329 réponses à ce sujet

[bondari reloads.]

If the 'wardenists' are lucky then BW took Hawke in DAI as a test run and may even be looking into episodic Witcher-style playing-as-NPC. The DA4 protagonist would have to compete against the HoF however, as that would lead to questions aka "Why not have the HoF as protagonist in the first place". I don't care either way.

[Phoe77]

All I know is that I would avoid these forums like the plague if Bioware brought the Warden back.  I can scarcely imagine the fan rage that would be wracking the boards.  

[Jononarf]

Could you please make a DLC about Hero of Ferelden ? I'm sooo disappoint that we can  meet Hawke and even play with him  during few missions, but HOF just desappeared when he/she's needed... That's so lame and unfair...

I don't like Hawke and had to deal with him, but HOF is a real character to me. I searched and hoped to see my warden during all the game and nothing happend.... Some letters isn't enough...

Would he/she have a voice?

[DuskWanderer]

Agree with you, though have to point out the strawman in your comment, not everyone who wants the Warden back is a 5 year old child who can't form proper sentences. 

 

Although I am somewhat surprised by gamers fascination with HoF, it was your clichéd voiceless soulless husk of a protagonist who went and saved the world (although, not really "saved" the world). In fact, Hawke was a better playable character than the Warden, even though he was as incompetent as a hero gets, at least he had somewhat of a personality. 

 

Hawke was a smaller scale, but I don't think he was incompetent. Anders did what he did. But yes, Hawke is much better than the walking cliche factory that is the Warden

[Steppenwolf]

Looks like a lot of you need to read up on the concept of diminishing returns. Origins came out in 2009. Only the most die-hard of fans are still talking about the HoF. Of those die-hard fans, only a specific faction want the HoF to return in a significant way. Another faction, seemingly of equal or greater size, wants the HoF to stay gone so as to avoid tarnishing their experience with the character.
So now ask yourself why BioWare would want to make content catering to such a small group while alienating another? It doesn't make good business sense or good PR sense.

Do you have a link to back this stat up?

What stat? He said "many" not a number.

[Rocknife]

If the Hero of Ferelden survived the Fifth Blight, then he must come back. If not, then the Orlesian Warden Commander from Awakening replaced him and at the end of the Awakening he went to Weisshaupt so his story has not ended either and then he must come back. Giving us useless "illusion of choices" and ending their stories with ridicoulus excuses such as voice actors is not fair. If they insist on doing so, then they should at least be honest enough not to call Dragon Age a RolePlaying Game since obviusly none of our "choices" matter, and our future choices will not matter the in the slightest either.

 

You may not have liked Awakening but it was as important to the story as Legacy DLC and I paid for it so I can at least demand to know what happens to the Warden-Commander. At the end of the Awakening, if the Warden Commander is Orlesian, s/he disappears just like the HoF would if s/he was alive and I want to know the story of a product I paid for or else I'll feel like I was robbed of my time and money.

 

If some people think it is their right not to want Warden Commander from Awakening, then I feel it is my right not to want Hawke back since s/he was the protagonist of the most disastrous game Bioware ever made. If even Hawke comes back, why doesn't Warden come back as well? Especially if Dragon Age can be called a RPG where our choices, at least major ones like the Dark Ritual matters. If the HoF died in DAO, then the Warden Commander from Awakening can replace the HoF perfectly since s/he is powerful enough to defeat the Architect and s/he knows a great deal about the Architect.

 

And for those who say that "most" people doesn't like the Warden or sacrificed him/her obviously didn't see the Ultimate Party results. The Warden was by far the most popular protagonist, naturally. So, both according to the story and according to the fans, the story of the Warden Commander (Either the Hof or Orlesian) must continue. If Bioware is unwilling to bring him/her back even though they brought Hawke back, then I am unwilling to pay for any product from Bioware with the same logic just to avoid feeling robbed of my money and time since the story of Awakening surely was not complete.

 

In short for those who will still refuse to understand: What I want is not for Bioware to bring back the Warden from Origins whether s/he died or not. What I want is for Bioware to bring back the Warden from DAO: Awakening. I paid for Awakening and I feel it is my right to know about the Warden Commander. If Hawke was brought back because he fought Corypheus and knew about him, then the Warden must be brought back when the Architect comes back or another blight begins with the same logic. I buy Dragon Age games and DLCs thinking they are RPG and if none of our decisions will matter then I'd hardly call it a RPG series. If even The Dark Ritual was meaningless and didn't matter the slightest bit, then Dragon Age is nothing like a RPG.

[TK514]

I would rather not have my Warden's rotting corpse dug out from under that crypt in Redcliffe. I can maybe see them bringing the Warden Commander back, but don't really see the point.

[Toasted Llama]

If the Hero of Ferelden survived the Fifth Blight, then he must come back. If not, then the Orlesian Warden Commander from Awakening replaced him and at the end of the Awakening he went to Weisshaupt so his story has not ended either and then he must come back. Giving us useless "illusion of choices" and ending their stories with ridicoulus excuses such as voice actors is not fair. If they insist on doing so, then they should at least be honest enough not to call Dragon Age a RolePlaying Game since obviusly none of our "choices" matter, and our future choices will not matter the in the slightest either.

 

You may not have liked Awakening but it was as important to the story as Legacy DLC and I paid for it so I can at least demand to know what happens to the Warden-Commander. At the end of the Awakening, if the Warden Commander is Orlesian, s/he disappears just like the HoF would if s/he was alive and I want to know the story of a product I paid for or else I'll feel like I was robbed of my time and money.

 

If some people think it is their right not to want Warden Commander from Awakening, then I feel it is my right not to want Hawke back since s/he was the protagonist of the most disastrous game Bioware ever made. If even Hawke comes back, why doesn't Warden come back as well? Especially if Dragon Age can be called a RPG where our choices, at least major ones like the Dark Ritual matters. If the HoF died in DAO, then the Warden Commander from Awakening can replace the HoF perfectly since s/he is powerful enough to defeat the Architect and s/he knows a great deal about the Architect.

 

And for those who say that "most" people doesn't like the Warden or sacrificed him/her obviously didn't see the Ultimate Party results. The Warden was by far the most popular protagonist, naturally. So, both according to the story and according to the fans, the story of the Warden Commander (Either the Hof or Orlesian) must continue. If Bioware is unwilling to bring him/her back even though they brought Hawke back, then I am unwilling to pay for any product from Bioware with the same logic just to avoid feeling robbed of my money and time since the story of Awakening surely was not complete.

 

In short for those who will still refuse to understand: What I want is not for Bioware to bring back the Warden from Origins whether s/he died or not. What I want is for Bioware to bring back the Warden from DAO: Awakening. I paid for Awakening and I feel it is my right to know about the Warden Commander. If Hawke was brought back because he fought Corypheus and knew about him, then the Warden must be brought back when the Architect comes back or another blight begins with the same logic. I buy Dragon Age games and DLCs thinking they are RPG and if none of our decisions will matter then I'd hardly call it a RPG series. If even The Dark Ritual was meaningless and didn't matter the slightest bit, then Dragon Age is nothing like a RPG.

"If the Hero of Ferelden survived the Fifth Blight, then he must come back. If not, then the Orlesian Warden Commander from Awakening replaced him and at the end of the Awakening he went to Weisshaupt so his story has not ended either and then he must come back."
Nobody 'must' come back. Nobody. And just because the Warden Commander didn't die and went off to do other things doesn't mean "their story" isn't complete. The story as far as DA:O and DA:A is concerned, is a done deal.

"Giving us useless "illusion of choices" and ending their stories with ridicoulus excuses such as voice actors is not fair."
Let's just blatantly ignore the fact that it's not just a matter of voice actors, but the fact that not everyone wants their Warden back or has their own idea of how the Warden should return and if Bioware doesn't follow that idea to the letter, they'll get a shitstorm and the whole premise of Dragon Age as opposed to Mass Effect is that every game has their own new protagonist, whose story ends when the game ends, regardless of living/dead state. Great reasoning and logic, 10/10 - IGN.

"If they insist on doing so, then they should at least be honest enough not to call Dragon Age a RolePlaying Game since obviusly none of our "choices" matter, and our future choices will not matter the in the slightest either."
Translation: Bioware isn't doing 100% what I want so it's not a roleplaying game. Because my opinion on RPG is most holy and divine.

"You may not have liked Awakening but it was as important to the story as Legacy DLC and I paid for it so I can at least demand to know what happens to the Warden-Commander. At the end of the Awakening, if the Warden Commander is Orlesian, s/he disappears just like the HoF would if s/he was alive and I want to know the story of a product I paid for or else I'll feel like I was robbed of my time and money."
You paid for the story of Awakening, the story that starts and ends with the issue of the talking and intelligent darkspawn. Nothing more, nothing less.

"If some people think it is their right not to want Warden Commander from Awakening, then I feel it is my right not to want Hawke back since s/he was the protagonist of the most disastrous game Bioware ever made."
Yes you have that right. No that does not mean Bioware has to listen.

"If even Hawke comes back, why doesn't Warden come back as well? Especially if Dragon Age can be called a RPG where our choices, at least major ones like the Dark Ritual matters. If the HoF died in DAO, then the Warden Commander from Awakening can replace the HoF perfectly since s/he is powerful enough to defeat the Architect and s/he knows a great deal about the Architect."
The HoF/Warden Commander returning or not has nothing to do with choices being acknowledged. The DR gave you the decision whether your Warden and/or their companion Alistair/Loghain lives. Not whether or not the HoF will show up in a future installment.

"And for those who say that "most" people doesn't like the Warden or sacrificed him/her obviously didn't see the Ultimate Party results. The Warden was by far the most popular protagonist, naturally. So, both according to the story and according to the fans, the story of the Warden Commander (Either the Hof or Orlesian) must continue."
You can like a character and still be done with their story. Shocking, I know.

"If Bioware is unwilling to bring him/her back even though they brought Hawke back, then I am unwilling to pay for any product from Bioware with the same logic just to avoid feeling robbed of my money and time since the story of Awakening surely was not complete."
Be careful not to let the door hit your bum on the way out, darling!

"In short for those who will still refuse to understand: What I want is not for Bioware to bring back the Warden from Origins whether s/he died or not. What I want is for Bioware to bring back the Warden from DAO: Awakening. I paid for Awakening and I feel it is my right to know about the Warden Commander."
And it's Bioware's right to do whatever the **** they want with the HoF/Warden Commander and right now they're saying "No."

"If Hawke was brought back because he fought Corypheus and knew about him, then the Warden must be brought back when the Architect comes back or another blight begins with the same logic."
Hawke was only brought back because DA:I was originally supposed to be an expansion on DA2, darling.

"I buy Dragon Age games and DLCs thinking they are RPG and if none of our decisions will matter then I'd hardly call it a RPG series. If even The Dark Ritual was meaningless and didn't matter the slightest bit, then Dragon Age is nothing like a RPG."
Translation: If games don't do 100% what I want them to do, they're not role playing games.

[shortbreadspacer]

It just seems kind of weird that they'd record so many different VA's just for a cameo. You have the 4 for the HoF, and 2 more for the Orlesian.

I know it's pretty moot since they are basically saying it'll never happen - but if they were, they could have just had the cameo happen only if the Origins Warden is alive, not Stroud. So it's a HoF cameo only, not a Warden Commander cameo.

 

It kind of makes me mad that the potential of fan anger is swaying them away from bringing the HoF back - the loudest win out again, I guess. It's not my favorite game but I'm not a huge DA2 hater and I really felt like Hawke's appearance was forced fan service. The Hero actually has more story to tell that they themselves introduced (curing the calling). They dangled the carrot, and when we respond they just say "Hey, not so fast, we can't do that."  I just think that it could be a cool story to tell and a good way to wrap up their story if they live. And anyone who killed off their Hero could just not buy the DLC, or the cameo wouldn't trigger if it's within a larger story. But it's also a time/resource issue I'm sure.

[Brockololly]

Looks like a lot of you need to read up on the concept of diminishing returns. Origins came out in 2009. Only the most die-hard of fans are still talking about the HoF. Of those die-hard fans, only a specific faction want the HoF to return in a significant way. Another faction, seemingly of equal or greater size, wants the HoF to stay gone so as to avoid tarnishing their experience with the character.
So now ask yourself why BioWare would want to make content catering to such a small group while alienating another? It doesn't make good business sense or good PR sense.

 

So that's why the Warden and two companions from Origins, an almost 6 year old game, were voted most popular in BioWare's recent Ultimate Party vote, while a player character like the Inquisitor, from a game barely 6 months old didn't win?

 

Time has nothing to do with it. If the writers have a story best suited for the HoF to take part in, like all the Grey Warden Civil war strife or curing the Calling, then I would want to play as the HoF in that story. Doesn't mean that the HoF needs a whole other game or even a whole DLC for that- use multiple protagonists like The Witcher 3 is doing or hell, even GTA V did. BioWare already did it with Leliana's Song DLC for Origins and even controlling Joker for a short bit in ME2. Just have the Player Character that makes sense for a story take part in the given story. I don't want the Inquisitor off exploring Grey Warden issues when you could have an existing Player Character much more personally tied to Grey Warden issues dealing with that stuff first hand. Just as I wouldn't want a Warden PC dealing with Inquisition stuff.

 

 

You speak of people wanting the HoF to stay gone to avoid tarnishing their experience with the character. Well what about the present experience being tarnished because of the conspicuous lack of the HoF? My Warden did not die, he's still part of the world. They gave the HoF an excuse to be absent in Inquisition but are they just going to keep doing that? That only works so many times before it feels really trite, especially when BioWare seems to have no issue bringing back old companions of the Warden and even old love interests. Personally, I'd find it really obnoxious and possibly "tarnish" my HoF by having them forced off screen while Morrigan keeps getting brought back and embroiled in main plot points again and again. So if they're going to force my HoF offscreen, I'd prefer they keep old companions like Leliana or Alistair or Morrigan offscreen as well, instead of forcing those companions down generic character development paths that effectively write off or overlook the still living HoF.
 

 

I would rather not have my Warden's rotting corpse dug out from under that crypt in Redcliffe. I can maybe see them bringing the Warden Commander back, but don't really see the point.

Nobody is proposing resurrecting an Ultimate Sacrifice HoF. Its about not having a living HoF relegated to effectively the same story role as a dead HoF. And when BioWare seemingly has no issue bring back every other old companion and love interest under the sun and thrusting them into a plot heavy role, why not the HoF? The point would be if they're going to possibly do some story that intersects with an issue personal to the Warden, I'd want my Warden doing that story first hand, not somebody like the Inquisitor who has no personal ties to it. My Warden off curing the Calling would be a more engaging narrative than having the Inquisitor randomly get involved with Grey Warden affairs when he would have no personal motivation (or a really weak one) to do so.

 

This extends to dealing with old companions too. So much of the Morrigan material in Inquisition was kind of rendered way less engaging because you had the Inquisitor as the PC, instead of a Warden that maybe romanced or had some history with Morrigan. Same with Here Lies the Abyss- as a player I maybe was fretting the choice between Alistair and Hawke but my Inquisitor just met these dudes and has next to no personal history with either of them. That disconnect between the player and player character was way too present in too many of the choices in Inquisition when old companions or characters were involved.

 

 

It kind of makes me mad that the potential of fan anger is swaying them away from bringing the HoF back - the loudest win out again, I guess. It's not my favorite game but I'm not a huge DA2 hater and I really felt like Hawke's appearance was forced fan service. The Hero actually has more story to tell that they themselves introduced (curing the calling). They dangled the carrot, and when we respond they just say "Hey, not so fast, we can't do that."  I just think that it could be a cool story to tell and a good way to wrap up their story if they live. And anyone who killed off their Hero could just not buy the DLC, or the cameo wouldn't trigger if it's within a larger story. But it's also a time/resource issue I'm sure.

Or like they did with Leliana's Song DLC, they changed the dialogue system there from the main game. If they brought back the HoF/Warden Commander in a playable role, why not do the same and change the dialogue system back to how it was with Origins? Hell, the procedural over the shoulder conversations they used in Inquisition would work better with a non voiced PC.

 

There are a bunch of ways they could deal with the HoF in a satisfying way but they seem intent on not doing that. While at the same time they seem intent on bringing back everyone that surrounded the HoF and getting them involved in big plot points. That's what irks me the most.

 

 

my view is this: BW keeps overlapping stories in the same time period, so they elected for the challenge of a world with >1 player character in action. I would rather they fully stepped up to this challenge (including a voiced HoF/WC, and letting us outfit our hawke, and giving us more control over their dialogue in certain cases) instead of backing away from it.

 

the easier path logisically would have been to set these games a generation of time apart so that our prevous heroes were dead. then maybe we could have selected their respective fates in the Keep. that sort of thing.  BW didnt opt for this, which would be vastly incredibly exciting - except that they're afraid to bring past heroes back.

That's part of it but even not skipping a generation ahead or something, its just about geography and how large of a scale the story is. For instance, if you had some smaller scale story taking place in the far corner of Rivain, even if its going on roughly the same time as Origins or Inquisition, you wouldn't need or expect cameos and references to the HoF or Inquisitor or Hawke. BioWare is exacerbating this issue doubly so by bring back old companions and love interests of the HoF in Inquisition. And then thrusting those old companions into story heavy roles, like Morrigan dealing with Flemeth or Alistair potentially dying (again) or Leliana potentially becoming DIvine. Those are all big plot points for those old companions of the Warden and so it seems only natural to me that people might want to be able to engage with those old companions as their old PC, the Warden to get a more personal take on those plots.

 

But you set your game some other location and make a story that doesn't involve those old companions or old PCs and you don't even need some huge Elder Scrolls style time jump.

[noxpanda]

Eh personally i dont want too see my warden come back or hear from them even in a letter, make that any of my wardens, for i have many lol. Same for hawke, didnt want them back either. I do get very attached to my PCs but i dont want every game to revolve a damn menagerie of past PCs, im quite content to let their stories end with each game and happily ponder up a variety of ultimate fates in my head.

 

Plus if you keep including them in every game youd end up having to have stupidly overpowered villains to make it seem like a legitamate threat, could you imagine in DA4 if you had the hero, champion and inquisitor... what do you challenge them with?

 

I must admit i find the decision in the fade hilarious as my poor hawkes snuff it every time except for if strouds around, other characters are much more interesting to me going forward then my PCs

[Aren]

I have to resolve yet the Mistery of How My US Warden is still alive in Awakening,  Edo Tensei?

[DanAxe]

Come on guys.... Let the Hero of Ferelden rest. He had his adventures, they were epic, he fought the good fight, and he/she is supposedly investigating the calling which could be important for the future of Thedas, but I think its time for him to bring out the shades, find a spot in the sun and drink cocktails for the rest of his life.

 

The hero's story has been told. You can relive it in Origins and Awakening. There is no point in bringing him back. I know its hard, but try to forget him pls. Keep your good memories of him and let it rest. Bringing the Hero of Ferelden back will raise more problems than solutions. Let new heros come forth.

 

I think the fact so many people want him back is related to people wanting a Dragon Age Origins 2.

 

It wont happen. Origins is done and gone, and so is the hero. Its time to move forward with Thedas history.

[Rocknife]

Yeah because every single peasent in Thedas is potentially a Godslaying hero in a world where everyone turns out to be Gods (like Flemeth and Solas and who knows who else)! Let all those heroes come forth!

[Toasted Llama]

Yeah because every single peasent in Thedas is potentially a Godslaying hero in a world where everyone turns out to be Gods (like Flemeth and Solas and who knows who else)! Let all those heroes come forth!

All the more reason for the HoF to get killed by one of those gods.

[Dieb]

Yeah because every single peasent in Thedas is potentially a Godslaying hero in a world where everyone turns out to be Gods (like Flemeth and Solas and who knows who else)! Let all those heroes come forth!

 

It's funny how as an unimaginative Human Male player, DA actually made me crave being a peasant for a change again.

[Rocknife]

Being a peasant for a change in a world full of Gods? Really very smart!

 

If the world being full of Gods is another reason for the HoF to be killed, then poor everyone else!

[Toasted Llama]

Being a peasant for a change in a world full of Gods? Really very smart!

 

If the world being full of Gods is another reason for the HoF to be killed, then poor everyone else!

Except more that 1 person can be a hero.

5/10 so close, try again.

[Rocknife]

More than 1 person can be a hero but only one person can be a leader. No need to try again. No one tells the story of a peaceful farmer.

[Shechinah]

In all fairness, your entire party was heroes as well for their part in the events and came from different backgrounds. Loghain was a farmer's son who came from nothing and worked his way up until he potentially died to kill an Archdemon. 

[Rocknife]

Yes, Loghain became a hero in long years. That is what I'm saying. I'm sick of becoming a hero in no time.

[DanAxe]

Yeah because every single peasent in Thedas is potentially a Godslaying hero in a world where everyone turns out to be Gods (like Flemeth and Solas and who knows who else)! Let all those heroes come forth!

 

Hawke was a peasent. The inquisitior was pretty much a peasent (regardless of race/origin you start as a convict).... They both seem to be godslaying heros... So why not a few more for the next instalments? Its pretty much standard for RPGs to start with peasent protagonists that rise to be great heros, so I really dont see what's your problem here.

 

It seems to me Bioware has spoiled you with great games in the past, and now you feel intitled to get more and more and more. You have no rights whatsoever here, and what you paid for was not to own the heros of Dragon Age. You paid to play for a game that belongs to a company. A game that is not owned by the players, and it is their (Bioware) RIGHT to do what they want with it. What you have is the privilege to either pay to experience it, or not. And thats the extent of our rights as gamers. The longer you take to realize that, the longer you will be stuck on this HoF issue, and trust me, it wont end well for you mate.

 

Im not being sarcastic or trying to start a discussion with you, im just trying to make you realize any personal "I WANT this to happen in DA" is of no consequence and you'll only get it if by chance thats what the writers intended all along.

Now, if there is some personal "I WANT THIS" that gathers lots of followers, and if they make their voices heard in a respectful manner towards the devs, there is always a possibility they will try to implement it. But this HoF issue is widespread, with so many different opinions from so many different gamers, the most likely scenario is for the HoF to be done for good. This is one of those cases where to please some, the devs would have to displease others, and God knows BSN doesnt need any more of those... So i really hope the HoF/Warden Commander are really done for and dont make an actual appearence in the future (maybe some codex, maybe some more letters, but not the actual character).

[Rocknife]

I am simply saying that it would make more sense for an experienced warrior to fight big enemies like Flemeth and Solas rather than new guys who becomes ridicoulusly strong in no time for stupid reasons such as being in the right place in the right time. Bioware doesn't have to do what I find more logical, I am simply speaking my mind.

[DanAxe]

I am simply saying that it would make more sense for an experienced warrior to fight big enemies like Flemeth and Solas rather than new guys who becomes ridicoulusly strong in no time for stupid reasons such as being in the right place in the right time. Bioware doesn't have to do what I find more logical, I am simply speaking my mind.

 

And you have every right to do that. I'm just trying to say that being stuck on the HoF will probably end bad, all things considered.

 

As to what the next protagonists will be, there is no saying what will happen. It's actually very likely that at some point we will play a seasoned warden when the time comes to tackle the story of what is going on in Weishaupt. The thing is, when you write a story for other people to enjoy, it is easier to make the readers/players connect with the protagonist if you start the story from the beggining, when you are still no one, cause you will see them rise to power and you will have gone through the process that turns them from a no-one to hero. If you start the story as a hero already, people will have a harder time connecting to it. And for roleplaying porpuses (and after all these are rpgs we are talking about) if you have an established hero from the get-go you wont feel like you are playing your own character, you feel like you are playing in the shoes of someone else. That's not to say its impossible to have that feeling of "being" a character if they are already an established hero, but its certainly harder to do so. Who knows, maybe in the future Bioware will do that. We have to wait and see.

 

Unfortunatly, using the HoF as an established hero that all of us have a connection to, will be close to impossible to implement in future games because of the choices we had in Origins/Awakening, making it nearly impossible to bring back a HoF that catters to every player choice.

[Rocknife]

Well, the warden-commander is not the Hero of Ferelden in Default World State and I think he/she may fit into your seasoned warden description that would get involved in the events going on in Weisshaupt with no greater influence than any other wardern since Commander is not that big a title in the order. Warden Commander's story is unknown even to those who played Awakening, other than he saw the Architect.

 

New people would play with the Default World State and those who played DAO would play with their own world states. Again, that's just my opinion.