176 réponses à ce sujet

[Beregond5]

Here's something that occurred to me today: if you have the potential to also play a Dalish in the game... how come there aren't Welsh VOs for them? I mean, they have the British one for Nobles and the American for Qunari and Dwarven. I realise it sounds like nitpicking, but it's kind of jarring that every Dalish you meet speaks with a Welsh accent, except for your Dalish Inquisitor.

[Aulis Vaara]

But it doesn't necessarily mean that. Mythal introduced the notion that a spiritual transfer can only happen with a willing vessel. If the Archdemon attempts to possess an unwilling host then soul cancellation may very well be the result. Archdemons can't control Grey Wardens, Corypheus can, so he makes them willing. So Corypheus being able to jump into Grey Wardens doesn't prove anything.

Archdemons have the same ability as Corypheus to influence corrupted minds. And they have the intelligence to do so as well. Furthermore, any Warden expecting the end might well accidentally let the Archdemon in thinking that is what death feels like.

Besides, if that was how it worked, why aren't there a shitton of dead demons and mages who killed each other by the mage refusing possession?

[Statare]

But it doesn't necessarily mean that. Mythal introduced the notion that a spiritual transfer can only happen with a willing vessel. If the Archdemon attempts to possess an unwilling host then soul cancellation may very well be the result. Archdemons can't control Grey Wardens, Corypheus can, so he makes them willing. So Corypheus being able to jump into Grey Wardens doesn't prove anything.

 

It might (key word might) prove that it is not about "soul less vessels" as was always the idea.

 

Edit: because if Cory can possess a being with a "soul" but an Archedemon dies when it does something similar, It calls into question if it is the Joining itself that creates a situation that kills the OGS, or if the Joining is a vehicle to allow the Warden soul to kill the OGS. 

 

The Dark Ritual also calls into question the Warden Final Calculus. Kieran still has his own soul if he has the OGS. Two souls can exist simultaneously. There is not 1 + 1 always must result in 0. It opens the doors to other soulutions to the Old God Problem.

[Heimdall]

Archdemons have the same ability as Corypheus to influence corrupted minds. And they have the intelligence to do so as well. Furthermore, any Warden expecting the end might well accidentally let the Archdemon in thinking that is what death feels like.

Besides, if that was how it worked, why aren't there a shitton of dead demons and mages who killed each other by the mage refusing possession?

Except that Archdemons don't have the same ability. Corypheus has exhibited a vastly superior ability to control and influence Grey Wardens through the taint than any we saw from the Archdemon.

Demonic possession requires consent, this has long been established. Consent can come through torture, but it still counts.

[In Exile]

Here's something that occurred to me today: if you have the potential to also play a Dalish in the game... how come there aren't Welsh VOs for them? I mean, they have the British one for Nobles and the American for Qunari and Dwarven. I realise it sounds like nitpicking, but it's kind of jarring that every Dalish you meet speaks with a Welsh accent, except for your Dalish Inquisitor.

It's just costs. I like it because it lets me RP a former CE (and a radical reformer type, who the Keeper only tolerated because of magical talent).

[In Exile]

Except that Archdemons don't have the same ability. Corypheus has exhibited a vastly superior ability to control and influence Grey Wardens through the taint than any we saw from the Archdemon.

Demonic possession requires consent, this has long been established. Consent can come through torture, but it still counts.

We don't actually know that the ADs don't influence the GWs. We assume they don't because the HOF wasn't influenced by Urthemiel but for all we know they CAN influence GWs subtly through the blight.

Though I think the actual explanation here is that the blight drives them mad. I don't think the ADs are actually in charge of it as much as people think - like Meredith as she goes insane from red lyrium.

[Heimdall]

It might (key word might) prove that it is not about "soul less vessels" as was always the idea.

Edit: because if Cory can possess a being with a "soul" but an Archedemon dies when it does something similar, It calls into question if it is the Joining itself that creates a situation that kills the OGS, or if the Joining is a vehicle to allow the Warden soul to kill the OGS.

The Dark Ritual also calls into question the Warden Final Calculus. Kieran still has his own soul if he has the OGS. Two souls can exist simultaneously. There is not 1 + 1 always must result in 0. It opens the doors to other soulutions to the Old God Problem.

It doesn't really matter to me whether the Wardens are wrong about the exact mechanism. My point is that Corypheus' abilities don't discount the idea that the Warden's soul and the Archdemons cancel each other out.

[Heimdall]

We don't actually know that the ADs don't influence the GWs. We assume they don't because the HOF wasn't influenced by Urthemiel but for all we know they CAN influence GWs subtly through the blight.

Though I think the actual explanation here is that the blight drives them mad. I don't think the ADs are actually in charge of it as much as people think - like Meredith as she goes insane from red lyrium.

That's actually what I think too. The Archdemons are powerful and give focus to the horde, but they're really glorified insane ghouls when it comes down to it.

[Iakus]

It's not about what did happen, it's about what didn't happen: Corypheus didn't die upon body jumping. This means that soul cancellation can't be the true cause. We DO know that the joining requires Archdemon blood, which seems the likely cause of mutual annihilation.

I think the taint works differently for Corypheus and any other surviving magisters.  They have greater control over the taint and its power.

 

I mean, from his journal at the shrine of Dumat:  "They spit on our deeds and claim we brought darkness into the world.  We discovered the darkness.  We claimed it as our own, let it permeate our being."

 

The Blight seems to be a source of power, though a corrupt one.  And Corypheus was a master of it, perhaps beyond even the archdemons.

[Aulis Vaara]

Except that Archdemons don't have the same ability. Corypheus has exhibited a vastly superior ability to control and influence Grey Wardens through the taint than any we saw from the Archdemon.

Demonic possession requires consent, this has long been established. Consent can come through torture, but it still counts.

 

Not the point. What happens when a mage refuses to be possessed? Nothing. Their soul is not cancelled out with the spirit. So the theory that non-consent leads to mutual soul annihilation is nonsense.

[Heimdall]

Not the point. What happens when a mage refuses to be possessed? Nothing. Their soul is not cancelled out with the spirit. So the theory that non-consent leads to mutual soul annihilation is nonsense.

That's because demons don't try to enter them without permission. They wait, torture, or tempt their subject until they have it. Either they can't or they know what would happen if they did. The difference is the Taint. The Archdemon is following the taint to the nearest tainted vessel and attempting to enter regardless of permission. That's what destroys it.

[Rhidor]

I have two questions some of you might have an answer for.

 

What happened to Haven? Sure, the place we are at in the beginning of the game shares the same name, but it looks not even close to the one we knew. It's not even in a similar place. Was this "New Haven" just called like this to remember the cultist town? Or did someone remove the mountain it was build on...?

 

Then, Redcliffe. I noticed that the village we knew is no longer accessible, but I think I can still make out the base structure from the other side (as we aren't aloowed to enter). The whole village was lifted up the hill though, as it was partly build on Lake Calenhad before. Also... what happened to Redcliffe Castle's bridge interior? Did someone build an enitrely new castle in just 10 years?

[Heimdall]

I have two questions some of you might have an answer for.
 
What happened to Haven? Sure, the place we are at in the beginning of the game shares the same name, but it looks not even close to the one we knew. It's not even in a similar place. Was this "New Haven" just called like this to remember the cultist town? Or did someone remove the mountain it was build on...?
 
Then, Redcliffe. I noticed that the village we knew is no longer accessible, but I think I can still make out the base structure from the other side (as we aren't aloowed to enter). The whole village was lifted up the hill though, as it was partly build on Lake Calenhad before. Also... what happened to Redcliffe Castle's bridge interior? Did someone build an enitrely new castle in just 10 years?

There's a codex that says the Chantry tore down the existing Haven and built the new Haven at a nearby site, I believe.

As for Redcliffe castle, yeah, redesign.

[The Baconer]

Was Gatt one of the Dalish before he was enslaved (he is wearing Dalish gear after all)? If not, what is the explanation for his accent if he's a Tevinter?

[Taint Enthusiast]

I think the taint works differently for Corypheus and any other surviving magisters.  They have greater control over the taint and its power.

 

I mean, from his journal at the shrine of Dumat:  "They spit on our deeds and claim we brought darkness into the world.  We discovered the darkness.  We claimed it as our own, let it permeate our being."

 

The Blight seems to be a source of power, though a corrupt one.  And Corypheus was a master of it, perhaps beyond even the archdemons.

From the Venatori note in Coracavus, presumably written by Servis:

 

"You’d do well to muzzle your doubt. Our information was passed down to Lucanus from Corypheus’s most trusted servants. Be grateful you were chosen to come at all.

Think of the power locked in these wastes. We need only to find it. Once liberated, we shall never rely on tinctures of lyrium or crude bloodwork again. Is that not worth any risk, to become a little godlike ourselves? Tell me the thought holds no appeal. We must exhaust every lead, however faint it may be. To do less is to dishonor Him."

 

It seems Corypheus promised the Venatori a way to take advantage of the blight in the same way, at least gave them permission and resources to research it. I think it's well settled by now that the blight can be considered a third magical fuel (though I wouldn't be surprised if lyrium, blood, and the blight had a single, unifying connection).

[Beregond5]

It's just costs. I like it because it lets me RP a former CE (and a radical reformer type, who the Keeper only tolerated because of magical talent).

True that. Thanks much!

(I'll just headcannon they're that good a spy. XD)

[Dai Grepher]

It's not about what did happen, it's about what didn't happen: Corypheus didn't die upon body jumping. This means that soul cancellation can't be the true cause. We DO know that the joining requires Archdemon blood, which seems the likely cause of mutual annihilation.

 

But Cory wasn't slain by a Grey Warden, and he has influence over them because he has mastered the blight far better than any archdemon.

 

Not every Joining needs archdemon blood, but that is the easiest method. The other is to just get darkspawn blood and then amplify it with magic. This was mentioned somewhere in Origins.

 

Riordan explains the soul cancelation involves the Warden drawing the soul into him or her self with the final blow. As I wrote, no Warden has ever does that to Corypheus, at least not that we know of. Each time Cory would just mind control them enough to where they would not attack him.

 

As for him possessing a Warden, he might overpower their soul when he does that. Who knows what would have happened if he had tried that on a Warden who was not as malleable, like a Hero who drank the Power of Blood. 
 

[Dai Grepher]

But you glitched it, so the game treats it as if you went to Val Royeaux even if you didn't. You didn't discover anything other than the characters have set dialogues that take into account specific events (even if you didn't do them because you glitched).

 

I'm not contesting that. My point is that glitching it is what allowed me to have a non-biased perspective of the conversation and see it from Fiona's point of view. When you play as your character, you got to Val Royeaux and experience their experiences. So when you go to the tavern and tell Fiona that she invited you there, it doesn't seem at all strange to you. But if you just go straight from Haven to the tavern and have the same conversation without any trip to Val Royreaux in your mind, then the claim that Fiona invited you there seems absurd. All I'm saying is that the character's claim about the meeting her in Val Royeaux should seem more preposterous to Fiona than how she reacts to it in the game.
 

[Dai Grepher]

Archdemons have the same ability as Corypheus to influence corrupted minds. And they have the intelligence to do so as well. Furthermore, any Warden expecting the end might well accidentally let the Archdemon in thinking that is what death feels like.

Besides, if that was how it worked, why aren't there a shitton of dead demons and mages who killed each other by the mage refusing possession?

 

No they don't. An archdemon can't stop a Warden from killing it. An archdemon can only give commands to darkspawn that have not been awakened (via the Architect's ritual). Also, the archdemon's mind is corrupted and twisted. It is bent on destruction and chaos, not thoughtful planning.

 

I don't think it has to do with the Warden's will in that case. I think the soul clash happens because the Warden has mastered the taint somewhat. The Joining involves mastering that taint. So when the archdemon soul is drawn in the Warden's mastery is what kills it. And that's the difference with Corypheus, because unlike the archdemon, he has mastered the taint to a level beyond even the Grey Wardens.

 

When a mage refuses possession they cast the demon away. If the souls are forced together somehow, meaning the mage resists but it isn't enough, then a twisted abomination is the result. Two in one, basically. This also does not involve the taint, so the comparison isn't fitting to begin with.

[Dai Grepher]

Not the point. What happens when a mage refuses to be possessed? Nothing. Their soul is not cancelled out with the spirit. So the theory that non-consent leads to mutual soul annihilation is nonsense.

 

I'm not sure anyone argued that in the case of the archdemon and the Warden. I think that is a case of the Warden drawing the archdemon soul in so he or she can destroy it, and such a task requires everything from the Warden.
 

[Aulis Vaara]

I'm not sure anyone argued that in the case of the archdemon and the Warden. I think that is a case of the Warden drawing the archdemon soul in so he or she can destroy it, and such a task requires everything from the Warden.

No. It happens automatically, it's not something someone does.

And it's not like bloody possession either, so will fulness does not apply. That Archdemon blood is in the joining for a reason.

[Rhidor]

There's a codex that says the Chantry tore down the existing Haven and built the new Haven at a nearby site, I believe.

As for Redcliffe castle, yeah, redesign.

 

I thought that Codex spoke about how they cleared out the old cultist stuff from the houses. 

 

Redesigns in an ongoing series... hm. Wished to be able to see a logical development of change to the castle and town, not simply a new one.

[Augustei]

You want The Warden to come back and fight Corypheus, dayum. The last thing The Inquisitor needs is for Corypheus to posess The Wardens body, that'll sure make his task alot harder.

[KCMeredith]

Why did King Harrowmont die at the end of Origins (the slide says he didn't rule long and there was fighting after his death) but I get a message from him in DAI? Orzammar being ruled by Necromancers now?

[Reznore57]

Why did King Harrowmont die at the end of Origins (the slide says he didn't rule long and there was fighting after his death) but I get a message from him in DAI? Orzammar being ruled by Necromancers now?

 

Most of DAO epilogue as been retcon as false rumours.