You have these options, they're called Josephine and Cassandra. Josephine is just as cute as Cullen and is also an advisor, these two romances are equivalent. Though I'm not sure why I bother talking to someone who doesn't believe you can be a woman and have short hair at the same time.
It exists but whether or not it exists in a statistically relevant quantity is questionable as we don't know either way. Sure, you can fault a guy (it is a free country) all you want but seeing as he has better evidence than you, it would only make him more right than you are in the end. And while you don't need a better study to criticize a study's faults, criticizing a study's faults does not invalidate its results when used in a debate when you don't have a better study to contradict it. And yes, he misrepresented the results. He said world. The poll only covers the US.
I'm not even sure what your point is really, tbh. But if it was to cast doubt on the study's findings, then I'd have to disagree. His original point wasn't to transpose US data into Thedosian demographics (tho it was clever how people managed to maneuver him into taking that position),p.
I don't quite know why any of it would matter, given that Thedas isn't Earth, humans didn't evolve the same way that they do on Earth, etc.
Both Cassandra and Josephine are good characters. No complaints about either of them.
I hope Bioware adds a 6.3 feet tall, muscular Qunari as a love option next time, for straight men. A short haired one. Just for spite.
Plz no. Many people want a butch woman to actually be into other women for a change.
And it's not invalid, provided that you don't do what I just mentioned. I recommend vocally repudiating anyone who does that; it'll help your reputation and make your arguments look better.
This is a social forum for a video game about dragons and magic, I honestly don't care about my "reputation". The same can be said about making arguments on a social forum for a video game about dragons and magic, I'd much rather spend my time playing that video game about dragons and magic.
This is a social forum for a video game about dragons and magic, I honestly don't care about my "reputation". The same can be said about making arguments on a social forum for a video game about dragons and magic, I'd much rather spend my time playing that video game about dragons and magic.
Clearly you do care, otherwise you wouldn't be upset by people looking askance at you for criticizing the straight male options.
Clearly you do care, otherwise you wouldn't be upset by people looking askance at you for criticizing the straight male options.
If you read a post I made a page or two back you would know I'm completely content with the straight male options for DAI. I'm actually criticizing the people who are criticizing other guys who are upset by people looking askance at them for criticizing straight male options.
Sure, you can fault a guy (it is a free country) all you want but seeing as he has better evidence than you, it would only make him more right than you are in the end. And while you don't need a better study to criticize a study's faults, criticizing a study's faults does not invalidate its results when used in a debate when you don't have a better study to contradict it.
That's not how it works as I'm not making a claim of my own which needs evidence, but I digress.
Second, while they are not universal because there are always exceptions, most males have similar tastes. Take a look at the physical looks of most succesful professional models, you have a lot of Victoria´s Secret vids on youtube, or take a look at the physical looks of most young actress in a romantic role. There are definitely a enormous majority of men who have similar standards in the matter of female sex appeal and Cassandra is not an attracitve woman (or even just a woman) by those standards, and neither Josephine (although she is a woman at least by those standards, unlike Cassandra)
I'm curious about your evidence that the majority of the male population would not jump at a chance with Josephine. Speaking as a hot-blooded male, I think she's more than adequate.
What I'm getting from this is that our female characters all need to be Miranda Lawson for them to be considered romanceable to anyone. And I say this because Miranda aside, most straight male romance options in Bioware games are not on the level of Victoria's Secret models, so I'm not sure why they must meet that standard.
I don't quite know why any of it would matter, given that Thedas isn't Earth, humans didn't evolve the same way that they do on Earth,
All a matter of taste: To me Josie's mouth reminds me of a that scene where Hannibal Lecter says he's going to eat a liver with farva beans. While I adore her personality her looks aren't appealing to me.
Same with Cassandra, while I love her personality(even moreso after the whole Swords and Shields scenes), her jawline is still twice the size it was in DA2, now granted that is because a new engine etc etc etc....but it doesn't change the fact that for me and many others Cassandra was far more attractive in DA2 than she is now.
But again it is all a matter of taste. Everyone likes a different flavor.
This isn't about people simply having different tastes and leaving it at that, it's about people claiming they were screwed over or that Bioware has an agenda in pissing them off romance wise or something. I didn't like either Fenris or Anders in DA2 and didn't go up in arms about how Bioware must hate me as a straight female and have an agenda of putting ''not REAL men'' in the game as an ''anti-sjw'' statement. (to replicate people who argue this)
Guest_Juromaro_*
What I'm getting from this is that our female characters all need to be Miranda Lawson for them to be considered romanceable to anyone. And I say this because Miranda aside, most straight male romance options in Bioware games are not on the level of Victoria's Secret models, so I'm not sure why they must meet that standard.
I had to laugh at that, while she had a great body, her forehead was really large....now Liara....yes I need a Liara, or an Ashley
That's not how it works as I'm not making a claim of my own which needs evidence, but I digress.
Sounds like a claim to me....You can claim that this means that "roughly" 3.4% of Americans are actually LGBT, but you are ignoring the fact that it's likely much higher
There are going to be just as many (and likely many more, to be honest) people who aren't willing to out themselves to a stranger, so that number is just a small percentage of actual LGBT people. I hope you realize that, right?
Sounds like a claim to me....
"it's likely much higher" Also, followed with numerous statements about how this opinion is not based on empirical evidence.
I'll give you one thing, you certainly do cherry pick data like a researcher. Good on you.
And what's your point at this point? Mine was that the study that he cited and tied to Thedosian demographics was limited and inappropriate for the claims he was making. You agree with those points. So........what's up?
Guest_Juromaro_*
This isn't about people simply having different tastes and leaving it at that, it's about people claiming they were screwed over or that Bioware has an agenda in pissing them off romance wise or something. I didn't like either Fenris or Anders in DA2 and didn't go up in arms about how Bioware must hate me as a straight female and have an agenda of putting ''not REAL men'' in the game as an ''anti-sjw'' statement. (to replicate people who argue this)
That is all this has ever been about, taste. Sure you didn't go up in arms about Fenris or Anders, but I bet some people did. I remember what people said when Bioware revealed the new elf look. People said, "Too thin", "Too ugly", "Heads too big, while small body" etc....
While some people are using the sjw/agenda shield to describe their own displeasure with something, alot were not, they simply stated they felt a certain way about their options, and they get attacked for it.
It has everything to do with taste and preference, nothing more, nothing less.
Now you can read this subforum and you'll see an LGBT thread about the LI. They give their likes and dislikes of certain LGBT leaning romances. 3 pages, all civil and respectful.
Now on the flip-side, you have this thread. Someone states they are un-happy with the straight options. almost immediately attacked, being told they have no taste, that their own personal preference doesn't match someone elses so they are obviously wrong, and now here we are at page 10, continuing to debate on whether or not someone's own personal view has any merit or not.
Now you can read this subforum and you'll see an LGBT thread about the LI. They give their likes and dislikes of certain LGBT leaning romances. 3 pages, all civil and respectful.
Now on the flip-side, you have this thread. Someone states they are un-happy with the straight options. almost immediately attacked, being told they have no taste, that their own personal preference doesn't match someone elses so they are obviously wrong, and now here we are at page 10, continuing to debate on whether or not someone's own personal view has any merit or not.
That's because all the homophobes remain in the homophobe thread, the one about the Orlesian court.
Holy hell.
STOP MAKING THESE THREADS.
What's done is done! The LI's are fantastic, Cassandra's character has massive depth and Josephine is really sweet. They're amazing characters once you get to know them.
Holy hell.
STOP MAKING THESE THREADS.
What's done is done! The LI's are fantastic, Cassandra's character has massive depth and Josephine is really sweet. They're amazing characters once you get to know them.
I contend that Josephine is pretty... neutered in her romance.
Just because you admit to having no data supporting a claim doesn't make something any less of a claim. Heck, the fact that it is yet unsubstantiated (by definition) is what actually makes it a "claim" rather than a "fact". It's a simply word, look it up."it's likely much higher" Also, followed with numerous statements about how this opinion is not based on empirical evidence.
I'll give you one thing, you certainly do cherry pick data like a researcher. Good on you.
And what's your point at this point? Mine was that the study that he cited and tied to Thedosian demographics was limited and inappropriate for the claims he was making. You agree with those points. So........what's up?
Now you can read this subforum and you'll see an LGBT thread about the LI. They give their likes and dislikes of certain LGBT leaning romances. 3 pages, all civil and respectful.
Now on the flip-side, you have this thread. Someone states they are un-happy with the straight options. almost immediately attacked, being told they have no taste, that their own personal preference doesn't match someone elses so they are obviously wrong, and now here we are at page 10, continuing to debate on whether or not someone's own personal view has any merit or not.
I genuinely do think that it's about how it's phrased. This thread immediately set the tone as a negative one. It's complaining about the love interests and makes some sweeping generalizations and immediately paints straight guys as victims of an agenda. The LGBT thread that you are referencing is mostly neutral in tone. It's simply asking people to chime in on what they like and didn't like. There have been a ton of LGBT threads that didn't start off neutrally and ended up flaming out just like threads like this one.
If I recall correctly, there is a thread on one of the subforums that is posed like that for the straight male options. It's something like: Cassandra and Josephine. Which do you prefer? And, if I also recall correctly, that one didn't get nearly as heated.
I think the issue with threads like this one is that they start out accusatory and defensive all in one. It sets a negative tone that isn't helped when people use phrases like "agenda", "propaganda", and "shoving it down our throats". At this point, after literally about two dozen of these threads popping up over the past two weeks, it might be too late to see another nice neutral discussion about what people like and dislike about Cass and Josephine. Perhaps in a few weeks, once the hype dies down and a bunch of the casual board-goers and trolls retreat away, those calmer and less inflammatory discussions can happen.
Frankly, it's in between games when the most fan-based influence happens. That's when the devs are on the boards, asking us our opinions.
Just because you admit to having no data supporting a claim doesn't make something any less of a claim. Heck, the fact that it is yet unsubstantiated (by definition) is what actually makes it a "claim" rather than a "fact". It's a simply word, look it up.
It's sad how you like making assertions but the have nothing but cop outs when asked to substantiate them yet feel that you are somehow in the right when criticizing someone who actually provided proof. Bad form.
And my point? If we take away the tangents you've taken the discussion to, it's that (as my original post about the survey said) the gallup poll is actually the best figures we have to go on in this thread. That's it. Dunno why you keep trying to question it and then provide nothing but "claims" to back up what you say...
You seem to be confusing "critiquing" with "claiming". It's also clear that you are devolving into making disparaging remarks. Have a great day sir.
The best Bioware romance was Ashley Williams, because she was just a normal girl with no nutty problems or annoyances.
Guest_Juromaro_*
Holy hell.
STOP MAKING THESE THREADS.
What's done is done! The LI's are fantastic, Cassandra's character has massive depth and Josephine is really sweet. They're amazing characters once you get to know them.
Quite true, I initially hated Cassandra and Josie before I played the game. Currently my male warrior is romancing Cassandra, and my female mage started out with Josie but ended up going to Cullen since I found Josie's romance arc lacking. I love their personalities and can stomach their looks, but should the opportunity to mod them arise I will do so without a second glance.
I like Cassandra's overall look, but I'd fix her jawline, and I like Josie's overall look but I'd fix her mouth. Just as with Dorian I'd remove his stache, I'd give Solas some hair and I'd make Sera not talk at all.
You seem to be confusing "critiquing" with "claiming". It's also clear that you are devolving into making disparaging remarks. Have a great day sir.
a 6.3 feet tall, muscular Qunari as a love option next time, for straight men.
Stop it. You're getting me aroused.
Can she have Arishok-esque horns?
Guest_greengoron89_*
You guys got trolled.
Well, to be fair on this one, it's not like straight gals have had a "Hollywood supermodel" guy in every game. None of the guys in DA 2 fit that trope. Certainly no more so than Josephine or Cassandra do.
I see a lot of people complaining about how the writers are forced to include a variety of sexualities and should just create characters that they want to create. If that's true, then shouldn't the same be said about how they look? They shouldn't be forced to create a Victoria's Secret model looking gal every time, right? They've done it in almost every game, but they decided not to for this one and, instead, gave two perfectly attractive LI's who might be a little unconventional looking.
Cassandra and Josephine are not "perfectly attractive LI's who might be a little unconventional looking", this is not a semantic game, they are ugly, well, Cassandra is plain ugly by most men standards and by videogame standards for female characters sex appeal, and Josephine between ugly and averague.
That said, the right they have to put ugly women as the only romance options for straight men (while actually putting attractive LIs for every other sexual orientation) is the same right we have to rightfully complain about it. And so far there have been tons of complaints about it, not only in this forum, but on almost every major english forum in the internet.
Seriously, I can´t think of a reason for them to do this. I can´t think of a Bioware creative meeting going like:
Bioware/EA worker 1:_Ey guys, we have recieved praise for our straight male catered romances in our games, everyone says they love Leliana, Morrigan, Miranda, Ashley, Liara and Isabella so I have come across a revolutional idea: let´s make ugly women the only romanceable options for straight males in our next game, I´m sure everyone will love it!
Bioware/EA worker 2:_Oh God! Such a revolutionary concept! You Sir are a visionary!
Bioware/EA worker 1:_I know right? And one of them will be a man we will give a female name and tell the player he is a "she".
Bioware/EA worker 3:_But sir, what´s the logic behind that way of thinking? I mean, if we have got praise for our attractive woman being romanceable by straight male players, and we have decided to include in our next game attractive and interesting LIs for straight female players and homosexual males and females, then why would we just include orcs for straight males?
Bioware/EA worker 1:_Ummm...that´s a good question...
(6 months later)
Bioware/EA worker 1:_Well, time is up and we have to speed things up if we want to finish the game so I don´t have more time to think about an answer to your question Bioware/EA worker 3, we are gonna do it simply because I am your superior and I can fire you, does that logic convience you?
Bioware/EA worker 3:_Completely sir, completely.
Ce sujet est fermé
Retour en haut