43 réponses à ce sujet

[Sandtigress]

As I was playing through this scene last night, I got to thinking.  Its the first time I've done it since I finished reading the Calling.

Do you think this pendant belonged to Fiona, if she is indeed Alistair's real mother?  I don't recall any mention of it in the book, but perhaps I should go back and look through to see if it wasn't mentioned in passing.  I don't even remember Fiona being particularly devoted either though.

If only we could get a cutscene of him showing it to Goldanna and her saying "Um, that's not mom's, she never had a thing like it!"    Then again, she'd probably take it and try to sell it, shrew.

[Treason1]

I'm of the opinion that Fiona is indeed Alistair's mother..

..but I just had the thought that maybe it's the other way around, and Alistair really is the son of a maid from Redcliff..and it's Maric who isn't his father.  Alistair is just a convenient scapegoat to take the focuse away from the realy royal bastard..whoever he might be.

..then again, maybe not, and I'm thinking way to much like a day time soap opera.

[FFLB]

Well, Cailan and Alistair do have a striking similarity... Even Anora finds it to be uncanny.



I remembered Fiona with a pendant, but I think it was probably just "those" pendants that I was thinking about.

[Treason1]

FFLB wrote...

Well, Cailan and Alistair do have a striking similarity... Even Anora finds it to be uncanny.

I remembered Fiona with a pendant, but I think it was probably just "those" pendants that I was thinking about.

Could very well be the same pendant.  Perhaps Fiona's pendant was taken/shaped as a holy symbole for some reason unexplaind.  When Alistair broke it, it lost the blood held inside.

[LadyVaJedi]

You mean Fiona's Warden pendant correct?

[odiedragon]

Yeah, that whole mother's locket thing bothers me to.  One small mention of it in The Calling would have been nice.

Or, it's just ANOTHER part of the elaborate scheme of lies that Eamon was perpetuating... <_<  Maybe it truly had belonged to Goldanna's mother, and Eamon, ever the opportunist, snapped it up and used it to his advantage.  (We hates Eamon, can you tell?)

Modifié par odiedragon, 26 janvier 2010 - 04:08 .

[Thiefy]

some other people from the swooping is bad community brought up good reasons why alistair may not be fiona's child. i havent finished both books yet so i can't tell you myself, but i remember it had to do wtih timeslines between what alistair said and what loghaine said.

[SurelyForth]

Thief-of-Hearts wrote...

some other people from the swooping is bad community brought up good reasons why alistair may not be fiona's child. i havent finished both books yet so i can't tell you myself, but i remember it had to do wtih timeslines between what alistair said and what loghaine said.

The big timeline issue is Rowan.  Fiona's baby was conceived and born after Rowan's death, while, according to Loghain (and the Codex) Eamon raised Alistair to protect him from Rowan and Maric never acknowledged him to save Rowan's reputation/keep people from knowing that he stepped out on Rowan.

Modifié par SurelyForth, 26 janvier 2010 - 05:13 .

[Sandtigress]

The problem with that, for me, is that after the books, I just don't see Maric as the kind who would cheat on Rowan at all, not even for a one-night stand. Really, he just never seemed like the one-night stand kind of guy, nor the kind who would do anything to hurt Rowan while she was alive. Maybe it was a sort of drunken encounter or something, but I just don't see it.



And if Alistair is not, indeed, Fiona's son, then that implies that a second bastard son is out there. This is something that will surely have to be explored in future expansions - either a trip to Weisshaupt and confirmation of Fiona as Alistair's mother, or perhaps the rise of an evil bastard (heh) to try and take over the Ferelden son, to the imperilment of the Wardens there.

[SurelyForth]

Sandtigress wrote...

The problem with that, for me, is that after the books, I just don't see Maric as the kind who would cheat on Rowan at all, not even for a one-night stand. Really, he just never seemed like the one-night stand kind of guy, nor the kind who would do anything to hurt Rowan while she was alive. Maybe it was a sort of drunken encounter or something, but I just don't see it.

And if Alistair is not, indeed, Fiona's son, then that implies that a second bastard son is out there. This is something that will surely have to be explored in future expansions - either a trip to Weisshaupt and confirmation of Fiona as Alistair's mother, or perhaps the rise of an evil bastard (heh) to try and take over the Ferelden son, to the imperilment of the Wardens there.

I agree that book Maric doesn't seem like the cheating type, and especially with a random maid.

The only thing I could think of to excuse the discrepency with the Rowan thing is that Eamon and Maric were lying about Alistair's age (to Alistair and possibly to Loghain) for some reason because they thought saying he was being hidden to perserve Rowan's reputation was better than saying he was being hidden because his elf mage mother requested he be raised out of the court. It would only be a year or two discrepency, easily explained away if Loghain never knew he existed until he was five or six years old.

Modifié par SurelyForth, 26 janvier 2010 - 05:44 .

[Sandtigress]

Hmm, that's a possibility. Rowan had been dead two years, I think, with the events of the Calling. I forget what Alistair says if you ask if Loghain knew about his heritage, but I think all he says is that he was Maric's best friend, so of course he knew.



I could see wanting to hide the fact that Alistair was the son of an elven mage Grey Warden, I mean, that combination is about the scum of the earth to most Fereldans anyways, and a lot to pile on top of someone who is already the illegitimate son of a king. It might also have been their excuse for hiding the boy's presence the way that they did - if Rowan was already dead, then it wasn't such a terrible thing for Maric to have an illegitimate child, except that he was also elven-blooded and the son of a Warden.



I'm still thinking I might comb through the Calling and see if there's any mention of Fiona's pendant. I want to know!

[Sandtigress]

Well, David Gaider just stated that Cailan's age in most of the paper copies of the Calling is incorrect - Cailan is five in the book and not nine. How does this change people's thoughts on whether Fiona is Alistair's mother or not? Seems to make it more certain in my eyes!

True, there is still the discrepancy of hiding Alistair to protect Rowan, but I am still convinced that this was a lie to protect the identity of Alistair's mother i.e. so Loghain wouldn't put two and two together and think about that elven Warden who came to Ferelden and whisked Maric away.

Modifié par Sandtigress, 08 février 2010 - 05:58 .

[Maria Caliban]

Sandtigress wrote...

As I was playing through this scene last night, I got to thinking.  Its the first time I've done it since I finished reading the Calling.

 I assume you went to an American public school then.

[Sandtigress]

lol While that's true, I meant it was the first time I had played the scene since I finished the Calling. :-P They try to encourage thinking in grad school. Try, mind you. ;-)

[spottyblanket]

Not to change the subject, but is The Calling any good? Worth reading?

[Leonia]

Definitely worth reading! (So is Stolen Throne if you haven't read that either)

I have a hard time believing the pendant belonged to Fiona, a Grey Warden mage that grew up in an Elven alienage, seeing as it has the symbol of Andraste on it. Her faith is never talked about in the books and given her past, I doubt she'd have faith in anything beyond herself and her own abilities.

I am a strong believer that Fiona is indeed the mother of Alistair. He has been told several lies, such as Goldana being his sister and the pendant belonging to his real mother. All of this was done to prevent him from becoming a threat to the throne (and Fiona did request that he never be brought into Fereldan politics, so potentially it is all in his best interests).

I think it adds another layer of tragedy to Alistair's character. Not only does he lose what is important to him and have a crappy childhood, he is also mislead about his real mother (who probably would have given him all the love he needed if she had been able to raise him). Good thing my PC is around to give him the love he deserves, eh?

Modifié par leonia42, 08 février 2010 - 08:54 .

[Sandtigress]

Another reason to hide the identity of Alistair's mother, especially from Loghain. Fiona was from Orlais, yes? At least she came to Ferelden in the company of the Orlesian Wardens and was rescued by them from the Circle of Magi. I forget if she specifically says that the nobleman who "rescued" her from the slavers was Orlesian.



That makes Alistair the elven-blooded, mage-bred half-ORLESIAN bastard prince. Oh, Loghain would have a field day with that one! So would the people of Ferelden, on several of those counts. Good thing none of my girls care!

[SurelyForth]

I hope that Fiona is Alistair's mother just because it might make him feel better towards his father to know that his mother was a woman Maric cared about, a capable woman, and not some random maid that Maric cheated with. He might be hurt that she never contacted him (and that she encouraged his father to stay away as well), but I think he would understand the circumstances and be totally grateful that Goldanna isn't his sister.

[Sandtigress]

I think we would ALL be grateful that Goldanna isn't his sister. That means we could do what we want to her.

Modifié par Sandtigress, 08 février 2010 - 05:49 .

[nos_astra]

Like cutting out that shrew's tongue? ;-)

[Sandtigress]

My City elf would go for her throat...  

[Addai]

SurelyForth wrote...

I hope that Fiona is Alistair's mother just because it might make him feel better towards his father to know that his mother was a woman Maric cared about, a capable woman, and not some random maid that Maric cheated with. He might be hurt that she never contacted him (and that she encouraged his father to stay away as well), but I think he would understand the circumstances and be totally grateful that Goldanna isn't his sister.

And a Grey Warden!  I think he would be thrilled about that, actually, despite the shock.  He would probably understand the distance given that she is an elf.
I'm pulling for Fiona, too, BTW!  Especially for my elf PCs who have romanced him.    I think it would be so sweet for them to find out that he is half-elven, and would give context to his remark (when asked if he wants to sleep with her even though she's not human) "especially because of that."  I always interpret that as saying he's got a thing for elven women.  Not that that would make him unusual for human men in this society, o'course.

Modifié par Addai67, 08 février 2010 - 06:04 .

[Sandtigress]

Addai67 wrote...

SurelyForth wrote...

I hope that Fiona is Alistair's mother just because it might make him feel better towards his father to know that his mother was a woman Maric cared about, a capable woman, and not some random maid that Maric cheated with. He might be hurt that she never contacted him (and that she encouraged his father to stay away as well), but I think he would understand the circumstances and be totally grateful that Goldanna isn't his sister.

And a Grey Warden!  I think he would be thrilled about that, actually, despite the shock.  He would probably understand the distance given that she is an elf.
I'm pulling for Fiona, too, BTW!  Especially for my elf PCs who have romanced him.    I think it would be so sweet for them to find out that he is half-elven, and would give context to his remark (when asked if he wants to sleep with her even though she's not human) "especially because of that."  I always interpret that as saying he's got a thing for elven women.  Not that that would make him unusual for human men in this society, o'course.

Yes to all the above!  Having Fiona as his mother would be so good for Alistair's self-esteem, I think.

I really, really, really hope that since the Architect is making an appearance in Awakening that Fiona might as well.  *crosses fingers and throws the devs big sad puppy eyes*  Pwetty pwetty pweaaaaaaase?  

[SurelyForth]

He has the same thing for dwarves, too.



I actually find that line a bit creepy for elves considering the amount of objectification we see throughout the game. My CE ran away as soon as he said that, it reminded her too much of Vaughan.

[Addai]

SurelyForth wrote...

He has the same thing for dwarves, too.

I actually find that line a bit creepy for elves considering the amount of objectification we see throughout the game. My CE ran away as soon as he said that, it reminded her too much of Vaughan.

I thought that dwarves would probably get the same line, too, but in my (admittedly pro-elf) gameview, that's just for simplicity and so that dwarven PCs don't feel left out.  I extrapolate a bit from Maric's predilections.  I like book Maric a lot and am glad if Alistair seems to follow in his footsteps. 

I agree that there is a creepiness factor to it.  He no doubt means it well, and that's how my PCs who care about him choose to take it, but I don't think it's an accident that it's a clumsy line.  Bachelor Alistair has more than one of those!   It's also just a fact of Ferelden that humans tend to find elves beautiful and alluring, and an elf would certainly recognize the double-edged sword behind that.  It is part of the bittersweet angle of an elf PC-Alistair romance.  He has to wonder whether she loves him for him, she has to wonder the same for different reasons.  Add to this the fact that the outside world, both elven and human, is against such a match, and it's one reason why this is one of my favorite Alistair romance scenarios.  It has such bittersweet angles.

Modifié par Addai67, 08 février 2010 - 07:45 .