516 réponses à ce sujet

[Danoniasty]

8 skill slots were designed for gamepads, there is no more space on my 360 controller to fit even one more skill couse every button is already attached to some action, sure they could addes 2nd skill slot but well......

[Cundu_Ertur]

Oddly, I played DA:O and DA2 on gamepads, and had access to far more than 8 actions at any given time through the radial menu. Now I don't.  Sometimes simplifying a menu is a good thing.

This is not one of those times.

I'm playing a third time as a mage, and the limit is really hurting me in a big way this time. As a rogue I could go assassin and use those specialist abilities in place of other similar abilities and not miss much. I'd also take two skills from the archery tree and two from the daggers tree, and swap them out depending on if I was using a bow or daggers. But as a mage now, I can only do eight things, and that isn't enough. And what if I'm all set up with ice spells and an ice staff when I run into a pack of despair demons and arcane horrors? Oh, that's right -- die and reload because you can't change inventory or actions in combat. With the set up from the earlier games I could swap weapons and access ALL abilities from the radial menu on the fly.

That's the root of the current complaints.

[RMP _]

This limit of eight just freaking sucks. There's no good reason for it. I've avoided taking some abilities for passives I didn't really want just to try to keep it within eight. It's not even eight really, with mark of the rift it's seven. Taking a specialization puts a even more of a crunch on it.

 

If you're playing a mage, it blows. The three damage trees are all element based which of course is a problem since a lot of enemies have elemental resistances. One third of your spells could be largely ineffective. Some spells are nearly useless against some enemies. Static cage doesn't hold everyone, for example. In the same fight, I might need a AoE spell one moment and a then single target spell the next.

 

For a while I was OK with just taking passives and upgrades, but the more I play, the more limiting it feels and the more frustrating it is at every level up.

 

I've seen some really stupid reasons why people say eight is great, I don't buy any of them. They're all just a bunch of rubbish.

 

"It's like DnD, preparing ahead of time."

NO, it's not. My CHARACTER doesn't need to memorize stuff ahead of time. It's me the player that would have to prepare. It's just a hassle, a chore. I got enough hassle in this game selling useless gear and upgrading all my companion gear after every area. I don't want more chores!

 

"There's no point because you don't have enough mana to spam abilities."

It's not about mindless spamming whatever's not on cooldown, it's about using the spells I have for whatever the situation calls for.

 

"You can use other abilities on the next play through."

I never do multiple playthroughs, and if I did, it would be with a different class.

 

"It's more challenging."

No, it's more boring. I can get by with eight, but it's less enjoyable.

 

"It' really 8 * 4 =  32"

Ugh, can't believe someone actually said this, holy crap. I only play my character and let the rest of my party do its thing most of the time. But even if I micro-managed every battle, seriously, this is the lamest argument there is.

 

"I'm having fun with eight."

Well good for you! Probably you're playing a warrior. Regardless, adding more slots for the people who want more wouldn't ruin your game.

 

 

The real problem here is controllers and multiplayer together. They wanted fast action (no pausing) to be available on a controller for multiplayer. What's stupid is that they didn't need to change the single player game for this.

 

In Mass Effect 3, my multiplayer character had fewer abilities than my Shepard. They could have just stuck with 8 for MP and left the single player game the same as DA:O and DA2, for both PC and console.

 

And seriously, how hard is it to get another wheel for a controller scheme? If holding down the trigger opens the second group of 4, why not make it so holding the trigger part way would open a 3rd? Or someone mentioned holding it and using the Dpad. I don't care how it could be done, but it's not rocket science to figure something out.

 

If they insist on this stupid limitation, they why not have two upgrades for every ability? Or change the skill trees so there's no top to bottom. Just pick whatever skill you want. Don't make me get an ability I can't fit in my bar just to get to something else.

 

Yeah, I don't see them changing this for DA:I if they haven't already, that doesn't mean I'm not going to complain about it. Hopefully it won't be so lame in their next game.

[Wintermist]

I'm sure they COULD do this for us, the question is rather, do they WANT to?

 

Is it perhaps moddable for the PC mouse and keyboard? I'd settle for that if there was such a thing.

[Lee T]

I'm sure they COULD do this for us, the question is rather, do they WANT to?

They already chose. I know nothing about programming, but modifying the console UI to bring back ye ole radial menu or other solutions seems way too involved considering the game's development is now over. Right now part of the team is making DLC(s) and the rest has moved on to other projects. There's a small hope for PC players, if it doesn't require much work, but imo there's more chance to see a fan made mode one day.

[Kantr]

I wonder what the point of Dragon Age is that it destroys? The Role playing?

 

Not defending the annoying 8 slot limit (4 in multiplayer)

[Deders]

It would have at least been nice if the talents that aren't assigned to a button could be used by characters you aren't controlling

[Walfan]

There's no excuse, it's dumbed down for the sake of easier console play and thus a wider audience (in case turning the game into Skyrim wasn't enough).

 

$$$$$ is the only answer you'll get.

[Rawgrim]

There's no excuse, it's dumbed down for the sake of easier console play and thus a wider audience (in case turning the game into Skyrim wasn't enough).

 

$$$$$ is the only answer you'll get.

 

But, but, but...they said it was for tactical reasons?!

[SofaJockey]

Is this still rolling on?

No, it's not going to change.

 

Nothing wrong with 8 slots, it just means you have to make choices.

I prefer it to DAO's endless confused skill trees.

 

I'm finding the builds very interesting in multiplayer where you have 4 slots,

and that learning transfers very nicely back to the single player game.

[Deders]

Is this still rolling on?

No, it's not going to change.

 

Nothing wrong with 8 slots, it just means you have to make choices.

I prefer it to DAO's endless confused skill trees.

 

I'm finding the builds very interesting in multiplayer where you have 4 slots,

and that learning transfers very nicely back to the single player game.

I still find myself in situations, especially with mages where I wish I had a certain power to use in certain situations but I can't use it because I don't have the space and can't make room for it due to needing the more essential powers.

[Walfan]

But, but, but...they said it was for tactical reasons?!

Great idea actually ! Do you think I could tactically type with my nose if I cut off my hands ? Or tactically go and sit on the toilet if I cut off my legs ?

Life would be so much more interesting.

[Rawgrim]

Great idea actually ! Do you think I could tactically type with my nose if I cut off my hands ? Or tactically go and sit on the toilet if I cut off my legs ?

Life would be so much more interesting.

 

Probably not, but even without legs or arms you can still beat DA:I easily enough.

[PhroXenGold]

I still find myself in situations, especially with mages where I wish I had a certain power to use in certain situations but I can't use it because I don't have the space and can't make room for it due to needing the more essential powers.

 

Being in situations where you don't have access to the perfect ability is a good thing. It forces you to adapt. It forces you to come up with a solution using non-optimal tools.

[Wintermist]

Being in situations where you don't have access to the perfect ability is a good thing. It forces you to adapt. It forces you to come up with a solution using non-optimal tools.

 

I would call it an Alternative thing rather than a Good thing. Good is subject to what you believe, it's certainly not what I believe. I believe in having access to my abilities that I selected because I adapt to the game by selecting those specific talents.

 

Having to drag and drop them before a specific battle is just an extra annoyance. The difference between having to drag and drop abilities before a battle as opposed to ONLY using those abilities IN the battle is exactly that, annoying. There is no difference in having those 8 abilities out, or just using those same abilities even though you have 4 more in the toolbar.

 

The tactical choice is not what you have available in your toolbar, the tactical choice lies in how and what you use what you have in the toolbar.

[Zhen Dil Oloth]

8 skill slots were designed for gamepads, there is no more space on my 360 controller to fit even one more skill couse every button is already attached to some action, sure they could addes 2nd skill slot but well......

In DA;O and DA2 we had access to all of our skills.

 

Even with the limited number of buttons of the gamepad. 

[SofaJockey]

I would have no issue if there were more than eight.

I'm not convinced I personally would need many more

and I've adapted to there being eight (which won't change).

 

But a bonkers hyperbole laden thread title as this thread has tends to harden peoples' positions.

 

If we were wanting to have a sensible discussion about this, I suspect that ship sailed at the OP.

[Rawgrim]

In DA;O and DA2 we had access to all of our skills.

 

Even with the limited number of buttons of the gamepad. 

 

Correct. Those two games weren't designed purely for gamepads. DA:I was.

[Zikade]

This is one of the things I list whenever asked what I don't like about DA:I. It doesn't "destroy the entire point" for me but is certainly a pet peeve. I suspect the system was designed with multiplayer+controller in mind (fast action, no pausing) but I find no good reason at all for it to be in single-player. It's a baffling design choice which only limits your gameplay and doesn't add to it.

 

You are forced to choose your 8 abilities, and thus you restrict your character's diversity and adaptability during combat. In fact the AI has more flexibility in what they can use than the actual player does. Reassigning your abilities before each battle doesn't make it more challenging or tactical. It makes it more annoying. I'd prefer to actively make these decision myself during battle, not be forced to drag and drop my abilities because of some artificial limitation. Mana/stamina and cooldowns are there to prevent you from throwing 20 spells/abilities in a row. This new limit just adds irritating busywork and certainly doesn't make the combat flow better.

 

The point of leveling up is to learn new skills and have better options against more difficult enemies. This system makes leveling up more boring since you can't play around with your hard won skills during combat. I almost dreaded learning new abilities since the hassle with the slots would start. It encouraged to spam the same techniques and almost made me avoid getting new abilities and go for the passives instead. 

 

It's also rather hilarious (read: downright stupid) from a roleplaying point since my character seems to have this case of forgetting and re-learning his spells. Or maybe he's just so devoted to each chosen set of strategy that he would rather take a beating than use spell #9.

[Zhen Dil Oloth]

To play a character in an epic fantasy story? I thought it was along those lines, anyway. It never occurred to me that the point of Dragon Age was to play a game with lots of quickslots.

And having access to all our abilities prevent that somehow???

 

Did it prevent us from playing a character in an Epic fantasy story in DA;O??? or DA;2??

[Zhen Dil Oloth]

Correct. Those two games weren't designed purely for gamepads. DA:I was.

If this was in the context of a MMO..... it would make sense.

 

In the context of a single player game??? not really.

 

And the 3 multiplayer maps do not qualify this game as a multiplayer game.

 

It is a single player game with 3 maps that can be played in multiplayer,

[jedidotflow]

Let me see if understand what some posters are saying.

 

You mean to tell me that they placed the 8 skill limit and dumbed-down (because it's not simplified, it's dumbed-down) the party tactics screen to make combat more tactical and strategic?

[AlexMBrennan]

(in case turning the game into Skyrim wasn't enough).

Funnily enough, Skryim lets you have as many "favourite spells/weapons" as you like - press one button to bring up the list, up and down to scroll through it and mouse to select.

It's also rather hilarious from an RPG point since my character seems to have this case of forgetting and re-learning his spells. Or maybe he's just so devoted to this chosen set of strategy that he would rather take a beating than use spell #9.

Oh dear. I understand that you prefer a different system, but sadly the facts do not support you - in fact, D&D initially had Vancian Magic before the fancy mana mechanics were ever imagined: your wizard can cast, say, three spells before he has to take a nap. If you had a fireball memorised and ran into a group of enemies immune to fire then you'd be in serious trouble.

True, there is a reason this system has fallen out of favour but your attempt at historical revisionism is silly.

[Spellbound7]

Oh dear. I understand that you prefer a different system, but sadly the facts do not support you - in fact, D&D initially had Vancian Magic before the fancy mana mechanics were ever imagined: your wizard can cast, say, three spells before he has to take a nap. If you had a fireball memorised and ran into a group of enemies immune to fire then you'd be in serious trouble.

True, there is a reason this system has fallen out of favour but your attempt at historical revisionism is silly.

 

Isn't the point of Vancian magic preparation and not just memorisation? I've only ever played Neverwinter Nights and Icewind Dale (the latter was a long ass time ago so I don't remember very well), but you only had to prepare spells as a Wizard (and some other class like Clerics or smthng). The Sorcerer could just cast whatever he wanted without preparation - he just had a limit on how many times he could cast spells.

 

Unless I'm mistaken, it wasn't about forgetting spells, not really. It was more about preparing them in your spellbook for use, kinda like buy arrows for your bow.

[Cheviot]

If you want to access powers that you have that are not already in the slots, you can swap them out in the character menu, can't you?  That's of course ignoring you could take another mage (or whatever) with you and change characters.

 

Also, the entire point of Dragon Age is that it's the Age of Dragons.  It's there in the title.