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Why is Common bow better than this unique bow?


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8 réponses à ce sujet

#1
SaveFerris

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0nPNQaF.jpg

 

First and foremost, I'm so sorry about the AWFUL picture quality. The camera on my phone doesn't pictures of screens very well.

 

I've had that common bow for quite some time, and it's been nice. I got that Unique bow a few hours ago and have been playing with it, but I've noticed it's not as good as my common bow. The normal, base attacks hit for about 20 less, and where Long Shot with the common bow hit between 1000-1200 pretty regularly, the Unique only hits for 900-1100.

 

The Unique bow has a higher base damage, substantially more Dexterity. Is it the Armor Penetration on the common bow? I remember in Dragon Age: Origins, Armor Penetration was an amazing stat (don't want to use the term OP, because that is thrown around way too loosely), but always kind of figured it would be dialed back.


  • gay_wardens aime ceci

#2
ShadowSociety

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Yea it's the armor pen, not sure how much DEX raises your actual damage but that is a big % of armor pen. Also notice the equal base damages. And the crit dmg from the DEX doesn't seem great unless you have high crit% and cunning.



#3
wKmike

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It's just sorted by item level. that's all



#4
gay_wardens

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why the hell is there a 2% chance to use shield bash?! WTF... ok this is proof that EA ruined this game.



#5
Vishimtar

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why the hell is there a 2% chance to use shield bash?! WTF... ok this is proof that EA ruined this game.

 

noticed that too, that's hilarious on a bow :P



#6
Chaz Darkbane

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why the hell is there a 2% chance to use shield bash?! WTF... ok this is proof that EA ruined this game.

 

Have you ever seen it proc? It is hilarious. You feel like Green Arrow firing a boxing glove.

 

Yea it's the armor pen, not sure how much DEX raises your actual damage but that is a big % of armor pen. Also notice the equal base damages. And the crit dmg from the DEX doesn't seem great unless you have high crit% and cunning.

 

Actually this straight up doesn't make sense. Dex increases your base damage for rogues by .5% meaning that bow is a 12% increase in overall damage, that combined with the higher base damage and stronger rune indicate it should be doing way more damage than the previous bow. Armor Pen only helps on heavily armored targets as far as I am aware, and armor itself doesn't provide much mitigation. Think of it like this if an enemy had enough armor to ignore 10% of your damage, and you can ignore 25% of that armor, he is still ignoring 7.5 % of your damage, meaning you got a 2.5% increase in damage, where as the bow increasing your base damage by a flat 12% should be a much larger value.'

 

However the more armor enemies have the more effective armor penetration is, if an enemy has enough armor to ignore 50% of your damage, than a 25% penetration value would reduce that value to 37.5% reduction. This would be giving you 12.5% increase in damage. Which would be more useful than 12% flat increase to base damage against heavily armored targets.

 

 

Lets say you had two bows, one with 25% armor pen and one with a 12% increase in attack. Both have 100 base damage for this experiment.

 

Damage against a target with 10% reduction.

 

  • Attack Bow: 112 * .1 = 11.5 point reduction in damage; putting you at 105 damage.
  • Penetration bow: 100 * .075 = 7.5 point reduction in damage; putting you at 92.5 damage.

 

Damage against a target with 50% reduction

  • Attack Bow: 112 * .5 = 56 point reduction in damage; putting you at 56 damage
  • Penetration Bow100 * .37 = 37 point reduction in damage putting; you at 63 damage

As the targets get higher and higher values of armor then penetration becomes more and more effective against those targets. But keep in mind that while it will make your damage against those targets higher, your damage against the enemies with lower armor will decrease. Keep in mind thought that for this example we had the level of armor penetration more than double the value of the attack damage bonus, if both were equal than penetration would have been far less effective.

 

Now with the OP's bows as the examples

 

If we take the 6 dexterity (3%) increase in damage and that fact that it also has 27% armor pen (not 25% like in my examples) into account his damage against a 10% reduction enemy would be

 

  • 130 with the 3% increase to damage would be a 3.9  point increase, putting the weapons strength at 133.9 base damage
  • 133.9 * .073 would mean the damage is being reduced by around (rounded up) 9.8 points. Putting it at 124.1

Now with the other bow

  • 132 with a 12% increase to damage would be a 15.8 increase to damage putting the new base value at 147.8
  • 147.8 * .1 would mean damage is reduce by 14.8 (rounded up) putting our damage at 133.

Closing and Tl;dr: Seeing as we don't know exactly how effective armor is we have no way of knowing how much it actually mitigates of our damage. Unless the enemy is somehow ignoring an extremely large amount of your damage than attack % increase will usually be stronger. Especially in the situation the OP posted where the base damage of the other weapon was larger regardless.



#7
Waagabond

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Item level 23 vs iterm level 19.

 

Very simple.



#8
Ghanima

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Weapons seems a little bit confusing for now

got a 175 dps fire runed epic bow with a 18% armor Penetration and 75% weapon dmg explosion on kill (trepanner's requital). level 18 epic bow

a 198 dps (longbow of the griffon) with 42% attack on it. level 21 epic bow

 

regular hit are 140 dmg for the requital in average.

regular hit are 200-240 for the griffon masterpiece.

 

explosive dmg from the requital seems to varie depending on what skill I used...

full draw one shot routine lesser shade with explosion compared to normal attack shot that seems to deal way less dmg than it spposed to.

 

so +% attack seems the way to go



#9
PvtNiss

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The answer to this thread is simple, basic attacks are low damage and eat enemy armor. Other than that you are testing long shot which is a bugged skill at the moment. Because its weapon damage varies +%attack mods aren't applied to it for some reason. The armor penetration is doing something the +%attack (Dex) is not as you don't crit, the tenasarin will win in any other situation BUT long shot unless it crits.

 

Some more info on random stuff and source:

http://forum.bioware...afting-testing/