69 réponses à ce sujet

[d1ta]

Eek. Creepy stuff that O.o' makes me go icky to stick my inqui's head to an occulara for those shard hunting.
damn.

@cute nug: thx for the tip on bringing cas, viv and cole.. does dorian make a comment as well if he's present?

[Gervaise]

I've already mentioned in another thread on this subject that I'm surprised we are never allowed to call anyone to account for this crime.   I also objected to being forced to use them in order to complete a quest that is specifically mentioned in the Keep.      Since that quest doesn't turn out to have any particular significance, at least in this game, I have steadfastly ignored them ever since.     

 

I don't know if Dorian makes any comment because I usually find the shed on visiting Redcliffe the first time, before recruiting Dorian.   May be I'll leave breaking into the shed until Dorian is with me next time.

 

I must have missed Cole saying he would avenge the tranquil.   May be it was one of those quests that was originally going to be included and then dropped.    It would seem the writers don't regard the tranquil as people considering how they treat this.    I can only assume that since you kill an awful lot of Venatori in the course of the game, eventually you would get the one's responsible for the tranquil.     I would have liked to question Alexis about this if you do Hushed Whispers and get to judge him, if only to see his answer.

[d1ta]

I pretty much think that it SHOULD be part of Alexius' trial (provided you enter the locked house first before completing the quest. Pretty much like how you could blow Denam's cover during trial, that he's just 'doing what he was told to do and was completely clueless' in CotJ)

.. Man, if this case be put to the trial (plus the obvius ones like evicting the rightful Arl, etc), I don't see how Alexius and Servis would be alive in many people's PT.

[Gervaise]

I think they omitted it from evidence at the trial so it would be easier for people to spare Alexius, considering Dorian specifically hopes that you will be able to do so.    What makes the whole thing worse is that it has already been discovered, and later confirmed, that it is possible to reverse the rite of tranquillity.   The Venatori obviously know this too, since they use the same method to create the occularum; the demons is encouraged to touch the mind of the tranquil, they are now returned to full consciousness with all their emotions restored, then they are killed.    It is one of the singularly most horrible things that is described if you have a good imagination.  Which I do.   Also read Asunder where we originally learn this is how to restore a tranquil and we see the effect on someone this has happened to.

 

So the wretched rebel mages and Templars abandon the poor tranquil to fend for themselves, the Venatori round them up and then do that to them.     I'm only glad that I managed to help that tranquil who was still alive in Redcliffe.   I imagine he only did so because they already had sufficient occularum.   Given the number we see stacked on the shelves, it is clear they killed way more than they needed to.      I should imagine that Sandal is going to be able to corner the topside Enchantment market in the future with no new tranquil being created and the majority of the old ones dead.   Apart from Tevinter of course.    There they use the rite to punish dissenters but only the non Altus ones.

[Guitar-Hero]

Another reason not to collect shards

[Absafraginlootly]

Disappointed this couldn't be brought up at Alexius's trial.

[myahele]

I wonder if all those veilfire torches had similar methods of creation?

[Ashagar]

Maybe they do... There is certainly something unnatural about those things and they are always in ancient elven ruins...

[Absafraginlootly]

I wonder if all those veilfire torches had similar methods of creation?

O.o

 

kay, I never noticed they had skulls before.

[d1ta]

I think they omitted it from evidence at the trial so it would be easier for people to spare Alexius, considering Dorian specifically hopes that you will be able to do so. What makes the whole thing worse is that it has already been discovered, and later confirmed, that it is possible to reverse the rite of tranquillity. The Venatori obviously know this too, since they use the same method to create the occularum; the demons is encouraged to touch the mind of the tranquil, they are now returned to full consciousness with all their emotions restored, then they are killed. It is one of the singularly most horrible things that is described if you have a good imagination. Which I do. Also read Asunder where we originally learn this is how to restore a tranquil and we see the effect on someone this has happened to.
.. snip.
.

Feel pretty much the same here the image is just so gruesome and horrible. To suddenly have all your emotions come flodding back only to face execution, .. >__< urk!

I plan to do my next PT doing Hushed Whispers, but suddenly it felt more like a drag. I know I can execute Alexius, but the part where I cant comfront this particular crime and make zip mention about it in game bothers me. Bah.

EDIT:
@myahele
Good find on the veilfire thing. Part of me wishes that it was a plastic molded skull being there for 'badass' reasons (or maybe skulls of fallen enemies/those who die naturally but has given consent to have the skull being used later on for the benefit of society ^^')
Another part, well it could be something akin to the occularum on the part on how it's made. Imagine a whole lot of creepiness when that happens to be true.

[Former_Fiend]

Minaeve mentions that most mages, in her circle at least, either ignored the tranquil completely or outright abused them. When they up and rebelled, they just left most of the tranquil at the circle behind, and only Minaeve stayed behind to protect them.

 

While I doubt that was the case for every circle, or even most of them, one assumes that a few other circles had that happen; the tranquil were just abandoned and left to their own devices, and were easy prey for the Venatori.

[Gold Dragon]

Eek. Creepy stuff that O.o' makes me go icky to stick my inqui's head to an occulara for those shard hunting.
damn.

@cute nug: thx for the tip on bringing cas, viv and cole.. does dorian make a comment as well if he's present?

 

Sera is creeped out by it. (yes, she comments)

[d1ta]

Thanks Gold Dragon.
Then I plan to bring Cas, Cole and Sera to that spot.

[Phoe77]

Clemence also says that Alexius had been trying to force Tranquil out of Redcliffe.  It's entirely possible that the non-venatori mages had no idea bout what was happening to them.  It's also worth noting that the codex entry states that the Tranquil has to be killed immediately after being possessed for the whole thing to work.  It's unlikely that most would have even noticed that the Tranquil was suddenly not so Traquil anymore.  I'm not trying to defend the act at all, but there you go.

 

The codex also mentions that the magic that had been cloaking the shards has only recently been removed.  I assume that it was due to the breach.  

[Bleachrude]

 

 

So the wretched rebel mages and Templars abandon the poor tranquil to fend for themselves

 

Er, why are the templars being brought into this? The tranquil that are in the circle left behind by the rebelling mages would still be protected by the templars there so I'm not sure how the templars are even a bit responsible for this.

[spinachdiaper]

I kind of felt like the shards were hidden intentionally by Solas and or his agents because they unlock the temple of Solasan doors

[Panda]

Er, why are the templars being brought into this? The tranquil that are in the circle left behind by the rebelling mages would still be protected by the templars there so I'm not sure how the templars are even a bit responsible for this.

 

Tranquils work for templars and not for the Circle, or so I have understood it.

[Bleachrude]

Tranquils work for templars and not for the Circle, or so I have understood it.

 

Er no. The tranquil worked for the Circle (there's no indication that the tranquil worked for the templars as Oswain for example worked in the storehouse of magical items that you as a mage warden interacted with) but that's not the issue. My point is why did the previous poster mention that the templars are responsible for the tranquil that the rebel mages took with them?

[Panda]

Er no. The tranquil worked for the Circle (there's no indication that the tranquil worked for the templars as Oswain for example worked in the storehouse of magical items that you as a mage warden interacted with) but that's not the issue. My point is why did the previous poster mention that the templars are responsible for the tranquil that the rebel mages took with them?

 

I'd say that they are responsible of leaving them behind. Templars are the one who created them and mages aren't exactly friends of the tranquil either, many don't think they are same as them and belong in the Circle. This is my impression at least, I think templars and chantry were responsible over tranquils not mages.

[Former_Fiend]

Tranquils work for templars and not for the Circle, or so I have understood it.

 

I never got that impression. Origins definitely implied tranquil work for the circle - in fact it stated that they were the Circle's primary money makers, responsible for the enchantments that the Circles would sell to finance itself. Figure if they worked for the Templars, the order would be the ones pocketing that gold, not the mages.

 

DA2 definitely showed the tranquil following the templars more, but that was most likely just showing how corrupt that particular branch of the Order had gotten in Kirkwall.

[Semyaza82]

It always bothered me that even if you pick the lock before going to meet him you couldn't confront Alexius about it. 

[TobiTobsen]

It always bothered me that even if you pick the lock before going to meet him you couldn't confront Alexius about it.

Would have been nice if it had actual consequences on his judgement.

Denam, his Templar counterpart, actually has different judgement options, depending on whether you looked into his office or not.

[Semyaza82]

Would have been nice if it had actual consequences on his judgement.

Denam, his Templar counterpart, actually has different judgement options, depending on whether you looked into his office or not.

Definitely. The murder of a boat load of tranquil isn't even listed as one of the crimes he's on trial for.

[Bleachrude]

I never got that impression. Origins definitely implied tranquil work for the circle - in fact it stated that they were the Circle's primary money makers, responsible for the enchantments that the Circles would sell to finance itself. Figure if they worked for the Templars, the order would be the ones pocketing that gold, not the mages.

 

]

Hell, I'm not even sure templars get paid....I mean, wasn'tt he reason why Aveline could marry her templar Wesley was that she showed to a Grand Cleric that she could provide for herself? Furthermore, I don't think we have EVER seen a templar living high off the hog...neither meredith or Gregoir had ostentatious rooms IIRC You could bribe a templar with lyrium but that's due to their addiction to the stuff but we never encounter a templar that is living well - I mean, I don't remember in any Thedas work be it game, factbook or novel about a templar living richly as even some mages did....

 

 

I'd say that they are responsible of leaving them behind. Templars are the one who created them and mages aren't exactly friends of the tranquil either, many don't think they are same as them and belong in the Circle. This is my impression at least, I think templars and chantry were responsible over tranquils not mages.

 

I'm not sure I follow. The ocularum were created from the tranquil that the rebel mages took with them from the circles. Why would the templars and Chantry be responsible for them being used by the venatori when they don't even know about the venatori at all? The rebel mages are implied to know something is going on with the tranquil as the game notes the disappearance of tranquils but I'm not sure how the templars are even a little bit responsible for this given that a large part of the templars are NOT roaming around the countryside.

[Panda]

I'm not sure I follow. The ocularum were created from the tranquil that the rebel mages took with them from the circles. Why would the templars and Chantry be responsible for them being used by the venatori when they don't even know about the venatori at all? The rebel mages are implied to know something is going on with the tranquil as the game notes the disappearance of tranquils but I'm not sure how the templars are even a little bit responsible for this given that a large part of the templars are NOT roaming around the countryside.

 

I admit that I haven't played for sometime, but my impression is that lot of tranquils were left behind when mages left, I think researcher in Haven comments on it.