.

I take all tree myself because the last 2 passives, helping me survive. With Walking bomb, spirit mark and the first lightning skill i am good to go. So i focus on passives.

One in lightning and one in fire that reduce cooldown are also great. Recommended, as you will need to recast both necro skills often to dot everyone.

I said about survival because the play style of a necro is different from a glass cannon. You will often get aggro from enemies and get hit more often than other builds (you can zerg the tank target, but as necro you will pick specific targets, and will play apart from your group). So yes, survival is important, and with necro/spirit passives you will be safe.

Some people use cold, i don't like because you need all the tree to be worth. Too many points.

 

 

Focus haste for necro, OMG!:

The focus ability if a waste for me, of course you will get because is a free ability once in a while, but is very out of context. Necros should get a summon or a debuff. Not a haste spell (what the hell happened with devs)


Conclusion:

So i conclude... if you are a DoT lover or someone that don't like easy glass cannon builds, Necro is for you... if you don't like micromanaging encounters (and i don't mean strategic view), and control the combat zone with strategy, you will not like necro. (If you played GW2, remember mesmer?) You can easily see everyone falling around you with your dots, explosions and spirits, and that can get very messy and confusing if you are not a little experienced rpg player. Is not tank/spank style.


I hope this helped you to choose (or not) the specialization.

[Medhia_Nox]

What happens if you cast Revive as a Simulacrum?

[Hamztein]

What happens if you cast Revive as a Simulacrum?

 

 

Omg, never tried this, will try later... cast in myself, don't think it will work, it shouldn't... lets see

[Selea]

I tried different Necro builds in these last few days and the one I find the strongest differs heavily from what you suggest. 

I prefer to not focus on Spirit Mark at all but instead go with Fire spells (Immolate/Fire MIne), Walking Bomb and Barrage (and other storm spells if you have points later). In the Winter tree Winter Stillness is a must (as are naturally the fire passives to reduce casting time) since if you want to cast many of the needed spells one after the other Necros need mana regen (Death Syphon is simply not enough) and reduced cooldowns.

Fire synergize very well with Walking Bomb since fire spells produce DoTs too. Barrage is for the target in case it is strong and/or to kill it fast (Barrage is also very useful to proc crits to cast spells even faster with Flashpoint.). Example: cast Immolate and Walking Bomb on a not very strong target surrounded by others, attack it to make it explode then Barrage another one and you have explosions galore (simply repeat the process). Fire mine for more difficult mobs. If you have Solas having Pull of the Abyss it is even better. 

It is very similar to the very powerful spirit/blood mage combination in DA:O that was actually the one I loved more and I'm trying desperately to recreate with DA:I

[Sevitan7]

I found Spirit Mark pretty darn good on Nightmare because the spirit seems to follow very different mechanical rules than your party; they end up doing a ton of damage whatever they hit.

 

Plus it's cool to have a Rage Demon on your side now and then. I almost feel like one of those psychopathic Kirkwall mages that could summon half the population of the Fade at will.

[Selea]

I found Spirit Mark pretty darn good on Nightmare because the spirit seems to follow very different mechanical rules than your party; they end up doing a ton of damage whatever they hit.

 

Plus it's cool to have a Rage Demon on your side now and then. I almost feel like one of those psychopathic Kirkwall mages that could summon half the population of the Fade at will.

I know that's powerful but I prefer more to nuke  As I said I'm trying to recreate the good old spirit/blood mage from DA:O that was the build I loved more.

Btw my previous build has expanded. Practically it has now become almost a non-spec mage + WB, but it seems to work wonderfully.

[Sevitan7]

I know that's powerful but I prefer more to nuke  As I said I'm trying to recreate the good old spirit/blood mage from DA:O that was the build I loved more.

Btw my previous build has expanded. Practically it has now become almost a non-spec mage + WB, but it seems to work wonderfully.

 

That's cool, I enjoy necromancer the most out of the 3 specializations myself.

 

What was your Origins spirit/blood mage build? I was always disappointed in Origins that on higher difficulties Mages late game had rather weak sustain damage compared to Dual Wielding Warriors. They were great early on, and again in Awakening (but everything was OP there) but I always enjoyed my mages in Origin as CC/utility/buff casters.

 

Blood Wound was such a deadly CC spell, I sure do miss it.

[Selea]

That's cool, I enjoy necromancer the most out of the 3 specializations myself.

 

What was your Origins spirit/blood mage build? I was always disappointed in Origins that on higher difficulties Mages late game had rather weak sustain damage compared to Dual Wielding Warriors. They were great early on, and again in Awakening (but everything was OP there) but I always enjoyed my mages in Origin as CC/utility/buff casters.

 

Blood Wound was such a deadly CC spell, I sure do miss it.

I sincerely don't remember all the build since it is a lot of time I don't play DA:O. I just remember it was a lot of fun. Blood Wound + Virulent Walking Bomb + Fireball was very very fun. Situational, sure, but when it worked it was like watching a splatter movie  Then it wasn't only the build in itself but the type of rp you could follow with the character that was really interesting.

DW rogues were surely more powerful but the mage was still the most fun class to play as you could do whatever you wanted. With DW if you wanted to be powerful you had to do always the same two builds, with mages you could do whatever you wanted and always be able to be pretty useful no matter what.

I played different mage builds and the spirit/blood one was the one I had more fun with and it was on par with power with the AW/BM one; the only thing it was a little less powerful was with single very powerful enemies (and the same seems to be true for the necromancer in DA:I but BM had the blood control spell for it that was very handy).

[GuyNice]

I love using Dorian with Static Cage. Works amazingly with DoT's and Horror and helps keep the mobs close together for Walking Bomb. The other 2 mage specs are definitely strong but I still prefer having a Necro in my party more often than not, as I love Walking Bomb and the armor reduction from Horror. Seems like there are plenty of viable paths for the spec as well.

[Sevitan7]

That's true enough, Mages were so much fun in Origins. I loved using Spell Might + Necromancy to get a 5th companion, casting Death Hex on an Ogre and watching as my skeleton buddy triggers a synch kill on him.

 

Also, nothing funnier than seeing a skeleton summon kill synch a dragon. Seeing my bony buddy climb up on top of the Archdemon and bringing it to the ground with stab to the head never got old.

[Selea]

Also, nothing funnier than seeing a skeleton summon kill synch a dragon. Seeing my bony buddy climb up on top of the Archdemon and bringing it to the ground with stab to the head never got old.

LOL. You should have made a video of it.

[Sevitan7]

I had some images posted of it on Gamefaqs, but they were on imageshack and appear to be gone forever. All I could find is some tiny thumbnails of the skeleton killing  an Ogre here

 

Too bad they seem to be lost in the void of the internet.

[BananaBoy]

Thanks for the tips! I'm not a Necromancer, but this will help me with spending ability points on Dorian.

 

Also, the Haste focus skill has some ties with Dorian if you choose the rebel mage quest instead of the templars.

[The Baconer]

What happens if you cast Revive as a Simulacrum?

 

Won't work. Or shouldn't work, anyway, according to the skill description:

 

"You cannot be revived by any means until the spirit leaves."

[Bayonet Hipshot]

Necromancer Build Suggestion:-

 

Requirement

 

Necromancer specialization + 26 Skill Points. 

 

Skill Distribution

• Necromancer - 10 (Horror upgraded, Spirit Mark upgraded, Walking Bomb upgraded, Death Syphon, Simulacrum, Power of the Dead, Blinding Terror)
• Inferno - 4 (Immolate Upgraded, Flashpoint, Clean Burn)
• Winter - 4 (Winter's Grasp upgraded, Mana Surge, Winter Stillness)
• Storm - 4 (Chain Lightning upgraded, Energy Barrage, Conductive Current)
• Spirit - 4 (Barrier upgraded, Peaceful Aura, Guardian Spirit)

Skill Slots

1. Horror
2. Spirit Mark
3. Walking Bomb
4. Immolate
5. Winter's Grasp
6. Chain Lightning
7. Barrier
8. Mark of the Rift

Requirement

 

Necromancer specialization + 27 Skill Points. 

 

Skill Distribution

• Necromancer - 10 (Horror upgraded, Spirit Mark upgraded, Walking Bomb upgraded, Death Syphon, Simulacrum, Power of the Dead, Blinding Terror)
• Inferno - 4 (Immolate Upgraded, Flashpoint, Clean Burn)
• Winter - 4 (Winter's Grasp upgraded, Mana Surge, Winter Stillness)
• Storm - 5 (Energy Barrage, Static Cage upgraded, Conductive Current, Static Charge)
• Spirit - 4 (Barrier upgraded, Peaceful Aura, Guardian Spirit)

Skill Slots

1. Horror
2. Spirit Mark
3. Walking Bomb
4. Immolate
5. Winter's Grasp
6. Static Cage
7. Barrier
8. Mark of the Rift

Thoughts and comments ?

[SomeoneStoleMyName]

The most important question for me is:

 

Are spirit mark and walking bomb limited to one active DoT at the time only?

Or can you with reduced CD and flashpoint, have spirit mark and walking bomb dots on several targets at once?

 

Also OP, that haste is not good - IS GOOD! You can use mark of the rift without being afraid of "losing your specialization focus ability" AND it saves you one skill point!

[coldflame]

What? No Blizzard + Ice Armour?

[konfeta]

AND, Walking Bomb and Spirit Mark stacks... you will see 2 DoTs ticking at same time... so its 375% damage per second, with a 600% at end of 10 seconds and a spirit for 45 seconds when he dies.

I am curious as to why these stack and the different Fire damage burns don't.

 

Maybe because "Burning" is classified as a singular status effect, while those 2 are explicitly coded damage over time spells?

[Bayonet Hipshot]

The most important question for me is:

 

Are spirit mark and walking bomb limited to one active DoT at the time only?

Or can you with reduced CD and flashpoint, have spirit mark and walking bomb dots on several targets at once?

 

Also OP, that haste is not good - IS GOOD! You can use mark of the rift without being afraid of "losing your specialization focus ability" AND it saves you one skill point!

The DoT from Spirit Mark and Walking Bomb stacks, which makes the Necromancer a DoT monster. However, you can only have one Walking Bomb and one Spirit Mark at a time.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

What? No Blizzard + Ice Armour?

 

Blizzard is bugged and the Necromancer is not supposed to be at the frontline. 

[odi0n]

Blizzard is bugged and the Necromancer is not supposed to be at the frontline.

I knew there was something wrong with blizzard, I just couldn't pinpoint it. What exactly is bugged with it?

[Bayonet Hipshot]

I knew there was something wrong with blizzard, I just couldn't pinpoint it. What exactly is bugged with it?

 

Drains too much mana, does not do listed damage and sometimes does not activate...

[Selea]

Thoughts and comments ?

This is very similar to the Necro build I'm running currently, also if I focus more on nukes (I don't go for Spirit Mark early, only far in the game). In short almost a full non-spec mage but with WB galore (oh, and I don't use Horror).

My build atm is like this:

1, Walking Bomb

2. Static Cage
3. Immolate
4. Chain Lightning

5. Winter's Grasp
6. Barrage
7. Barrier
8. Mark of the Rift

(Barrage and Chain Lightning are wonderful to proc crits to renew spells with Flashpoint and Barrage is very powerful to have a WB explode immediately/almost immediately on a medium or weakened foe).

[SomeoneStoleMyName]

I'm a necromancer myself on NM mode and I've gotten the chance to play myself now. Here is my impression on top of the OP's one

Horror is inferior to flashfire and wall of fire, you lose the AOE - but horror mana cost is sky-high. Wall of fire is more than enough to AOE panic foes. 
Fire wall and flashfire are both better alternatives and horror just feels like overkill. Even with the upgrade I dont think horror earns a spot, ever. Also horror seem to have a longer cast animation, which makes bad even worse. 

Death Siphon is stronger than it looks. The heal + mana will save you more pots than you might realize.

20% Damage bonus on kill is really great with skills like fire mine, immolate and energy barrage.

Simulacrum is abit lackluster. The 10 seconds goes really fast. Best skills with simulacrum imo is flashfire+Energy barrage, Blizzard and pure damage nukes OR if you are also a healer, you can ress people while dead. You can also disrupt rifts in spirit form.

 

Spirit mark + WB: The dots deal spirit damage, so they pass most immunities. They allow you to do damage while mobile, so it synergizes less with winter. A WB AOE combo can completely wreck mass mobs, even on nightmare. Spirit mark resurrect can be very strong, I've ressed despair demons and giants! These two dots are worth it alone. On normal, mark is the lesser skill - and WB the bigger skill - cause mobs die faster. For NM play, spirit mark resurrect dead is stronger, and WB weaker (again due to high hp pools).

Conclusion: Necro synergize best with fire and least with winter IMO. In the middle, storm and spirit. A pure fire mage would go KE for the barrier = bonus damage, bonus damage = barrier. If you would like to play a traditional mage, and not a melee mage - necromancer is a solid choice. Especially since you get to keep mark of the rift (as haste suck due to its low duration). For dragon fights, DOTs are very useful for consistent damage!

[Bayonet Hipshot]

I'm a necromancer myself on NM mode and I've gotten the chance to play myself now. Here is my impression on top of the OP's one

Horror is inferior to flashfire and wall of fire, you lose the AOE - but horror mana cost is sky-high. Wall of fire is more than enough to AOE panic foes. 
Fire wall and flashfire are both better alternatives and horror just feels like overkill. Even with the upgrade I dont think horror earns a spot, ever. Also horror seem to have a longer cast animation, which makes bad even worse. 

Death Siphon is stronger than it looks. The heal + mana will save you more pots than you might realize.

20% Damage bonus on kill is really great with skills like fire mine, immolate and energy barrage.

Simulacrum is abit lackluster. The 10 seconds goes really fast. Best skills with simulacrum imo is flashfire+Energy barrage, Blizzard and pure damage nukes OR if you are also a healer, you can ress people while dead. You can also disrupt rifts in spirit form.

 

Spirit mark + WB: The dots deal spirit damage, so they pass most immunities. They allow you to do damage while mobile, so it synergizes less with winter. A WB AOE combo can completely wreck mass mobs, even on nightmare. Spirit mark resurrect can be very strong, I've ressed despair demons and giants! These two dots are worth it alone. On normal, mark is the lesser skill - and WB the bigger skill - cause mobs die faster. For NM play, spirit mark resurrect dead is stronger, and WB weaker (again due to high hp pools).

Conclusion: Necro synergize best with fire and least with winter IMO. In the middle, storm and spirit. A pure fire mage would go KE for the barrier = bonus damage, bonus damage = barrier. If you would like to play a traditional mage, and not a melee mage - necromancer is a solid choice. Especially since you get to keep mark of the rift (as haste suck due to its low duration). For dragon fights, DOTs are very useful for consistent damage!

 

You saw my Necromancer build earlier. Should I drop Horror from it ? But you have to pick Horror ! Ugh...Why is the first skill for Necromancer and Rift Mage somewhat lousy ? The first skill for Knight Enchanter on the other hand is godly.