I love how you can spam the hell out of the bombs. http://youtu.be/nXIut1bVroo?t=10m46s
And she's hilarious. Like one of those dwarves that worked with too much lyrium from DA:O.
As you can see at the end of the video I was trying to decide whether to go with the cold elixir, toxic cloud or sleeping gas. I do have a ring that increases the effect of the sleeping gas but I kind of just want to go crazy with the alchemist's signature ability which appears to be the elixirs.
Alchemist is definitely one of my favorite chars, but I think it needs some serious reworking. The signature mine spam looks amazing on paper, but in practice, it is actually very difficult to get enemies to run over the mines when you are actually playing with the whole team because 90% of encounters have most enemies die before they can run over the mines even from ice flask taunt, aside from 5/5 chokepoint mine spam.
It is actually very difficult for alchemist to survive at higher difficulty levels while doing her mine spam, which requires that she stand very close to enemies and start throwing mines for anywhere between 5 to 8 seconds, depending on whether or not tonic duration passive was used. And ice flask doesn't work while it is mine throwing time, and imo 5 seconds is way too short for the ability. 5 seconds of 85% damage reduction when your other abilities are for stealth, flask of fire, and elemental mines, means 3-5 seconds of weak basic attacks, after which enemies will destroy you for being so close to the front lines unless you go back into stealth and wait for more mine spam.
If it was possible for alchemist to keep on running while throwing mines, she could litter the whole battlefield with them very quickly before the rest of the team wipe out all the enemies, and that would be significantly better than having to choose between throwing 5-8 times in a single location where 80-90% of the mines won't be triggered, or 2-5 mine throws so that the mines can be distributed more around the battlefield but take a very long time to deploy due to all of the animation delays from each individual throw and delay in animation before you can begin running again.
Again please don't see this as me trying to diss alchemist, I think the character is cool and gameplay is good in theory, but in practice she is probably the weakest class in the game due to the difficulty of actually safely and effectively using her signature attack.
Honestly I got used to it very quickly. You just need to rush ahead of your entire party and be the first one at the encounter.
Your post made me decide to keep Stealth instead of Ice Flask. I feel like stealth is an amazing way to hit a crowd of enemies with all your elemental mines from the fire flask. Maybe in a while I will reset my Alchemist's skill tree and try out Ice flask but for now it sounds too risky.
I think I am going to stick with Stealth, Poison weapons, Fire flask, Elemental mines.
Might even waste a skill point on Ice flask when I hit level 20 if I feel comfortable trying it out.
How do you avoid the CD on the grenades?
Guest_Stormheart83_*
Flask of fire.How do you avoid the CD on the grenades?
Mines are terrible. Complete waste of a skill point imo.
Alchemist doesn't have many good skills, and the good skills it does have are shred with assassin which can make much better use of them.
Flask of fire.
One more level to go, then.
Honestly, if you think elemental mines are useless you sir, are a moron.
For example, With the elemental mines + flask of fire combo and shadow strike I can single handedly hold the choke on stage 5 With elemental mines on atleast threatening, and all large, concentrated Groups we meet melts too my flasks.
You should also grab stealth and I was never here for this class. You walk up to large Groups stealthed, dropped like 100's of mines and then take Down the Archers while Your team Works on the rest. I have played all the classes and I honestly think that this build is probably one of the most usefull and fun builds to play.
Having good DPS weapons is of course a must like it is With every build apart from a tank build.
I'll be honest that was painful to watch. The amount of time wasted waiting for the team to open treasure rooms and then blatantly running by pots that are right next to you was just sad (or watching you backtrack for them and miss entire encounters). The mines that were thrown and dealt no damage numbered in the hundreds. The lack of stealth openers was bad since you instead threw mines and rarely hit anything. Opening treasure room chests that obviously have a boss when you are alone and then having to chase the mini-boss as it flanks your teammates, instead of grabbing the pots in the room while your team regroups was laughable. The way you camp in the spawn on wave 5 and then fail to create a meaningful chokepoint. Continuing to attack the Templar boss after he has started his death throes. This video pretty much summarizes my experience with PUG Alchemists (and most players in general). Let's say I was not surprised to see you at the bottom of the score list at the end after watching this video. Fun? I guess each of us defines that a little differently.
Hiero_glyph, now I myself havent seen the video posted here, as I felt no need to having promoted Alchemist a few times and done most of them With a focus on elemental mines. I do agree With all the Points you say, which all would probably annoy me too, but to give you a better impression of the alchemist you should have a few games With mine. Now, I dont always end up on the top score Board - but I assure you my elemental mine-spams are insanely usefull, and at the same time I can stealth kill all the Archers or even the larger mobs really really quick. Also helpfull would be that my two daggers have a dps of 475 and 380 respectively With the last one proccing walking bomb f.ex.
I bet you would change Your mind quite quickly.
Honestly alchemist seems to very much be a jack of all trades and master of none (and a poor one at that). I was shocked to see how awful that flask of fire+mines combo is. After hearing people talk about it here I expected the screen to be like a firework display, instead you just throw 5 mines 2-3 times in a row. Flask of fire is THAT short? I know there is a duration upgrade but I don't imagine its significant, regardless, using flask of fire means not getting the upgraded mine ability so you are only throwing a very small amount. So...the main reason to get alchemist is for the fire flask...yet it lasts about 5 seconds, long enough for maybe 2-4 uses of the mines...but the mines can't be upgraded...and her stealth is gimped too since she doesn't have the assassin abilities to really capitalize on it...and ice flask is a waste of an ability slot. Honestly, if you want to throw mines, go hunter. If you want to play stealth, go assassin. Considering that the combination of stealth and mines on the character affords you no real benefit I don't really see any reason to play her.
Also that goddamn dialogue she has is probably the most grating of all of the MP characters. Worse than the templar, and thats saying something.
Hiero, there's no point criticizing how he is playing. He's not claiming that he's a pro or anything. He was playing routine, not in any way trying to show off, he just wanted to share that he felt alchemist is fun. The game has a very steep learning curve especially with the sh*tty controls on PC. We were all at that stage at one point or another, so lay off the diatribes mkay?
Hiero, there's no point criticizing how he is playing. He's not claiming that he's a pro or anything. He was playing routine, not in any way trying to show off, he just wanted to share that he felt alchemist is fun. The game has a very steep learning curve especially with the sh*tty controls on PC. We were all at that stage at one point or another, so lay off the diatribes mkay?
Agree that its not the point of the thread but he has a point.
Bastion, fire flask can give you 4-5 mines assuming no delays for moving or changing direction of character. Ice flask and fire flask with 3s extra duration for using ice flask prior will let you do 8 mines and on rare occasions 9 mines. You can use the upgraded mine with fire flask, you will just have no stamina on the last throw which could be a bit dangerous since no ice flask/stealth immediately after throwing your mines.
But I do agree about alchemist needing to be made more viable.
Bastion, I can throw out about 6-7, upgrades mines out on the floor With one use of fireflask, and then I can reset it With shadow strike which also instakills any enemy if flanked. When I have thrown out my mines (it takes some practice using it efficiently) I assure you nothing in the area or that will enter the area survives the rainbow of damage from all the elements.
If you cant get this to work you are not doing it right. I have promoted all character With specificly crafted builds and to me, this was one of the most usefull characters. Of course there are better, but this one is imo the most fun to play aswell.
I thought that if you have the upgraded mines (where you expend all of your stamina for more mines) it overrides the fire flask "infinite stamina"? Is this incorrect? If I am to understand what was just said, you can have the upgraded mines and throw them infinitely until the fire flask runs out?
Fire flask seems to me a bit short, but I have also upgraded the duration through a passive, whenever I pop fire flask I stand still and spam the button. If I hit directly at a large Group of mobs I get a kill before I even finish throwing them out and can start my stealth and go for the Archers.
If you dont like alchemists you havent played With the right People. Honestly.
I forgot to answer the question. The answer is yes you can. You throw out mines during the Whole duration of fire flask, which is a bit Shorter. If it was longer it would be totally OP though.
Alchemist is the hero of Routine. I was super excited to unlock her; I think her VA is great and her whole personality/visual design is cool, but she needs help. Promoted her once to try out different things, but I felt completely useless on higher difficulties with a Shadow Strike spam/Mine spam build, and I feel equally as useless with a poison build. Everything she can do stealth-wise, the Assassin does better and the rest of her kit (you know, the alchemy bit) lacks synergy and any real impact on your team's success in Threatening/Perilous.
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