89 réponses à ce sujet

[DragonKill83]

Yeah...talk about the game turning on its head!  Once I got to Skyhold---well, things aren't tedious anymore!  I've spent over two hours talking to my party members alone!  Wow...and this isn't just random chatter...a lot of this stuff runs deep.....and it's easy to see by your character's expressions.

 

If I'm going to be spending a lot of time with my advisors, my companions, friends, allies, and even possible enemies and spies, I need to spend as much time as possible with them, speaking to them, progressing through several different conversations with them to reveal their true intentions.  The writing in this section of the game so far (for me in personal experience) is excellent.

[StingingVelvet]

Yeah...talk about the game turning on its head!  Once I got to Skyhold---well, things aren't tedious anymore!  I've spent over two hours talking to my party members alone!  Wow...and this isn't just random chatter...a lot of this stuff runs deep.....and it's easy to see by your character's expressions.

 

If I'm going to be spending a lot of time with my advisors, my companions, friends, allies, and even possible enemies and spies, I need to spend as much time as possible with them, speaking to them, progressing through several different conversations with them to reveal their true intentions.  The writing in this section of the game so far (for me in personal experience) is excellent.

 

Having more companion conversations available doesn't change gameplay. This isn't a movie.

 

Skyhold changes nothing gameplay wise. All the side content and "open world" gameplay is still pure MMO design and super tedious. Skyhold changes nothing about that. The main story missions are much better, but there's only what... 10 of them?

[AlexMBrennan]

I do not agree with the general complaints. All you need to do in hinterlands is to talk to the two NPCs (one more is optional). Everything else that you are doing there, you doing by your own choice. The game offers freedom of action. Taking it as a forcing to something, to put it likely, is hypocritically

Of course - you do not have to play the game at all if you don't like it, but some might consider paying full price for a AAA game of which you're gonna skip 80% a bad deal.

Plus there are collectibles to consider.

[Renmiri1]

Where the f are those darn quarries ????

 

[In Exile]

The hinterlands is a bad design. They drop you into a starting area that is large, mostly dull and then don't expect the player base they have which is loaded with OCD and AR mentalities who have been trained to clear the black and check off quests to just ignore all those markers?

They should have dropped you into a smaller area with a few quests (Lothering) you could do with your party because Haven doesn't "teach" you that. After that you should have been driven to VR and then let the world open up. So much of the bad reaction is that people won't move into the plot and also the longer you stay in the Hinterlands you also aren't getting new companions. You listen to the commentary on something like Portal and realize that the devs do a lot of work to help you learn the game and move you through the game without making it obvious.

Bioware did it IMO because of all the worship of games like BG1 that do exactly that thing. Excepy they are not that fun and people only look at it fondly because of nostalgia.

[ExFalsoQuodlibet]

Bioware did it IMO because of all the worship of games like BG1 that do exactly that thing. Excepy they are not that fun and people only look at it fondly because of nostalgia.

 

 

I think the Hinterlands alone has more fetch quests than all of BG1, BG2+ToB combined.

 

Oh, and a "fetch quest" in BG2: "We're trapped in another dimension and need the heart of a demon to escape, let's go outside into the Abyss to get ourselves a demon heart so we can get back home."

 

or "the dragon has the legendary sword of our sacred order... so you're gonna need to kill it to get the sword back for us."

 

Little different from getting 10 ram's meat.

[In Exile]

I think the Hinterlands alone has more fetch quests than all of BG1, BG2+ToB combined.

Oh, and a "fetch quest" in BG2: "We're trapped in another dimension and need the heart of a demon to escape, let's go outside into the Abyss to get ourselves a demon heart so we can get back home."

or "the dragon has the legendary sword of our sacred order... so you're gonna need to kill it to get the sword back for us."

Little different from getting 10 ram's meat.

There's a reason I only mentioned BG1. The Hinterland's the spiritual successor to BG1's aimless wandering around, with quests often being limited to a short dialogue tree that didn't always even have flavour dialogue.

BG2 is different.

[ExFalsoQuodlibet]

BG1 definitely had some aimless-feeling wandering around, but even in aimless non-main-quest areas the side quests were expontentially better. In BG1, when you find a chicken, he talks, and is the apprentice of an wizard who you need to take him to to get the spell reversed. In DA:I, when you find a chicken, you need to kill 100 of them, scattered all around 2-3 different maps, to feed a village and get that amazing +1 power reward you'd been hoping for all along and a "thanks, these chickens will help us immensely!" 

[ExFalsoQuodlibet]

Obviously I'm exaggerating slightly... but not that much.

[In Exile]

BG1 definitely had some aimless-feeling wandering around, but even in aimless non-main-quest areas the side quests were expontentially better. In BG1, when you find a chicken, he talks, and is the apprentice of an wizard who you need to take him to to get the spell reversed. In DA:I, when you find a chicken, you need to kill 100 of them, scattered all around 2-3 different maps, to feed a village and get that amazing +1 power reward you'd been hoping for all along and a "thanks, these chickens will help us immensely!" 

 

You're using a really clever BG1 quest here. Most are decidedly more mundane. Not to mention that your companions basically don't talk. 

[AlexMBrennan]

Where the f are those darn quarries ????

There's one in Emprise... I'm not gonna say that they did this to encourage sales of the guide but...

[Sidney]

There is a perk that unlocks the ability see them in the map. Logging stands in particular seem hard to spot for me and I've walked by several being only a few meters away and not seen them.

[ExFalsoQuodlibet]

It's been a while since I played BG1, I'll admit. BG2 was actually my introduction to the series, and I've played it about 100x more. But ~45 hours in, my biggest complaint about DA:I the relative mass of meaningless/uninteresting side quests to interesting ones. The level of fetch / accumulation /requisition quests is just overwhelmingly bad. 

 

The thing is, they did do some great side quests in DA:I. Heart of Still Ruins is a really cool optional dungeon. Iron Bull's Demands of the Qun is excellent. Speaking of companions, though...

 

DA:I's fetch-quest-heavy-nature is even more frustrating that Cullen, Cassandra, Blackwall, Varric, and Vivienne all have initial side quests that are basically (multi-area, in some cases!) fetch quests as well. I think Solas does as well, only to add insult for injury, it's not even marked, you just can't go further down his quest line until you've activated 10 elven artifacts, AFAIK.

 

If you removed all non-inquisition-improvement requisitions, Bottles of Thedas, Occulariums/Shards, and a solid 20 minor fetch-type quests from the game... DA:I would be better. Hell, you could probably get rid of nearly half of those fetch quests in the hinterlands alone. Spend all the time spent placing these objects around maps and coding druffalo-herding and halla-chasing into one more main story quest instead.

[bcursor]

That is the problem with open world games. Thus I never like Elder Scrolls series. Yes I like the huge awesome maps but respawn is killing the classic atmosphere of Bioware games.

[Unkn0wnfear]

Da fuq? I played straight through with no grinding at all. If you go to an area that's to hard then you aren't meant to be there yet. You're supposed to come back to each area multiple times.

I found the combat so fun that I wanted to partake in every fight, except the ones that were so low they don't give exp in which case you can just walk around them.


My advice having beaten the game, if you want to lv up fast and get strong, hunt dragons. You will grow a full level and more from killing just one. In order to kill one, use mages and a staff the element they are weak to, and many barriers. Also, use Vivienne's spirit Sword

[Altima Darkspells]

My recommendation is to abort any completionist tendencies in the womb. Do NOT do all the 'side content' for DAI, unless you want to get bored out of your mind in the first act.

Basically, skip all side content unless you find it really, really interesting. Those quests? The rewards are useless. Since XP stops being gained for creatures that you're three levels above--regardless of the effort it takes to take down said critters--you should just ignore everything but the main quests and MAYBE the area quests.

I first did the Storm Coast before getting Skyhold, and I was...a little miffed at the area quest at the time (tracking the grey wardens).

So yeah, on my next playthrough, I plan to skip everything but the area quests and dungeons and just do the main story. The only side content I may do is killing dragons, but that's so end game, it really won't matter.

[DragonKill83]

Having more companion conversations available doesn't change gameplay. This isn't a movie.

 

Skyhold changes nothing gameplay wise. All the side content and "open world" gameplay is still pure MMO design and super tedious. Skyhold changes nothing about that. The main story missions are much better, but there's only what... 10 of them?

 

Skyhold changes nothing gameplay wise?  Wow.  Let's get rid of it, then.  Gameplay is gameplay, whether you're sitting in the pouring rain watching frogs hop across lilypads or slaying forty fire-breathing dragons on top of the Great Wall of China while vomiting zombies lurch their rancid rot down on you in drone-manned fighter jets.  It encompasses the mundane to the grand, and I think your viewpoint is shortsighted.

[abearzi]

The problem with the MMO-esque grind in DAI is that there is no payout for the grinding. Influence stops being useful once you pick up a few key perks. Power becomes completely worthless if you do even a few sidequests (and Requisitions are a complete waste of time/resources). Quarries and Logging Camps are also useless after the only 3 upgrades to Skyhold, and there are dozens more quarries and logging camps than needed. Tying Skyhold being repaired to main-quest completion is asinine, as it should require more Quarries and Logging Camps which are already in the ****** game! Let the people who who want to explore and be completionists actually get some meager cosmetic reward, rather than tying the shabbyness of the keep to arbitrary MQ completion. Even gold is somewhat useless, as there are so many excellent drops from quest mobs/operations that the entire party can be totally kitted out, without ever having to spring for the fancy vendor-purples.

 

These are not bad designs inherently, but in a single player RPG they are completely wasted.

[DragonKill83]

Abearzi, question for you:

 

If the shabbiness of Skyhold were not connected to the MQ, do you think you would do sidequests that upgraded it instead?

 

Because if you say yes, then it's going to happen either way.

 

I guess perhaps you simply place more value on whether or not your Skyhold castle is upgraded, as a decision that's left up to you when or whether you do it.  But personally, I don't want to have to keep coming back to my home base in a run-down condition throughout the main story.  I'm going to be going there a lot, I would imagine.  Seems to me to get it out of the way quicker is better.  To each his own.

[ExFalsoQuodlibet]

The problem with the MMO-esque grind in DAI is that there is no payout for the grinding. Influence stops being useful once you pick up a few key perks. Power becomes completely worthless if you do even a few sidequests (and Requisitions are a complete waste of time/resources). Quarries and Logging Camps are also useless after the only 3 upgrades to Skyhold, and there are dozens more quarries and logging camps than needed. Tying Skyhold being repaired to main-quest completion is asinine, as it should require more Quarries and Logging Camps which are already in the ****** game! Let the people who who want to explore and be completionists actually get some meager cosmetic reward, rather than tying the shabbyness of the keep to arbitrary MQ completion. Even gold is somewhat useless, as there are so many excellent drops from quest mobs/operations that the entire party can be totally kitted out, without ever having to spring for the fancy vendor-purples.

 

These are not bad designs inherently, but in a single player RPG they are completely wasted.

 

Actually, since you can use gold to purchase influence (and thus more inquisition perks) I'd argue it isn't wasted - also, some of those purple vendor drops are quite nice, and the top armor schematics are rather expensive. 50 hours in I'd still only found 1 quarry. 

 

You're right about power being mostly-worthless though - or at least, it feels inflated. If they made you gain influence, but not power, from closing Fade Rifts, that might help a lot. Requisitions definitely feel like an utter waste of time.

[eternal_napalm]

I was having fun exploring the Hinterlands but left to continue the main quest and do other stuff

There is a lot for me to still do there and I plan on returning and doing everything.

[Kirmm]

Please read this PSA before continuing with thread discussion. The Hinterlands are misleading. 

 

 

________________________________________

 

HUGE THANKS FOR SHOWING THIS! I finally started to enjoy this game just because of this post.

[Hazegurl]

I started this thread after 15 hours in the game. Bored out of my wits I did several characters after that first  attempt of game play, for a change for something interesting but could not go to Hinterlands for the gawd awful grinding.

I mean the endless repetitive combat which keeps coming back again and again and again and again and so forth. Kill the monsters/baddies and they just keep respawning again and again and again and.. right into your face. ok, you get my point.

No to mention the pc controls being utterly bad. I´ve spanked my mouse so hard that animal protection officers called. And where the heck is auto attack? It feels like my pc version is just a bad console copy. The rpg elements are gone from the character leveling. Just slapping some skills and trying to upgrage items. So I pick flowers and collect rocks to my miniature backpack while I kill stuff.  

 

This is the first time I have actually become bored of Dragon Age game in my first playthough. I don´t know if it is the obvious Skyrim rip off or something else (didn´t finish Skyrim either) or what but the game feels soo booooring. I have no connection to the story nor the characters. I just run around killing everything and listen the occasional party banter, which I can´t even participate. Nice.

 

Maybe I am too much of a story driven player. I don´t know. I do enjoy certain amount of freedom but to achieve enough levels to advance in the game is just way too boring. I can´t play the game another time with the awful grinding.

 

Anyone else have similar feelings or am I alone in this?

I agree, I'm trying to have a second playthrough where I skip all the errand boy grind quests I think my Inquisitor shouldn't waste his time on. I wanted to focus on gaining power by closing rifts. So far I've left Hinterlands and unlocked all other areas except Val Royeux(sp?). Lvling is sadly slow, Fallowmire seems too high lvl at this point yet there is nothing else to do BUT to just head to Val Royeux. Unless I try my luck rescuing the soldiers in Fallowmire. Basically this game is all about doing those silly grindfest quests. Where are console commands when you need them.

 

**Okay forget what I said about fallowmire. All the creatures are my lvl...now...maybe it was a weird bug?? 

[Jackal19851111]

Once you leave the hinterlands the whole game opens up, not only does it give you more gameplay features (alot more) but you'll release how small the hinterlands is (and yet it's one of the bigger areas). However, it no longer feels like grinding as you'll be finding yourself going to and fro between vast territories and using the side quests to relax after the adrenaline pumping main story / companion quests.

 

It's so obvious on metacritic that the majority of negative votes are from those who haven't left the hinterlands yet - look at the comments! It's quite sad really, considering the amount of content that people are missing after the poor first impression the game makes.

 

Also, I don't grind, I follow the quest markers. As for materials, I only pick up those I truly want (rare stuff), the rest I can purchase (like elfroot, only costs 17 gold each). Don't play the game like a MMORPG, there's enough content to allow you to keep advancing without having to farm. I think that's the game's biggest problem, it fails to deliver a sense of urgency for players. If you compare the side quests with Skyrims, DAI's quests are far better, the collection quests help you find amazing locations and views while there are many that feels like it's to the same quality as the main quests. As for leaving areas unfinished - you'll find yourself doing that alot past Haven. But you'll WANT to go back to have a break after a main quest or some such.

[Jackal19851111]

Anyways, just a note: If you feel bored and find yourself grinding, then it means its time to leave and advance the story.