16 réponses à ce sujet

[whostoblame]

Hello,

 

at first sorry if my sentences doesnt make sense or lacking grammar. English isnt my native language and im to many years out of school

 

For my question:

 

Im playing Mage on Nightmare and cant decide wich specialisation i should take.

 

At first i thought about KE. But i dont want a second arcane warrior. Didnt like the playstyle in origins. And i dont want to faceroll every enemy in this game. Is it possible to play a KE/Spirit/Winter Mage who is manly a supporter to the team, spamming defensive spells and crippling/stunning enemys. Or is KE only playable with a melee based gameplay?

 

If KE is only playable with a melee style combat i tend to play necromancer as main dd and build my companions for support.

 

It would be great if someone can give me some advice.

[brazen_nl]

I don't get what you're asking. Every mage has the same abilities, except for their specialization. And then, you still need to use those abilities. So, if you choose KE, but don't use the specialization skills, then why would you choose it? Pick a specialization that you think fun and useful.

[Boboverlord]

I don't know how to make non-melee KE but let's say non-spec builds are always viable in DA:I.

[LexXxich]

KE is the only specialisation that buffs Barrier, IIRC. So yeah, just take those passives (and Focus ability, only actual heal in the game) and you don't need to actually use any of it's other actives.

[whostoblame]

I don't get what you're asking. Every mage has the same abilities, except for their specialization. And then, you still need to use those abilities. So, if you choose KE, but don't use the specialization skills, then why would you choose it? Pick a specialization that you think fun and useful.

 

Yeah the problem is, either Riftmage and Necromancer are useful for dealing damage. But i try to build a support mage based on Barrier, CC etc. My question was is it possible to build the KE that way. Every KE build i found was like buttonsmashing, invincible op tank-melee.

 

KE is the only specialisation that buffs Barrier, IIRC. So yeah, just take those passives (and Focus ability, only actual heal in the game) and you don't need to actually use any of it's other actives.

 

Ok thanks i will give it a try.

[Lerrasien]

Yeah, I hate the ridiculous god mode of KE myself, so I run viv with her spec passives and focus and all the cc she can get along with the .5s cd redux on basic attack passive and the fire passive that if you crit on something, your next spell has no cd. If you get lucky on that, even with just 1 mage in a decently difficult fight, you can keep barrier up for the whole team almost constantly.

[PrinceLionheart]

This reminds me of the "How about using Vanguard without Charge" stuff from Mass Effect. I mean yeah, you can forgot using your Fade Sword, but it defeats the purpose of Specialization since all the passives are geared towards melee.

[brazen_nl]

Yeah the problem is, either Riftmage and Necromancer are useful for dealing damage. But i try to build a support mage based on Barrier, CC etc. My question was is it possible to build the KE that way. Every KE build i found was like buttonsmashing, invincible op tank-melee.

 

 

If you want CC, spec into Rift Mage for Pull of the Abyss and the knockdowns. With the passives taking care of regen and weakening targets you have a great support mage. Double duty with Solas and nothing touches you.

[whostoblame]

This reminds me of the "How about using Vanguard without Charge" stuff from Mass Effect. I mean yeah, you can forgot using your Fade Sword, but it defeats the purpose of Specialization since all the passives are geared towards melee.

 

Not at all. It is not about the OPness of KE or anything like that. Well maybe a little bit... But more like the Idea to play KE as a defensive Mage shielding your group, getting CC from Ice.

 

If you want CC, spec into Rift Mage for Pull of the Abyss and the knockdowns. With the passives taking care of regen and weakening targets you have a great support mage. Double duty with Solas and nothing touches you.

 

Yeah that will be my choice if KE cant be played without using spirit blade constantly.

[brazen_nl]

Yeah that will be my choice if KE cant be played without using spirit blade constantly.

 

Of course it can, just don't use Spirit Blade. However, my point was, why spec into something that you won't use? 

[swk3000]

For a support character, the Knight Enchanter tree has some nice stuff.

Fade Cloak - personal survivability. Nice in a clutch, and to ensure that your Support Mage is able to keep supporting.

Fade Shield - gives you Barrier without having to waste Barrier on yourself. Great for keeping yourself up, and allows you to put the Barrier on whoever actually needs it (such as your Tank).

Knight Protector - Barriers you create last longer. Very nice. Probably doesn't affect the Barrier from Fade Shield, since you didn't cast it, but that's made up for with the ease of getting that Barrier up in the first place. May be bugged, but I've only seen one person say so, so I can't say for sure.

Disruption Field - Nice CC, as it hampers enemy movement. When upgraded, it stops enemy movement. Drop this, then drop a bunch of AoE abilities on the suckers with the bad luck to get caught in it.

Resurgence - an extremely useful tool for a Support Mage, and probably why the OP wants this spec in the first place. Revives anyone who is down, restores everyone to full health, and any ally near you gets healed a portion of their HP per second.

While it's true that running a support Knigt Enchanter isn't using the spec to it's fullest, it's still got a few great tools for a Support Mage. Just be aware that in order to get all the skills you want for a support Mage, you'll have to give up 2 points: one in Spirit Blade, and one in either Combat Clarity or Veiled Riposte. Otherwise, you can't pick up Knight Protector or Disruption Field. Just be sure to disable Spirit Blade, that way your Inquisitor won't go charging into Melee range if you need to take control of someone else for a bit.

[Ganen]

for better party support spirit - winter - rift mage is better tbh, but knight enchanter gives much stronger survivability and dmg potential (even if nothing really benefits the rest of the team) with the spirit - fire - knight enchanter build.

 

http://forum.bioware...oles-nightmare/

[sofandi]

I am in the same boat concerning a caster KE. Due to the no-party banter bug, I put my single player game on hold an tried multiplayer for a while, had a blast with the elementalist, which is sort of a crossover of caster KE and DPS Fire/Ice Mage as opposed to the Arcane Warrior with spirit blade (Maybe that is why I dislike the Spirit Blade KE, a skinny elf with grey hair button mashing Spirit Blade doesn't sound like fun).

 

Some clear advantages of a caster mage though:

 

1.) Fade cloak is awesome DPS-wise and defense wise, it needs to be actively controlled, can't be done by the AI, works almost like Shield Wall, since you need to enable it right before damage hits you or locate into enemies for DPS -this needs to be player controlled

 

2.) get the winter stillness passive + combat clarity passive, you're not gonna run around too much as a KE caster + enemies might be reasonably often within 5 meters radius to trigger the regen

 

3.) Automatic barrier regeneration, good for support, now you can continuously drop your barrier on the tank, don't have to worry too much about yourself. + Barrier empowers fire spells -> huge DPS

 

4.) I consider using upgraded winter's grasp to freeze enemies in place, then hit with fire mine (+ empowered passive) - ideally Solas as a rift mage casts Pull of the Abyss to concentrate enemies. It might be possible that the spells hit the tank, that's why there may need to be two mages continually setting up barriers on the tank - both mages get threat reduction and an archer doing damage from behind.

 

5.) A KE caster frees up the requirement for a second mage, since you can get up barriers fast and effortless. With a rift mage you pretty much need a second mage for constant barrier casting. 

 

That's my take on using an elementalist approach in the single player campaign - I will try it, maybe you guys have some ideas about it too...

 

Small addition: I am planning on using this on nightmare with friendly fire enabled, so lots of planning and tac cam required - that's also why I don't want to spend too much time in action mode for the Spirit Blade KE style...

Modifié par sofandi, 26 novembre 2014 - 10:30 .

[ExFalsoQuodlibet]

The two most effective mage builds I've seen both rely on damage output. For Rift Mage, it's using damage to fuel Restorative Veil - more mana, more spells. For KE, it's Fade Shield - using damage to fuel your character's barrier.

 

IMO, 4 points in the Fire Tree (Immolate 1/2, Flashfire, Clean Burn) are basically a must on either build. Gives you an 8-second cooldown good-damage AoE and two passives that make it much easier for you to keep pumping out spells.

 

4 points in KE is all you really want/need early on, especially if you're not going melee-heavy - Spirit Blade, Combat Clarity, Fade Shield, and Knight Protector. Spirit Blade is a point-suck for you, but Fade Shield and Knight Protector are worth the point-sink even if you don't want to melee.

 

2 Points in Barrier is a must for any Mage who wants to have "support" as a part of the role. I'd stop there until you pick up another damaging spell or two, ideally in non-fire. Probably Winter's Grasp, if you're using Solas as a secondary mage - he can detonate it with Stonefist, and the other good AoE alternative (Chain) might be hard to aim well with FF enabled. 

 

I'd consider Fire Walls for a little extra crowd control and the left side of the Spirit Tree after that. Dispel is nice for dealing with Fade Rifts and the various demons/mage enemies, and extra mana generation lets you keep pumping out spells.

[Sidian]

Is it possible to play a KE/Spirit/Winter Mage who is manly a supporter to the team, spamming defensive spells and crippling/stunning enemys. 

Possible but counterproductive. You can't make use of most of KE skills as a supporter, the only useful one are the barrier enhancing one (less decay), the group heal and Disruption Field. In addition, those skills are not even that good on their own (with the exception of the heal).

Rift Mage is a much better supporter: Very strong weakness effect (permanently -45% damage of enemy groups and even bosses instead of the normal -15%, there is no way KE can compensate that), great CC and decent damage, too. I alway take Solas as my supporter, i don't need the heal or any defensive skills at all (and i actually never used Disruption Field when playing my KE savegame). Blackwall is almost always at 100% block (playing on "hard" difficulty), the weakness effect is just too strong.

 

Of course, you can still take Solas with you and make him an DDish mage, but in my opinion too many points are wasted in KE if you don't make use of it. It's like taking Walking Bomb as a necro and using it in boss fights only.

[JaegerBane]

This reminds me of the "How about using Vanguard without Charge" stuff from Mass Effect. I mean yeah, you can forgot using your Fade Sword, but it defeats the purpose of Specialization since all the passives are geared towards melee.

That's not totally true, the passives (and the non-spirit blade spells) are geared towards mitigating damage, which of course comes in handy if you're in melee. But you don't necessarily need to be in melee, particularly with Fade Walk.

I can see why one might want to build a KE that can double up as a Nuker/support but I agree that using KE as *exclusively* artillery is pointless. If one wants to stay at the back then the other specs are better.

[LexXxich]

KE is the only spec that helps in buff support department, seeing how it enhances the only buff spell - Barrier. Rift Mage and Necromancer are more about debuffs and CC. And there's also a consideration that playing melee KE is not very comfortable in tac cam.